Open 188 - Tweed Mafia - Over!

[Jazzmyn]

First I never said I was for the idea. I saw the pro's and con's but never said lets do it. Also as scum it helped but wasn't a garentee. Do not put words in my mouth there were not there.

Keep digging, farside. I didn't put words in your mouth. I never said anything about it being a guarantee for scum and I never said that you said "let's do it". I said that you suggested that hypocop claiming would help the cops (because you did suggest that) and it does no such thing. It helps the scum. Period.

As scum it's easy to see if someone is just BS'ing if they are terrible with hypo claim and claim something dumb. However there is guessing it it.

Again, it only helps the scum by narrowing their targets, even if "there is guessing in it" because if everyone makes a claim, some of them are going to be (to the scum) quite obviously wrong, thus eliminating those players as real cops and narrowing the field for the scum to pick off the cops.

As for the game zach brought up. No I didn't look at it because I was commenting on those (1) I remembered off the top of my head and (2) was commenting more on the fact it wasn't a novel concept.

If you didn't look at it, you should have because it was posted as evidence of why hypocop claiming in a game like this is a bad idea, and you cited the post in which it was linked. Secondly, I find it hard to believe that you wouldn't remember that game in light of your big, dramatic spat with another player at the end of the game and during the post-game. I'm more inclined to believe that you remember the game very well, but that you hoped nobody else would actually read it to find out that you played in it with an alt, because you're scum in this game and because you know from that game that the hypocop claiming suggestion is a bad idea for town here.

Regards,
Jazz

[XScorpion]

@Jazz: What's your opinion of a possible Lowell/Kitty/Farside threesome?

[Jazzmyn]

@Jazz: What's your opinion of a possible Lowell/Kitty/Farside threesome?

It's possible, but so are many other combinations. I think it's too early to call a trifecta when there are so many possible permutations. First things first, we need to lynch one scum. After that, alliances should become more apparent.

Regards,
Jazz

[StrangerCoug]

Lowell and farside22 make sense as scum together, I must admit.

[Lowell]

I agree. We'd be an unstoppable team. I'm not scum, though, unfortunately.

[farside22]

First I never said I was for the idea. I saw the pro's and con's but never said lets do it. Also as scum it helped but wasn't a garentee. Do not put words in my mouth there were not there.

Keep digging, farside. I didn't put words in your mouth. I never said anything about it being a guarantee for scum and I never said that you said "let's do it". I said that you suggested that hypocop claiming would help the cops (because you did suggest that) and it does no such thing. It helps the scum. Period.

As scum it's easy to see if someone is just BS'ing if they are terrible with hypo claim and claim something dumb. However there is guessing it it.

Again, it only helps the scum by narrowing their targets, even if "there is guessing in it" because if everyone makes a claim, some of them are going to be (to the scum) quite obviously wrong, thus eliminating those players as real cops and narrowing the field for the scum to pick off the cops.

As for the game zach brought up. No I didn't look at it because I was commenting on those (1) I remembered off the top of my head and (2) was commenting more on the fact it wasn't a novel concept.

If you didn't look at it, you should have because it was posted as evidence of why hypocop claiming in a game like this is a bad idea, and you cited the post in which it was linked. Secondly, I find it hard to believe that you wouldn't remember that game in light of your big, dramatic spat with another player at the end of the game and during the post-game. I'm more inclined to believe that you remember the game very well, but that you hoped nobody else would actually read it to find out that you played in it with an alt, because you're scum in this game and because you know from that game that the hypocop claiming suggestion is a bad idea for town here.

Regards,
Jazz

Sweetie I said it helps hide the cops and allows them to give a results so if they die the town has info.
Also I didn't suggest the idea. Lowell did I was explaining what it was I felt he was talking about.
As for remembering all the games I play. The answer is no. The games I remember the most are the ones I had fun in. I'm sure as you get older you may understand that

[Nikanor]

Internet is dead, posting from cafe. Internet guy arrives on Monday, so you'll be seeing the postings at that time.

[Jazzmyn]

Sweetie I said it helps hide the cops and allows them to give a results so if they die the town has info.

It does not help hide the cops, though. It helps to expose them.

As for remembering all the games I play. The answer is no. The games I remember the most are the ones I had fun in. I'm sure as you get older you may understand that

Now, now. No need to insinuate that I'm too young to know what I'm talking about. I'm quite certain that I'm older than you, and probably by a decade.

But I think that your newly acquired patronizing tone ("Sweetie" and "as you get older you may understand") is another sign that you're scum. I.e. trying to sidestep legitimate accusations by illegitimate means.

Regards,
Jazz

[StrangerCoug]

Sweetie I said it helps hide the cops and allows them to give a results so if they die the town has info.

It does not help hide the cops, though. It helps to expose them.

I have to agree with you here. There is a Mafia tailor and no roleblocker, and the tailor probably told the rest of the Mafia his or her target. Therefore, in a hypoclaim situation, somebody claiming a correct result on a player that was tailored that night can be ruled out as a cop, thus narrowing down the pool.

[farside22]

Sweetie I said it helps hide the cops and allows them to give a results so if they die the town has info.

It does not help hide the cops, though. It helps to expose them.

As for remembering all the games I play. The answer is no. The games I remember the most are the ones I had fun in. I'm sure as you get older you may understand that

Now, now. No need to insinuate that I'm too young to know what I'm talking about. I'm quite certain that I'm older than you, and probably by a decade.

But I think that your newly acquired patronizing tone ("Sweetie" and "as you get older you may understand") is another sign that you're scum. I.e. trying to sidestep legitimate accusations by illegitimate means.

Regards,
Jazz

I disagree that it exposes them.
I doubt your older. You really remember every single game you were ever in? Not me. I remember my favorites and that's about it. The rest are a blur. I don't see as not remembering a game I was an alt in is scummy it means it was an unmemorable game.

[farside22]

Sweetie I said it helps hide the cops and allows them to give a results so if they die the town has info.

It does not help hide the cops, though. It helps to expose them.

I have to agree with you here. There is a Mafia tailor and no roleblocker, and the tailor probably told the rest of the Mafia his or her target. Therefore, in a hypoclaim situation, somebody claiming a correct result on a player that was tailored that night can be ruled out as a cop, thus narrowing down the pool.

As I said having a tailor alters the idea completely.

[StrangerCoug]

No it does not. If it does at all, it's only by a trivial amount in favor of scum, who knows who should be showing up as innocent and who should be showing up as guilty. Stop insisting that the town can benefit from hypoclaiming.

Unvote: Lowell
Vote: farside22

[StrangerCoug]

Oh, and

Mod: You show yabbaguy as still alive.

[Zachrulez]

Mod, can we get a vote count please?

[farside22]

No it does not. If it does at all, it's only by a trivial amount in favor of scum, who knows who should be showing up as innocent and who should be showing up as guilty. Stop insisting that the town can benefit from hypoclaiming.

Unvote: Lowell
Vote: farside22

I did not say it did. Jesus!

[Jazzmyn]

I disagree that it exposes them.

You can "disagree" all you like, but the

fact

is that it absolutely does expose the cops. Anyone claiming an innocent on an untailored scum or anyone claiming a guilty on a tailored townie would be immediately known to the scum to be not-cop, thus narrowing the field for them to hit the real cops.

I doubt your older.

I don't know why you're continuing with this, but I base my guess that I'm older than you on the fact that your son is about 3 years old and my daughter is 21 years old. Lay off the patronizing.

You really remember every single game you were ever in?

Yes, I do but I have a good memory and I haven't played all that many games.

I don't see as not remembering a game I was an alt in is scummy it means it was an unmemorable game.

I'm not saying that you're scummy for not remembering a game. I'm saying you're scummy for all the reasons set out in my posts 305, 313, 325 and 332.

Regards,
Jazz

[farside22]

Conversation:
Lowell: hey lets do a cop claim
zach: lowell that is scummy
scorpion: I agree
kitty: role fishing
farside: I think he (lowell) is talking about hypoclaiming which allows the cops to state their claim without being forced out into the public. It gives the town a clear when/if the cop dies.
zach: don't agree states reason
farside: with the tailor it does bring into effect WIFOM

In other words Jazz most of your case is based on my clarification of what Lowell is proposing. You do realize I was clarifying his proposal and how I see it. I never said lets do this. I showed games that yes it helped mafia narrow down their suspects but doesn't guarantee a mafia success.
With this game the tailor corrupts the investigation (which I didn't think about till a few post later) which would mean hypoclaiming is bad.

[Zachrulez]

It's not just the tailor thing, vanillas can claim innocents on mafia or guilties on townies and be eliminated as potential cops as well.

Regardless of whether it outs the cops or narrows the field, it gives the mafia an edge, why would we want to do that?

[Lowell]

I feel like I'm having this argument everywhere at once.

No, zach, it doesn't necessarily give the mafia an edge. The edge WE get is that if a cop dies before being able to claim we'll at least have their results on record. The cop results could be corrupted either way, so this isn't an argument againts a hypoclaim. Again, I don't care if no one wants to do it, but to pretend that there's no upside and to accuse anyone who sees upside as being scum is ridiculous.

[Jazzmyn]

In other words Jazz most of your case is based on my clarification of what Lowell is proposing.

No, it isn't. See my post 305 and subsequent posts.

Regards,
Jazz

[Zachrulez]

But of course if the cop dies, then they can't get anymore investigations, so we don't really get much of an edge at all.

Which is exactly what we increase the chances of if we hypoclaim.

[Zachrulez]

In other words Jazz most of your case is based on my clarification of what Lowell is proposing.

No, it isn't. See my post 305 and subsequent posts.

Regards,
Jazz

That's really bad actually. Trying to make the case about one point and trying to defeat that one point in order to say that you don't have a case at all.

[Zachrulez]

Thinking about it a little bit more.

Why were you so quick to come out and answer for Lowell in 280 Farside?

[Jazzmyn]

@ Mod: please prod KittyMo, MrSuave and nhammen, and please replace Locke.

Regards,
Jazz

[MrSuave]

I see this thread has no mercy for new years and world wide holidays. I see I see. well I'm going to catch up on my games and I'll post when I've done that.