Mafia 105 - Caught in the Crossfire (Game Over)

[SpyreX]

/confirming my double-bomb cult jester up ins

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 1

hiphop ( 1 ) sigma
Budja ( 0 )
charter ( 0 )
ConfidAnon ( 1 ) crypto
crypto ( 1 ) RedCoyote
CSL ( 0 )
elvis_knits ( 0 )
Energetic Penguin ( 0 )
hitogoroshi ( 0 )
Hoopla ( 1 ) popsofctown
Idiotking ( 0 )
imaginality ( 0 )
Infinis ( 0 )
Juls ( 0 )
Maemuki ( 1 ) CSL
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
Psychologic ( 0 )
RayFrost ( 0 )
RedCoyote ( 0 )
roflcopter ( 2 ) hitogoroshi - maemuki
sigma ( 3 ) Sotty7 - infinis - Vi
Sotty7 ( 1 ) roflcopter
SpyreX ( 1 ) Pads
Vi ( 1 ) Hoopla

With 25 alive, 13 needed to reach a majority.
Deadline is at December 1st, 11am EST

Vi, CSL, Pads, Juls

Not enough letters. Lazy.

Scum are lazy.

Thus.

MEGAVOTE

[SpyreX]

I, although meta-blah, understandish what sigma was suggesting. However, this still absolutely baffles me:

I was hoping that someone would take offense at my stated reason and non-random vote me. I don't think that's likely to happen now -- probably should have waited a little longer for that to happen, but I'm feeling impatient.

So, was it "wagon because I don't know" or "lol, reactions"?

[SpyreX]

And how praytell am I traitorous mr.I am a paranoid cop but the town STILL lynches your investigation because you hit scum day one?

Not that I'm bitter.

---

That said, I'm not getting any super vibes yet. I'm a little flabbergasted that charter has 5 suspects from this mess.

---

@Ray:

Betting on yourself for the lynch makes one think there is a predisposition for thinking you, yourself, are scummy.

I'm currently trying to currently figure out how that works, currently.

[SpyreX]

...

I guess I just dont understand. I see a decent chunk of white noise but nothing that makes me think you'd get lynched today?

[SpyreX]

CONTINUED white noise is scummy. White noise in the first few pages isn't (and, even if it doesn't make sense the fact you said you'd bet on sigma or yourself being lynched is... something).

I don't think I've ever been an early bandwagon.

Is it tasty?

Is it scary?

Will it hurt?

Help. Me.

[SpyreX]

Maybe I'm extra sensitive today but it seems like people have it out for me today, sheesh.

How's about this: I'll DIAF if you take responsibility for said F.

[SpyreX]

I'm talking about the small gravity well you already seem to be forming with the crazy voters. Lets assume I actually DO DIAF today there done be some woosh goin on'

[SpyreX]

Spyrex, you've posted a couple of times about white noise, while being pretty noisy yourself. Do you have any reads either way on anyone yet?

You should drop a vote somewhere.

I love the quick jump to NOISE considering of the whole 7 posts I have what ones are true noise? My confirm? My random silliness to start things off?

My others posts while still joking around ARE saying things. If that bit of joking is too much noise to see what I'm saying well... it looks like the mood is getting somber enough that it'll go away anywho.

REAL BOY reads? No. Although, recent events sure have given me something to dance with.

Vote: Budja

Spyrex's play seems unusually passive (especially for him).

Considering the volumes of posts to base my play on thus far this game trying to rationalize a vote on this choo choo under these grounds is highly suspect.

Hmmm, better hope it doesn't happen again. Razz

If you were a daycop, which of the people I listed would you investigate and why?

Of the five you listed if I were you? I'd be daycopping me and sitting on it to see how this little dance plays out.

Assuming thats not what you were asking (and thus I'm not one of them) - I wouldn't be daycopping anyone yet. Let it simmer for a bit and watch the tides shifting.

Nothing you have said or done so far would suggest that this is a risk that isn't worth taking.

And then we get to this.

See, I'm cool with a wagon. The part of this I'm having some issues wrapping my head around is that this seems hyper-aggressive - like you actually think I'm scum and this is some kind of power-push.

Which at this point I flat out don't understand. However, like I made reference to it sure seems like your gravity well is working.

[SpyreX]

This game is going to be a giant :headdesk: for me, isn't it?

Dare I ask: why?

[SpyreX]

At least ask me QUESTIONS or something or pretend or SOMETHING. Or, we can just skip to the L-1 claim and dance because this may be becoming the awesomest and most mind-boggling wagon I've been a part of ever.

[SpyreX]

<3

Welp, I think thats a sign its bedtime.

Choo choo, young bucks.

[SpyreX]

Holy hell in a handbasket. 4 pages overnight? Awesome.

Budja is correct.
You're not going to like hearing this, SpyreX, but now that I've seen the gap between you-Town and you-scum it's pretty easy to pick out.

First quote: Seconding this.

Second quote: SpyreX-Town is extremely obvTown.
SpyreX-CitC is being vague all over and rubbing off as fake.

No, I thought all the votes passed around in the first 500 posts are just aimlessly accusing each other until people start lurking!

If you read these other posts in isolation... no they're not.

A game where SpyreX was obvious Town (yet the scum tried to discredit him for some reason).
A game where I noticed "oh SpyreX is acting differently" from my first post (and chose to proxy my vote to him anyway) >.>

Now, see, this is what is awesome about meta. Its not that I, this game, am being scummy it is simply a factor of my play seems different here. Which, sure, because my play DOES tend to change as a function of the games I'm in.

So, when the argument is "You're playing differently" well, yea I am. (In fact, there is a variable in those two games that Vi has shown that is fairly apparent but in the hatred of meta I'm not going to share.)

The issues I have with this whole wagon are threefold:

1.) This talk of white noise. Aside from my first two posts I AM asking questions; sigma's double-bladed "lol, reactions / meta beem", rayfrosts defeatist attitude which, apparently, is meta-fueled and then trying to parse out this meta-wagon. There's a theme there, I just can't put my fingers on it...

2.) The fact that Vi is pushing this like "SCUM FOUND" instead of the information / pressure wagons one would EXPECT from the early wagon. I'm not even sure what I have to discuss with it (part of the itch of meta) "You're playing different, hence you're scum." "I'm not scum" WOOOSH.

3.) Captain Budja and the little wagonneers. Sure it'd be tech if I am scum but when this party seems to be the lemmings and Vi playing the pipes and that's A-OK well awesome.

---

I love the call to OMGUS, too. But, lets just keep on keeping on and look at some of the delectable plays we have goin up ins:

- Budja 146. Just, seriously. Not one, two, three but FOUR reasons to jump on this train?
- Hiphop the cheerleader.
- Anon the snipa'

I'd put more than even money on one of those three being scum. This wagon is too good to, even at this point, keep the fingers off of.

Oddly, I have FAR less issue with Ray and Rofl's jumps on it for the simple headshake of it.

----

On the flipside Mam is solid, sigma (sans start) is feelin town, and CSL's 203 may, in fact, be so bizarre that it goes around the horn to zen.

And, based on current behaviors we're going to see one of the games with a MASSIVE content divide that pre-needs to be monitored before it gets out of control.

Mod Note: This is 540 words. Not a huge deal, but please be cognizant

[SpyreX]

For whatever reason when I see your name I think "Mamuki" instead of "Maemuki" hence the mam.

And no, I'm not sharing for the simple reason that meta on surface is blah and sharing would a.) require MORE meta and b.) be discounted as a function of WIFOM (much like how the fact I'm voting for budja loses something because it is apparently OMGUS when it is anything but).

On that meta front I am still absolutely baffled at the Ray-hate (I'm assuming that kill was a joke). The three amigos on the wagon are ALL much more hateable thus far.

[SpyreX]

My ConfidAnon vote was random. I think Maemuki is more scummy.

Que? Sure you didn't get the names mixed up there?

[SpyreX]

But that's not true at all~
You even listed two quotes from me where I argued that you were scum without using meta~

What? Which ones?

How about this. Show me the case. Not the one that is a function of "he's not playing like X"

The questions you're asking are/were not particularly convincing for scumhunting regardless of who asked them. Many posts, not much worth.

It would be more convincing if you played in some form of a pro-Town manner.
In addition, what's the point of a pressure wagon if there's no chance of it leading to a lynch?

WOOSH.

I absolutely don't understand this hate but I'll play your game.

Martyr time. You lynch me, I'm town, you get lynched. I mean since I'm so CLEARLY scum and my myriad of posts are OBVIOUSLY just scum fueled drivel well.

And pressure is pressure and wagons are wagons. The fact that from a handful of posts you've pulled out SCUM FOUND is the headdesk part.

Why Budja in particular, considering we brought up the same points at about the same time? (And considering ConfidAnon's the one with the wagon)

I'd swing to any of the musketeers. However, I find budjas repeated rationales for said business with the fallback of "ohh ya and wagons are good" to be enough to keep the vote.

And considering how awesome wagons are at this point Confid's being the wagon of choice is about as swaying as four monkeys doing the hula. Naked. In tahiti. During mid summer.

[SpyreX]

Ahaha I forgot all about that rule.

That DOES kind of give me better feelings about hiphop since scum would have just messaged for the modkill / penality / whatever happens.

Sigh, gg SpyreX

[SpyreX]

This thread has some go-juice. Again.

I do like crypto's 307 quite a bit - even if I don't agree with it. I think Mam is pretty town thus far BUT the approach makes sense and is solid - especially for playing catchup.

However, once again, lets look at where my vote lays:

I didn't really notice ConfidAnon until he was pointed out. His comment of Spyrex being too defensive was bad. He comes of as very passive/going with the flow. Moderatly scummy.

I can't say Spyrex has done much to change my opinion of him. Dislike early claim, I'm assuming that the martyr claim is not a joke.

crypto's push on Maemuki seems silly. There are better wagons.

CSL is a bit scummy. A bit iffy here as it seems to be his meta. But I do really dislike his 203.

I feel no need to shift my vote.

First off trust me if I'm going to claim, you'll know it. Martyr is a function of the PLAY, nothing else. However, that does beg the question of what in the hell would a roleclaim have to do with your reasoning that I am scummy (meta + wagons are good).

Then, in the glorious light that is qualitatitive langue we see a "silly" push on someone when there are better wagons (note the lack of alignment on either of them for this) AND back to meta and "a bit scummy".

Yea, I will be pushing this wagon. I

guarantee

there's scum on that early shift and all signs point to the musketeers who are down a member.

Pads 321 is... something?

Alright, that wagon was fun, but we have plenty of other leads now, and I see no reason good enough to stay on it (it was my random vote anyway). That's not to say I think SpyreX has been particularly pro-town. His responses have had components of both self righteous bristling (town) and dismissive, redirecting (scum).

I'm not sure how many fences one could put together to build a house of fences but, yea. If you asked me what his read of me was after that paragraph I couldn't tell you. And there's an unvote.

RedCoyote's logic in 333 is solid (although I'd disagree with crypto and sigma as scum (and due to the post-count a little less weary of hiphop) and budja as town).

---

MORE LATER (400 wordsish)

[SpyreX]

All other issues aside, I am 100% behind 414. To the depths of hell with information paralysis.

(I'll be talking in real time while I wait for more catchup, spirit of the letter and all).

[SpyreX]

MORE catchup, ffs:

@SpyreX: Your posts. They're white noise. You say "but it's early". I say "I don't care", partly because my posts are NOT white noise and neither are a handful of others'. You say "you can't find scum on page 5". I say "lol why not". You say "I don't know who to stick with between ConfidAnon and the people on your wagon". I say "gee I wonder why, considering ConfidAnon is the more likely one to be scum". You say "I dare you to lynch me and see what happens". I say "I think you're bluffing and I'll take you up on the offer, but I can't lynch you by myself".

1.) Illustrate my "white noise" not playing the game posts complete with post numbers.
2.) If I am SCUM FOUND and, as you have said this isn't a case based on meta, and you had it nailed down by page 5 go ahead and show what/how.
3.) Confid was on my wagon. And was one of the three people I specifically called out for it. The fact that I find Budja's business worse is not a function of anything with Confid's play.
4.) I want this post to be remembered. Dayvig, we be tight, right. Let it be known. Like I'd bluff about this.

----

Crypto 341 AGAIN I like the theory even if I still disagree with the results.

IK 361 and Pads previous posts thus mentioned could make babies that would produce enough fences for everyone in the multiverse.

EP is going to be a VI. Calling this now. Emphasis on the V.

Hoopla has turned on the awesome gears.

@RC: 441 - I'm not seeing scum motivation for sigma's early move. I would have loved to explore that MORE but the world kinda collapsed so.

IK saying he replaces out every time as scum may be one of the most :headdesk: statements I've ever seen. However, the risk-reward suggests that this is a town move.

Pads 454 actually gives a stance on me but good lord is it qualified.

[SpyreX]

Weighing in at a 7 posts with less words than our post limit is I give you the NUMBER. ONE. CHAMPION.

Budja, come on down!

Yes, and good.
I dislike that method.

Spyrex's play seems unusually passive (especially for him)

.

I agree with charter on EP, hitogoroshi.

RF looks like he is being silly but not scummy.

unvote, vote: Spyrex for the above and to get on the bandwagon.

I don't need pages of posts to see that your acting differently SpyreX.

Being very passive is a scumtell anyway. Random sillyness is fine to a limit, but your posts have shown no real opinions/suspicion/anything.

The fact that this is far removed from your normal play (as I have seen it) is a bonus.

Also early bandwagons are good .

I didn't really notice ConfidAnon until he was pointed out. His comment of Spyrex being too defensive was bad. He comes of as very passive/going with the flow. Moderatly scummy.

I can't say Spyrex has done much to change my opinion of him. Dislike early claim, I'm assuming that the martyr claim is not a joke.

crypto's push on Maemuki seems silly. There are better wagons.

CSL is a bit scummy. A bit iffy here as it seems to be his meta. But I do really dislike his 203.

I feel no need to shift my vote.

So, I'm the numero uno because of meta AND the fact that bandwagons are good.

Which then is backed up by the quote 2 statement that

is wrong

is delectable parroting AND well we better reinforce that bandwagons are good (TM).

Then holding on because apparently meta is still meta and I must STILL be being passive / have no opinions...and adding in an early claim (which wasn't).

Pro tips on looking soo deeply for claims though. Hmmm, its a mystery. (Yea, you'll notice one whole post is bolded because well that all ties into the world of the UNKNOWN)

[SpyreX]

Because I think budja is scum and would thusly like him to be lynched?

Pops is ehhh.

[SpyreX]

I did what now? Did I...say that?

[SpyreX]

Ohhh hayyy 542.

Thats all I've gotta say about that.

So, whats this new crypto-slapfight? I see IIoA mentioned. However, I don't see how IIoA had anything to do with what was going on (unless it was pops AGREEING that crypto's business with rofl was bad?)

In short. What in the hell?

[SpyreX]

Contextually it STILL doesn't make sense to me:

Crypto: Roflcopter, too much summary and too little analysis is not a convincing case given our options. That said, I'm not terribly interested in debating this with you. (this would be saying Rofl is utilizing IIoA, one would assume)

Pops: IioA is one of the best tells ever. For serious. (This is pops agreeing)

Crypto: Yeah, I knew I shouldn't have said that but I did anyway. Confused I can't recall seeing it in any of my games. (This just doesn't make sense in the above).

I'm apparently just not connecting the dots. What is it that I'm missing?

[SpyreX]

Yes, 573 makes the issue make more sense.

The only scenario in which this would make sense for scum-crypto (more than just mistake-crypto) would be if Infinis was scum as well and even THEN it seems a bit early to the party.

[SpyreX]

I'm still holding on to Budja because seriously now.

I'll go through and give Infinis another look but at best he's the moon to Budjas sun of scumminess.

[SpyreX]

I'm going to do it.

I'm going to be THAT GUY.

I just reread Infinis. AGAIN, while I'm not agreeing with his reads I think the IIoA call is a bit out of point in this - I think he's p town.

HOWEVER, I'm baffled at crypto's 588:

Why jump on a wagon on someone not that scummy (we still got SOME time before this has went on too long today). Why pre-call out the bussing?

[SpyreX]

Spyrex, what differentiates budja from infinis? they seem p much the same to me.

Go REALLY read them in iso.

Infinis is, even if wrongly,

trying

. Especially in some of his town reads.

Budja....
well...
ya.

Crypto - go zen. Deep breaths. "I will not self destruct. I am not a VI. I will help lynch Bujda because he deserves it."

[SpyreX]

Ohh rofl shine on you crazy bunny.

So, instead of me being scum for not following this case praytell what makes budja so apparently town no one wants to talk about him but me?

[SpyreX]

Crypto gets a shiny <3.

After this fiasco I'd be down with an elvis lynch as well as Budja. Semantics are sweeetttt.

Although, IF Crypto is a scum (whcih, again makes no sense) I'd put IK in front of a bullet asap.

These truths are self evident.

[SpyreX]

Le Sigh.

Unless you think this is going to be a bastardly game the N0 kills ARE saying there is:

No Cult, No Bomb, No Jester, No Priest, No Mayor, No Golden Retreiver AND that BOTH Mafia 1 and 2 don't have a Don.

[SpyreX]

@ Everyone who is making excuses to cover crypto: why are you making excuses?

Hi, my name is unnecessarily loaded question, how are you doing today?

LOOK, can we all just come together, hold hands and lynch Budja. Its the right choice, and we all know it deep in our hearts.

[SpyreX]

You know we could all just do the mod a fav and go ahead and lynch Budja.

Just saying.

I mean after all that hard work not keeping up, wagoning, defending said wagon under not one but multiple spurious (and mimicked) reasons.

We should just give that spot a rest. A permanent one.

[SpyreX]

I'll set my own trends. For now.

I'm not sure what the secret 2KOOL decoder ring this game is to get people to LOOK AT YOUR CASE but seriously the "everyone else is doin it" doesn't get me all stoked for a case.

[SpyreX]

Ohh CSL could use a rope/bullet as well. No questions there. As well as e_k.

That doesn't change the fact that Budja jumped on a spurious wagon under spurious reasons and then tried to turn on the cruise control for cool.

[SpyreX]

Why you gotta mute me? I WILL NOT BE SILENCED. DOWN WITH THE PROLETARIAT.

That said I agree with 758.

[SpyreX]

God I haven't played on there in forever. That would be, by far, the WORST role to exist on MS.

EM = epicmafia. Go there if you want your brain to melt.

And I like pops's a bit dramatic personification of replacements. They are a bane.

Mod Note: Oh how I yearn for the day that I'm well enough respected to run a bastard mod setup and include silencers.!

[SpyreX]

In one page from 8 to 15.

YEeeeaaaa, something tells me this isn't going to end well.

[SpyreX]

Color me curious. Dare I ask why?

[SpyreX]

That is a series of words.

Unfortunately they don't seem to have meaning.

(P.S. I fully expect you to flip town due to the sheer speed of that awesome wagon)

[SpyreX]

While Scotty is leaps and bounds better than Budja that still is *GASP* where my vote is.

E_K has done minimal to give one those delicious vibes.

After your flip there will be some serious analysis, doubly so if you are town (if you are town no WAY that wagon doesn't have scum crawling all over it)

[SpyreX]

Ohh shi we've went around the horn and now we're BOTH scum?

Huzzah!

If CSL is town I would guess that no LESS than four scum are on that wagon.

[SpyreX]

Only this game generates this much activity during, in essence, twilight.

Yea, if CSL flips scum just go ahead and shoot me and save that whole business tomorrow.

However, when he flips town because that was quite the amazing wagon lets go ahead and rip it apart and shake all the delicious scums off it.

[SpyreX]

Actually, Charter, roflcopter, Vi, sigma, Pads, and Sotty7 were all on both the Confid and CSL wagons. I get the feeling that at least half of these folks are scum, if not more.

I agree, to an extent. HALF may be pushing it - I don't expect them to be THAT obvious.

However, of that list, I'd definitely not be surprised to see a third. Namely Pads and another (Vi / Sotty / charter). Not sure yet though.

But, back to the big one:

CSL (801) - RedCoyote, sigma, Pads, Idiotking, crypto, popsofctown, roflcopter, Infinis, charter, hiphop, Idiotking, Hoopla, imaginality, Vi

Of THAT list the ones that make me go huh are: Pads, pops, charter, hiphop. Vi, if scum, is probably not scum WITH imaginality.

---

Now, on a setup line - the kills last night DONT make full sense to me. With a dayvig yesterday AND three last night that lends one to think (Mafia/Mafia/SK). However, why in the hells bells would they kill crypto after all the flak? If it wasn't for the vig yesterday I would have all but assumed that was a vig shot - but two vigs? Unlikely.

I'm missing something (and I don't think its as clear cut as Vi's business on e_k) but it'll come to me.

---

THAT SAID:

Vote: Pads

Vig, shoot e_k plox

[SpyreX]

Sans one major issue in your conclusions (and the non-addition of Pads) I could get behind that list.

[SpyreX]

obv i understand you disagreeing with me calling you scum. but i hope you understand where it comes from, since imag directly defended you in his first post.

otherwise, yes, pads could very, very easily be the guy on imag's "town" list that is a scumpartner. he's still not the best lynch today because of the weight of evidence against elvis, mae and idiotking.

another note: imag totally ignores a lot of people, but ignoring vi (by far the loudest player in the game) is definitely quirky. don't know what to make of it yet.

Yea, and of course I'm of the mind that was pre-prep for a bus of one of his buddies who was on it.

I'm on Pads for the lynch because I'm rooting for the vig to shoot ek. If that doesn't happen I'll swap.

[SpyreX]

Xyl is it TOO early to be your bff?

Tell me which is better:

1. We kill the most likely scum by lynch, and the day- killer kills his second person as scum or,

2. we let the day-killer kills the scummiest player, and the town argues over who will be lynched.

Not sure what you're aimin for here in general but I'll bite.

Regardless of what is picked the end results are important - like the shot yesterday on a growing wagon.

Personally, I'd do the simple (much like yesterday) - once someone has that for mad reals push take the shot. See the flip. Assess. Wagon to lynch. Pretty standard.

Because, of course, the part you're not REALLY addressing is how much information is actually gained from the flip of the first shot. Thats the good stuff.

[SpyreX]

I'm not down with Vi's lynch - the weird wagon on me early doesn't make sense as a scum maneuver (especially with all the gravity it created).

Further, I'm p sure that Vi is NOT scum with imaginality due to the votecounts and although I still fully expect two scum groups with the ambiguous flip one will assume one... thus that limits the options.

I'll go into detail on Pads (Don't you think I've forgot Budja regardless of the replacement play) tomorrow but if you asked me to place a clear stance on anything Pads is down for I couldn't.

Which is extremely disconcerting when you consider the wagons he's been on.

[SpyreX]

Not "TOWN" points but definitely "NOT SCUM WTIH IMAGIN" points:

Jumping back to back with a scum partner is a high risk / low reward scenario. WIFOM all you want but votecounts create ties that, generally, partners aren't going to make.

NOW, if Vi was power <3 on Imagine AND followed his votes around like a puppy sure. As it sits, nah.

[SpyreX]

Choo choo goes the vig.

Now, Pads.

[SpyreX]

And yes, for the lazy who didn't look:

Scum can't daytalk this game. Which means especially towards endgame watch for filibustering when they're trying to align a lylo lynch.

[SpyreX]

I'm definitely not opposed to hiphop.

This, again, is a bizarre case of deja vu though so I'm sticking to Pads and even try to get the gumption to give a case before capitulation.

[SpyreX]

I don't know what to make of the Mae quote quoted by Xyl. It COULD be an amazing scum move but I just don't know.

However:

Ok, reread.

I am like 100% sure Ray is town.
EP is scummy early on.
sigma still seems town. Also, he's the only person alive in Elvis's 295 scumlist, so he's probably town.
RedCoyote is probably town.
Mae is probably scum.
Sotty, unfortunately, is probably not town.
Infinis is still scummy, even after whoever died.
EP is scummy midday as well.
I think that if EP is scum, rofl is his buddy. EP keep giving Hoopla flak about bandwagoning, but never mentioned rofl doing it.
Besides that, rofl is pretty neutral.
Still think pops is scum, but I'll deal with that later.

Anyone not mentioned didn't catch my eye.

I'd lynch Mae or EP. Despite the slimyness of Vi's vote on Mae, and her general scumminess with regards to all things Mae, there was quite a bit that suggested Mae was scum with Elvis.
unvote, vote Vi

Despite the giant :headdesk: lodged in there (it can be a secret for now).

I've got one big issue: In your reread you had NOTHING to say about me (and thus a function of crazyworld)?

[SpyreX]

But I was scum last twilight?

I just don't understand.

[SpyreX]

Vi gets, again, the "I'm not scum WITH imaginality but if there are two scumgroups like I would surmise I could be part of the the other group" points.

[SpyreX]

SpyreX looks a lot dodgier to me on re-read. SpyreX, you were all "lynch Budja" on D1 and that completely disappeared on D2. I know he replaced out and all, but why did you completely drop this case? replacements don't affect the role.

No, but replacements that are playing townier sure make it harder to push a lynch. (and, by nature give some level of hesitation)

THAT SAID...what?

I still would get behind a Budja lynch. Or a hiphop lynch. Or a pads lynch.

[SpyreX]

Because that power wagon reeked of the style that scum will jump all over? Yea.

My issues with Mae are far less about the ek and far more about the general jumpiness. Which, ultimately, doesn't strike me as near as lynchworthy as others.

As for the reads well every lynch is going to be informative. That's not gonna make me all giddy.

[SpyreX]

I love how many people I get to be scum with. Its awesome.

SpyreX? He traded some toothless conversation with me on Day 1, but that's about it.

Toothless? I have plenty of teeth. I thought I made it pretty clear with my fence analogy AND the qualfiers that I found you to be absolutely wafflescum in regards to me yesterday.

Are you being ironic or is it just my imagination?

What? I'm not voting for you (if that is the implied irony).

Although:

Well, that's the only useful thing that my lynch is going to make anyway.

I would defend myself, but my fate is sealed. My only hope is to out as many scum as possible with my lynch (coughrccough)

If you're gonna just throw up your hands I sure as hell will be.

[SpyreX]

Charter said Vi and I were scum together.

Pads just said Hit and I are scum together.

Its just a fun little game.

Good lord I didn't realize you were at 7. Yea.

[SpyreX]

FFFFF

Unvote, Vote Maemuki

Even in your analysis you promised more analysis and now you're throwing in the towel.

Yea.

[SpyreX]

I'm starting to get some real bad jujubies from sigma too. Especially 1126 just oozes sliminess.

TOMORROW can we lynch Pads or Budja please? GOD

[SpyreX]

How abouts we shoot one lynch the other?

[SpyreX]

I

always

know where my towel is.

As for budja it appears to just be my two heads talking (although there was some nibbles that were "OHH REPLACEMENT TECH BUDJA WIN") but its day will come.

Soon. Especially after the stellar late-day play by the entity known as Budja to the body.

a) what does 'sliminess' even mean?
b) how is it a scum-tell exactly?

To be slimy. In this instance some pro-grade cheering on Mae.

Note, this ONLY really applies if Mae is town.

[SpyreX]

Now, see, the timing of the above (and the fact that right there is a TRUE IIoA) would make me push to power shift this if not for the defeatism.

[SpyreX]

There's not enough bullets. NOT ENOUGH.

[SpyreX]

^

This. More and moreso.

Infinis could meet his maker tonight versus the other by a TINY margin assuming that one can't shoot both of them.

[SpyreX]

Charter wouldn't make me cry.

Hippyhoppy either.

However, *gasp* I still would like a pads / shotty lynchshot.

And if I was a vig just go ahead and shoot infinis in the face kthx.

Unvote, Vote: Pads

[SpyreX]

If one can make a compelling argument sure. I'm just not seeing it though.

I've seen a lot of fences and a lot of words but not a lot of content.

[SpyreX]

No, I said the vig should shoot elvis. Which they did. Under the guise that it wasn't going to happen then I would have hopped my vote.

Just like how I thought the Mae case was junk until Mae opted to give up.

[SpyreX]

OMGUS

NO U

Unvote, Vote: Hiphop

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 3

hiphop ( 3 ) Xylthixlm Sotty7 SpyreX
Shotty to the Body ( 0 )
charter ( 4 ) roflcopter Shotty to the Body hiphop RayFrost
fhqwhgads ( 0 )
hitogoroshi ( 0 )
Idiotking ( 0 )
Infinis ( 0 )
Xylthixlm ( 0 )
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
Zakeri ( 0 )
RayFrost ( 0 )
RedCoyote ( 0 )
roflcopter ( 0 )
Sotty7 ( 0 )
SpyreX ( 0 )
Unvote ( 9 ) charter fhqwhgads hitogoroshi idiotking Infinis Pads popsofctown Zakeri RedCoyote
Total Votes ( 16 )

With 16 alive, 9 needed to reach a majority.
Deadline is at December 12th, 4pm EST

I'd still love that vig to come in and do some bidness too.

I'd actually be far more inclined to believe charter-scum if infinis is shot and flips scum. There's a weird dynamic with charter and his voting for infinis this game.

[SpyreX]

Last person who told me this was scum.

The last person that told you that you were defacing the attack on someone by calling it omgus when even if that WERE true it has little to do with anything and is a third party in the whole affair was scum?

Thats mind blowing.

[SpyreX]

Key words, I think. Not "I know". Charter made, what you believe, one bad attack on pops, I made, what you believe, one bad attack on you. The difference is, I attacked you. In fact your whole case on me is OMGUS.

You went:

This situation is similiar on a surface level to a different situation.

The difference is I attacked you.

Thus, your reasons are OMGUS.

My deep philosophical input was that this is silly and lynchworthy.

[SpyreX]

I see what you're attempting to say.

I voted for you because its moonbeams.

If you actually believed it was some kind of handwaving why would you not take an offensive stance instead of just simply trying to make the vote weaker.

[SpyreX]

Why in the ass would you out yourself with a smattering of nothing on you at this point?

[SpyreX]

Welp pops is town.

[SpyreX]

So, two deaths this time?

As awesome as that one was, I have a REAL hard time stomaching that the charter shot was done by town. Just a fyi

Couple other notes. SpyreX goes on the back burner until hito flips. Hiphop hurt himself a lot yesterday, but there's a tinge of new player in the air. Going to re-read him before I cast a yea/nay to his wagon.

I was front burner? Ever?

Even though I know this isn't happenin', can we pleeese lynch pads?

----

Zakeri is IN this game? Woosh.

[SpyreX]

Hito has been since early on holding hands with charter which under NORMAL circumstances would be damning but with the mod-information stating that even if they were scum they wouldn't have known at the point it started happening... I find it kind of null.

Now his Iso 30 is bothersome - but I still think that it was a case of not wanting to repeat perceived mistakes instead of "I'll try to protect my scumbuddy knowing I'm screwed if he gets lynched"

---

Idiotking has done flat nothing. I would be behind this lynch.

---

Now, since I played nice nice, care explaining to me why Pads is soo town with that elaborate me-too post and the weird I'm back burner now statement?

[SpyreX]

If one wanted to get all :smug: about it I called CSL as a town lynch, wanted E_k dead, and found the case on Mae to be junk until they opted to give up.

The only one that got me was charter post-claim. It added up with his business and I sure wouldn't have pushed that one in the near future.

[SpyreX]

...and I think I recall you giving Vi a thumbs up as well. Not that any of us outside of charter, I think, seriously considered a scumVi theory. Anyways, that's fair, but if you really think you have a good pulse on the game, what are the odds that hiphop is going to flip scum?

I forgot all about Vi just because I was still trying to parse the early wagon business on me.

Odds on hiphop flipping scum are solid (Although we're gonna give a different lynch the old fashioned try). 1310 is a LOT of words and yet still doesn't do a whole bunch for me. It really feels like words for the sake of words.

You were in the toaster.

...

Most of my suspicion of you is based on the idea that you were buddies with Hito. Is it all that strange that I want to see the flip of Hito, who I find far more scummy, before I attempt to start a wagon on you?

Woosh.

Lets go look at the way back machine.

unvote: SpyreX

Alright, that wagon was fun, but we have plenty of other leads now, and I see no reason good enough to stay on it (it was my random vote anyway). That's not to say I think SpyreX has been particularly pro-town. His responses have had components of both self righteous bristling (town) and dismissive, redirecting (scum).

But it's posts like Post 283 that swayed me the most to take my vote off of him. Scum or town it looks like he's been reduced to his base components, so to speak; his more primal reactions. He's not going to be of any actual aid to the town like that, and he's not going to give me a good enough read to call him scum posting in such a manner.

If I were prodded with a hot poker to choose scum or town, I would say town, frazzled by the pressure that was put on him.

Lynches I approve of:
Maemuki
Vi
Charter (I realize I haven't talked about this one yet)

Lynches I view less favorably, but would still go along with.
RayFrost
Hitogoroshi
Elvis_Knits (A flip from an earlier post, caused by her finding a contentless vote scummy, and the ensuing baseless attack)

Lynches that would be highly informative, but I don't expect to find scum
SpyreX
CSL

I'd find some way to live with myself if Ray_Frost, Roflcopter, or Hitogoroshi were the next lynched.

I can't decide if I want to think of SpyreX as scummier or more town for his suddenly cockier tone. With no wagon in his past, I'd say townier, hands down. But a scum may feel like he's 'beaten the rap'.

Yea, that looks like a front burner case.

Lets look at what ties hit and I together though:

SpyreX? He traded some toothless conversation with me on Day 1, but that's about it.

Come Day 2, and you both make a beeline for me. That utterly reeks of scum making a plan of attack during the night phase.

So, you find switching opinions townlike and SpyreX finds it scummy? I'm sure this will give you both a lot to talk about. SpyreX joins you on my scumlist, as per the aforementioned reeking.

Annndddd thats the extent of it. Huzzah! A whole lot of words for "you both voted me".

Unvote, Vote: Pads

I'll be fair in rereading the only thing that gives me pause is:

The lifeless corpses of Maemuki, Vi, Elvis_Knits, and Charter all hanging from a tree would make for a nice wind chime set.

But, of course, this is before Charter was converted I think soo...

[SpyreX]

Yes I'm throwing a tantrum.

Actually, my issue is "on the back burner" implies that at some point I was "not on the back burner".

Which, by your own explanation of what your metaphor would have meant would be "the current focus"

Which, from the quotes I found from you about me absolutely doesn't make sense.

Unless your current focus is on someone who each time you jump off the fence you come down and say is town.

Until he votes you. Then he's scum.

[SpyreX]

<3

Yea. Hiphop un Pads dos ropos.

[SpyreX]

I don't like the apologetic mousey 1335 at all. It oozes fake from every pour.

Enough that I could get behind that wagon assuming Pads, yet again, is gonna be free.

[SpyreX]

A multi-word apology doesn't do it for me. Especially with the "you want me to strangle myself" after.

I'm definitely not subscribing to the elvis list being a rosetta stone for scum.

However the bad-dog pose with the puppy dog eyes does little for me.

And painting all the votes as if they are a function of that, well.

Unvote, Vote: IK

[SpyreX]

Xyl I have the greatest love/hate relationship with you this game. I swear.

Pickin' out town seems to be a LOT easier than picking out scum (especially when I SUPER don't have whatever the Konami code is to get them lynched).

IK not putting up a fight is... baffling. I don't like it but I'm having a hard time sorting out if the more it goes on its because I think he's scum OR if its just such a drastically different method of approaching the issues that is makes me think he's scum.

That said I've got THREE other solid town reads that apparently I better not say because then they die.

[SpyreX]

.... Did Ray SAY that?

Have I missed a glowing lynch me sign?

[SpyreX]

....

So, lets just sum up what's just happened:

RayFrost goes hyperlurker under the grounds of SECRET PI INVESTIGATION.
IK, then, goes bi-polar from hyper apologetic to nothing to see here.
Xyl then votes fhq for lurking (see point 1).

I have no words.

[SpyreX]

You are here, you should REALLY answer that Ray.

Allow me to help:

Unvote, Vote: Ray

[SpyreX]

... Yea.

This is happening.

[SpyreX]

Hey, lets not lose sight of the fact Pads just used a lot of words to say "If Ray IS scum, well, lynch me because I'm his partner"

[SpyreX]

Again, I could easily switch to Pads, just sayin.

In fact, if anything, this is giving me that "defending the plane on fire" vibes quite a bit.

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 3

hiphop ( 1 ) - Sotty7
shotty to the body ( 0 )
fhqwhgads ( 0 )
hitogoroshi ( 2 ) - Pads - RayFrost
Idiotking ( 0 )
Xylthixlm ( 0 )
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
Zakeri ( 0 )

RayFrost ( 8 ) - idiotking - SpyreX - Xylthixlm - roflcopter - popsofctown - hitogoroshi - Shotty to the Body - fhqwhgads

RedCoyote ( 0 )
roflcopter ( 0 )
Sotty7 ( 0 )
SpyreX ( 0 )
Unvote ( 3 ) - zakeri - hiphop - RedCoyote
Total Votes ( 14 )

With 14 alive, 8 needed to reach a majority.
Majority reached. Plurality will be lynched at 3:45pm EST Friday, December 4th

Hey, lets be fair: That was only mimicing Xyl's tinfoil at my awesomeness.

[SpyreX]

Nah. Enticing offer though.

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 3

hiphop ( 1 ) - Sotty7
shotty to the body ( 0 )
fhqwhgads ( 1 ) - idiotking
hitogoroshi ( 2 ) - Pads - RayFrost
Idiotking ( 1 ) - fhqwhgads
Xylthixlm ( 0 )
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
Zakeri ( 0 )

RayFrost ( 5 ) - SpyreX - Xylthixlm - roflcopter - hitogoroshi - Shotty to the Body

RedCoyote ( 0 )
roflcopter ( 0 )
Sotty7 ( 0 )
SpyreX ( 0 )
Unvote ( 4 ) - zakeri - hiphop - RedCoyote - popsofctown
Total Votes ( 14 )

With 14 alive, 8 needed to reach a majority.
Majority reached. Plurality will be lynched at 3:45pm EST Friday, December 4th

The only thing in your favor is those kills have been REAL nice to have.

I have a really hard time stomaching letting you live though.

Did you kill infinis and not charter for reals?

[SpyreX]

See I'm ok with that BUT that means something REALLY wonky happened with the charter kill then.

If you're claiming the vig kills we've seen (sans that one) as an SK - charter claims vig and gets killed... but it wouldn't be by the mafia.

AND if that day kill wasn't town then what in the HELL is going on at night - you've claimed your kills were during the day which means we had THREE night 1 that weren't you?

God in heaven that is a lot of kills

[SpyreX]

Hmm, that may be the case Xyl. Maybe.

Lets look at this though with the premise that RF is being truthful:

Day 1: ConfidAnon the Vanilla Townie was killed - RF
Night 1: imaginality the Mafia Roleblocker was killed
Night 1: crypto the Vanilla Townie was killed
Night 1: Hoopla the Vanilla Townie was killed
Day 2: elvis_knits the Mafia Mason was killed - RF
Night 2: Sigma the Vanilla Townie was killed
Night 2: Vi the Vanilla Townie was killed
Day 3: Infinis the Vanilla Townie was killed - RF
Day 3: charter the Mafia Roleblocker and ex-Traitor Vigilante was killed

First off looking at it like this GOOD LORD.

So, assuming Ray's explanation of events is honest...yea, I'm kinda scared / becoming convinced that we don't have a day vig and its 2 scum groups and 2 SK's (flavor suggests some madness of this sort as well, but)

The day/night cycle and some of the targets would have this make sense. Although looking at the above the crypto kill STILL stands out as a :wtf:.

[SpyreX]

If thats the case then :gonk: though because then RF would just be plain lying? Or our vig needs to grow a pair?

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 3

hiphop ( 1 ) - Sotty7
shotty to the body ( 0 )
fhqwhgads ( 1 ) - idiotking
hitogoroshi ( 2 ) - Pads - RayFrost
Idiotking ( 1 ) - fhqwhgads
Xylthixlm ( 0 )
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
Zakeri ( 0 )

RayFrost ( 4 ) - SpyreX - Xylthixlm - roflcopter - Shotty to the Body

RedCoyote ( 0 )
roflcopter ( 0 )
Sotty7 ( 0 )
SpyreX ( 0 )
Unvote ( 5 ) - zakeri - hiphop - RedCoyote - popsofctown - hitogoroshi
Total Votes ( 14 )

With 14 alive, 8 needed to reach a majority.
Majority reached. Plurality will be lynched at 3:45pm EST Friday, December 4th

Well.... hells bells.

Do we power wagon someone else to...save the SK?

[SpyreX]

Woosh.

I'd really be pro shotty, pads, fhqhqhhedas getting some bullets for this, ps.

[SpyreX]

I will be more than glad to push a shotty lynch IF, and I swear to god I mean this, that it means that if he's scum Pads goes the way of the dodo tomorrow.

If not, I'm not going to try and spaz out in however small amount of time from when that magic clock started in trying to do it.

[SpyreX]

Actually I haven't even looked for connections so my caveat doesn't need to be there.

I just think they're both scum v0v

[SpyreX]

I'm gonna be out for a good chunk of the rest of tonight but needless to say:

Unvote, Vote: Shotty

There's a whole mess of SECRET INFORMATION I think to pull from this. Its obvious enough that if I am the dead someone else can do it (but not obvious enough I want to spell it out if he doesn't get killed / before the night actions come in).

[SpyreX]

While I understand Xyl's sentiment I still see a lot of upside to RF being around even ANOTHER day - because, realistically, we've been hitting mafia and its not like we're gonna see a WHOOPS SURPRISE LYLO in the next few days.

RF goes off-cocked, gets lynched.
Starts hitting town, gets lynched.
Run out of scum, gets lynched.

I mean, yea, he has a chance* to pull it out but I find it so minimal that I'm not gonna sweat it at this point.

[SpyreX]

Of course this is all based on him not lying about being SK which COULD be some kinda magnificent move (I find it unlikely but).

[SpyreX]

Ultimately he doesn't have a choice.

No way in hell is he going to get to pick his shots.

Even if we end up lynching him tomorrow I'd still like to have one more shot.

[SpyreX]

Hence the vote on one of the fairly lurking votes that led us to this spot.

I mean, realistically we could 180 and go back to hiphop or IK.

[SpyreX]

In MOST cases I would agree.

In this one with a kajillion kills floating around AND scum getting offed left and right I see it a bit different.

However I think its moot because *gasp* its the little group of us discussing it when we can do very, very little about it.

[SpyreX]

Ohh believe you me I still think you're pretty damn town.

I think we're just having a disagreement on theory, for the most part.

That is unless, of course, Shotty is scum. Then we might have a talk. ESPECIALLY if he's different scum.

[SpyreX]

I tend to see multi-kills as more painful than not and even with the kills I DO worry that mislynches on scum are going to cost us the damn game since I don't ever expect cross kills.

So, having a shot AND a lynch helps out enough that it balances some.

[SpyreX]

Ohh I could see trying this stunt as an SK.

Doesn't change that in this particular situation I'd still want it.

[SpyreX]

You know what the best part about that is?

Every other time he's brought up my desire to see that spot lynched since the days of Budja it's been mellow yellow.

This time, SERIOUS BUSINESS.

Now, if I'm around tomorrow I'll give you a real case. Doubly so if we kill RF and get woosh.

If I'm dead just assume I gave a lot of awesome words and lynch them both for me. Or, at the VERY least I want at least TWO of you sillies to go through and iso him real close. Real real close.

[SpyreX]

It helps me. See, eventually the deluge of VI's and silly SK's will be done with and we can get to serious business.

Just because NOW isn't the time doesn't change the fact that it will be later.

Fume all you want though. All things come to those who wait. My pet lynch list isn't going anywhere and if we, in essence, waste this lynch on the SK then maybe there wont be a huge list of secret connections and the related funny business and I can actually get traction goin.

[SpyreX]

Yes, I have indeed been tunneling. I also have made no serious posts about either you or Pads.

I AM UNDONE.

[SpyreX]

RC sure feels like he went way over the top on his last post. Especially that last line.

If pops has a case of the stupids, well I do too.

Unvote, Vote RayFrost

I still would have rather bagged a scum. Now, if this was some TECH GAMBIT and he flips scum well more the fool me.

Its not happenin' though.

[SpyreX]

Overall I agree with RC's results. No way he investigated the group above.

Of all the possibilities, I'm leaning hardest on the investigation being fhq.

Expect my shotty business in the nearest of futures. That and Pads.

Unless, of course, a vig wants to be a helper.

[SpyreX]

Now, hiphop is unquestionably crazy in his logic for voting RC but I'm not seeing how that makes him more likely to be scum. In fact, his whole PLAY this day sans that vote is the most townie I've seen him this game.

Enough that, duh, I am not down with a hiphop lynch today OR an RC lynch.

That said, why in the world is there talk of a backup?

[SpyreX]

So, between Zak and Psych we have 8 posts?

Really?

[SpyreX]

Woosh.

This game I swear.

Unvote, Vote: Zak

No foolin. IF WE HAVE A VIG PLEASE DO NOT DICK AROUND AND JUST SHOOT ZAK RIGHT NOW KTHX.

This is happening today.

[SpyreX]

Anyways, since I said I would:

Lets get our flow on (THIS IS NOT THE FULL CASE WORD LIMITS R HARD):

(Note, a lot of this is extrapolation based on the concept you're not going to jump with people you find scum without issue)

Iso 1:
Scum:

CSL

,

Vi

, IK
Scum for jumping on Crypto:

Elvis

, Penguin,

Rofl

Town:

Hoopla

, Pops

Neutral: Mae, Spyre, Crypto, Charter, Hito, Sigma

Luker Callout

Iso 10:
Scum: IK
Scummy:

Ek

,

Vi

Iso 12:
Town:

Hoopla

Iso 13:
Scum:

Rayfrost

, RC,

Sigma

Town:

Vi

, Hiphop

Iso 17:
Town: IK
Scum:

Mae

(Due to rofl's posts)

Iso 18:
Town: SpyreX, Pads,

Rofl

, Xyl,

Vi

Scummy: Pops
Scum:

Infinis

,

Rayfrost

,

Sigma

, Hiphop,

Charter

Iso 19:
Neutral: Zak (Note* If Zak is scum look at this one a bit closer)

Iso 28:
Town: Pads

Iso 29:
Scum: IK
Scummy:

Rayfrost

----

The thing that gets me the most about this is how some people jump around as NOT really a function of their play but as a function of their lynchability. (And, well, rationales at all for most of this - the most concrete we normally see is "lurking")

Vi jumps from scum to town.
IK jumps from scum to town to scum.
Ray lives in scum (for lurking) but gets shifted around quite a bit.

After LURKER CALLOUT coming in he defends* Zak on "maybe they're just catching up".

And one mention of pads as super town.

Again, if Zak comes up scum, especially a different scum group, we are lynching Scotty. THEN, if he comes up partner scum I swear we're lynching Pads.

Then I will be happy.

So vig be a helper.

[SpyreX]

Figured it was clear.

And Shotty. Stupid names, so close together.

[SpyreX]

Pads, still and forever, is scummy for the amazing amount of waffling early game. Just fabulous amount.

[SpyreX]

The key difference is that your focus is FAR more a function of lynchability than being scum. That being scummy I think is fairly self evident.

Like I said, its not done. There will be more. After Zak gets SHOT IN THE FACE VIG HINT HINT.

[SpyreX]

...

We had 2 day kills right? One was Ray? The other one was ??? Or am I losing my mind with this game AGAIN.

[SpyreX]

Something still isn't adding up with the kills then but whatevs.

Zak needs to be lynched, ASAP. Seriously lurkers quit lurking because SOME of you have to be town and get this done.

As for the other I love the hyper-aggressive tone with someone you've professed is town.

For that you get: nothing.

Yep. I'm not proving anything until Zak is lynched. Zak comes up DIFFERENT scum then it'll come regardless of if I'm alive tomorrow or not.

If Zak doesn't, then we'll see how it goes.

Ohh, and don't forget:

CSL ( 13 ) - RedCoyote -

sigma

- Pads -

crypto

- popsofctown -

roflcopter

-

Infinis

- shotty to the body -

charter

- hiphop - idiotking

hoopla

-

imaginality

There's still at least one scum left up there.

[SpyreX]

At least we can agree on that if Zak gets lynched versus shot anyone claiming vig dies? Deal? Deal.

Also not voting for Zak is deserving of capital punishment. BUS AWAY YOUNG BUCKS.

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 4

hiphop ( 2 ) - fhqwhgads - zakeri
shotty to the body ( 0 )
fhqwhgads ( 0 )
hitogoroshi ( 0 )
Idiotking ( 0 )
Xylthixlm ( 0 )
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
Zakeri ( 4 ) - SpyreX - Xylthixlm - idiotking - Shotty to the Body
RedCoyote ( 1 ) - hiphop
Sotty7 ( 0 )
SpyreX ( 0 )
Unvote ( 5 ) - hitogoroshi - RedCoyote - Pads - popsofctown - Sotty7
Total Votes ( 12 )


With 12 alive, 7 needed to reach a majority.
Deadline is December 18th at 4:30pm EST

High Fives all around.

Next on the list: see who's been posting in other games and not this one! Woo.

[SpyreX]

I've officially lost my mind.

I swear hoopla was scum and was basing a WHOLE mess of thought processes on it.

[SpyreX]

Or I'm retarded. What in the hellllll was I thinking?

GOD I'm officially in too many games or something.

[SpyreX]

Yea I totally never answered that before.

Sup unnecessary fear mongering. If there was 8 unified scum in this setup I will eat ALL THE HATS IN THE WORLD.

[SpyreX]

Shh Xyl don't spoil the fun.

[SpyreX]

But, what about the brohug that starts with a handshake? What then?

More importantly... where the hell IS everyone?

[SpyreX]

Hows about this one:

What do you want to discuss today that doesn't involve Zak and thus the kill?

[SpyreX]

Yea, since you've opted to leave the vote off for discussion is there anything in particular you've got? Or just a general one?

I'm suffering from both idiocy and confirmation bias so I'm trying to take it chill until we get this done.

Needless to say I agree with you on Pad's post being off kilter.

[SpyreX]

Pretty much. If Zak is scum, especially DIFFERENT and PR yea I'l throw Pads up against the wall and Shotty after. Or vice-versa.

[SpyreX]

Well the fear mongering OHH GOD THERE MAY BE EIGHT!!! SCUM THIS IS A PLOT post really didn't sit well.

Also Dogs + Shoes. I mean, come on now have you seen a dog with shoes? Rediculous.

[SpyreX]

Aside from trying to fear monger the wagon, no.

[SpyreX]

But see as we've seen after I did an elaborate analysis based on a fundamental wrong that I am too high on goofballs to look at either Pads or Shotty correctly. Sooo

[SpyreX]

And, by correctly I mean without the bias of thinking they are scum.

Yes, mass prods please. OR, you know, pops could throw that vote down.

[SpyreX]

Hit, aside from the MAD paranoia I get whenever I see you quote me and agree with it I'm diggin your style.

However, I swear to god, this lynch isn't happening today. Zak is dead walking.

[SpyreX]

I feel like I should be doing something, but mostly I just want Zakeri to

contribute or

die.

Fixed that up for you.

The series of events that would have to occur for Zak not to get lynched today are so ridiculous I'm not even gonna bank on it.

[SpyreX]

70 pages. 8 posts. The first callout was a "shrug".

No.

[SpyreX]

Takes one to know one, apparently. This town has rushed into three lynches, none of which have turned up scum (yes, I realize that one was an SK, but the point is we've only been able to lynch people the scum have wanted dead). If you want to try and convince people that my call for caution is fearmongering, then good luck to you.

What? If you're going to say I've been fearmongering well go ahead and cite it. Otherwise... yea. Now, lets look at why this is fearmongering. (I notice others have talked about how quickly you are pushing a logic train forward that is choo choo off the charts so).

Scum sure are working hard to twist the play of roflcopter.

First of all, just because roflcopter talked about his opinion of an individual which unflinching certainty, didn't mean he had investigated that individual. For proof of this, you need only look at Day 1, when he didn't have any investigations, and he directly called for the lynch of several townies, including Infinis and Crypto. He also firmly put Charter on the town list.

Thus, the revelation of who he investigated must be determined from the idiosyncrasies of his behavior, more than his declared levels of certainty.

So, let's have at it.

Roflcopter's first night investigation was Elvis_Knits.

Roflcopter had virtually nothing to say about Elvis_Knits on Day 1, but there's evidence to indicate that Roflcopter had her picked out to be his first investigation. For instance:

So, is it that we're misinterpreting this? No. Its very direct: scum are misinterpreting this on purpose and we're biting.

But, that's just the appetizer to the truly magnificent fearmongering:

I had hopes today of going with a policy lynch of Zakeri, but as I see the votes rack up on him and take a look at the vote counts, I feel the need to discuss something else first. Are we at lynch or lose?

Twenty five person game, 1/3rd would be eight scum, three are dead, leaving five. A town lynch today and a town kill tonight = 5 town, 5 scum = death. Granted, we don't know the setup, and anything from a back up vig to a lower number of starting scum (to balance out the large number of kills) will give us a little more breathing room but right now, I'd say that I'm going to let the dream of a policy lynch go.

So, disregarding the fact we've already seen an SK kill AND the opening flavor AND the damn title of the thread lets really look at this with one of my awesome paraphrases:

"Ohh I'd totally lynch the lurker but then the unified 5 scum (from their nest of eight little birdies) would WIN THE GAME. So, we can not lynch them, alas. Woe is me for not being able to lynch this target."

Oddly enough... this ends without a vote. Its a mystery.

Or, not. In fact, very, very not.

But, back to current events:

But now that you have, I know what your case against me is, and I can appropriately defend myself.

Just want this clear: Pads is saying I've never said what my problem with him is. Never. That this is the first time.

This is the part where you take an unwarranted step in reason, malicious or not. Waffling, is certainly an action often associated with scum. It's the unwillingness to make a decision when decision time has come.

But that's not what I did. At all. Not even a little bit.

What I did, was not know your alignment, and not have a strong guess as to what your alignment was. That's all. Guess what? I'm town. Townies don't know. Townies especially don't know on Day 1. I didn't know on Day 1. Heck, the way you've been playing I still don't know. I've seen townies put their fingers in their ears and focus on 1 or 2 people all game, just like you have, so your play is not without precedent. But the feeling that you're saving me and Shotty for a LyLo wagon is most certainly in the air.

All that said, if you were at L-1 right now, I'd make the call. I'd hammer or I'd call you town. I might be wrong, but I'd throw my hat in the ring one way or the other and take my chances. When decision time comes, I do not waffle. Haven't waffled this entire game, with the exception of the Maemuki case, which was hammered on before I could make a deciding post.

Wrong or right, I made the call to vote in favor of keeping RayFrost alive, I made the call to jump on Elvis' wagon. I made the call on Zakeri earlier today, and, as loathe as you may be to admit it, I made the call on your wagon, despite its popularity, to step off of it.

You are either town that believes that a scum disengaged from a popular town wagon, or you are scum who has latched onto a victim and is either saving him for lynch or lose, or simply doesn't know how to let go at this point without looking suspicious.

Either way, I'm not guilty of what you say I'm guilty of.

No.

Waffling comes in many ways. I'm talking about the jumping off the early wagon and STILL going "well shucks he may just be a scum" ready to jump back on.

I'm talking about the repeated discussions about my alignment that seem to end in "ohh he's town" yet like above still go "ohh but I don't know".

I'm talking about doing things like saying "I stepped off the SpyreX wagon" like that is a firmament of your stance WHEN WHILE YOU WERE DOING JUST THAT you left yourself ample room to hop back on just in case.

I'm talking about "You're either town or scum *shrug*".

Like I said, though, this is moot. Zak is getting lynched today. Period. What happens next is based off that.

[SpyreX]

Woosh.

[SpyreX]

HAY NEW REVELATION: IF YOU ARE A POWER ROLE EVEN IF YOU ARE GOING TO BE LYNCHED GO AHEAD AND CLAIM YOUR ROLE AND TARGETS.

Seriously. I'm not enthused.

[SpyreX]

Hito being town doesn't surprise me. The killing does.
Xyl, yea. Woosh.

I'm still fuming at a PR just fumbling to death.

I still want to vote Pads real, real bad but.

[SpyreX]

But Zak flipping freaking town PR kinda put a hamper in part of my thought process.

I'm going to try and regroup with this game and see if I still think Pads is the right way.

As it sits I'm not stoked.

[SpyreX]

I wouldn't get on RC over that too much. Especially since that was very close to my first thoughts.

That is HILARIOUS looking back at charter.

That said I'm goin back to my pure gut. I DO feel a -bit- better about Shotty at the mo.

I do NOT feel better about Pads.

Unvote, Vote: Pads

With only 9 left it may be time for a massive hunt when I get a bit more energon.

[SpyreX]

Who does that leave us? RC. Got to be the godfather.

Being that charter was heading for a lynch at the time, it must be a vig giving the town another kill.

Either scum bussed or it has got to be fhq, rc or spyrex

I'm a bit irked by the adamancy in the first two statements and THEN the possibility opening up in the last.

However:

Good Lord, that's the most blatant flip-flopping I've ever seen.

Vote Hiphop

A combination of his flip-flopping and his previous (and current) adamant claim that RC is scum, even though RC is almost certainly town.

Now this gets me on the other end. I'm going to make one of those fabulous statements: This is NOT the tone of a same-alignment argument.

One of IK / Hiphop is not town. I'd bet a hat on it.

I'm just not sure which one.

[SpyreX]

Spyrex, I'm not liking the way you are looking down the scope in the latter half of 1784. "When one flips town kill the other" is fine if you can justify it, but instead you're handing me and "it's just there".

I've been fighting a RL shitstorm today so I haven't got a chance to parse it out correctly. I'm NOT going to simply say lynch one then the other.

Hiphops flipping irritates me, but a lot of his other posts don't make a lot of sense to me as scum.

IK, on the other hand, had that whole give up business and some tenantive problems.

I'm trying to figure out which one of them is the scum. I'm pretty damn confident that one of those will flip scum. I'm positive that both wont.

[SpyreX]

Most of hiphop's play does not make sense at all. The only thing I can make sense of is really scummy. Sort of like my EP logic, except this hasn't been damaged by connections or an EP crumb.

See, hiphop is really an engima.

He hops on my wagon and encourages more votes. Without any reason.

BUT, then he tells me to make sure I don't get killed via overposting.

Then comes on Mae but his csl vote is:

vote csl Besides, do you really want someone in this game with a bad past, that they can't defend. You are putting off the inevitable.

Then there is his iso 14 which I still can't make heads or tails of in regards for having a vig shoot ek. It REALLY seems like he is aiming for the shot to NOT be taken which, with elvis being scum, could be a desperation move.

But then tells rofl to stay on elvis versus jumping for vi (iso 16)?

And then comes out hard opposed to sigma.

And votes charter.

And calls xyl town rightfully so. And gets on Ray.

And stays on charter when exploring other avenues.

---

It hurts the head but really the ONLY thing that sitting there when giving it a real read that really bothers me is the issues with RC.

However, those DO make sense when you take it as a function of new information coming into the game.

IF I'm wrong and hiphop is scum I'd almost guarantee him being part of a second group (or, of course the mafia are two groups and we're just not seeing any distinguishing marks).

So, I'm apparently letting pads freaking go again:

Unvote, Vote: Idiotking

[SpyreX]

Vote Count, Day 5

hiphop ( 2 ) - idiotking - popsofctown
shotty to the body ( 1 ) - Pads
fhqwhgads ( 0 )
Idiotking ( 2 ) - SpyreX - fhqwhgads
Pads ( 0 )
popsofctown ( 0 )
RedCoyote ( 1 ) - hiphop
Sotty7 ( 0 )
SpyreX ( 0 )
Unvote ( 3 ) - Shotty to the Body - Sotty7 - RedCoyote
Total Votes ( 9 )

With 9 alive, 5 needed for a majority.
Deadline is December 23rd, 11am EST

@RC:

There's only one major issue: I'm pretty sure you're town. I'm town. I'm fairly confident pops is town.

I really think we saw a full load blow on CSL via scum and the answer still lies there.

@Sotty:

The reason why I'm betting on not both of them being scum is, ultimately, that would have been a poor poor bussing attempt. However, everything about that exchange doesn't ring town-town fighting.

[SpyreX]

Rc- whether you want to believe me or not, that is the truth. If you take both posts side by side,

than yes one of them is a lie (unkowingly, but yes)

, however if you have connections, than my second post is the truth. It's funny how you are on all the townie lynches, but you haven't voted for one scum yet. How odd is that? I was hoping that zak would flip scum,

and the game would be over,

but apparently not.

Que?

What exchange are you talking about? I have called idk not buddies with Elvis this entire game. Are you talking about idk voting for me (in which I never commented on)? I find the argument (if one of is scum the other must be town) decent, but the other one of, (if one of us is town the other must be scum), a bunch of bull. What kind of argument is that? In fact I never heard of such an argument. Probably because it is unreal, and not understandable. How we supposed to know what the other person's alignment is if we are both town? We don't, so as far as I am concerned, this is town talking to town, who are both looking for scum.

I'm talking very specifically about your ADAMANT stance on RC being the godfather. Followed by your ADAMANT stance on charter being killed by a vig. Followed by your "well, either their busing or its X".

To which IK replies "flipflopping! vote hoo!"

Nothing about that smells like same alignment. Its not a function of you two knowing each others alignments its a function of a bizarre attack being met by a bizarre vote.

[SpyreX]

If this was early, sure. At this point with multiple kills bussing like that just doesn't add up.

[SpyreX]

HELLO TO GAME

WORDS ARE NECESSARY FOR THINGS TO HAPPEN

DO NOT BE THE NEXT ZAK

[SpyreX]

Hiphops posts become harder and harder for me to digest. Something about the way they jump around just breaks my head.

But, I'll try.

Fact- there is a mason conneted to elvis, fact- there is connections between rc and elvis, fact-rc did not vote for either scum wagon, fact-our mod said some roles will be combined, fact- our mod uses godfather, fact- it says in wiki that a godfather is a common role, question- what does a godfather do? Fact-he heads a mafia group. Question- wouldn't there be a godfathers leading the scum group/s if there is two possible scum groups? I am saying that the godfather role is very likely.

This... I..

1.) There is a mason connected to elvis. This is true.
2.) "There is connections" doesn't mean anything. Show and detail these connections because seriously. Without words. Just quotes.
3.) RC not voting for either scum wagon IS suspect but you're painting "the wagons" like they went to lynch and weren't both shots during the day.
4.) "Our mod uses godfather" is quite the misnomer. The POSSIBILITY of a Godfather exists. Unless you are saying we have all the roles outlined well...
5.) The frequency of a godfather is moot. We've seen a traitor vig / backup roleblocker when converted flip.
6.) A "Godfather" in mafia terms

normally

means simply they will investigate town on investigations. "leading" the mafia is a misnomer.
7.) If you're using "possible roles" as an arguing point ignoring the pre-game flips of the Don's is more than just a little shady.

As for your case- The first one is me being me, scumhunting. As for the second one- you say it is a bizzare vote, but what about pop's vote on me for the same reasons? Oh, I forgot he is town /sarcasm. I am still laughing over that one. Scum, because he is town. HA. Laughing Even rc has doubts on me, because of flipflopping (of course he is scum, but so what.)

Still looking for votes on rc. Bussers are always nice, if he is not the only one left.

Take a deep breath and follow me here.

There is no case.

I am not voting you.

That said you sure are acting like you want me to ffs. "scumhunting" doesn't explain the shift from definitives to a new wacky set of definitives. Secondly, and follow me here again:

pops is not what I'm talking about at all. At all.

I am talking very, very specifically about the exchange between you and idiotking. I even used the names.

But, kudos for "Yea well he did it toooooo" when I'm not voting you. God in heaven.

[SpyreX]

Spyrex- I suggest you read godfather in wiki. Like I said it says it is a common addition.

Also it doesn't matter that you are not voting for me. What matters, is that you are voting idk for shady reasons.

Well then lets lynch us a RC and then the scum wont be able to kill anymore yeehaw!

Note: sending in the kill != being the single authority on the kill.

Not to mention the whole "flavor says we may have a godfather. Flavor also says the godfathers would have been killed DISREGARD THE SECOND PART"

And, if you think its such a shady vote well swoosh.

I'll hop on shotty if need be. I'm still holding to the one of IK/Hiphop scum theorem and, frankly, neither of them are ever going to get killed so.

[SpyreX]

Vig!!!!

Where the hell were you yesterday, huh.

[SpyreX]

Spyrex, fhq, and rc- this is very important- you all have posted since the idk death, so WHY ARE YOU NOT VOTING WHEN WE ONLY HAVE TWO DAYS AND LESS THAN SEVEN HOURS LEFT? However, I want the town to think about this:
So far we have:
Dead anti-town: 4
Dead town:17
Alive players:8
If we hit the 33%, we could have a possible 4 scum left. I am not saying it is probable, but possible. So think hard before you answer these questions:
Is Shotty the best lynch?
Is Sotty the best lynch?
*speaking calmly*No hurry, just 2 days left*Speaking calmly*
Also from my understanding of the rules, as soon as deadline hits, the lynch happens instantaneously(no 24 hours), so Shotty please claim now, or at least soon.

OHH GOD THE SKY IS FALLING WE HATH NO HOMES.

You really just suggested an 8 man scumteam in a 25 person game and used this as a justification to a.) push for a claim when that lynch is NO where near set in stone and b.) to fearmonger about the time we have left.

I don't like it.

Enough that:

Vote: Hiphop

RC is not getting lynched. FHQ is not getting lynched. Pops is not getting lynched.

Believe it or not I don't want Shotty lynched as things sit.

So: Pads, Hiphop, Sotty.

I think I'd still love a pads but something tells me that isn't happening.

I need to reread Sotty because either RC is doing a bangup job misinterpeting it or this may be the way to go.

[SpyreX]

No.

NO.

Seriously. No.

Do not answer that question in any form.

Unless Pads has some SHOCKING REVELATION (which based on what happened he doesn't) I swear to god.

[SpyreX]

He should answer it if he's going to be lynched

. pops/fhq are taking the pressing nature of today too lightly. They need to step up to the plate and give us some feedback. I'm game for all three lynches, but I easily prefer Sotty, even moreso than I had prior to voting her.

I don't know if Pads is right to unvote

, but he's right to be concerned about lynching a potential power role. fhq and/or Spyrex need to get serious about a hiphop wagon if that's what they feel is right, and pops needs to make up his mind. The time to kick the tires on a hiphop wagon is closing, y'all need to buy it or get off the lot.

I bolded the ding ding ding parts. If you're going to lynch, then you damn well put it to where its a for reallies lynch not after unvoting

after someone else unvoted

.

The claim is a function of the wagon. Not a byproduct of if one is going to

be

wagoned or not.

As far as I could tell, that lynch was set in stone, because it looked like four people were unmovable, so I was thinking that unless we have a claim, that lynch was the lynch. What is your idea of a lynch set in stone?

I did not suggest a 8-man team. I said 8 scum were probable. Do you know how many are left, because I don't? We should however be careful with our lynches.

Now I am going to ask you, what would you rather have, a no-lynch or a lynch?

I see three votes as of last pages VC. Further, of the group on shotty I see two unvotes. Yea, that is not a "set in stone" and this is not a function of a lynch or no lynch. Just because a deadline is looming isn't an excuse for losing ones mind.

To stop a nolynch I'd vote Shotty. After these last few pages I'm far, far more comfortable with a hiphop lynch.

[SpyreX]

Not to mention Pad's whole "I'm voting you if you claim anything but vig" business.

[SpyreX]

That was almost close enough to what I said to not be a total misrepresentation. What I said, is that if he's the vig, it explains his actions. If he claims to be another role, I would not be so sure that his actions are explained by having that role. Not being sure implies that I would consider it before I made a call.

Wooosh. If this:

To that end, more than just them claiming a role needs to be examined. Their entire play, within the context of their role, must be considered. Their list of night actions must be considered, in addition to any breadcrumbs they left. As I said before, if Shotty is the vig, what I took for scummy play is reasonably explained. Another power role? I'm not so sure.

Isn't some kind of WORDS for "If Shotty doesn't claim vig I'll have to re-evaluate in the less than a day we have (i.e. lynch him)" well golly gee.

I mean, its not like you're pushing for a lynch on him if he claims something else...right?

To anyone who gets their panties ruffled by that, let me ask you this: Do you think we stand any realistic chance of hitting scum today if we issue a blanket refusal to lynch uncountered power roles?

Ohh wait there it is my bad.

You know... thinking about stuff? Reacting to stimuli, having your opinions changed by what you see in the game? Something that you have failed to do for the entirety of the game?

You know what you are totally right. Its not like I've changed my mind on Shotty at all. Or went back and forth on hiphop because his play is like throwing my brain in a blender. Or even sotty.

ACTUALLY, I'm pretty sure I've been adamant on you and pops. But, well, that is everyone.

I can't help but wonder if that's because SpyreX can't see it, because he's not town, and can't see the game through a town's eyes.

THIS JUST IN POPS AND I MUST BE SCUM SAYS THE MOST statement ever.

Because why? Ohh, thats right the "claim when a wagon is dissolving for mysterious superpowers" idea went whoo-bang.

My god.

Vote: Pads

Pops, Shotty and apparently my secret OTHER scumbuddy because well, hell, there's 8 of us afterall wonder powers unite and make this happen.

[SpyreX]

Arrrghghghghgh

Unvote, Vote: Scotty

[SpyreX]

Did you unvote and then ask for a claim, specifically a claim of a vig?

Did you then pretty clearly say that anything but a vig claim was going to have to require you to "think" about the claim?

Did you suggest to lynch uncounterclaimed power roles as that would be the only way to find scum?

Is saying this has anything to do with "good policy" a stretch by all measurable fashions?

Does this series of statements made by you strike ANY chords of hypocrisy?

SttB is implying that he holds one or more of the following beliefs:

a) Only scum find townies scummy.

b) The scum made a choice to make themselves look bad by killing someone they had publically denounced as scummy, and revealing that person to be non-scum.

c) We should out the vig.

The first option is a path to a mislynch, the second option doesn't make much sense,

and the third option is just anti-town play

. A reread of Shotty to the Body ensued. It is not good.

Is the lurker you're defending weighing in at 35 posts?

Is the lurker you're attacking weighing in at over double?

Have you opted to defend a lurker because the other "hasn't made a case" when the lurker you've opted to defend pretty much has done the same things?

Are you scum?

(Hint: The answer to all these questions is yes)

[SpyreX]

Nearing lylo your argument is that power roles, namely a day vig, have little purpose.

I have to say that again:

Nearing lylo your argument is that power roles, namely a day vig, have little purpose.

Which is even MORE amazing in this game because the damn vig has killed all the mafia. WE sure haven't. I...

Anyways.

I am not even sure where this absolutely amazing and false dilemma of save the PR's is coming from.

Pretty sure we haven't, in fact, ran into that scenario yet either.

Pretty sure that no one has even pretended to say "Ohh snap its a PR lets all bow to him in his PR glory"

Pretty sure that lynching lurkers is going to become even MORE relevant (like, ohh, PR's) as we approach lylo.

And, yea, scum are totally gonna not gun for a PR for the WIFOM factor. Doubly so a vig. I mean, not like the vig has interrupted any plans thus far rite.

No, quantity does not equal quality. I am making no comments about that. I am making the direct and vocal statement that 35 posts is absolutely unacceptable and the fact that you're defending this as somehow not lurking is truly a beautiful and rare flower.

And that large post? The one that calls Shotty scum and everyone else town except for Red who maaaayyy be scum? That is your silver shield of the true paragon of scumhunting?

Which such awesome little bits as:

Pads thinks a lot like me. I think he is town simply because of this fact, we use a lot of the same logic on people especially his reasoning for rolf investigating fhq

OR

I keep flipping on him. The start of today was really bad, he seemed to be spreading scumminess every where and seemed a bit panicked. Lately I have been seeing where he is coming from. I think his case on me is really weak and he could easily be scum. He has been saying I am scummy for several days and yet hasn't really done anything about it until today when Shotty gets some decent pressure. Looking like there is a link there.

And just so its clear:

Unvote, Vote: Sotty7

Just so its ultra-clear: If a wagon were to form on Pads high-fives all around.

Extra points for leaving out entirely the earlier "OHH LOOK AT HIM AND HIS ANTI-TOWN VIG LOOKING OHH YA ARE YOU VIG?"

[SpyreX]

You know whats awesome?

Looking at the main MS page and seeing the last post in a different thread be Shotty's and nothing here.

[SpyreX]

In comparison to their purpose at the start of the day? Yes, of course. Are you trying to say that six days of power role is not better than one or two days?

That is exactly what I'm saying. And that seven is better than six. Etc, etc. The relative value of PR's, especially the one we are talking about actually increases as the game goes forward.

I have no idea what you're talking about.

If you are saying you were not insinuating that the end result of an uncontested PR claim would be a different lynch well go ahead and confirm by voting yourself.

What about a few lines up where you praised the vig as the only killer of scum in the game?

The hell does that have to do with anything? I'm saying I'm not going to push aside a lynch because of a claim. For example, if you claimed vig I would still lynch you because I find your play scummy.

Then help me lynch one. One based on quality, not quantity.

Or, if you'd like, we can go through all the posts in the game and count up everyone's amount of typed words, and conclude that the person with the lowest number is the scummiest. That's no less ridiculous than the way you're justifying calling Sotty a lurker now.

I haven't called RC a lurker and he has less than a handful more posts than Sotty does. There's a reason for that.

35 doesn't seem unreasonable to me in a game that has moved at the speed that this one has because of retards like you and I willing to spam slapfights at the drop of a hat. And I hope everyone takes note of the "Quantity isn't important! 35 is bad, though!" sentiment here.

Wooosh.

Lets try this again.

No. Quantity does not equal quality. I am not talking about that. I am talking specifically about the fact that THESE 35 POSTS are not quality and, also, *gasp* not quantity.

Why would I want to leave it out? I made an observation, and I reacted to it. That I slammed on the brakes for a moment should indicate to you that I don't have some over-arching scum plan that I"m sticking to.

The fact that you earlier condemned Shotty in one of your examples for "wanting to out the vig" and "that behavior is anti-town" and then you not voting for Shotty and, in fact, attempting to out him if he was the vig doesn't ring any bells?

Of course not.

This game irritates me more than most.

If Shotty gets lynched and is not scum OR if Scotty gets lynched and is scum I am voting for you and leaving it there for the rest of the game.

[SpyreX]

You're here RC. We could do this. We could.

[SpyreX]

I can't stay out of your head. Its so warm and fuzzy there.

[SpyreX]

I have to get some sleep. I'll be checking this about an hourish before deadline. I will have time to vote to stop a nolynch.

Thats about it.

We better be at that point.

[SpyreX]

COLOR ME CONVINCED

Or not.

Get this done. Or, well, lynch Pads tomorrow.

[SpyreX]

I only wish I was a lyncher. I have the misfortune of being town.

In fact, MASSCLAIM TIME woo

I'm... ready for it?

Vanilla.

We've got two scum left. Its nolynchin time probably unless something truly magnificent happens.

[SpyreX]

Hey, chuckles:

6 - 1 = 5 with 2 scum left is lylo.

6 - 1 - 1 = 4 with 2 scum left is a scum win.

And, again, no I've never been persuaded and considering the two people I wanted to lynch are still alive I SURELY haven't been on any wagons, rite?

Not to mention the fact that if I WAS a lyncher I would just say so and force a nolynch and attempt to win with the scum in this scenario.

[SpyreX]

Before I lose sight of the goal and do something stupid lets play parse out some players:

fhq - Overall I like it. My only gripe(s) are his predecessor (who boggles the mind) and AGAIN (OHH SNAP) the amount of posts. The fact he stayed away from the sotty lynch in favor of a hiphop lynch is tentatively good?

pops - Maybe its being on the same wavelength or what have you but pretty much all game I've had that happy vibe. My only big concern is how often I've came up in his posts. NOW, if it weren't for the first part of this I'd be really worried but as is? Nah. p town. Popsofptown if you will.

The other three I'm having major issues parsing out. I'm firmly of the opinion both the scum lie within that set but.

[SpyreX]

What?

How do you go from:

Of course he wants us to no lynch. No lynch = 1 less town tomorrow = the town can no longer stop the mafia (assuming 2 scum left) and lyncher from insta-winning the following day. I highly recommend against it.

to:

I understand the numbers, but we're not lynching a townie today, so that's not an issue.

When the first argument (supposition of me being lyncher aside) doesn't matter since if that were the case the game is done RIGHT NOW?

I...

No.

Someone that's not pads get in here and make me not lose my mind.

[SpyreX]

If I was a lyncher and announced my target and said I was a lyncher and voted nolynch the scum would be able to split a win with me. (assuming 2 scum and not a DIFFERENT bizarre scenario). There'd be no reason to not do that.

[SpyreX]

Yo yo massclaim in the house.

Lyncher madness, much like its idiot stepbrother jester madness, is absolutely unhelpful.

Much like thinking ANYTHING but a nolynch is going to happen today barring miracles.

[SpyreX]

Are we back to the whole wanting elvis shot because, yea.

[SpyreX]

Well thats unsurprising.

I'm planning a nolynch today but I want some real activity before we do so. I'm planning during the next week to really do some in-depth analysis on those still alive.

[SpyreX]

Good lord this page.

Thats a lot of words. That end with AGAIN PUSHING NOT NOLYNCHING TODAY.

I'm gonna start some iso-reads on the brigade. I should be able to get one done tonight at least because at this point woosh.

[SpyreX]

I changed my mind a little. I'll do some isos but I'm having a hard, hard time altering the reads (especially Pads iso considering what he's accusing pops of). Sooo instead (OHH SNAP IIOA CHOO CHOO):

Votes:

Pads: SpyreX, ConfidAnon, Mae, CSL, Elvis, Hit, Shotty, Shotty, Shotty

Shotty/Budja: SpyreX, EP, CSL, Sigma, Sigma, Infinis, Infinis, IK, Rayfrost, Zak, Sotty

EP/FHQ: Confid, Hoopla, Confid, Crypto, RayFrost, IK, RayFrost, Hiphop, IK, Hiphop

Hiphop: CSL, SpyreX, EP, CSL, Sotty, RC, Sotty, Charter, RC, RC, Zak, RC

Pops: Hoopla, Charter, Consid, CSL, EP, infinis, CSL, Mae, Infinis, Charter, Infinis, Rayfrost, Shotty, Hiphop, Shotty, Hiphop

SpyreX: Budja, Pads, Mae, Pads, Hiphop, Pads, IK, Ray, Shotty, Ray, Zak, Pads, IK, Hiphop, Pads, Sotty

[SpyreX]

Is that to me?

I need to get the overdrive to see if I'm missing something but today my options really are nolynch or roll the dice for the win on Pads.

[SpyreX]

Woooosh.

I like the elaborate measures to say "SpyreX didn't vote for EK or charter". If thats the case, go ahead and say it.

I'm going to a birthday party today but if we really want to throw down today I'll do the Pads dance. Especially since in this ruleset his rationale for "they'll get easier mislynches" is not only incorrect but absolutely 100% wrong - this setup favors town in lylo for the simple reason there can't be a power scum-hammer.

[SpyreX]

OHHHH I see you're saying that its odd that the people I've called scum are still alive. Yea, thats real strange all things considered - or, really, its not. For more than a couple reasons that I don't feel like hearing the WIFOM dance about soo.

As for the other:

See, someone (or someones) throw down votes that don't make sense or are opportunistic - that's not game. In fact, a power hammer would have quite the chance to flip back on the person(s) who did it. So, one of the greatest scum end-game assets - a town that votes fast setting up the mislynch, just isn't available in this ruleset.

[SpyreX]

I'm so tired of beating my head against this game.

Is there a 100% SUPER CONFIRMED TOWN? No.

THUS, nolynch makes absolutely more statistical sense. Of course at this point if you chuckleheads ARE right about shotty I'm getting lynched for the loss so huzzah.

As for Pads. I'm not going to make a full case but if you want some NEW reasons for it look at his case on pops. Just really look at it. Then, go ahead in the way back machine and look at day 1.

And the whole lyncher debacle. And this gem of gems:

Today, scum need two townies to misvote. Tomorrow they need but one. Let's not dick around. Scum are just going to kill SpyreX or fhq, who no one was trying to lynch anyway, and decrease the number of townies they need to vote incorrectly whilst not affecting our number of targets at all.

AND the fact that his shotty part of the case today was circumstantial to pops being scum and OPTED TO VOTE FOR SHOTTY INSTEAD.

And then the vote count business.

Vote: No Lynch

Notice how confident I am in Pads being scum. Notice also I'm voting No Lynch.

[SpyreX]

And again if Shotty wasn't scum that is game. I'm really not sure whats so hard about this.

[SpyreX]

On an unrelated note: We're all retarded and some of it isn't accidental.

The starting game flavor clearly says there is only one mafia faction. My lord.

[SpyreX]

Huzzah.

Lets play a game of "who could the partners be"

Pads:
Pops - maaaybe. The giant case and the push for a vote at 6 left just doesn't click right for a bus BUT who knows.
Hiphop - this I could see. Hiphop has been the bridesmaid a lot but never the bride and all things considered with how often hiphop has been named scum well.
Shotty - I can't decide about the power bus. IF we had lynched at 6 left (haha) that bus could have been the win.

Pops:
Hiphop - I'd be surprised. The "one mafia" theory pushed out would make bussing your partner really weird at that point.
Shotty - This I could see. Namely the yin to the yang of the hiphop. However switching the next day to putting the vote down? Why be that concrete and then waste the effort put in at minimal pressure the next day?

Hiphop:
Shotty - This is truly the X factor setup. No votes from either on the other. Very mellow interactions for the most part. Up until late yesterday when he implores me to look at pops or shotty over pads. Odd.

So, really, and I can't decide one way or another on this yet: would scum in the 6 person have tried a bus (knowing full well the traction on a nolynch) or would they have gambled harder for the win together?

If its the former, well... considering the love-love Shotty gets from, well, everyone I dont even know but it would pin him.
If its the latter, I'd definitely say Hiphop/Pads.

Regardless, and I want to be clear about this:

Once we reach a lynch (barring madness hammers) keep the votes there. Don't him and haw in the twilight.

[SpyreX]

And all is quiet on the western front, once again.

[SpyreX]

....

That is a lot of words based solely around you being the mislynch. That all the machinations hinge on that.

AND not even entertaining other options? So, in essence this could be boiled down from line one to lynching shotty?

Awesome.

WELP,

Vote: Pads

[SpyreX]

Again. If Shotty is town, the maneuver yesterday ended the game.

Yes, what was the most likely scenario (FHQ-town, FHQ-NK) happened, but that still eliminates a set of variables.

Yesterday, in order to achieve a lynch, we would have needed "all the townies" just the same as we do now. (Or a bus, just like now).

Nothing has changed. A variable was removed. That is it.

IF for whatever wacky reason they had NK'd someone else we'd be having a different discussion today.

[SpyreX]

I post ten minutes after EVERYONE in this game like 80% of the time. I'm an equal opportunity hater.

Thats now been up for far, far too long.

[SpyreX]

So... I'm scum now again? I just like to keep track for the giant board - I mean, not like this all started with you waffling on just that point, rite?

If you look at all the slapfights we've had, it usually goes like this. SpyreX brings up a point, I defend against the point, SpyreX posts again bringing up new points, ignoring the original points and the defense against them. He almost never stays on a single point of debate. That's indicative of a person who's not really arguing, discussing, learning, deciding, and debating. It's much more indicative of a person who's already got the conclusion, and is trying to find as many reasons as possible to justify it.

Show it. Go ahead and how you bring up a "defense" and me just ignoring it and moving on my merry way. Pretty sure if you could show such an amazing outcome I'd get lynched as power scum right there.

Course, oddly enough, this isn't happening.

As for me not talking about non-Shotty scum options. Well.... uh.. are you considering non-Pads-scum options? Not really. Not in any of the last three (six?) days posts, as far as I can tell. So I'm not sure how that makes me scum if it doesn't make you scum, too.

Nah I totally haven't done that at all. Not like... on this page or anything. Silly me.

Compare that to "everything I'm posting is based on the point that Shotty is scum".

[SpyreX]

The only thing I'm fairly confident about is you being town.

So, if you opt to roll with the shotty lynch I can't stop it.

I'm not about to let things like the above just slide by - but, really, go ahead and look back at Pads and I and tell me if I'm off my rocker when getting my heckles raised at the idea I'm attacking / deflecting my issues with Pads (which apparently are just gameplay).

[SpyreX]

I'll try to get that to you this weekend. I get to go to meetings huzzah.

My biggest objection to the Shotty lynch, really, is the people "on it" right now.

I can't swallow a bus in this scenario. The fact that Pads and Hiphop AND you have all expressed being cool with it AND the fact I'm town means that, ultimately, this isn't so hot.

[SpyreX]

I'm still working on the pads but, for the sake of discussion, lets follow that thought process:

You think I'm town.
You are town.
One other is town.
You also think the scum aren't bussing.
We are assuming 2 scum are left.

It requires all three of said town to lynch a scum.

Of the three not discussed two (other than you) have professed desire to lynch someone that is not either you nor I.

Therefore, by nature, the person that is desired to lynch would be... town!

And, process of elimination says the two lynching would be the scum.

[SpyreX]

Ok pops the abridged version:

1.) The early game absence of stances on well, anything. Especially the stance regarding my wagon.
2.) The whole "hit and SpyreX are scum who planned in night to attack me" business. With its brother "the back burner".
3.) Iso 19. Iso 28. Iso 37. Iso 38. Iso 43.
4.) The bouncing, much like 1, about me all game. I've been an SK, Town briefly, Lyncher and then Scum. Really, the biggest change has been.....the amount of pressure I've put on pads.
5.) Shotty wants to out the vig is anti town (32), then flat out asks for the claim (36).
6.) Iso 34. Considering what we've seen this sure serves as a clearing position on someone. Interrresting.
7.) Look at the case on you 55. Compare it to what Pads himself had done on some key points. Cognitive dissonance is awesome.
8.) Iso 68. The all scum machinations have been to lead us to this point where I have been left for a mislynch business.

---

I made up my mind.
vote shotty This puts him at L-1.

Spyrex think about this way. Two people(pads and me) express desire to lynch shotty. The lone scum doesn't want to go agaisnt the town so he busses. Now tomorrow he doesn't stand out by not being the lone man off the wagon. It reminds me of my first game. Where at the end Zorblag said he would have bussed his partner without a second doubt in lylo if the town showed desire to do so. Same thing here. If you vote pads and shotty votes pads, when the time is almst out pops switches and scum win. Even if you are the fourth vote put it on, and make it impossible for scum to lynch town.

Pops saying he doesn't think scum is bussing is only his way of:
a)redirecting to get people to look the other way. (Off of Shotty)
b) give the idea that he isn't aligned with shotty.

Right now it looks like pops is testing the waters, and his desire to lynch shotty is just words without a vote.

Of course it is possible that shotty is a lone scum and four townies want him lynched.

Think about that.

Where to begin with this one.

Is it "lone scum" or a scumteam? That is kind of important and you're bouncing around between both ideas as they fit.

You've accused Pops of not being willing to put down his vote but then put it in a position where he couldn't put down his vote.

All of your issues via voting are eliminated very easily:

If everyone isn't voting as deadline approaches, the person not voting is lynched.
If someone changes a vote after deadline, that person is lynched.

Treat this like a normal lylo. Because it is. If pops is scum its going to be game. He is the deciding vote.

[SpyreX]

Actually pops before you lay it down I'd like to see Shotty's final rebuke.

Believe it or not I'm still worried some about Shotty so I'm not letting him off the hook THAT easy.

[SpyreX]

I find it funny that Pads is calling US the scumteam now for handholding yet, somehow, the bizarro world relationship he's had with hiphop is aok.

...and last I checked Pops asked me for a case because he was planning on voting for Shotty? Woohoo hivemind there.

THAT SAID, I still want that case from Shotty before anything happens. No way in hell am I going to let that skate and let who was one of the cross-votes be the deciding factor.