Mini 885 - Boom, Game Gutshot/Abandoned by Mod!

[Seregil]

@Seregil: What do you think of 5cvm's claims of people being scum and his vote switching?

I missed this earlier...

I think some of 5cvm's posts are incomprehensible. His claims at this point on the game? Could be just trying to see what the accused reactions are or deliberately causing confusion.

[5cvm]

I pointed out that only scum would be so certain about who scum are right out of the gate.

You did, and you were correct, but since I am, in fact, scum, it's not a very helpful point.

Also, you seem to have dropped Squirrel and Rite for xvart and Button way too quickly.

That's because I was trying to cover my tracks. Xvart and Button are my scumbuddies.

[A_Squirrel]

@5cvm: Wanna tell me who milkshake is? =P Also, why are you outing your scumbuddies?

@xvart: I'm still curious--you accepting the coincidence or was i lying?

So magis has one post, evil has two, confid has one, and rite hasn't posted at all. AKA a third of our group is slacking -.-

[5cvm]

Also, why are you outing your scumbuddies?

I don't know. It just seemed like the right thing to do considering how scummy they were acting.

[Aranfan]

I pointed out that only scum would be so certain about who scum are right out of the gate.

You did, and you were correct, but since I am, in fact, scum, it's not a very helpful point.

Did you just claim scum? That is so anti-Town I don't even know how to say it.

Also, you seem to have dropped Squirrel and Rite for xvart and Button way too quickly.

That's because I was trying to cover my tracks. Xvart and Button are my scumbuddies.

I very much doubt it, scum wouldn't out their buddies like that, and if you're just a townie who's f'd in the head, you wouldn't know who scum is anyway.

[Boxman]

Post from a player not playing in this game was deleted upon request.

Also, sample townie role PM added to the Rules post as per request.

[ConfidAnon]

Wierdest start to a game I've played in by far, but nothign scummy yet, just sounds like a bunch of goofing around.

Vote: Aranfan

[xvart]

@xvart: I'm still curious--you accepting the coincidence or was i lying?

I do not accept that it was a coincidence; but, I don't necessarily think it was scummy; I think it's null at this point. It shall be filed away. With that said:

Unvote: A_Squirrel

Every single post by 5cvm has been scummy; not only that, but so brazenly scummy it makes me sick. Could there be a VI in a 12 person game?

xvart.

[A_Squirrel]

Wierdest start to a game I've played in by far, but nothign scummy yet, just sounds like a bunch of goofing around.

What do you find weird about our start?

[ConfidAnon]

@xvart: I'm still curious--you accepting the coincidence or was i lying?

I do not accept that it was a coincidence; but, I don't necessarily think it was scummy; I think it's null at this point. It shall be filed away. With that said:

Unvote: A_Squirrel

Every single post by 5cvm has been scummy; not only that, but so brazenly scummy it makes me sick. Could there be a VI in a 12 person game?

xvart.

WOW. Now this is a scummy post.

1. A nulltell now will be a nulltell later. Why are you filing it away, and saying that it's "null at this point" is setting yourself up to add it to a potential case later. Sounds like scum trying to start an early D1 bandwagon, realizing that their evidence is weak, and backing off until they can get a better case built.

2. 5cvm is "so brazenly scummy" that it makes you sick . . . and you're not voting him? Why not?

Unvote, Vote: xvart

[5cvm]

5cvm is "so brazenly scummy" that it makes you sick . . . and you're not voting him? Why not?

Ooh, oh, I know, I know!

[xvart]

1. A nulltell now will be a nulltell later. Why are you filing it away, and saying that it's "null at this point" is setting yourself up to add it to a potential case later. Sounds like scum trying to start an early D1 bandwagon, realizing that their evidence is weak, and backing off until they can get a better case built.

The point I was making about filing it away was simply because if a pattern of behavior develops surrounding the same sort of behavior I was mentioning, it ceases to be a null tell. One simple comment that can appear scummy can be made by anyone, but if it happens over and over, then further scrutiny is needed.

2. 5cvm is "so brazenly scummy" that it makes you sick . . . and you're not voting him? Why not?

Because I asked if there could possibly be a VI in a 12 person game? Did you miss my question asking for more information? I haven't been a member of this site long so I don't know the standard setup that includes VIs, but I'm not going to jump on someone, especially when it furthers the current (and strong) bandwagon, when he could be the VI.

xvart.

[xvart]

EBWOP:

By VI I mean Village Idiot or the jester. The other forum that I've played calls that role the Village Idiot.

xvart.

[ConfidAnon]

The point I was making about filing it away was simply because if a pattern of behavior develops surrounding the same sort of behavior I was mentioning, it ceases to be a null tell. One simple comment that can appear scummy can be made by anyone, but if it happens over and over, then further scrutiny is needed.

Mind giving an example about how a pattern of behavior about the "lie" would develop?

The random vote die rolling coincidence thing, to me, has absolutely nothing scummy about it. How would a pattern of behavior develop over that?

Because I asked if there could possibly be a VI in a 12 person game? Did you miss my question asking for more information? I haven't been a member of this site long so I don't know the standard setup that includes VIs, but I'm not going to jump on someone, especially when it furthers the current (and strong) bandwagon, when he could be the VI.

Must have missed your question about the VI. I haven't seen a jester in a mini normal game, although I'm no where near experienced. I don't think it's common practice to include one.

xvart, I just noticed we're both from Missouri. Hi! Anyways, jester hunting is in and of itself scummy, so my vote stands.

[hitogoroshi]

Okay anyone who is taking 5cvm's claims at face value needs to learn a bit of critical thinking, here. :p

Although, 5cvm, I really don't think you're doing anything productive. I'm sure you feel badass by flustering people but quite frankly you're just finding out who is calm and who isn't calm, and that doesn't have a whole lot to do with alignment. Paranoia may be a scumtell, but that can't really work until there's enough post history that scum can have the worry that maybe they slipped somewhere and you know exactly where. I don't think anyone here is so easily thrown off their game that they think you've read their role PM and know they are scum, or something.

[Evilgorrilaz]

VI is pretty much bastard modding. Since our mod is dead I don't see how the mod can go on about bastard modding, so I don't think we have a VI.

Sounds like scum trying to start an early D1 bandwagon, realizing that their evidence is weak, and backing off until they can get a better case built.

Alas, but we all shall file away tidbits of information that we can utilize to start wagons later on in the game.

[ConfidAnon]

Alas, but we all shall file away tidbits of information that we can utilize to start wagons later on in the game.

Yes, but usually those tidbits are scumtells, not nulltells.

[5cvm]

scum can have the worry that maybe they slipped somewhere and you know exactly where.

Scum slips are a myth.

Yes, but usually those tidbits are scumtells, not nulltells.

Smart.

Did you just claim scum? That is so anti-Town I don't even know how to say it.

I very much doubt it, scum wouldn't out their buddies like that, and if you're just a townie who's f'd in the head, you wouldn't know who scum is anyway.

Indicative of membership in a certain family organization. ';..;'

[xvart]

Mind giving an example about how a pattern of behavior about the "lie" would develop?

I was more referring to the fabrication of a story to support a given action.

Must have missed your question about the VI. I haven't seen a jester in a mini normal game, although I'm no where near experienced. I don't think it's common practice to include one.

That's what I thought, but I didn't know for certainty.

xvart, I just noticed we're both from Missouri. Hi!

Awesome! Nice to meet another person from the heartland.

Anyways, jester hunting is in and of itself scummy, so my vote stands.

Nobody is "jester hunting." I asked a question about game setup.

xvart.

[xvart]

EBWOP:

I meant to add that maybe I should have said "I've got my eye on you" instead of "filing it away." Maybe if I had used a piece of terminology from the MS wiki it would have been more kosher.

xvart.

[ChiboSempai]

VI is pretty much bastard modding. Since our mod is dead I don't see how the mod can go on about bastard modding, so I don't think we have a VI.

Can you please explain this further? Pretty much as what you mean by bastard modding, as I've never heard the term.

---

As much as I almost want to ignore 5cvm's claim, I just hate WIFOM like that. No one is going to like it in the end. It certainly isn't going to help someone who was town or mafia really. The first thing that came to mind when I read it was if he could possibly be a Jester.

---

I'm not particularly liking xvart's replies

[xvart]

I'm not particularly liking xvart's replies

Why? What concerns you about them?

xvart.

[ConfidAnon]

What do you find weird about our start?

Sorry about missing this question earlier. I just found the joking scum claims and other joking aroudn wierd, idk why.

I was more referring to the fabrication of a story to support a given action.

I don't like this. Unless you can have conclusive proof that someone lied, how can you be sure that any motivation is a fabrication?

Still seems like your setting yourself up to have grounds to start a Squirrell mislynch. You can claim that his explanation for any of his actions is a fabrication, when there is no conclusive proof to support that . . . in fact, in the earlier example (Randomgate), the evidence supports that he is telling the truth more so than it does that he is lying.

Nobody is "jester hunting." I asked a question about game setup.

Whoa deja vu (got killed recently in a game where jester speculation was a major point of discussion.) Anyways, you asking about the possibility of a jester is in a way hunting for a jester. Looking for a jester is scummy for a few reasons:

1. Jester =/= scum. When we look for a jester, we aren't looking for scum, which hurts town.

2. Setups up a possible scumbuddy defense. Example: Mafia A messes up and does something really scummy. Mafia B says "He's too scummy to be scum, this is most likely a jester, we shouldn't lynch him."

3. While I've never seen this type of thing on MS (my original site is epicmafia.com, a chat based website), mafia could be looking for a joint win. On EM, mafia can joint with fool (that sites name for jester) given the right situation (2 mafia, 2 town, 1 fool alive. Mafia and fool vote together to lynch fool, fool gets lynched, and then mafia have the numbers to win as well.)

EBWOP:

I meant to add that maybe I should have said "I've got my eye on you" instead of "filing it away." Maybe if I had used a piece of terminology from the MS wiki it would have been more kosher.

xvart.

It wasn't the word choice that I had a problem with, it was the meaning. Either phrase I would have been wary of.

Can you please explain this further? Pretty much as what you mean by bastard modding, as I've never heard the term.

Bastard modding is any case of the mod lying to the players. I wouldn't call a fool bastard modding, just an unconventional role.

[xvart]

What do you find weird about our start?

Sorry about missing this question earlier. I just found the joking scum claims and other joking aroudn wierd, idk why.

I would normally write the joking scum claims off for day one RVS shenanigans if the joking had stopped or ceased. But since every single by 5cvm is obviously asking for a lynch, I stopped to ask about potential game setup before putting up a third vote (and increasing the bandwagon) on 5cvm.

1. Jester =/= scum. When we look for a jester, we aren't looking for scum, which hurts town.

I understand that. I don't think I can be any more clear: I wasn't looking for a jester; I was asking a simple question about game setup before I considered putting another vote on him.

2. Setups up a possible scumbuddy defense. Example: Mafia A messes up and does something really scummy. Mafia B says "He's too scummy to be scum, this is most likely a jester, we shouldn't lynch him."

You are the one making that case, not me. I never once defended him and said he was the jester. I was asking about the game setup. In fact, I wasn't the only one who made note of the odd posting behavior:

As much as I almost want to ignore 5cvm's claim, I just hate WIFOM like that. No one is going to like it in the end. It certainly isn't going to help someone who was town or mafia really.

The first thing that came to mind when I read it was if he could possibly be a Jester.

(bolded emphasis mine)

And I may note, that that person, in the same post, said he didn't like my responses:

I'm not particularly liking xvart's replies

3. While I've never seen this type of thing on MS (my original site is epicmafia.com, a chat based website), mafia could be looking for a joint win. On EM, mafia can joint with fool (that sites name for jester) given the right situation (2 mafia, 2 town, 1 fool alive. Mafia and fool vote together to lynch fool, fool gets lynched, and then mafia have the numbers to win as well.)

Do you really think that the mafia and the (mostly likely) non-existent jester have already planned out this grand scheme you suggest?

I think some of 5cvm's posts are incomprehensible. His claims at this point on the game? Could be just trying to see what the accused reactions are or deliberately causing confusion.

Exactly my feeling. If he isn't mafia he is certainly anti-town.

ConfidAnon -

who do you think is more anti-town at this point? Me or 5cvm?

I want to make it clear that I am more than happy to put my vote on 5cvm. This early in the game it is hard to differentiate between anti-town behavior and scum behavior, so that vote is as good as any for now. The reason I'm not going to vote him now is because I'm not ready to continue this bandwagon on page three. I think there is plenty of things to discuss, like ConfidAnon trying to build a case around me based on:

1. my comments towards A-Squirrel (which, granted, are legitimate, and I will be happy to continue that discussion if warranted);
   
2. my alleged "jester hunting."

I just want to make it clear to you, ConfidAnon, that you are the one that continues to talk about the jester, not me. I'm just answering to your allegations that are unfounded.

xvart.

[magisterrain]

wow. this game is moving fast. i'm in the middle of a busy 4 day weekend, but i will work on catching up.