Newbie 841 - Game over!
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Tororingu-chan Goon
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Tororingu-chan Goon
- Goon
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PaltryExcuse Mafia Scum
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Tororingu-chan Goon
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havingfitz Survivor
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I was a bit suprised at the amount of analyzing she did on the cop. As you have half the posts in the game if she doesn't 'waste time' with you she'll get her analysis done in no time.Tororingu-chan wrote:Starbuck, I advise you stop wasting time with my posts~ =_=;
<j/k Starbucks...I know there is value in reviewing TCs comments and interactions with others>
BTW...the more time that passes the more I find myself re-reading Paltry's posts and my scum meter getting a bit lower on Pablo and higher for Paltry. Maybe down from 70-30 to 60-40. Still most suspicious of Pablo but am finding some of Paltry's towniness scummy.
Question for the more experienced players....when you are provided your roles at the beginning of the game...if you are Mafia and your game has a Mafia Roleblocker and a Mafia Goon like our does....are you informed that your scum partner is a Roleblocker if you are the Goon or would the only way you know your partner was a Roleblocker if he/she told you during your night PMs to each other?Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
The shortest GTKAS thread ever!-
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PaltryExcuse Mafia Scum
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Odd timing for this question...havingfitz wrote:Question for the more experienced players....when you are provided your roles at the beginning of the game...if you are Mafia and your game has a Mafia Roleblocker and a Mafia Goon like our does....are you informed that your scum partner is a Roleblocker if you are the Goon or would the only way you know your partner was a Roleblocker if he/she told you during your night PMs to each other?-
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PaltryExcuse Mafia Scum
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havingfitz Survivor
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What would have been a better point to ask it? It did not occur to me to ask it until I began looking closer at yours and Pablo's interactions with DN/AMB. I just want to know when the Goon would conceivably know their partner was a Roleblocker. In the initial notification from VRK? If not...they can communicate before the game begin...right? Or at the very least at night between Day one and two.PaltryExcuse wrote:
Odd timing for this question...havingfitz wrote:Question for the more experienced players....when you are provided your roles at the beginning of the game...if you are Mafia and your game has a Mafia Roleblocker and a Mafia Goon like our does....are you informed that your scum partner is a Roleblocker if you are the Goon or would the only way you know your partner was a Roleblocker if he/she told you during your night PMs to each other?Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
The shortest GTKAS thread ever!-
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havingfitz Survivor
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My opinion of yours and Pablo's games is they have been opposite ends of the spectrum. Consider that a gut feel. I still lean towards Pablo but I also think a good mafia player would try to look as much townie as they could. I'm down to two suspects for the last scum and as I think you are the more town of the two (you and Pablo)...and as this day drags on...my gut start to wonder if you seem more townie for a reason (i.e. are you scum that has done a good job disguising it).PaltryExcuse wrote:And how is my 'towniness' scummy?Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
The shortest GTKAS thread ever!-
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PaltryExcuse Mafia Scum
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Obviously, the remaining scum would know the answer to this question. So you're basically saying, I can't be the last scum because I don't know how scum works.havingfitz wrote:What would have been a better point to ask it? It did not occur to me to ask it until I began looking closer at yours and Pablo's interactions with DN/AMB. I just want to know when the Goon would conceivably know their partner was a Roleblocker. In the initial notification from VRK? If not...they can communicate before the game begin...right? Or at the very least at night between Day one and two.
I'm pretty sure this question is honest, as I also believe Pablo is scum, however the timing makes it weird.-
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Vel-Rahn Koon Virginia's Trump
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havingfitz wrote:Question for the more experienced players....when you are provided your roles at the beginning of the game...if you are Mafia and your game has a Mafia Roleblocker and a Mafia Goon like our does....are you informed that your scum partner is a Roleblocker if you are the Goon or would the only way you know your partner was a Roleblocker if he/she told you during your night PMs to each other?This is dependent on the Mod, but most Mods tell you your partner's role as well as yours if you are Mafia.
Yes, in my games the Mafia members know each others roles without having to talk to one another.
For future games, I am going to update my role PMs post (post 2) to reflect this information. Thanks fitz.
Official Vote Count
Pablo Molinero - 1 (PaltryExcuse)
PaltryExcuse - 1 (Pablo Molinero)
Not Voting - 3 (havingfitz, Starbuck, Tororingu-chan)
3 to Lynch.is the end of Sunday, November 8.DeadlineThe Newbie Queue ALWAYS needs ICs and Mods!
Are you willing to help out? Check the Queue title to see what roles we need filled!-
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Tororingu-chan Goon
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havingfitz Survivor
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I didn't know the answer to the question (thanks VRK)...I could only assume what it was. It was asked on the off chance that any of the players currently in the game had been Mafia before and in a Goon-Roleblocker scenario. Like I said...the timing was based on the extended opportunities we've all had to dwell over each other's postings and my curiosity over what point in the game the Goon would know there was a Roleblocker. IMO early knowledge would give the Goon insight into the 50-50% chance there was a cop and may affect their posting habits...especially if they saw what appeared to be cop-like behaviour on their buddy (such as TCs focus on DN in Day 2). I was not expecting you or Pablo to say "Deathnote never mentioned it to me" etc. I give you both more credit than thatPaltryExcuse wrote:
Obviously, the remaining scum would know the answer to this question. So you're basically saying, I can't be the last scum because I don't know how scum works.havingfitz wrote:What would have been a better point to ask it? It did not occur to me to ask it until I began looking closer at yours and Pablo's interactions with DN/AMB. I just want to know when the Goon would conceivably know their partner was a Roleblocker. In the initial notification from VRK? If not...they can communicate before the game begin...right? Or at the very least at night between Day one and two.
I'm pretty sure this question is honest, as I also believe Pablo is scum, however the timing makes it weird.
Thanks again VRK for the answer. Interesting.Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
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PaltryExcuse Mafia Scum
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The reason for it aside, it was still a weird question to ask considering where we are in the game. It wasn't how it reflected on us, it was how it reflects on you. Essentially, you must be townie since you don't know how scum works. Do you see how it could be weird for me coming from one of the two unconfirmed people?-
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Starbuck Jack of All Trades
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Starting at the top of page 6
I definitely don't agree with the lynch on OMGL as I said in my last analysis post. I definitely think it was driven by opportunistic scum. Knowing his alignment, it's very obvious that he was a frustrated townie, and the fact that the "experienced" players in this game didn't pick up on this bothers me greatly.
On MiteyMouse
I know Mitey is dead, but I really liked this post by her and I definitely think that it needs to be re-read by a few people because I saw the nastiness on the last page when I went to check the current vote count.
MiteyMouse wrote:That being said, I am a nice player and will shoot compliments to players...I also give out hugs and worry about the feelings of the other players. That is just me, I like tokeep the games clean and friendly. I get accused of buddying almost every game that I play...and yes, I do try to build favourable relationships with the players in the game.I play quite a few games here and don't want a bad relationship from a game to hurt the potential to play with someone at a later time.
On havingfitz
He makes the point that I made in my first analysis post about other people besides OMGL being inactive in Post 131.
I also like the points he makes on MiteyMouse. You have every right to expect more out of experienced players. I think it's quite hypocritical for experienced players to talk down to newbies (not saying that Mitey did this, just my experience in Newbie games) when the Newbie Queue is for helping people get orientated and to sit back and not add anything of value to the conversation. This goes for SE's and IC's imho.
He takes a very opportunistic jump onto the OMGL wagon in Post 141. I also don't like how he seems to go out of his way to analyze why he thinks that the person putting the 5th vote (or in this case the hammer vote on someone) would not increase his suspicions of them. And the fact that he mentions that his vote will get to a lynch quicker bothers me.
This. QFT.PaltryExcuse wrote:The timing of your vote, havingfitz, really is odd. The thing that scares me more is the fact that you're inviting us to vote out OMG and statingno consequences or suspicionsfrom yourself. In that situation if someone threw on a 5th vote I would think them reckless and scummy. It reeks of a quicklynch now that we've waited for many days waiting for an OMG response.
Being impatient in a mafia game is a BAD thing. I know at the time of this post that OMGL hadn't posted in 5 days, but lynching someone who can't defend themselves is scummy.havingfitz wrote:1.) I’m an impatient person. If everyone was actively participating I would be in no hurry to end the first day.
I agree two weeks is definitely not a quicklynch especially at the rate this game seemed to be going, but your entrance onto the wagon is definitely scummy.havingfitz wrote:I don’t think two weeks into the game is a quicklynch…especially when OMG has been the scum focus of the game and has had votes on him for most of the game.
What bothers me here is that you just admit to voting for him because he's the focus and has the most votes. You, more or less, make a small post about Mitey and then tunnel on OMGL for the rest of the day.
He's still new though, newer than yourself. It seems to me that quite a few people in this game aren't looking at that fact.havingfitz wrote:OMG did defend himself and his weak defense is one of the things being held against him. Weren’t you the one who encouraged us to pile on the votes?
The contradictions in this post, and the contradictions with your previous posts with the post bother me. You agree that L-1 and hammer votes are actions that warrant suspicion, but then you contradict yourself and say that you can't consider the hammer after your L-1 vote to be suspicious.havingfitz wrote:I agree that the L-1 and 5th votes are actions that warrant suspicion. I tried to preface my vote with my reasoning as best that I could. After re-reading my vote post before I submitted it...I could not consider a potential 5th vote after mine as suspicious without being a total hypocrite. Which I try not to do. I've had OMG as my main suspect since last week...as have others. I don't look forward to my main suspect being replaced. I gave my thoughts on it being a quicklynch above…I don’t think it would be one.
You say you were suspicious of OMG since the week prior, but you basically parrot off of what everyone else says with your suspicion of him. I mentioned it in my first analysis and I'll mention it again. You definitely are following the crowd here.
You also repeat yourself quite a bit that you don't look forward to him being replaced. I get a very scummy feeling from this because you jumped on the wagon since he couldn't defend himself and you don't want a replacement to come in to defend themselves and possibly debunk your already weak case.
I definitely do not like the tone in this. OMGL really didn't leave such a huge stain of scumminess as you are painting here. The tunneling of OMGL is noted.havingfitz wrote:While a large part of my last few days posting has been based on a desire to move things along...it is also with the most likely scum candidate at the moment in mind and not having to deal with his replacement and the replacement's efforts to remove the scum stain left by OMG (which I would have a hard time accepting).
On Tororingu-chan
The fact that T-chan has almost double the activity of everyone else (going off of havingfitz's Post 131) seems to point in the direction that T-chan is trying to be overactive. I don't think that this is a scumtell, but I really think that she needs to let others get in edgewise.
I agree that no lynch is terrible, but I don't agree with your reasoning here. A lynch on Day 1, no matter if it's a Vanilla Townie or Mafia will always help garner information. The fact that you don't mention this bothers me.T-chan wrote:Nononono~~ No Lynch is terrible~ It means we don't get to use our most powerful weapon, the lynch~ >_<;;
Not always. It could definitely point to a frustrated townie, ESPECIALLY in a newbie game. I could see you saying this about an experienced player, but definitely not a new player.T-chan wrote:I think we really have to replace OMGLyncher.... Flaking under pressure, +1 scumminess~ >_>;
T-chan's constant riding of the new players in the NEWBIE game is rather irksome. I don't like how she never explains why certain things are scummy. I know you aren't an IC, but according to yourself earlier, you are experienced. I expect a lot more out of experienced mafia players.
Wow, what a contradiction here.T-chan wrote:Hmmm~~ I find it odd that havingfitz seems to think that OMGLyncher is guaranteed scum and would rather lynch him now rather than wait for a replacement~ >_<;
Yet at this point in time I would still prefer an OMGLyncher lynch.... havingfitz rushing into things only shows that havingfitz is impatient, not that he is scum... ^_^
How can that only show that havingfitz is impatient? I definitely have pointed out quite a few scummy things with havingfitz and I'm rather bothered that you just dismiss that with a wave of your hand.
On Pablo Molinero
Why?Pablo Molinero wrote:Did I mention that I dislike playing against replacements?
I'm very glad someone pointed this out when it happened, but I find it odd coming from you, especially with what I previously pointed out about you.Pablo Molinero wrote:That said, havingfitz's current post/vote comes at a very bizarre time, in my opinion. OMGLyncher is very clearly AWOL and unable to currently defend himself AND clearly in need of a replacement, (which I'm sure VRK will get in no time once OMG misses his prod), and only then does havingfitz pops in with a vote and post encouraging the town to close this day out ("I won't find vote #5 scummy"), before a defense for OMG can be made. I hate replacements as much as the next guy, but to axe a player while gone without allowing them to retort... it screams scummy to me.
On PaltryExcuse
In answer to your first question, yes. If you replace into a game and the person you replaced has made themselves look scummy, the replacement needs to redeem. Whenever I replace in, I always analyze my predecessor alongside everyone else, and I'm not afraid to point out where I think their faults are. You obviously won't be able to explain what that person was thinking, since the replacement isn't them, but you can try to.PaltryExcuse wrote:If we have two replacements, what tends to happen to those who replace in? I mean, they inherit the role of the previous owner, but does that mean they have to take responsibility for what their predecessor said and try to explain their thinking? Basically, do they take ownership of whatever was said by the one they replaced?
Unfortunately, most people that have started a game from the beginning will see someone as being scummy and when that person replaces out for whatever reason, they will still see the spot as being scummy.
You seem to fencesit here. You state that what he did was scummy, but then you turn right back around and say that he is trying to move the game along.PaltryExcuse wrote:What I meant was, now that he has stopped posting for 3 / 4 days and hasn't posted, I was waiting for a response. And then the 4th vote comes on and you encourage us to put the nail on the coffin, like a "quick, lynch that guy". I think what happened was suspicious, but all in all it more raised my eyebrows than convinced me of your guilt. Your comments have provided a large portion of recent activity and my gut is leaning towards you wanting to move things along.
Caught up to ABR and RayFrost replacing in Page 7, Post 152<3 Kise, Reck, dram, tans, & Kats <3-
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Starbuck Jack of All Trades
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Starting ABR and RayFrost replacing in Page 7, Post 152
On my predecessor, ronnieroo
I definitely think that ronnie defended herself very well against ABR in Post 173, as he is a tough competitor.
On Tororingu-chan
I'm very glad that Mitey pointed this out when it happened as it's exactly what I'm currently thinking.MiteyMouse wrote:See what I find funny about HF thinking that Ray/OMG is guaranteed Scum is that it smels of PIS (perfect infrmation syndrome). What I find funnier is that you point this out and then defend him T-Chan.
I don't like your willingness to accept that he's just impatient. You definitely are defending havingfitz. I also don't like that after MM pointed you out as defending havingfitz that you get all up in arms about it.T-chan wrote:I noticed it, and it was odd, but at this point in time I don't consider him scummier than OMGLyncher~~ ^_^ So far, I'm willing to accept his explanation that he's just really impatient, since I can see how it's possible to be exasperated at the rate this game is (was) moving.. @_@;;
On DeathNote
I just wanted to note the scumminess of Post 158. As I haven't gotten to Day 2 and seen the reason that he was lynched, the fact that he wanted to vote before Ray got caught up would have given me reason enough to vote him on Day 1 if I was here.
And noting Post 166 and in Post 174, especially with this one thing:
And then he thinks he put Ray at L-1!DeathNote wrote:He was simply the best option since he lacked the ability to defend himself.
Ray, I hope you are reading along and I hope you are basking in the fact that you were right about DeathNote with your first sentence.RayFrost wrote:DN - I put him here, but he's obv. scum. he's obviously the one manipulating events so I replace into games with him in them seriously though, no real read on him so far.
I mean, seriously, wtf. Why didn't you guys jump on DeathNote during Day 1? His very obvious scumminess is screaming at me.
On havingfitz
I definitely do not care for this post. I mean seriously, someone can't check in to say hi before they do their analysis?havingfitz wrote:I thought you learned your lesson in my last (& first...816) game. Always make your analysis post first. You did the same thing in that game...showed up way late Japan time...said you'd have a read and get back to us. Then you were lynched to end the game before you had a chance to speak.
What about this:havingfitz wrote:MM...nowhere do I make any reference to OMG being guaranteed scum. He was #1 on my list last week...as he was for a few others...but my suspicions on him were not the only reasons for my vote on him (as I have explained in detail). Don't put words in my mouth to justify your attempt to shift negative sentiment my way. I would focus more on the content of your posts. For someone with as much experience as you and so willing to help the IC...your posts don't have a lot of meat to them.
Do you have any other reasons to suspect me besides your faulty accusation that I think OMG was guaranteed scum?
You say right there that you would have a hard time accepting a replacement's efforts to remove the scum stain, which to me (and obviously to MM) is you stating that you think he's guaranteed scum.havingfitz wrote:While a large part of my last few days posting has been based on a desire to move things along...it is also with the most likely scum candidate at the moment in mind and not having to deal with his replacement and the replacement's efforts to remove the scum stain left by OMG (which I would have a hard time accepting).
Pablo hits the nail on the head here.Pablo Molinero wrote:I think it's interesting that havingfitz immediately downgrades to a FoS after a real life person came along. Not only that, but the real-live person hasn't even posted a proper defense or response yet. Where did the gung-ho behavior go? What about keeping pressure on and making replacements answer for with their predecessor did? I'm fine where my vote is right now on havingfitz, who hasn't helped himself one bit with his recent actions, but I'd definitely like to see how Ray responds.
How funny that havingfitz goes on and on how the hammer vote wouldn't be looked on as being suspicious by him, and he goes and hammers. And his reason now for his vote is that RayFrost hasn't done enough since he replaced in to change his mind.
Well, guess you are kinda wrong here with the fact that DeathNote was on the RayFrost/OMGL bandwagon.havingfitz wrote:I have low scum reads on all the people voting for RF while my top three suspects are sending their votes elsewhere. Seems like my odds (assuming my 'gut' is right) of hitting scum are decent.
On PaltryExcuse
How do you feel about it now that OMGL flipped town? You, yourself, are a newbie, and this statement is very odd coming from someone who at this point has only been playing on MS for 21 days. Ronnie has been playing for awhile now, and I'm definitely surprised that she is the only semi-experienced person to point out that his actions are showing more frustrated townie than scum.PaltryExcuse wrote:Upon a perusal of Roo's posts, I have to say ABR's argument does stand strong in my mind.
Reason: Roo plays the newbie card a lot when talking about OMG. Inexperience can be a detriment, but it's not an excuse for scummy behaviour. The defense is weak.
You say just up there that the defense is bad, but then you turn right around in the same post and say this:
Contradiction much?PaltryExcuse wrote:If Roo doesn't want someone lynched then wouldn't she defend them? She doesn't believe OMG is scum, and defends him against pretty much everyone else. However, if she was scum, Ray gets lynched and is town, she looks like a defender of the down-trod. I'm having trouble seeing how a defense is instantly bad.
I also think it's very scummy that you vote for Ray before he gets his analysis post up. This game is very, VERY wordy, which is what's taking me so long to get through it.
So after Ray flipped town, were you still suspicious of ronnie?PaltryExcuse wrote:I don't think Ray will pop up town, hence I don't think it is a when, but an if. This sounds like you're pretty sure Ray will flip town. I have to say this makes me a bit suspicious of you.
Caught up to the end of Day 1, beginning of Day 2...Post 227<3 Kise, Reck, dram, tans, & Kats <3-
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PaltryExcuse Mafia Scum
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I was completely wrong, obviously. In retrospect it makes sense, even though I couldn't see myself doing the same in his position. I still think the newbie excuse shouldn't be used too much. I've read games where scum has flown under the radar with it the entire game. If it's scummy, it's scummy, and I saw OMG's behaviour as scummy despite the source.Starbuck wrote:On PaltryExcuse
How do you feel about it now that OMGL flipped town? You, yourself, are a newbie, and this statement is very odd coming from someone who at this point has only been playing on MS for 21 days. Ronnie has been playing for awhile now, and I'm definitely surprised that she is the only semi-experienced person to point out that his actions are showing more frustrated townie than scum.PaltryExcuse wrote:Upon a perusal of Roo's posts, I have to say ABR's argument does stand strong in my mind.
Reason: Roo plays the newbie card a lot when talking about OMG. Inexperience can be a detriment, but it's not an excuse for scummy behaviour. The defense is weak.
Not in the slightest. I say a defense itself isn't scummy. I still didn't like the newbie defense and its use was weird in my mind. One was making hypothetical comments, and the other my analysis on her defense. Two different things. I stand by my thoughts on a weak defense being more telling than a weak attack any day.Starbuck wrote:You say just up there that the defense is bad, but then you turn right around in the same post and say this:
Contradiction much?PaltryExcuse wrote:If Roo doesn't want someone lynched then wouldn't she defend them? She doesn't believe OMG is scum, and defends him against pretty much everyone else. However, if she was scum, Ray gets lynched and is town, she looks like a defender of the down-trod. I'm having trouble seeing how a defense is instantly bad.
I wanted to keep the pressure on seeing as everyone was removing their votes. I thought they were absolving Ray of OMG's guilt and didn't like it.Starbuck wrote:I also think it's very scummy that you vote for Ray before he gets his analysis post up. This game is very, VERY wordy, which is what's taking me so long to get through it.
Slightly, yes. But her lack of activity took her off my radar as day 2 goes on as I had nothing to go on.Starbuck wrote:
So after Ray flipped town, were you still suspicious of ronnie?PaltryExcuse wrote:I don't think Ray will pop up town, hence I don't think it is a when, but an if. This sounds like you're pretty sure Ray will flip town. I have to say this makes me a bit suspicious of you.-
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havingfitz Survivor
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@Starbuck
It's good to see you getting caught up. If after you've read through the entire game you have any questions for me I will be happy to answer. I would address some of the points you bring up now but I'd prefer to wait until you have the whole game picture for you to formulate any questions for me.Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
The shortest GTKAS thread ever!-
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Starbuck Jack of All Trades
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Starting beginning of Day 2...Page 10, Post 227
On my predecessor, ronnieroo
I think she gave a perfect answer to DeathNote's question in Post 232.
I really have no qualms with anything that ronnie has done.
On ABR
QFT.ABR wrote:Activity isn't a scumtell at all, in fact most scum like to use lack of activity as a reason to mislynch town.
Like Day 1 for instance!
One thing I want to mention about ABR is that I've played with him before and although I see he was V/LA, his posts in general really didn't impress me especially knowing now that he was the doc.
On T-chan
So far you don't seem to have any opinions on anyone on Day 2, but you say this
You found absolutely no one else scummy on Day 1?T-chan wrote:Yes, I was probably tunnel-visioning a little... @_@; I thought he was miles scummier than anyone else, so I tried to get him lynched...
I don't care for the tiptoeing she's doing here.T-chan wrote:I've been watching both havingfitz and Pablo going at each other's throats, and I don't think I have any reason to believe either are scum.... let's try not to let them eclipse any other player and make it seem as if we all have to vote for either one or the other! ^_^;
I definitely endorse her case on DeathNote in Post 277, and besides what I previously pointed out and playing with him previously. He replaced out because he was caught. No question about it.
So in Post 389, T-chan claims cop with a guilty on DeathNote/almightybob. Unless she's seriously bussing and the real cop is just staying quiet, but without a counterclaim, then I'm thinking that she is the cop.
What's funny about all this is that the maf took the shot at ABR, probably figuring that there was a Doc out there that could protect T-chan. But I don't think they anticipated that he was the doc.
On havingfitz
QFT.Pablo Molinero wrote:Huge surprise there. The way he handled the last week before dropping the hammer was incredibly scummy. Hopefully I'll find a break in homework (which I'm currently doing) sometime this week to give a longer post why and drop my vote on him.
havingfitz wrote:That sucked. Two of my top three suspects turn out to be town. Obviously any gut feel/intuition I've got needs re-adjusted.
This just screams scumminess to me.havingfitz wrote:At least my odds of hitting scum have improved.
QFT.PaltryExcuse wrote:
Which was:havingfitz wrote:
Please see post 171. I basically answer the same line of questioning from Pablo.PaltryExcuse wrote:@Havingfitz: You put a vote on OMG to make him L-1, and encouraged others to vote before replacements (considering your distaste for them). Why was it once Ray 'arrived' the time to wait for OMG/Ray a chance to talk?
That doesn't make your intentions clear at all for me. If the town doesn't want him lynched, they'll respond in kind. It seems to me as though you shied away from attack and hid behind 'what the town wants'. From what I understand, it was the 'what the town wanted' that convinced you.havingfitz wrote:I was gung ho until the vote on OMG went from L-1 to L-2 and the town consensus seemed to favor waiting.
And when the replacement did have their say you placed the hammer vote because you didn't like what they said and they didn't do enough to change your mind, but you didn't state WHY or WHAT you didn't like.havingfitz wrote:I wasn't shying away...when the votes for OMG were getting fewer I was basically resigned to the fact he wasn't going anywhere (at least before a replacement was made) and once that replacement was made, it was only common courtesy to let the replacement have their say.
I'm definitely not liking the case he makes on Pablo in Post 246. He cuts out half of Pablo's Post 70 and only uses the part that makes himself look good. His entire statement about hypocrisy at all is null and void to me.
Reaching much? My goodness.havingfitz wrote:Note: at this point the two most active players were TC and DN. Pablo's 10 prior posts were within one or two posts of everyone else's in the game. Trying to divert attention from himself as one of the two most active players (which he wasn't) and steer attentions to the less active players, of whom he was actually right in line with and is now the leader of, =hypocrisy IMO
1. You and Pablo were not the only ones focusing on OMGL. At that point, everyone in the game was focusing on him.havingfitz wrote:Huh? I'm trying to be more active in the game. I give my reasons for thinking OMG is the scummiest person (whom you have been focusing on up to this point as well) and vote for him. In your limited number of posts you have urged activity (and used the lack of it as a reason to suspect OMG), prompted us to cast votes, stated your dislike of replacements, and cast suspicions towards OMG. In this one post you use basically all of these things you have espoused to shift suspicions towards me and change your vote from OMG to me. That IMO is several examples of hypocrisy lumped into one post.
2. Urging activity is part of being a good IC and being a mafia player in general.
3. I have said before that OMGL gave me the impression of a frustrated townie, but others do take lurking out of a game (depending on the actions of the person) as a scum tell. You also did this, so I don't understand your reasoning here.
4. Prompting to cast votes is also part of being a good IC. The best thing that townies have are their vote. The fact that you are jumping on him for asking people to use their vote bothers me.
5. A lot of people dislike replacements, how is this in anyway related to the situation at hand?
1. To me, it seemed like you couldn't care what RayFrost said because he would never redeem the actions of OMGL to you, and you state this in the post where you hammer him. So what was the point of you unvoting in the first place?havingfitz wrote:Pablo, who doesn't like replacements and wants people to vote and be active, denounces my downgrading of my vote on RayFrost (which I have explained in detail was to allow him (RF) to state his case) and looks forward to seeing how Ray responds. ? Isn't this what I am trying to achieve as well? <=Hypocrisy>
In summary....Pablo has: urged us to be active, to pile on votes, stated his dislike of replacements, used OMG's lack of activity as a reason to suspect OMG, and been willing to hear OMGs replacement state his case and hypocritically, Pablo has been: the least active on the board, vehemently objected to my vote on his main suspect (OMG), and criticized my willingness (however reluctant it may have been) to allow OMG's replacement to have his say in the very same post where he (Pablo) announces he is looking forward to hearing OMG's replacement's response as well. And then Pablo disappears until Ray is gone.
2. I already answered most of what you said above this.
3. Where has he been the least active? If you are going to say this, I want to see numbers.
4. Why can't he object to your scummy jump onto the wagon? Whether or not it's the same person he suspects holds no water.
The use of the word 'hypocrisy' throughout this whole post is a bit much. He's trying hard to get a case on Pablo when there really isn't one. If anyone is being hypocritical here, it's definitely havingfitz.
This bothers me because Pablo is no where near as inactive as OMGL was.havingfitz wrote:Who says you aren't comparable to OMG? You? Well that's convenient...for you. You used OMG's inactivity as a negative towards him like I am towards you (among other negatives). In my opinion there is a comparision. And my comments regarding your persistent hypocratic play do not revolve entirely on comparisons to OMG (?).
This post bothers me. You definitely did not care what Ray had to say especially because you were pushing for the lynch to happen before he replaced in.havingfitz wrote:Once the replacement occurred (as I've already mentioned) I was willing to hear RayFrost out.Funny enough....since you apparently were so keen to hear from OMG's replacement you may want to note that he had you as his top scum suspect and me as his least scummy suspect.
1. You definitely mentioned Pablo at the beginning of the game, but you rarely mention him (other than your scumlists) until Day 2 when he started mentioning your inconsistencies and scumminess.havingfitz wrote:Also...how is my vote pre-emptive or panicked? I have voiced suspicions of you since before OMG was even gone and with OMG (and subsequently MiteyMouse) gone...you are my top suspect. And I gave numerous reasons for my suspicions. Nothing panicked about it. You on the other hand have a very weak defense/case against me...especially considering the biggest thing I've done to add to you suspcions of me is the editting I invalidated at the beginning of this post.
2. Reading you in iso, you can find that your suspicions lie with T-chan, Pablo and OMG in this post. This is the one and only time you voice your suspicion of T-chan. You then mention your suspicion of MM here. You post another list of who you think is scummiest here. Then miraculously both of your suspects are gone, and you are free to focus on Pablo.
3. Where specifically is his case weak? My guess is that you did not read the whole thing because you only think he's making a case on you based on the editting you did of his posts.
I sense distancing.havingfitz wrote:I thought TC made some good observations on DN but when I looked closer I think I came to some of the same conclusions Bob has used in DN's defense. I'm not convinced DN is mafia.
One thing I'd like to point out is that MM highly suspected fitz on Day 1 & died Night 1 and then ABR did the same on Day 2 & died Night 2.
On PaltryExcuse
I definitely agree with Pablo's statement here, but I will point out that OMGL did the same thing (pointed out his faults) and got pounced all over for it.Pablo wrote:Really, admitting to fault and having some semblance of self-awareness before someone can point it out is a FAULT? Yikes, you have some messed-up priorities, if that's so.
On Pablo
I have no qualms about his case on havingfitz in from 247 to 249.
This is very easy and WIFOM-y to say after the fact.Pablo wrote:If forced to, due the deadline, I would have hammered, yes.
Caught up to the end of Day 2<3 Kise, Reck, dram, tans, & Kats <3-
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Starbuck Jack of All Trades
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Starting at the beginning of Day 3
On Havingfitz
I love a bowl of WIFOM first thing in the morning.havingfitz wrote:That sucks that ABR was the doctor. If the doctor had made it through the night town would have been guaranteed the win. Now a town win is more like 50-50 unless TC guessed right during the night. As she had a 1-4 chance of investigating the right person I hope she chose wisely.
On Tororingu-chan
OMG, I just saw this and I feel so bad now for suspecting you for a good part of my analysis!T-chan wrote:Sorry about that everyone, I had some connection problems~~ ._.;;;
Well, I was mostly fishing for reactions, but I have an innocent on Starbuck (ronnieroo)! ^_^
ROFL.
I did see your nastiness on the last page and where VRK edited in his thoughts. VRK knows that I replace into a lot of newbie games and he knows exactly what I do. I read the game from beginning to end. Although, I was curious to see what the vote count was so I checked it before I started the rest of my analysis and caught your words.
I never said you were scummy. As I said above, I analyze the whole game and I will point out what I think is faulty.T-chan wrote:Anyway, looks like for now I am number one on Starbuck's scummeter. Looking forward to who number 2 is~~ ^_^
I'm not sure how I'm feeling about this 1v1 between Paltry and Pablo, because I really don't suspect either and I'm getting the feeling of two townies going at it.<3 Kise, Reck, dram, tans, & Kats <3-
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havingfitz Survivor
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First things first....
Vote: Pablo Molinero
@Starbuck...is there any specifics you want me to answer or shall I just weed through your analyses and try to deduce what your questions are.Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
The shortest GTKAS thread ever!-
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havingfitz Survivor
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@Starbuck...btw, I'm not waiting for specifics to begin weeding...just want to make sure if there are items of more importance you feel are against me.
Also...the vote for Pablo is for reasons already specified throughout the game. I wan'ted to wait until Starbuck gave her analysis to see if she had any observations on Pablo or Paltry that I had missed. Guess not. No Pablo/Paltry analysis for Day 3? Just t vs t?Town 57w-66l :: Not Town 29w-16l:: TBD 2
V/LA on weekends (i.e. RL > mafia)
The shortest GTKAS thread ever!-
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Starbuck Jack of All Trades
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Starbuck Jack of All Trades
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