Open 162--Trendy and Subversive - Over! before 831

[Khelvaster]

Yeah, he's replacing Cass[/blue]

[yabbaguy]

Chinaman, first order of business.

ABR's claimed nurse. Can you counterclaim it yourself?

[Jahudo]

yay, game on

[Netopalis]

Let's do this. I'm looking forward to the four of us playing...and Albert nominally participating...again.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Hey my strategy worked great, you have no room to talk.

[Chinaman]

Lol..Alright guys, I start reading up on this game then saw I hadn't been announced. I just finished reading up in another game I'm replacing so this one will have to wait till tomorrow. But, to get some answers going, no, I can not CC nurse. As far ABR not posting much, I've played with him before where he was vocal enough for me. I think it may be due to the deadness this game was facing. I will catch up ASAP and post some thoughts ASAP. This, I promise, will happen before COB Thursday. Hopefully sooner.

[Netopalis]

COB Thursday? Whassat?

[Chinaman]

close of business
sorry...

[yabbaguy]

ABR's confirmed then.

I'll catch up with this later, right now, my mentality's a bit scatterbrained in real life and Mafiascum.

[Jahudo]

This'll probably be obvious but I'm interested to hear China's opinions on:

1. CSL's interactions with other people
2. Other people's interactions with CSL
3. Do points 1 and 2 make Neto look more town than us, about the same, or something else.
4. Jahudo vs. yabbaguy suspicions... if either one of us looks suspicious for being suspicious.

[Netopalis]

Jahudo, while I appreciate the logical positiveness of your statement - if China is town then he must know that one of the 3 of you, me and Yabba has to be scum - I find your constant setting up of dichotomies to be rather damaging to the town cause and honestly highly scummy. You've done this several times and each time you've said it was simply a way to spark discussion...but it seems that you are really, really interested in getting rid of Yabba. Why is that?

[Jahudo]

"Neither of us looking suspicious" is always an option, but I'd rather phrase the conversation in a way that helps to find the scum, rather than the town.

And I did am not referring to any dichotomy that did not already exist as a result of our scumhunting.

[Netopalis]

Jahudo, I'm sorry, you're a good player...but your actions lead me to believe that you're the most likely candidate for the scum here. I'm going to

Vote: Jahudo

, with the reservation to change my mind after a post by China. If there were more players available, I wouldn't be voting you at all, but given a tough situation like this where it seems that everybody's town or has a foolproof claim....I have to go with the person that I think is *most* likely to be scum.

[Chinaman]

alright, first let me say this game is weird. second let me say I'm pretty sure our mafia roleblocker is Vote: Net. Basically, while reading through him and one other person came to mind. It was p190 that sealed the deal for me.

I am fairly convinced that some combination of ABR/Cass/Jahudo is scum. ABR for his obvious scummy lack of content, Cass for his odd and infrequent postings which seem to be more of a hindrance than a help and Jahudo...Not really sure why on Jahudo - wording, perhaps? It's hard to say exactly why, but I do get a gut reaction from him. That being said, I find him the least likely candidate....

Also: Just did a quick reread. Unfortunately, due to CSL's inactivity/idiocy, there are no actionable connections between any of the other players and him.

First of all, 2 of the 3 people on you list are town. ABR claimed nurse, I'm town, and...you don't really know why Jahudo? There is plenty of reason to suspect Juhudo, yet you don't know why you do. I don't like it. Secondly, ABR claimed nurse and there was no CC. Why is he obvious scum to you before you all established whether or not he was nurse? Doesn't sit right with me.

Secondly, there was plenty of interaction I saw with CSL from you. It wasn't interaction really, but more of you mentioning him quite a bit. I will go back into your ISO and explain in my next post, but to me during the read through you started off onto CSL, then I got the feeling you were sorta defending him at one point, then you seemed overly excited that has being replaced enough so you mentioned it multiple times. All these things could indeed come from a town standpoint, I just got a scummy feel for them.

Also, it seems to me you like to go after ppl not posting rather than ppl who are active. That's been a scum tell in almost every game I have played in.

Last but not least, p260 almost made me change my mind on you, but then 262 came out and you sorta just auto assume I'm town there. Also you seem pretty sure Yabba is town as well. Why is that? I feel the same way, but why do YOU feel Yabba's town?
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On the flip side, I think Yabba is the most town player right now. Yeah, ABR is confirmed, but nothing Yabba has said has triggered any sort of ping on the radar.
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That being said, I have 2 people to pick from being scum. Jahudo or Net and I choose...

Vote: Net

(side note: whoever is csl's partner got screwed and I personally don't think this game should count against them, but w/e, a win is a win for me!)

[Albert B. Rampage]

I concur.

Vote Net

[Chinaman]

Net: 2 chinaman, ABR
Jahudo: 1 Net

Personal use but you can use as well.

[Netopalis]

First of all, Chinaman, let me say that the votecount is the mod's job and not yours. Second, ABR was not confirmed at the time that I posted that. Third, I was going after people for inactivity because the game was inactive and that was the primary thing hurting our advancement as town. My hope was that putting pressure on inactive players would cause them to, well, be active. Finally, my posts in relation to CSL were due to the fact that I've played games with him before and he was an abjectly awful player in all of them. I was really hoping that we could fix that. Eventually, I began to realize that he was a lost cause. Finally, you are not proven town and all agreed that Cass was rather scummy, so I'm not entirely sure why suspicion of Cass should be seen as a scumtell.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Blablabla my name is neto i like to go after easy targets so i don't have to compromise myself throug scumhuntin...oh wait.

[Netopalis]

Blablahblah, my name is Albert B. Rampage and I expect people to value my opinion even though I don't read the bloody thread.

[Albert B. Rampage]

You can value my vote.

[Chinaman]

First of all, Chinaman, let me say that the votecount is the mod's job and not yours. Second, ABR was not confirmed at the time that I posted that. Third, I was going after people for inactivity because the game was inactive and that was the primary thing hurting our advancement as town. My hope was that putting pressure on inactive players would cause them to, well, be active. Finally, my posts in relation to CSL were due to the fact that I've played games with him before and he was an abjectly awful player in all of them. I was really hoping that we could fix that. Eventually, I began to realize that he was a lost cause. Finally, you are not proven town and all agreed that Cass was rather scummy, so I'm not entirely sure why suspicion of Cass should be seen as a scumtell.

Well, the there seems to be vote changes quite often (especially with ABR around) and I already said it was for personal use so I could keep track.

Alright, I will give you that ABR wasn't confirmed by that post, but I will however point out he WAS claimed. That's enough for most people to take them off their obvscum list.

Secondly, I do not believe all agreed that Cass was rather scummy, if anything, he just wasn't there. You trying to make YOUR opinion into EVERYONE's opinion is certainly not helping your cause with me. I PERSONALLY view those with suspicion the 2 roles I can personally confirm as a possible suspicious activity. I'm not using you thinking he was scummy as my main point, it just fits with my overall impression of you.

That being said, what's your case on Jahudo? Why him over everyone else? bullet points and post numbers would be nice so I can go back and look, but w/e. Tell me why I should join you in voting him instead of you.

I would also like you to tell me why you were suspicious of Cass when he was around and thought him to be "rather scummy".

[Jahudo]

What was Net's case against Cass? I had some concern for her early on but I never called her scummy.

@china: can you elaborate your read on yabba? Is he just town for not doing anything scummy or anti-town, or is he town for doing something pro-town?

[Netopalis]

Big post coming after class sometime...Expect it before 6 PM.

[Chinaman]

Juh p271: It was more of a feel I got from him overall. More of a not doing anything scummy and posting in a pro-town feel overall tbh.

[Netopalis]

Alright....My case on Cass:

1) By the same logic that you accuse me of a connection with CSL, Cass had one as well by excusing his failure to understand the vote status. However, since I don't feel that my actions were scummy in relation to CSL, I don't think that this particularly was either.

2) Very few posts are significant. The lengthy posts are often rather fluffy. Take, for example, the following one:

Very well, let's ask some questions then:

@Khamisa: who is more likely to be scum, Yabba or netopalis? Why?

@ABR: In this setup, is doc+nurse better for town, or cop+deputy? Why?

@Yabbaguy: So you think scum tends to lurk? In this specific game or in general?

@Jahudo: Do you think yabba's response to your attack was omgus, or something else? Why?

@Netopalis: Can you give us a top three of most scummy players? Preferably with some explanations.

For the mod:
Unvote: whoever I was voting

The question to Khamisa sets up a false dichotomy, the question to ABR doesn't relate to anything at all, the question to Yabba is rather easily answered, the question to Jahudo asks his opinion of another's action which is really marginal and the question to me is just a request for more information. At no point during this post does he give any of his own opinions.

3) He encourages a great deal of voting which, in a game this small, can lead to mislynches quite easily.

4) Again, by the same token, if you consider the lynching lurkers thing to be a scumtell against me, you must consider it a scumtell against yourself, because Cass advocated the same thing.


Finally, it just seems that in all of his posts (however few they may be), he's trying to look like he's participating without actually

saying

anything.



In re: Jahudo, for the longest time, I wasn't quite able to put my finger on exactly what it was that struck me as wrong about him. Then, today, it hit me - he is trying to encourage the town to act in specific ways by asking questions that fit players into certain categories. Post 17 is the first time that he does this (reading him in isolation), but he does the same thing again in 44. Many of his other posts in which he asks questions are generally leading, such as 9, 18, 33 and 44. It seems as if he is asking the question with the intent of driving the town in a certain direction. To me, this seems extremely scummy.