Mini 861: Hellsing Mafia - (Game Over!)

[Doombunny9]

I still think that Neto should decide what we're going to do about this. I mean, it's fine if we drop one or two suggestions about it but this whole thing is getting us off track of scumhunting and discussion and isn't helping the game at all. Neto has the power, not the town as a whole.

[Amished]

You're obviously not understanding my real point if you're just focusing on my analogy. How is the math better in case we miss later, cause that's your point for not vigging. Any way that we can get suspected scum is beneficial to the town.

[Chaco]

Any way that we can get suspected scum is beneficial to the town.

So shooting on a whim allows us to get "suspected scum"?

[Amished]

@DB: I, however, want Net to make the best theoretical decision possible. If we have this debate (while also looking for scum (Looker/Saber are my top suspects at this point)), net can make a decision and we'll get scum anyways.

Vote: Looker

Still for active lurking.

[Chaco]

net can make a decision and we'll get scum anyways.

You seem so confident that his shot will be right. To me it seems like nudging.

[Doombunny9]

Hell, take this last page. You've said you were defending Saber because he was being attacked for weak reasons, but then YOU VOTE FOR HIM for no other reason than saying that it's the play of the day. *%&$#%yu$#)*%()&#$%&@*()#)$^ BLARGH.

Even though the reasons were bad I still agreed with them. I still thought he was scummy. I would still be fine with a vote for him. I would however, prefer to vote Looker. I thought I made this clear before. Guess not. Oh well.[/quote]

[Doombunny9]

Just realized my votes still on saber

unvote

I'll decide who I want to vote tomorrow. Right now I have to get some sleep.

[Amished]

Do you deliberately try to avoid my question, or do you not read all of my posts?

You're scared of missing scum with a vig shot. Understandable. How is never shooting (or shooting later in the game under the 1-shot-UNK-miller-vig claim) better for the town?

1) It wouldn't be "on a whim"; it'd be because of suspicion. It's like a cop, you investigate who you're suspicious of, and you get a result. Yes, this is an analogy too, so don't just quote this line either and ignore the rest of my posts.

2a) The vig is right (i.e. we get scum). We test Net's claim immediately; and we're rid of one scum.

2b) The vig is wrong (i.e. hit a *suspicious* townie). We still test Net's claim (which helps us with determining his claim = beneficial). We eliminate a distraction from the game, reduce the list of suspects while not offing somebody people view to be pro-town (=beneficial).

In your scenario, we make anybody scummy to have to be lynched until late game when mistakes are more amplified. I will not allow you to delay something that will benefit the town so that you can allow a sketchy claim to go through til it's too late to evaluate it; while also hurting the town by allowing scummy people that we don't have enough lynches for.

If the vig misses, I've already pointed out with math why it's more beneficial to miss now rather than later. The reduction of the list of suspects is also beneficial, and widely regarded to be true. I can dig up the MD threadS on this as well if necessary.

Yes, I'm confident that my reads are right. Clearly they not always are. Are you not confident when you think you've found scum?

Chaco replaces DB on my list of suspects.

[Amished]

Even though the reasons were bad I still agreed with them.

I still thought he was scummy. I would still be fine with a vote for him. I would however, prefer to vote Looker. I thought I made this clear before. Guess not. Oh well.

[/quote]/facepalm

[Chaco]

Do you deliberately try to avoid my question, or do you not read all of my posts?

You're scared of missing scum with a vig shot. Understandable. How is never shooting (or shooting later in the game under the 1-shot-UNK-miller-vig claim) better for the town?

1) It wouldn't be "on a whim"; it'd be because of suspicion. It's like a cop, you investigate who you're suspicious of, and you get a result. Yes, this is an analogy too, so don't just quote this line either and ignore the rest of my posts.

2a) The vig is right (i.e. we get scum). We test Net's claim immediately; and we're rid of one scum.

2b) The vig is wrong (i.e. hit a *suspicious* townie). We still test Net's claim (which helps us with determining his claim = beneficial). We eliminate a distraction from the game, reduce the list of suspects while not offing somebody people view to be pro-town (=beneficial).

In your scenario, we make anybody scummy to have to be lynched until late game when mistakes are more amplified. I will not allow you to delay something that will benefit the town so that you can allow a sketchy claim to go through til it's too late to evaluate it; while also hurting the town by allowing scummy people that we don't have enough lynches for.

If the vig misses, I've already pointed out with math why it's more beneficial to miss now rather than later. The reduction of the list of suspects is also beneficial, and widely regarded to be true. I can dig up the MD threadS on this as well if necessary.

Yes, I'm confident that my reads are right. Clearly they not always are. Are you not confident when you think you've found scum?

Chaco replaces DB on my list of suspects.

We gain more information from a lynch than a night kill.

I understand what you're saying. Now if you would, kindly stop forcing it down my throat. We have differing views, so be it. Yes, lessening the lynch pool is beneficial.

I also do not get where you're pulling that I do not want to lynch until near endgame. It is heavily implied, even if you did not word it directly so. All I have said, is that vigging N1 is ill advised. You disagree. I'd like to hear other opinions rather than you forcing your own. Different people have different opinions, and to function as a town properly you need to take into consideration the thoughts of all others. You remain adamant in your thoughts, and believe you are dead on. I however, do not feel so.

I also do not see your backing behind adding me to your suspect list. Elaborate.

[Amished]

We still gain information from a night kill. In this specific case, we even get more information about our outed vig. We get twice the normal amount of information than from a normal vig shot.

I do not imply that you don't want to lynch.

Oh, I dunno, leaving your vote on a claimed PR after asking you to unvote when at deadline the number of votes needed are halved is a pretty decent reason for me to suspect you.

[Chaco]

My vote is on Saberwolf.

But at the rate this is going, it may not for long.

[Amished]

My mistake then, I looked at the wrong vote for doombunny.

[Shotty to the Body]

I haven't read all of this, but it's an I told you so moment concerning DB it appears. I still prefer Saber lynch over anyone else, why do you think Looker is scummier then Saber's spot Amished?

[MafiaSSK]

Doombunny, can you givbe me a summarization of the game please?

You want the short or long version? Short-We all RLed, Archon (the dude you replaced) self voted to bring game out of RVS. BWs soon piled on saber and me shortly after for joking. Amished came back from his V/LA to start more feirce attacks on us. BWs and stuff formed and people started to dissapear. saber and Amished started to play better and more people left or started to active lurk. thats pretty much it unless I'm forgetting something.

This will do. Thank you.

[MafiaSSK]

Nah, I'd still hammer you. But I'd just rather lynch Saber. Either way, I'd go for both of you.

And you sidestepped the question why?

[MafiaSSK]

This is rediculous. What Amished, makes you so eager to want to lynch us all? (me, saber, looker) you're acting like you did when you came back from your V/LA. Also, since it seems as if I'm going to die (either lynched or NKed, that is, if Neto doesn't object) I see no reason why I shouldn't claim right now. Everyone ok with that? If there are no objections I'll be doing that soon.

He's not that eager to lynch. Eagerness would be asking for the hammer every single post. And why are you asking permission to claim?

[MafiaSSK]

The vig should never kill in case he misses? That's on par that we should never lynch in case we screw up!

Not what I said, and you know it. If not, you should. If you don't get what I mean, so be it. I'm not going to continuously explain my stance if it falls on deaf ears as it seems to be.

It is pretty much what you said. You're doing this a werid way of avoiding being attacked...

[MafiaSSK]

@DB: I, however, want Net to make the best theoretical decision possible. If we have this debate (while also looking for scum (Looker/Saber are my top suspects at this point)), net can make a decision and we'll get scum anyways.

Vote: Looker

Still for active lurking.

Why vote for just active lurking when you have such better cases on other people?

[MafiaSSK]

My vote is on Saberwolf.

But at the rate this is going, it may not for long.

Chaco, another thing you HAVE to understand is that Net will probably die tonight from scum's kill. Killing tonight is the best move.

[Shotty to the Body]

My vote is on Saberwolf.

But at the rate this is going, it may not for long.

Chaco, another thing you HAVE to understand is that Net will probably die tonight from scum's kill. Killing tonight is the best move.

He claimed bullet-proof miller one-kill vig, he won't die tonight if he is telling the truth. That being said I agree with Amished here anyways, shoot early, get us some more role info, eliminate a headache, and help prove a claim, its like a trifecta.

[Amished]

@SSK: My stance on your position is very clear (I think saber's play alone should be lynched).

@Shotty: I also want everyone to look at Looker; because active lurking to his extent is scummy as hell and both of you {SSK/Saber and Looker} should be lynched.

[Shotty to the Body]

SSK replaced Archon, not Saber. Saber's slot is still empty, if we don't lynch him today (real time) Kai was going to replace him. I'll ISO Looker here in a bit, I've got class soon however.

[Chaco]

@SSK: No, and no again. It is not what I meant nor implied. And I clarified numerous times. You seem to be skimming what I'm saying, otherwise you'd know that I said "DON'T SHOOT N1". Which does not turn to "OMFG DON'T SHOOT AT ALL".

And since Shotty already answered, but I'll reiterate: Net will not die tonight as he is a Bulletproof Miller Vig.

@ about Looker: He's like this in every game I've seen of him. I honestly don't think it's anything of importance, but I'll look in a bit.

[Amished]

Chaco, we realize that you're saying don't shoot at all.

Under what circumstances later in the game would "allow" Net to use his shot?