Mini 686 - Chess Mafia (Done)

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Movecount, then I decide.

[RayFrost]

Movecount, then I decide.

why not decide now?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I just want to know where we stand before I vote.

I don't really like any of our moves, for the record. I don't see whites counter to a couple responses to Nxh7, and g4 is pretty meh. I don't really have any other options for you all though.

[ah2190]

I just want to know where we stand before I vote.

Same here.

[Indigo Heron]

I smell the other scum partner amongst the two of you.

In any case, TCS, neither move is L-1, so not much to worry about. If you don't want to vote on a move, at least discuss and debate about Nxh7 v. g4, or throw out new moves if you think you see them.

[ZazieR]

Unofficial Move Count:

g4

(2) - Veerus, AA

Nxh7

(4) - IH, Zazie, Emp, Ray

[ZazieR]

I just want to know where we stand before I vote.

Same here.

Nothing to add at all?

[ZazieR]

I smell the other scum partner amongst the two of you.

In any case, TCS, neither move is L-1, so not much to worry about. If you don't want to vote on a move, at least discuss and debate about Nxh7 v. g4, or throw out new moves if you think you see them.

Agreed with the second paragraph.
Also, if one of Veerus and AA isn't scum, it's very likely ah is scum.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

What was the response to Nxh7 Qf7?

[Indigo Heron]

*facepalms, muttering "Only human..." over and over again*

*recovers after 10 minutes*

I believe that gxf4 is not a good move. It's incredibly short-sighted, enough said.

Re5 isn't very good either, at least when I compare it to either Qd3 or Nxh7.

Qd3 Qf8 Nxh7 Kxh7 g4 Kh8 gxf5 Rc7 Rxa6 Bf6 Rf1 f3 and really, Black is screwed all over.

OR....

Nxh7 Bf8 Ng5 Rf6 gxf4 Rc7 Kc1 Rxc2 Kxc2 Qc8 Kb1 and Black is still screwed, but at least he goes down trading pieces.

I've yet to make up my mind, but I will. In the meantime, I beseech you to unvote and discuss the new moves first.

[Indigo Heron]

EBWOP: Whoops.

I believe that the Qf7 response has been covered by veerus today. Just check back.

[veerus]

yes, as something that wasn't great for white.. but whatever, i guess we'll see how it plays out since it'll obviously win at the deadline

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I am an idiot.

g4 is a better move by far from what I can see. The lack of response to my query regarding Nxh7 Qf7 seems to indicate to me that

we don't have one

.

The more I look at this the more I wonder how this debate is even happening. Nxh7 is aggression for the sake of aggression, with our pieces in shitty position. g4 puts our pieces in better position.

Also in case anyone was wondering, en passant would not be a legal next move for black in the position resulting from g4. I say this because I'm stupid and thought it was, writing g4 off earlier.

move:g4

[RayFrost]

Rh6 - good response to Qf7, imo.

[ZazieR]

yes, as something that wasn't great for white.. but whatever, i guess we'll see how it plays out since it'll obviously win at the deadline

Disagreed. You have 'showed' that Nxh7 doesn't lead to an attack. Would g4 have lead to an attack? Because if it does, I don't see it. Nxh7 does.

[ZazieR]

I am an idiot.

g4 is a better move by far from what I can see. The lack of response to my query regarding Nxh7 Qf7 seems to indicate to me that

we don't have one

.

The more I look at this the more I wonder how this debate is even happening. Nxh7 is aggression for the sake of aggression, with our pieces in shitty position. g4 puts our pieces in better position.

Also in case anyone was wondering, en passant would not be a legal next move for black in the position resulting from g4. I say this because I'm stupid and thought it was, writing g4 off earlier.

move:g4

Two things:
-What better position? The way I see it, Nxh7 continues our attack, while g4 destroys it.
-If I'm correct, you mean with 'your query' the question asked in Post 1383, right? Because if you do, I seriously don't like Post 1387. Only one of the four supporters of Nxh7 posted in between the time frame of the two just mentioned posts. And the one he showed is good. You're trying to discredit Nxh7 based upon three supporters of Nxh7 not posting in between a specific time frame. That doesn't mean that there isn't a countermove present.

[ZazieR]

Rh6 - good response to Qf7, imo.

I like the move, but could you have waited with it? Deadline hits soon with Nxh7 having more support than scumdriven move g4. There was no need to show such a strong attack.

[RayFrost]

Rh6 - good response to Qf7, imo.

I like the move, but could you have waited with it? Deadline hits soon with Nxh7 having more support than scumdriven move g4. There was no need to show such a strong attack.

>.>.<.<

I totally forgot about that. Anyway... I'm not sure I see a response Black can make in response to the move, but I'll need to take some time to read it out to determine that fully...

[ZazieR]

Already looked. Won't state anything about it yet though.

[veerus]

Rh6 - good response to Qf7, imo.

which is neutralized with Qg7 which leads to white maybe winning a pawn or two.. hardly an attack.

1. e4 c5 2. Nc3 Nc6 3. f4 e6 4. Nf3 f5 5. exf5 exf5 6. Qe2 Be7 7. Nd5 Nb4 8. Nxb4 cxb4 9. d4 Nf6 10. Qc4 a6 11. Bd2 b5 12. Qd3 O-O 13. Qxf5 d5 14. Qd3 Ne4 15. g3 Bf5 16. Qb3 Nxd2 17. Kxd2 Be4 18. Re1 Kh8 19. Qe3 g5 20. Bd3 gxf4 21. Qe2 Bxd3 22. Qxd3 Bd6 23. Re6 Rf6 24. Ng5 Ra7 25. Qf3 Rf5 26. h4 Be7 27. Qd3 Qf8 28. Nxh7 Qf7 29. Rh6 Qg7 30. Qxf5 Qxh6

Compare that to g4 which keeps the pressure up and wins a rook for a knight in the worst case scenario.. maybe same net result except that after g4 the black king is still under pressure

1. e4 c5 2. Nc3 Nc6 3. f4 e6 4. Nf3 f5 5. exf5 exf5 6. Qe2 Be7 7. Nd5 Nb4 8. Nxb4 cxb4 9. d4 Nf6 10. Qc4 a6 11. Bd2 b5 12. Qd3 O-O 13. Qxf5 d5 14. Qd3 Ne4 15. g3 Bf5 16. Qb3 Nxd2 17. Kxd2 Be4 18. Re1 Kh8 19. Qe3 g5 20. Bd3 gxf4 21. Qe2 Bxd3 22. Qxd3 Bd6 23. Re6 Rf6 24. Ng5 Ra7 25. Qf3 Rf5 26. h4 Be7 27. Qd3 Qf8 28. g4 Bxg5 29. gxf5

[ZazieR]

Veerus, stop proving that you're scum.
No further comment for now in case I might help Veerus-scum.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Veerus, stop proving that you're scum.
No further comment for now in case I might help Veerus-scum.

Not to get personal, but we

are

playing Chess here, and your arguments so far today have consisted not of Chess moves, but of accusing other people of being scum.

Are you going to respond to his line, or are you just going to continue the ad hom?

[ZazieR]

I'm not going to respond, because it only will help black. Veerus is trying to help him and his scumbuddy to let us shout what will happen so that they know what they are up against. Not going to fall for that again.
And TCS, stop proving that you haven't read what has been going on.

[veerus]

1. I'm not scum.. if I was, I wouldn't keep trying to find holes in the poor moves that have been suggested by you and co
2. Lack of your (and your buddies') desire to respond to my valid arguments and be content to wait until a worse move is deadlined is textbook scum.. considering you replaced sirdanilot who didn't contribute at all to this game except to make attacks or lurk, you're not convincing me that his (and your) play wasn't scummy
3. Nothing we say can really "help" black at this point. This is chess and there are a few FORCED sequences here after g4, all of which win material in the WORST case. Your suggestions lead down a questionable path with no clear way to secure a comparable advantage. If your line is such a great attack, show us a FORCED sequence that gives us an advantage (like g4 is) and everything will be solved. This "helping scum" routine is, well, scummy and if this game ever gets to the lynch stage, you'll be at the top of my list.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

1. I'm not scum.. if I was, I wouldn't keep trying to find holes in the poor moves that have been suggested by you and co
2. Lack of your (and your buddies') desire to respond to my valid arguments and be content to wait until a worse move is deadlined is textbook scum.. considering you replaced sirdanilot who didn't contribute at all to this game except to make attacks or lurk, you're not convincing me that his (and your) play wasn't scummy
3. Nothing we say can really "help" black at this point. This is chess and there are a few FORCED sequences here after g4, all of which win material in the WORST case. Your suggestions lead down a questionable path with no clear way to secure a comparable advantage. If your line is such a great attack, show us a FORCED sequence that gives us an advantage (like g4 is) and everything will be solved. This "helping scum" routine is, well, scummy and if this game ever gets to the lynch stage, you'll be at the top of my list.

I am town and I agree with the above statements.