Mafia 103 - Ktown Mafia (Game Over)

[kunkstar7]

Oh thanks! Was looking for a feature like that earlier.

[Faraday]

/avoiding prod. tomorrow. was studying today ugh. so yeh.

[danakillsu]

just making sure everyone knows I'm still here.

[Rhinox]

Deadline is December 19, ~11:00 am MST

We're now 5 days from deadline. The pace this game is going, we should probably plan on coming to an initial decision within the next day or 2 to make sure we don't have any surprise deadline claims and bad decisions as a result. We would be better off if we weren't rushing to make a decision on friday/saturday morning.

I don't really like dana and faraday posting for the sake of posting.

I'm glad to see malp's replacement is active, but I'm less than satisfied with the content. kunkstar, you think wicked is scummy, so why did you unvote instead of voting wicked? How do you think that more time is going to help you form a basis for a vote if you don't question anyone? And before you say you asked a question to wicked, it doesn't count because if you'd have read the thread, you'd have seen that question has been answered more than once. Also, why did you only choose to mention wicked, cades, furry, and sir chris in your analysis post? there are 7 other players in the game.

[danakillsu]

1: He's acting a bit scummy and a 2: little too eager for information...

1: How? Anything in particular?

2: Can you explain where I was doing this? Also, why does it mean I'm scum?


Well, I'm not voting for you anymore, so I obviously thought I could make a stronger case elsewhere.

[Kdub]

cades has been prodded. CrueKnight indicated he would be less active the past few days so he avoids a prod for now.

Vote Count

CrueKnight (2)

- danakillsu, SolemnJ

Furry (0)

-

cruelty (1)

- Wickedestjr

Sir Chris (0)

-

Rhinox (0)

-

Wickedestjr (2)

- Sir Chris, cruelty

kunkstar7 (3)

- Rhinox, Faraday, mikeburnfire

Faraday (0)

-

SolemnJ (1)

- Furry

danakillsu (0)

-

mikeburnfire (0)

-

cades (0)

-

No Lynch (0)

-

Not Voting (3)

- cades, CrueKnight, kunkstar7

12 players alive, 7 votes needed to lynch.

Deadline is December 19, ~11:00 am MST

[CrueKnight]

Bussing a scumpal?

vote CrueKnight

What are you talking about? And it that reason alone you are voting for me? Please elaborate on that.

I've been attacking you for a while.

Your post about your suspicions against Furry about him "being on the top of your list" for "no particular reason" really interested me.

Not no particular reason... he is defending me a bit too closely. He "knows" I'm townie because of "gut feeling". I feel a bit itchy about this.

[Faraday]

This game is a bit all over the place. We have 3 similar sized small wagons and then 3 other people not voting. Why are you not voting at this stage of the game?

[Faraday]

Is this fucking serious? So b/c ONE townie does it, it means it's not scummy? Really Wicked? Oh god this is unbelievably bad.

Lurking/not contributing is a stupid reason to lynch a player for in general anyway. How is that opinion "unbelievably bad"?

THAT'S NOT WHAT YOU SAID. Just b/c a town person does something scummy and flips scum does not invalidate the scum tell. To suggest it does is bad. For example Active Lurking. Haylen was guilty of it. It is scummy, just because Haylen flipped town doesn't mean I won't think it's scummy. There's no reason for town to lurk, they shouldn't be afraid to contribute, whereas lurking is beneficial for scum.

[Faraday]

Scott Brosius was an odd kill choice btw. Not sure if it makes CrueKnight more likely to be scum, probably slightly does I think. Sure it's WIFOM but meh, doesn't mean it's entirely useless to speculate on.

I like Mike's entry to the game too.

[Faraday]

I really don't like the Wicked wagon. I can't explain it but his posting at least gives me the opinion that he's at the very least trying to find scum, more than can be said for Malpascp and CrueKnight too I think.

[Wickedestjr]

mike, can you give your thoughs on cruelty?

1: My main question to Wicked is why would you not vote your top suspect, instead of just going with whatever bandwagon seemed fitting? 2: That's seems more like you don't care who really gets lynched, just pick one. 3: If you had a really strong feeling about your top suspect I think you should have pursued it better.

Wow thanks for reading the thread.

1: I have explained this many many many many times. We were few days away from deadline, and I didn't think I could convince anybody to vote anybody other than CK or Haylen since they were the two most popular bandwagons.

2: As long as somebody's high up on my scumlist and its not LyLo or MyLo, then I'm fine with their lynch. Especially on day 1, when the first lynch gives us the information that we can actually use to get a better idea of who's scum.

3: Who? foilist which had nothing against him apart from his predecessor's actions? Or, Katniss/cades who hasn't posted in a long time? Or Furry who everybody thought was town apart from me and SolemnJ?


kunkstar, can you give your opinion on CK?

1: He's acting a bit scummy and a 2: little too eager for information...

1: How? Anything in particular?

2: Can you explain where I was doing this? Also, why does it mean I'm scum?

Well, I'm not voting for you anymore, so I obviously thought I could make a stronger case elsewhere.

This makes me think you don't know your own case. Also, are you saying you don't think I'm scum anymore?

Scott Brosius was an odd kill choice btw.

I think it might have been because he had really nothing that could be used against him or he wasn't attracting lots of attention or something along those lines.


Faraday, if malpascp's behavior is scummy enough to vote for him, then why not vote dana or cades?


Rhinox, where did you give your reasons for your Haylen vote, and was Sir Chris's vote for Haylen better than malpascp's?

[danakillsu]

Also, are you saying you don't think I'm scum anymore?

Yep. Absolutely

[Rhinox]

Rhinox, where did you give your reasons for your Haylen vote, and was Sir Chris's vote for Haylen better than malpascp's?

I never really spelled out exactly my reasons for voting haylen, nor for why my vote remained on haylen.

yes, sir chris' vote was better. Sir chris wanted haylen to claim here, here, and here. He felt haylen was stalling, and this post appears to be the breaking point. He unvoted after haylen claimed, and revoted after the argument was brought up about haylen's claiming tendencies as scum. I can logically follow the path that led chris to voting haylen, and I can not form an argument that the path is scummy.

[kunkstar7]

Deadline is December 19, ~11:00 am MST

I'm glad to see malp's replacement is active, but I'm less than satisfied with the content. kunkstar, you think wicked is scummy, so why did you unvote instead of voting wicked? How do you think that more time is going to help you form a basis for a vote if you don't question anyone? And before you say you asked a question to wicked, it doesn't count because if you'd have read the thread, you'd have seen that question has been answered more than once. Also, why did you only choose to mention wicked, cades, furry, and sir chris in your analysis post? there are 7 other players in the game.

I did not vote wicked as my opinions in that analysis were mainly formed from the cursory (as you have noticed) read through of the thread. In my last sentence I stated that I do not have enough of a basis to call out anyone. For example, in your initial entrance to the game I felt you came in quite strong and that was a bit offsetting to me, as I felt that maybe the strong town play might be a ploy. Yet you have consistently posted well, so I did not comment on you merely on the basis of a first feeling. The players that I mentioned were the ones stood out to me as I skimmed through and I could find material to back up my thoughts. I prefer not to make claims without material to base it on.

My suspicion on Wicked stems mostly from the argument between him and Cruelty, as cruelty seemed to be making a much more rational argument than wicked.

In response to wicked about Crueknight..I can see your argument against him. His vote against solemnJ and following defenses were weak. It seems we have two camps in that little argument, solemnJ and wicked versus Furry and Crueknight. The fact that Furry seems sure of ck is offsetting to me as how would he know, although ck's subsequent suspicion of Furry because of it might be him distancing him from Furry. Unfortunately I felt like Furry was quite Town besides this, which mixes things up really. Why do you seem sure of ck Furry?

Personally, if we were to go with a lynch for non-contribution/lurking I am looking at cades mostly, possibly dana.

[Sir Chris]

It is true, I was really annoyed by that whole day one situation, I was appalled that someone could be that whiny and anti-town, and the fact that she had claimed vig as scum is too troublesome.

But as one of the posts noted, I really wanted Wicked dead yesterday but Haylen's dramatics got in the way. I still don't like wicked at all.

[cruelty]

We were few days away from deadline, and I didn't think I could convince anybody to vote anybody other than CK or Haylen since they were the two most popular bandwagons.

This right here is a scumtell. You didn't even try - you were happy with someone you didn't really want lynched (relatively) and you didn't attempt to scumhunt/push the wagon after your vote. A few days is ample opportunity to build a convincing case. The fact that you were apathetic about who was ultimately lynched is hugely scummy.

I had a gut read telling me that Haylen was town

Why didn't you try to stop her lynch then?

cruelty made the comment that he had started the wagon after I had made a comment regarding his stance.

Haylen (7) - cruelty, Faraday, Rhinox, foilist13, Sir Chris, malpascp, The Inquisition

My name is there first. I was first on the wagon. Therefore, I think I can legitimately claim to have started it. I attacked Haylen first, I pressured her, resulting in an OMGUS vote on me, which result in everyone else piling on. I didn't initially want her lynched, I was voting/attacking to try to get her involved in the game - she flipped out and everyone else voted for different reasons to my original vote. How is this hard to understand?

(Stepping out of the game for a sec, I find it sort of weird that I'm under attack for claiming to have started a mislynch wagon, heh).

cruelty has rose to the top of my suspect list, mostly because of today's actions plus a few sudden epiphanies.

The absence of elaboration (specifically regarding these "epiphanies") makes me wonder why you'd even say this - you think I'm suspicious and you've had these mind blowing realisations, yet you aren't sharing them? This isn't the wicked I know.

Lurking/not contributing is a stupid reason to lynch a player for in general anyway. How is that opinion "unbelievably bad"?

1: It sets a precedent for scum; lurk and we won't lynch you.
2: Lack of contribution is pro-town how?

We're now 5 days from deadline

Yeah, wicked you should probably pick a bandwagon now.

Scott Brosius was an odd kill choice btw. Not sure if it makes CrueKnight more likely to be scum, probably slightly does I think. Sure it's WIFOM but meh, doesn't mean it's entirely useless to speculate on.

It kinda is, without a scumflip it's just random speculation with no way to conclusively tie players together. Dislike.

Personally, if we were to go with a lynch for non-contribution/lurking I am looking at cades mostly, possibly dana.

You're probably right. Unfortunately in addition to what was basically active lurking, your slot has behaved pretty oddly all game. I am willing to get onto the mal/kunk wagon if the wicked one comes to nothing. This will be a deadline day thing though.


CrueKnight I've looked through your recent posts and you've contributed basically nothing. Can you please present a case on who you want lynched and why?

I'm still here, just watching, waiting.

You still there? You intend on actually participating or wsup?

[SolemnJ]

I find it interesting that the only people who would seem to want Scott brosius dead are CrueKnight and Furry. Scott Brosius only posted a couple of times. So actually...

unvote
vote:CrueKnight

Wrong. I don't have any intention to lynch Scott. The guys in my suspicion list are Furry himself, and I also agree with bits in the Wicked area.

I have no solid evidence against Furry, but I think Wicked is pretty obvious. I can elaborate when I have the time.

Bussing a scumpal?

vote CrueKnight

What are you talking about? And it that reason alone you are voting for me? Please elaborate on that.

I've been attacking you for a while.

Your post about your suspicions against Furry about him "being on the top of your list" for "no particular reason" really interested me.

Not no particular reason... he is defending me a bit too closely. He "knows" I'm townie because of "gut feeling". I feel a bit itchy about this.

ok then. Ic that you said something earlier about a valid attack on Furry. Just pointing out why I said this.

Now, as you said you would, elaborate on the obvscumness of wicked.

[mikeburnfire]

Alright, time to take charge. If we want to wring somebody up, allow ample time for a claim, then decide whether or not to postpone the lynch we had better hurry. I propose we state our top three candidates. Deadline is Saturday at 11, so in the next 48 hours (by Thursday) I would like everyone to follow suit. We'll take the top two candidates with the most psuedo-votes and split our final votes among them.

It's like the story of Jesus and Barabbus, except they could both be innocent. Or guilty.

vote: kunkstar7 (formerly malpascp)
vote: crueknight

I'll post more in a few hours. I think somebody asked me to do an iso on somebody.

[mikeburnfire]

Forgot to note: I only placed two pseudo-votes myself because I don't have a third yet.

[Wickedestjr]

Also, are you saying you don't think I'm scum anymore?

Yep. Absolutely

Well, can you please explain why you were suspicious of me at the time?

I never really spelled out exactly my reasons for voting haylen, nor for why my vote remained on haylen.

So, what made your vote better than malpascp's?

[Faraday]

Faraday, if malpascp's behavior is scummy enough to vote for him, then why not vote dana or cades?

I've only got one vote.

[CrueKnight]

As for Wicked, he has several things that stick out:
1. As everyone says... (and we should stop asking him why) ... he hopped on a bandwagon that he didn't entirely support. We do know why however as he explains it was a result of a deadline which forced him to hop on a bandwagon so we can lynch someone. I have to disagree with this however. If you have legit information and true evidence that someone who is on the top of your suspect list, you should always pursue it unless the bandwagon also had someone on your list.

2. He seems to be asking too many nonsensical questions that don't go anywhere. He needs to do the digging himself instead of overusing the word "why".

Here are some responses I don't like:

1: So you decided against scumhunting until the end and instead just pitched your tent and hoped for the best? 2: This is pro-town how?

1: Yes.

2: I'm not saying it is or isn't. I'm saying its not anti-town.

This is ridiculous, IMO. Stopping to pursue your suspects is anti-town activity. It may not mean scum, but it's anti-town whether you're town or not.


Re-reading through the thread I'd say wicked isn't on top of my list. There are a few I can pinch at... but Wicked is on my suspect list.

[Wickedestjr]

We were few days away from deadline, and I didn't think I could convince anybody to vote anybody other than CK or Haylen since they were the two most popular bandwagons.

This right here is a scumtell. You didn't even try - you were happy with someone you didn't really want lynched (relatively) and you didn't attempt to scumhunt/push the wagon after your vote. A few days is ample opportunity to build a convincing case. The fact that you were apathetic about who was ultimately lynched is hugely scummy.

It is not a scumtell. I tried to push another lynch before we got close to deadline. If that doesn't work, what's pushing at deadline going to do? It'll only slow things down.

I had a gut read telling me that Haylen was town

Why didn't you try to stop her lynch then?

Maybe you'd know if you hadn't gotten rid of the rest of that sentence:

I had a gut read telling me that Haylen was town,

but the evidence pointing to scumHaylen was just too much for me to follow my gut read, so that's why I had her high up on my list of suspects.

Stop taking me out of context scum.

cruelty has rose to the top of my suspect list, mostly because of today's actions plus a few sudden epiphanies.

The absence of elaboration (specifically regarding these "epiphanies") makes me wonder why you'd even say this - you think I'm suspicious and you've had these mind blowing realisations, yet you aren't sharing them? This isn't the wicked I know.

Those epiphanies weren't really anything I felt the need to share. I mostly just realized that I hadn't been giving you enough attention, and you seemed to be flying under the radar, which caught my attention. Then you made this terrible case, and have reiterated several points in an attempt to generate circular arguments that'll never end.

Lurking/not contributing is a stupid reason to lynch a player for in general anyway. How is that opinion "unbelievably bad"?

1: It sets a precedent for scum; lurk and we won't lynch you.
2: Lack of contribution is pro-town how?

1: A change in behavior

would

be scummy. I also doubt it would change anything anyway.
2: Where did I say it was?


Will finish later.

[cruelty]

I had a gut read telling me that Haylen was town

Why didn't you try to stop her lynch then?

Maybe you'd know if you hadn't gotten rid of the rest of that sentence:

I had a gut read telling me that Haylen was town, but the evidence pointing to scumHaylen was just too much for me to follow my gut read, so that's why I had her high up on my list of suspects.

Stop taking me out of context scum.

Thanks, that's what I was hoping for. Nice deflection.

You had her high on your list, still not top 4. Why then, despite the presence of a gut read, did you not pursue the possibility that Haylen was town in order to prevent her lynch?

Conversely, given this gut town read on the most popular wagon, why did you not try to push the CK wagon over the last few days? Why did you go into shutdown mode? Limited time is not an excuse here, it's bad, bad play to apathetically let someone you suspect is town get lynched.

If that doesn't work, what's pushing at deadline going to do? It'll only slow things down.

Wouldn't this be a GOOD thing? You just stated you had a gut town-read on the wagon that eventually rolled to the mislynch.