Kingdom Hearts Mafia - Game Over!

[DragonsofSummer]

@Raider: So your case on me is I've been trying to control the game by what? Not being as present as most people? That seems like terrible logic to me. It looks more to me like you are just saying hey DoS is scummy look at him, with crap reasoning and no evidence.

lol, I love it when people only skim posts and think they got the idea or when they try to turn the words to something else. Either way you were calling out people for tunnel vision when they disagreed with you. As soon as someone responded you left. It looks like you were going after or trying to find easy targets. Can you say you have done otherwise?

If you have more of a case than this:

DoS right now is who I would like to see lynched. I get the feeling he is trying to be controlling and accusing people of tunnel vision just because they do not see eye to eye with him. My vote will go here if nothing changes with the last few pages.

I would love to see it. Do not insult me by saying I only skimmed your posts. Even though all you did was say what had happened on previous pages for most of them I did read them, and that is the only thing even resembling a case against me. Also I only told one person they were tunnelling, and it was Sir Chris, stop misrepresenting what I did.

[raider8169]

Plum's talking like she knows what zwet will flip.

Plum, I don't know nor care what zwet's meta is. All I know is that he isn't contributing anything whatsoever to the game, and I've lynched too many scum who play the lurker game to stop now. You can say "Yeah but so-and-so isn't doing anything either" if you want but that doesn't excuse zwet (or those people for that matter) at all. I'll happily join a viable wagon on any other lurker scum, especially on Day 1 of a large game where it's just too easy to lurk. If zwet's wagon suddenly magically melted away and was replaced by *insert scummy lurking player slot here* then I'd join that one too. This isn't about zwet, this is about removing scummy players and improving our chances down the road.

That said, I'm also up for lynching one of Sir Chris/Rayfrost just to make them shut up.

I love this post! He is not trying to candy coat his intentions.

Though I do not want zwet dead day one for his actions or inactions as it may be I would rather target someone who we think is scum. Lurkers can be replaced and I would rather have that then just lynch people for not posting. In the long run we would spend the game doing that instead of scum hunting. Also by lynching lurkers when someone flips town or something else undesirable no one will take responsibility for it and instead blame it on that they were a lurker and leave it at that.

On my note this is why someone who has been a little more action should be lynched, say like DoS.

[ace5993]

stuff followed by On my note this is why someone who has been a little more action should be lynched, say like DoS.

I would agree with this in smaller games, but in larger games it is VERY easy to semi-lurk without anyone noticing, so at this stage of the game, lurking may be the biggest scumtell we have. Especially when that lurker has a very non-lurkish meta.

[Cobalt]

stuff followed by On my note this is why someone who has been a little more action should be lynched, say like DoS.

I would agree with this in smaller games, but in larger games it is VERY easy to semi-lurk without anyone noticing, so at this stage of the game, lurking may be the biggest scumtell we have. Especially when that lurker has a very non-lurkish meta.

OH THE IRONY

[Iecerint]

Is zwet your lurker with a "non-lurkish meta"? If so, I think you are misunderstanding what Reckoner means when he says that his play in this game is "different."

(Also, that was your first post in 5 days.)

[ace5993]

Yes I'm sorry, I've been sick the past few days so I haven't posted. I haven't been active lurking, I just... haven't been on :/

[ace5993]

And yes, from what I gathered zwet usually posts a ton, is this not correct? (Sorry, I'm not familiar with everyone's playstyles, considering my join date :p).

[Iecerint]

My experience is that zwet rarely posts and, when he does post, he posts little-to-nothing of substance (except votes). The result is that he looks scummy and is an easy D1 mislynch for scum; moreover, he's not much fun to play with, so town is usually indifferent to his survival. It's true that keeping him around is a liability (unless scum find him annoying or he claims a PR, they're unlikely to kill him), but the blamelessness of wanting to lynch him is what makes him such a compelling scum mislynch target.

Not to say that he's not scum sometimes. And some people say they can tell the difference between scumzwet and townzwet. Reckoner claims to be one of those people. I personally can't, though.

DeathNote's meta is somewhat similar to zwet's, except that DN is openly scummy rather than lurkerscum.

[Iecerint]

I've just realized that we need to request prods explicitly.

Please prod zwet

.

[ace5993]

My experience is that zwet rarely posts and, when he does post, he posts little-to-nothing of substance (except votes). The result is that he looks scummy and is an easy D1 mislynch for scum; moreover, he's not much fun to play with, so town is usually indifferent to his survival. It's true that keeping him around is a liability (unless scum find him annoying or he claims a PR, they're unlikely to kill him), but the blamelessness of wanting to lynch him is what makes him such a compelling scum mislynch target.

Not to say that he's not scum sometimes. And some people say they can tell the difference between scumzwet and townzwet. Reckoner claims to be one of those people. I personally can't, though.

DeathNote's meta is somewhat similar to zwet's, except that DN is openly scummy rather than lurkerscum.

Ah I see. I must have misgathered information somehow. I could have sworn someone said zwet usually posts a lot though. I have read through a couple games DeathNote has been in so I'm well aware of his "playstyle"

[xRECKONERx]

Plum's talking like she knows what zwet will flip.

Plum, I don't know nor care what zwet's meta is. All I know is that he isn't contributing anything whatsoever to the game, and I've lynched too many scum who play the lurker game to stop now. You can say "Yeah but so-and-so isn't doing anything either" if you want but that doesn't excuse zwet (or those people for that matter) at all. I'll happily join a viable wagon on any other lurker scum, especially on Day 1 of a large game where it's just too easy to lurk. If zwet's wagon suddenly magically melted away and was replaced by *insert scummy lurking player slot here* then I'd join that one too. This isn't about zwet, this is about removing scummy players and improving our chances down the road.

That said, I'm also up for lynching one of Sir Chris/Rayfrost just to make them shut up.

This post gives me an erection.

I nearly tore my hair out reading the back and forth between Chris and Ray. Seriously, just stfu, your bickering IS NOT HELPING TOWN AT ALL. It's just a pissing match between one neutral-read of mine and one townie-read of mine, and the arguing is doing NOTHING to push either of you either way. How about moving on and doing some actual scumhunting?

@Icerint: now that I go back and read through Empire at War again, I just realized something. Zwet was actually active and pretending to scumhunt there, BUT HE WAS SCUM. However, it was also a mini game, and he didn't really ever start picking up the pace with the scumhunting until D2. So, it seems as if he has NO vested interest in helping to scumhunt this game. Why?? One of two reasons - either he's a vanilla townie who has completely lost interest in the game, or he's scum trying to coast his way through while resting on his meta. NEITHER are good for town.

@Kdub: Do you think the fact that Empire at War was a mini and this is a large has anything to do with his playstyle?

@Mod: Can we get a prod/replacement on zwet?

[xRECKONERx]

Also, it's exam time, peeps. Meaning I'll be a looot less active for the next week or so. Just a heads up.

[Iecerint]

I think someone in this game did imply that zwet usually posts a lot, so I don't think you're imagining things. I can't quite recall who it was. It made me read it twice when I was reading through, too. I convinced myself that the poster meant something else IIRC (e.g. the post said something like "This is zwet we're talking about!" so I took it to mean that there was something-else-not-activity-level about zwet's play that was off).

Cobalt, when you posted that, were you referring to ace's insinuation that zwet was usually an active player, to ace's recent lower frequency of posts, both, or something else?

[Iecerint]

It's easy for (any) players to win +like points for telling spammers to quiet down. However, it is perhaps somewhat disingenuous when they have already stopped.

[Cobalt]

I think someone in this game did imply that zwet usually posts a lot, so I don't think you're imagining things. I can't quite recall who it was. It made me read it twice when I was reading through, too. I convinced myself that the poster meant something else IIRC (e.g. the post said something like "This is zwet we're talking about!" so I took it to mean that there was something-else-not-activity-level about zwet's play that was off).

Cobalt, when you posted that, were you referring to ace's insinuation that zwet was usually an active player, to ace's recent lower frequency of posts, both, or something else?

I was referring to the fact that ace was calling zwets a lurker when he was a huge lurker himself.

[Kdub]

@Kdub: Do you think the fact that Empire at War was a mini and this is a large has anything to do with his playstyle?

I'm not certain. I imagine it has some effect, but having never played with him in a game this size, I don't know how his play might be different. I still contend that he was far more proactive, even on D1, in EoW than he has been here. Right now, the zwet wagon seems like an easy diversion from people who have actually done suspicious things in this game.

[Papa Zito]

@Kdub: Do you think the fact that Empire at War was a mini and this is a large has anything to do with his playstyle?

I'm not certain. I imagine it has some effect, but having never played with him in a game this size, I don't know how his play might be different. I still contend that he was far more proactive, even on D1, in EoW than he has been here. Right now, the zwet wagon seems like an easy diversion from people who have actually done suspicious things in this game.

Give me names.

[Slicey]

Cheshire Cat: To trust, or not to trust? I trust you'll decide!

The Seventh Vote Count:
zwetschenwasser (10): wolframnhart, Cobalt, DragonsofSummer, ace5993, xRECKONERx, Papa Zito, Kise, saberwolf, Gorrad, MafiaSSK,
DisCode (2): Hayker, Kdub
fuzzylightning (2): Iecerint, Shotty to the Body
DragonsofSummer (2): Sir Chris, raider8169
Cobalt (1): RayFrost
Sir Pent (1): Vaya
MafiaSSK (1): Sir Pent
wolframnhart (1): zwetschenwasser
Plum (1): Deathnote
Gorrad (1): DTMaster
Deathnote (1): DisCode
saberwolf (1): Plum

Not Voting: Sajin, joe478, fuzzylightning

With 26 votes available, it will take 14 to lynch.

zwet prodded. DisCode has 24 more hours to respond to the prod.

Also, just a reminder that prods are only done by request.

[Cobalt]

prod fuzzylightning

fuzzlightning prodded ~Slicey~

[Papa Zito]

Oh BTW, wouldn't mind a Sajin lynch. I mean, look at this.

Thank you for being willing to help me, all.

No. You whine and cry for people to help you, the whole freaking town rallies with all kind of bolded nonsense, and.... that's it? "Thanks?" What kind of BS is this. First it's the "I have info no wait opinions no wait INFO AND OPINIONS BUT I CAN'T SHARE NYAH" and now it's this. You're a big huge scummy distraction.

If you can't tell I'm irritated that our first viable wagon in 30+ pages is being torn down for no raisin. If this town refuses to get its act together we're doomed.

[raider8169]

Oh BTW, wouldn't mind a Sajin lynch. I mean, look at this.

Thank you for being willing to help me, all.

No. You whine and cry for people to help you, the whole freaking town rallies with all kind of bolded nonsense, and.... that's it? "Thanks?" What kind of BS is this. First it's the "I have info no wait opinions no wait INFO AND OPINIONS BUT I CAN'T SHARE NYAH" and now it's this. You're a big huge scummy distraction.

If you can't tell I'm irritated that our first viable wagon in 30+ pages is being torn down for no raisin. If this town refuses to get its act together we're doomed.

Get our act together? Seriously? Oh no, day one and we cant work together, we are all screwed! Might as well give up now and give the game to scum.

Why are you in a rush for someone to get lynched. Bandwagons are great for getting information but there is nothing to gain with this bandwagon. Zwet isnt going to claim or post anything important for that matter. He is one of many in this game similar to that.

[raider8169]

If you have more of a case than this:

DoS right now is who I would like to see lynched. I get the feeling he is trying to be controlling and accusing people of tunnel vision just because they do not see eye to eye with him. My vote will go here if nothing changes with the last few pages.

I would love to see it. Do not insult me by saying I only skimmed your posts. Even though all you did was say what had happened on previous pages for most of them I did read them, and that is the only thing even resembling a case against me. Also I only told one person they were tunnelling, and it was Sir Chris, stop misrepresenting what I did.

Wow, missed this post somehow.

Ok looking at you in ISO just because I am lazy right now. Your third post calling out someone for not putting any content in there posts. Your first post you randomly voted, your second post was worthless. Gee where was your content at? Or does that only apply to other people? Post 351, calling out Sir Chris for utter crap. You have said little of anything thus far. Of course I am sure you are tossing around suspicion without any reason at least in your first 4 posts. You said someone actions were scummy yet it is the same thing you are doing. Does that make it less scummy for you? So then you back off because he posted, yet your posts still leave a lot of room. The vote would have been better suited for yourself and not Zwet. Then yet another post talking about not posting any content. I am seeing a pattern. Calling Chris out for tunnelling which I have already said and shown why it is not. Seems you have only gone after Chris which is tunneling except for your vote on Zwet which was just an easy place to move it and you didnt need to present a real case. Your 7th post gives me the feeling you are trying to appeal to the town. Otherwise it was another worthless post. Oh wait post 8 maybe something real...nope just you trying to be funny with a QFT. Post 9, woot a real post. Only you are just trying to defend yourself. My evidence you ask, well outside of this calling someone out for tunneling just because they were looking at you is a means of control. By calling him out you are hoping that he will move his vote, a minor goal would be to get him to join your side and vote for the same person you are. Any easy way to jump back on him for it later. Then bring us to your tenth and last post. Asking me to sum up my case.

In the end you are calling people out for what you are doing, which would be tunneling and not posting content. Lurking like most other people and admitting to it. To some people that can be a townie trait but not to me. It shows you know what you are doing and not willing to do anything about it. Oh, the skimming part, had you read my previous posts you would have seen the case and that you caught my eye early on so its not like I am just trying pick on you.

Eh, Im done with my rant for now, in a few days I hope you come back and respond.

[Kise]

Someone

is anxious to use his night action.
Sajin is looking for something. He just has to trust that he's found it.

[Kdub]

Give me names.

DisCode specifically.

[Iecerint]

I agree that DC's play is odd, but I think it's likely he's Riku, and I doubt that Riku is scum. Could be 3rd party, though. [/outguessing the mod]

Anyway, I'd like to see the role in more capable/active hands.