The Dark Goma Mafia: Massacre of the Cloth (Game Over)

[Benmage]

Whats your rolename?

[VP Baltar]

Chamber, need your top 3 lynch list.

Also, explain how your ability can be passive when it is power based and you make a choice each night.

[chamber]

Chamber, need your top 3 lynch list.

Also, explain how your ability can be passive when it is power based and you make a choice each night.

If I had a standard role I wouldn`t have claimed when I did. Perhaps because I don't target?

[Plum]

Yes, Vaya's my neighbor-friend-dude. I basically believe he's Town, though am uncertain. I disagree with many of his reads (Llama, Sajin, milk Benmage reads mostly, also maybe VP pending reread of him) but most of them basically make sense in conjunction with what he's said to me about the game as its progressed. Vaya has answered the other questions in the thread truthfully as well. We also have flavor information that, in conjunction with the Kublai-scum flip, makes us inclined to believe SB's roleclaim. If I recall, you'll see Vaya's opinions change after she notes the flavor of SB's claim.

Scumlist:

Suspect 1: milkshake
Suspects 2-5: stark, Sajin, Benmage, Elmo

Remember, if you suspect Battle Mage, that Tubby claims to have hid behind him successfully last night.

I have reasons to believe that Milk is scum other than Dram's theory that he's the strangler-guy - namely, a strong scum read from yesterday. I initially thought it negated due to Tubby's Hider claim, but if Dram is telling the truth about his role (or at least

enough

truth about his role) the Hide was unsuccessful anyway and tells us nothing about Milk's alignment. I need to do a reread, post a case on Milk later tonight (hopefully). Oh, well, I'll resurrect my Day 2 post on Milk for now:

I believe that both SpyreX and Bunny are town.

I thought that they were, basically, mutually exclusive. If you believe that Spy gave SB a potion with intent to kill him, you should at least believe the Spy thought SB was scum, and you probably should also believe that SB quite possibly had an ability that "killed" Spy (or possibly turned his potion back on himself.) So why do you think Bunny is town? What about her inciting people to perform actions on her through her miller claim?

Not mutually exclusive. With everyone having a power there are any number of scenarios which could account for it. Notwithstanding that I'm still waiting to see what, if anything, SB has to day on this. Otherwise I still don't believe SB is a good play today and I certainly don't think Spy is a fruitful lynch.

Milkshake's erraticness is also fail, and in this context I mean scummy. I will probably get him in iso and make sure I'm seeing stuff right and pick out stuff of his that looks scummy in this very post, so don't touch that dial.

Uh-oh, I think Vollkan is lying now...

Name: The Mod
Power Type: Active, Passive, Special, or...???
Alignment: With the Council, With the Converters, or….????
Flavor: Blah blah blah, I’m a dirty tramp
Power: Kick Ass
Win Condition: “You win when all who oppose The Council are eliminated.”, “You win when there is no way for the followers of the Council can win.”, or….???

There are 'physical' abilities, which concern material things (example provided was a weapon).
There are 'active' actions, which relate to powers.
And (which is different to the first bit of info I received, but then again the first info wasn't provided as an exclusive list) there is also an 'other' category for different abilities.

He's telling you stuff that he wouldn't tell us? There is both "special" and "other?"

I don't usually believe that scum make obvious mistakes. But this...?

??? is generic "there are other things that can be in this slot" just like for alignment we've seen another wincon &c (with Kmd). Scum fail.

vote: milkshake

Notable stuff about milkshake:

-Random votes Kublai.
-Weird rolefishing/hinting about his own role in response to Kise's joke in the RVS.
-Seems willing or to desire to leave claimed 3rd-party Kmd alive after the claim.
-Accuses SpyreX of fakeclaiming with "I am an Alchemist"

I'm not the hugest fan of flavor arguments, but I can't ignore them when they appear...

Liar liar pants on fire.

Also compare this:

So, what are you suggesting? I'm scum that somehow ghosted myself and am using it to try and kill a miller? Or..?

If you're talking to me, I'm not suggesting anything. I'm pretty happy with your post. The dead-next-night thing seems plausible... it's also very easily testable if we wait.

with this:

Previously, BM and I had said that we could lynch SpyreX tomorow if he didn't dissapear on his own. But I don't think that he's a ghost, and I don't see why he would be fully resurrected for just one day of life.

unvote tubby, vote: SpyreX

Why so flip-floppy? Opportunism? I smell a stench.

- Insinuates that SpyreX/Bunny being town is mutually exclusive when it clearly is not so radical a dichotomy at all - leaving room to push SB if the bandwagons swing?

-Insinuates that SB's suggestions that a Cop can target her to confirm sanity was scummy,

contradicting his earlier positions

on SB (he said her claim sounded legit and discussed the "inciting" incidents quite neutrally). This was done to further the false "either Spy or SB has to be scum" dichotomy he was pressing in the point I mentioned above. Remember, HE THOUGHT SB WAS TOWN and the only thing that seemed to swing this is his desire to convince Vaya that SpyreX and SB can't both be town.

- Then suggests that SB and Spy might be scumbuddies. HAH. Nice try, no cigar.

-

You stopped me from killing myself, eh?

Is this more of your jester-vigilante-cop antics? Unless your role talks about how you kill yourself because you're totally crazy, then no.

If you believe SpyreX targeted SB with anything, he's probably not scum.

I still doubt SpyreX's claim a little bit. It seems really weird that his role would turn out to be oddly inactive just as a (claimed) tracker targets him, and that his potion, although

meant

to kill Snow_Bunny (a pro-town action), would end up having no effect. However, I can also see how, in the right semi-coincidental circumstances, it could all be true. For example, maybe SB really does do bad things to people who target her. Also, importantly, his most recent posts have been convincing for me with regards to his claim...

Despite the fact that this doesn't address Milkshake's actual flavor reasons for voting SpyreX, that the role-type, diction of rolename claim and such looked scummy.

As I previously mentioned, though, I really can't understand SB's play if she's town. Personally I wouldn't claim miller as scum, but according to people here, it is done fairly often. It would especially make sense if SB interacts with people who target her... although, it wouldn't make sense for her to half-kill those people (like what happened to SpyreX). Maybe SpyreX is secretly NK immune? Maybe he really will die tomorow (I doubt that)? Maybe SB doesn't do the same thing every time someone targets her?

See how he makes a statement - " I really can't understand SB's play if she's town" and completely fails to quantify it. He just says "I've heard that sometimes scum claim Miller. Also maybe she was drawing people to target her which would affect them but that doesn't make sense so random speculation about circumstances". Remember, this AFTER Day 1 stance on SB which was that she was unlikely to flip scum and

Oh, also I was under the definite impression that miller claim was a null-tell or slight town tell because it meant cops had something to test their sanity on.

-

I also agree wholeheartedly with the "witholding a piece of the puzzle is anti-town" thing. I'm also starting to like "SB and SpyreX's scumynesses are mutually exclusive." What I said previously about it being a prearranged scum thing seems unlikely to me now. So I suppose I should switch my vote to the other half of the Spy/SB duality, and

unvote, vote: Snow_Bunny

So, yeah. Let's all lynch Snow_Bunny and see what happens.

What I don't like about this is how Milkshake uses the completely false dichotomy he's set up to help justify the SB lynch. The logic is both BS and scummy.

-

I agree that it's possible everything is fine, the non-ER role and the lack of 'type' is genuine and he's town, but I'm not convinced. What I AM convinced of is SB's reasoning for thinking Spy is scum (and subsequent vote of someone else) is rubbish. More 1-shot ability claiming and SB votes imho.

QFT... My position precisely (put more succintly). I also think SB's behavior regarding her 1-shot ability is scummy. She also has the fact that she was (presumably) targetted by SpyreX, but not harmed working against her, although there are many possible explanations for that.

It's possible I've missed something but I didn't see anything like that from milkshake previously. Scum grabbing onto an actual legit-looking reason and trying to pass it off as his position from before then?

- Says Vollkan is a liar when is obviously not the case. See above the milkshake reread for more details on that.

Just so we got the point:

Vote: milkshake

.

[Benmage]

Plum, what makes me scummy?

[Sajin]

I still support a stark lynch.

I am curious as to why you Baltar are not concerned about him anymore. Is this because you were worried about him being lynched so you wanted to be on the other side in case things went south quick? If he does indeed flip scum I think you are as well. What changed between then and now?

Milkshake can be my 3rd as I really do think dramonic has it right. I do not think his role really fits anyways- a cop insanity clearer? It sticks out like a sore thumb from every other role.

[Papa Zito]

Guys.

Dramonic.

Seriously.

[dramonic]

I just love the feel of caseless tunneling in the evening.

[Papa Zito]

Also I have no idea why Vaya decided to claim now.

[SpyreX]

I might could think abouts a dramonic once this is done.

However, oddly enough we've still had one person post that was 2 kool 4 scumlist if I remember correctly.

[VP Baltar]

@Sajin-who said I don't find stark scummy anymore? He's simply not at the top of my list at the moment. I don't see how you infer from my list that I'm not paying attention to him.

Also, you only named two people, stark and milkshake, as far as I can tell. If I'm your second, then please specify that.

[VP Baltar]

Yeah, chamber, you're intentionally ignoring me now and I don't like it. Who are your top three scum suspects. I'm not even asking you for a frakking reason.

[stark]

I would really like to know why I'm in three people's scumlists.

@Sajin- Nice job man. Way to berate me for not scumhunting, then next day coast by, and only come back when your name comes up to crawl back into your tunnel.

I thought you were just stupid town, but now I'm reconsidering.

[stark]

@Milkshake- Does it specifically say in your PM that you clear

cop

insanity, or is this something you infered from flavor?

[VP Baltar]

I would really like to know why I'm in three people's scumlists.

@Sajin- Nice job man. Way to berate me for not scumhunting, then next day coast by, and only come back when your name comes up to crawl back into your tunnel.

I thought you were just stupid town, but now I'm reconsidering.

I agree with the part directed toward Sajin pretty heavily actually. Stark is still scummy in my eyes for playing around in the scenery, but Sajin has done absolutely nothing today in terms of scumhunting and simply deserves to die for it.

[chamber]

Yeah, chamber, you're intentionally ignoring me now and I don't like it. Who are your top three scum suspects. I'm not even asking you for a frakking reason.

tbh spyre demanding that we all post lists in the way he did pissed me off so I felt like being obstinate for a while but I've calmed down since, I'll get one together eventually. I'm confused atm cause all my reads based on play more or less contradict the cross clearing claims.

[dramonic]

Stark is still scummy in my eyes for playing around in the scenery, but Sajin has done absolutely nothing today in terms of scumhunting and simply deserves to die for it.

Just today? XP

[VP Baltar]

Yeah, chamber, you're intentionally ignoring me now and I don't like it. Who are your top three scum suspects. I'm not even asking you for a frakking reason.

tbh spyre demanding that we all post lists in the way he did pissed me off so I felt like being obstinate for a while but I've calmed down since, I'll get one together eventually. I'm confused atm cause all my reads based on play more or less contradict the cross clearing claims.

Ok, I can understand that, but surely you can think of three people you'd like to see lynched. I am at work now and can't really finish my compilation until I get home anyhow, but I hope you can post them by the time today is over.

@dramonic-well, yeah, yesterday too, but it is especially noticable today from how completely lost he seems to be.

[curiouskarmadog]

Vote Count (Page 97, Day 3)

(no change)

dramonic

-3 (Snow_Bunny, milkshake, Papa Zito)
milkshake -3 (dramonic, Plum, tubby216)
tubby216 -2 (stark, SocioPath)
Papa Zito -2 (LlamaFluff, chamber )
Snow_Bunny -2 (Elmo )
SerialClergyman -2 (Battle Mage, VP Baltar)
chamber -2 (SpyreX, Benmage)
Benmage -1 (Kise)

Not Voting:

SerialClergyman, Sajin, Vaya

Note:

Deadline will be at the earliest 11/14 at 5:00 PM EST. With 20 whole votes available, it takes 11 to lynch.

[milkshake]

I think I already made a big post in response to the one you quoted Plum, but anyway I think you might be confused about the difference between able-to-be-picked-on/having-made-mistakes and playing-for-the-scum. :O (Also, you go bonkers about the Vollkan thing, but you must have missed my posts after that?)

As to top three people who I think are Converters...
1) Snow_Bunny (Remember her?

unvote, vote:snow bunny

)
2) dramonic (although maybe I can buy that scum wouldn't do what he did just to lynch a townie)
3) VP Baltar ( )

[Benmage]

I would really like to know why I'm in three people's scumlists.

@Sajin- Nice job man. Way to berate me for not scumhunting, then next day coast by, and only come back when your name comes up to crawl back into your tunnel.

I thought you were just stupid town, but now I'm reconsidering.

I agree with the part directed toward Sajin pretty heavily actually. Stark is still scummy in my eyes for playing around in the scenery, but Sajin has done absolutely nothing today in terms of scumhunting and simply deserves to die for it.

Word, I'm so down to vote this. Enough delay.

unvote vote Sajin

Yeah, chamber, you're intentionally ignoring me now and I don't like it. Who are your top three scum suspects. I'm not even asking you for a frakking reason.

tbh spyre demanding that we all post lists in the way he did pissed me off so I felt like being obstinate for a while but I've calmed down since, I'll get one together eventually. I'm confused atm cause all my reads based on play more or less contradict the cross clearing claims.

ignore the different claims just state off gut suspicion who you dislike/think is scummy...

[chamber]

ignore the different claims just state off gut suspicion who you dislike/think is scummy...

How would that info be remotely useful?

[Benmage]

ignore the different claims just state off gut suspicion who you dislike/think is scummy...

How would that info be remotely useful?

The claims themselves aren't even Absolute 100%. So just give us how you "feel" about the claim...it should be quicker...than you can further deduce after bringing the claims you believe into the scenario. I was trying to speed the process up for you.

[Benmage]

EBWOP:err feel about claim...claim should = people.

[Snow_Bunny]

Ok. Its time to shake past the power-role dance and look at this from a holistic approach.

I'm throwing this out there with one thing in mind:

I'm really starting to think there isn't a crazy scum masterplot causing havoc. It is simply us chasing our tails.

With that in mind, lets look at our cast of characters. (bold mean claims thus far)

1.) tubby216 (50)

2.) Vaya (36)
3.) Battle Mage (70)
5.) Papa Zito (93) (6)
6.) VP Baltar (152)

7.) SpyreX (162)

8.) SerialClergyman (88) (7)

9.) milkshake (125)

10.) Snow_Bunny (70)

11.) dramonic (172)

12.) Benmage (236)

13.) SocioPath (76)

16.) Sajin (50)
17.) LlamaFluff (65) (1)

18.) chamber (22) (2)

20.) Plum (98)
21.) Kise (48)
23.) Elmo (14) (16)
24.) stark (92)

Why VP isn't bolded if he has 152? Am I getting the list wrong?

Ok, my short 123 list:

dramonic
Tubby
Spy