Newbie 834 (Game Over!)

[GreenDude]

@oman: I didn't mean you were my other top suspect being scummy, but being dangerous. That you could be scum, and you could be town. And that it is very difficult to know which one you are because you are an IC and you are a good player. AND because looker hammered stupidly which got him lynched and it could be that he sacrificed himself knowing you were safe.

I think hiphop could be scum because he claims to be voting ox1de because the "evidence" or "looker said so" points to it. It could be true or not true. But if hiphop was scum, then he wants ox1de lynched because he thought 3 other people agreed. Unfortunately for him, I don't agree.

I don't really know about Darklight. I'm leaning scum on him. But I have not much clue.

Ox1de I think is town. He just feels that way to me.


I have to read through the game, I didn't get to yet. But I will before I vote anyone.

When is the deadline?

[DarkLightA]

Don't think that unvoting me earns you any town points, quite the opposite in fact.

Not what I was aiming for either. Just want the town to plant a solid base for finding the last scum.

[hiphop]

I'm starting to think of a looker-hiphop relationship now. It would make sense, seeing as he was the only one of us sitting out on the lynch of looker, but I'm not sure.

Think about it. Wouldn't there be townie points for anyone who was on the bw of someone who was scum? Looker was going to be lynched. That was evident. Oxide could have seen this so he put Looker at L-1. And he has the nerve to post this.

On the other hand I was scared that 'Mr Random' DarkLight would hammer Looker early.

And yet you kept your vote on her, even though I told you, you shouldn’t put someone in that situation. It was easily seen that Oxide wanted a quick lynch once he placed his vote.

<a long and well-reasoned post>

Welcome to the game.

Is it well-reasoned, because he is unvoting you?

The fact that it was in the same post as an accusation against me doesn't count for anything.

To you or to me? Because I know in this particular post it counts for me.

Cult, meh. Oman won't join in so it's pointless. Imagine a gang of two, or even one!

I posted my post before Oman declined. So you were trying to. You just failed that one. Either way a cult is still anti-town.

@Oman: Yesterday you thought you might be killed in the night, but today you're sure that you'll be here tomorrow? Just teasing...

Oman you do know that if we don’t lynch scum today there will only be three people left. Unless Oxide, me and you are left, than convincing you that someone is scum, when one of us is dead is pointless.

I am convinced that oxide is scum, that I don’t even have a second.

Not what I was aiming for either. Just want the town to plant a solid base for finding the last scum.

It doesn’t matter how we do it, as long as we do it.

First game finally finished on this site. Anybody want a meta, here it is

[0x1de]

@Oman: Can you dust off your IC hat and tell me how to view a person in isolation?

Talking of which:

We are going to have to start quoting, this is getting too confusing...

ARGH where did the lovely "show: <player name>/all" dropdown menu go? :'(

As I understand it, the configuration has been changed so that only mafia can view other players' posts in isolation

@all: Why didn't any of you comment on this?

[hiphop]

I can tell you if you want.

[0x1de]

How to view in iso, or why you didn't comment?

Come on mate, just 'cos I think you're scum doesn't mean I don't value your input.

[hiphop]

How to view in iso. I don't like to answer questions directed at someone else. It is a bad habit.

In this thread (or in any thread) go down to the bottom of this page. Right before the background turns white, at the very end of the blue, it says

Display posts from previous: All Posts

(drop down menu)

by All users

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oldest first

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Go

(push button). Change All Users to any player you want and push go. Happy scum huntimg.

[0x1de]

I'm starting to think of a looker-hiphop relationship now. It would make sense, seeing as he was the only one of us sitting out on the lynch of looker, but I'm not sure.

Think about it. Wouldn't there be townie points for anyone who was on the bw of someone who was scum? Looker was going to be lynched. That was evident. Oxide could have seen this so he put Looker at L-1. And he has the nerve to post this.

On the other hand I was scared that 'Mr Random' DarkLight would hammer Looker early.

And yet you kept your vote on her, even though I told you, you shouldn’t put someone in that situation. It was easily seen that Oxide wanted a quick lynch once he placed his vote.

Yet I actually took my vote off for a while, until everyone had a chance to contribute. Again I have to point out that I was voting for CSL/Looker right from the random votes on day one. You never tried to tell the other two to pull their votes. Besides, why should we do what you say?

<a long and well-reasoned post>

Welcome to the game.

Is it well-reasoned, because he is unvoting you?

Now you're being silly. DarkLight's posts have all been along the line of: 'JoeBob smells. Vote: JoeBob'. Plus I already pointed out that DarkLight dropping his vote makes him look even more scummy.

The fact that it was in the same post as an accusation against me doesn't count for anything.

To you or to me? Because I know in this particular post it counts for me.

Whatever.

Cult, meh. Oman won't join in so it's pointless. Imagine a gang of two, or even one!

I posted my post before Oman declined. So you were trying to. You just failed that one. Either way a cult is still anti-town.

Yes I tried to, but failed. I've also been hypocritical and tried to encourage a bandwagon. All of these seemed right at the time, but turned out to be scummy things to do. Still, they say that 'if you don't fall off, you're not trying hard enough'.

@Oman: Yesterday you thought you might be killed in the night, but today you're sure that you'll be here tomorrow? Just teasing...

Oman you do know that if we don’t lynch scum today there will only be three people left. Unless Oxide, me and you are left, than convincing you that someone is scum, when one of us is dead is pointless.

I am convinced that oxide is scum, that I don’t even have a second.

As you say: if you, me, and Oman are the survivors tomorrow, then I'm dead. Which means scum wins. I haven't worked out what to do about that yet.

I can't believe you don't have a second. What is it that has convinced you that DarkLight is town? Or even Oman? Quotes please. Personally my suspect list has four names on it (well GreenDude

might

be too good to be true).

[0x1de]

Thanks hiphop.

[Oman]

@oman: I didn't mean you were my other top suspect being scummy, but being dangerous. That you could be scum, and you could be town. And that it is very difficult to know which one you are because you are an IC and you are a good player. AND because looker hammered stupidly which got him lynched and it could be that he sacrificed himself knowing you were safe.

I don't know, I'm not the most dangerous right now. IF you were scum, you probably are, due to almost no suspcion on you. But yeah, I get where you're coming from. Its a common mistake for newbies to let the giant "what if" get under their skin and beat out the logic and probable scum they've compiled throughout simply because of the fear that they're wrong.

Oman you do know that if we don’t lynch scum today there will only be three people left. Unless Oxide, me and you are left, than convincing you that someone is scum, when one of us is dead is pointless.

Yup, I expect us three alive tomorrow though. Because of GreenDude's position as the swing vote today. (I mean, I'll talk about who I'd kill if I were scum tomorrow, based on the lynch, so that the scum can't steal my idea).

@Oman: Can you dust off your IC hat and tell me how to view a person in isolation?

Okay I don't believe that people should be viewed "in isolation" because context is a lot. However, it can be done, you just have to check a fair bit of context. If you go down the bottom of the page, select a name from the list, select oldest first and read through.

When reading in isolation you're looking for odd things that give you a bad vibe, not really evidence, just something to point you to it. (i.e. evidence requires context).


Also, tomorrow will be a very, very interesting day, I only hope I'm around to see it.

[hiphop]

You never tried to tell the other two to pull their votes. Besides, why should we do what you say?

I already explained why I didn't tell the others to pull their votes off, but you after the lynch had the nerve to say this

On the other hand I was scared that 'Mr Random' DarkLight would hammer Looker early.

If you were so scared, why did you keep your vote on?

I wasn't telling you what to do, I was saying if you didn't want a short day, why did you keep your vote on? You already said you didn't want to hammered early, yet you kept your vote on.

Is it well-reasoned, because he is unvoting you?

Now you're being silly. DarkLight's posts have all been along the line of: 'JoeBob smells. Vote: JoeBob'. Plus I already pointed out that DarkLight dropping his vote makes him look even more scummy.

Really? Being he unvoted you? You could of said that, because you can't show relief, otherwise, you would look like scum.

I can't believe you don't have a second. What is it that has convinced you that DarkLight is town? Or even Oman? Quotes please. Personally my suspect list has four names on it (well GreenDude

might

be too good to be true).

Because I am that convinced that you are scum. If you flip town, I would be blown away tomorrow. It isn't that I am convinced they are town, but that you are scum. In the game I linked to at the end one player said that onced someone answers the accusations a townie would back off, but scum wouldn't. I don't care what people think of me, you are the remaining scum to me.

Yup, I expect us three alive tomorrow though. Because of GreenDude's position as the swing vote today. (I mean, I'll talk about who I'd kill if I were scum tomorrow, based on the lynch, so that the scum can't steal my idea).

What would you do if Greendude was there tomorrow?

If you expect us three to be there tomorrow, than you must expect one of us to be scum. If that is so, why are you not voting for one of us instead of darklight? (Some people might call that buddying, but there is only one scum)? You are voting for darklight, because he made one inexcusable nulltell, when you expect scum to survive the lynch.

[Oman]

Reread, the vote the most scummy person, like I do every endgame-day.

Oh and I'm using all this "tomorrow" stuff in hypothetical. Its quite obvious I think Darklight to be the scummiest. Again, you misinterpret me.

[hiphop]

Reread, the vote the most scummy person, like I do every endgame-day.

Oh and I'm using all this "tomorrow" stuff in hypothetical. Its quite obvious I think Darklight to be the scummiest. Again, you misinterpret me.

But you said that you expect us three tomorrow, which means that Darklight must not be the scummiest. I believe you are only keeping your vote on darklight because you can't make up your ming between us two.

[Oman]

*sigh* I thought it was pretty obvious that Darklight was at the top of my list. I didn't think it was neccesary to put in "If Darklight flips town..." at the start of every comment.

I wouldn't be voting the guy if I didn't think he would flip scum right now, would I? Its pretty fundamental mafia play.

[GreenDude]

@oman: I don't mean that I think you are scum. But that you could be. Same way as I could be. Just because there's no evidence doesn't mean they aren't scum. What's wrong with what if-ing? What if Oman is scum, then the town is doomed. But what if Greendude points out Oman could be scum. Then the town might not be doomed. I'm not going to vote you but I'm just putting it out there.

Can we have a vote count?

When is the deadline?

[hiphop]

*sigh* I thought it was pretty obvious that Darklight was at the top of my list. I didn't think it was neccesary to put in "If Darklight flips town..." at the start of every comment.

I wouldn't be voting the guy if I didn't think he would flip scum right now, would I? Its pretty fundamental mafia play.

You think there is a chance he can be scum, that is why you are voting the guy. You said I expect for us three to be alive tomorrow, which means you expect Darklight to flip town. Which means you expect 0x1de or myself to be scum.

You never answered my question, if you were alive tomorrow what would you do if greendude were alive tomorrow too. Would you believe he is just as likely to be scum as 0x1de or me?

[Oman]

I did answer that, I said I would reread and vote the most scummy (after a bit of discussion) like I was always do on endgame-days. And as to him being scum, i'd have to reread, but I've got a fair bit of faith in him now.

You said I expect for us three to be alive tomorrow, which means you expect Darklight to flip town. Which means you expect 0x1de or myself to be scum.

You're either dense or being deliberate hard to reason with here. Obviously I expect Darklight to be scum, otherwise I wouldn't be voting him. IF DARKLIGHT FLIPS TOWN then I expect the three of us alive.

Is this concept so hard to grasp? Am I the only one that feels this is obvious? Can someone else chime in so I don't go insane on this.

What's wrong with what if-ing?

It tends to throw suspicion where it isn't warranted and distracts the town. Also, it leads to constant double-guessing of onesself, and when you get to complex night actions like Vigilanttes and Bus Drivers, you can trick yourself into killing the wrong person (or if you're scum then double-guessing on your own kills) all based on a complex web of "but he could be scum!"

I mean, sometimes you have to make the D "this person is town, this person is scum". It doesn't mean you don't watch them, that is always going to be around. Like with playplay earlier this game, I wrote him as town early, and kept my eye on him (obviously not well enough because I didn't see who killed him ).

Just a thought.

[hiphop]

IF DARKLIGHT FLIPS TOWN then I expect the three of us alive.

Now you say it. Next question, do you expect Darklight to flip scum?

[GreenDude]

@oman: If you put it that way then ok, ox1de is town, oman is town, and hiphop or darklight are scum. I would probably say hiphop though.

WHAT"S THE VOTE COUNT??

[Oman]

IF DARKLIGHT FLIPS TOWN then I expect the three of us alive.

Now you say it. Next question, do you expect Darklight to flip scum?

Obviously.

[hiphop]

I was reading back and I saw this quote.

No, not DarkLight, it's Ox1de that's the scum. It's Ox1de that needs to die.

So this is part of that context?

Nope. That's 'dying scum telling partner who to kill'.

How does he know what she was trying to do, if he wasn't scum himself? One can say that is the most obvious reason, but what about the possibility of she actually being mad at her partner for voting for her. Wouldn't than she give her partner away in a manner where she won't be banned from the site? I think that is the most obvious reason. Greendude has thrown the possibility out the window, and isn't even considering it, when a town person should look at all possibilities.

[0x1de]

Is this concept so hard to grasp? Am I the only one that feels this is obvious? Can someone else chime in so I don't go insane on this.

It is obvious. hiphop has a habit of repeatedly making the same accusation(s) without paying any attention to the counter-arguments. I find this approach to be quite annoying.

[hiphop]

Is this concept so hard to grasp? Am I the only one that feels this is obvious? Can someone else chime in so I don't go insane on this.

It is obvious. hiphop has a habit of repeatedly making the same accusation(s) without paying any attention to the counter-arguments. I find this approach to be quite annoying.

I made five posts in between your last two. It is obvious I think you are scum. By the time I hit my fifth post there was nothing left to do, but bring up your old arguments.

You on the other hand have a custom, that you will only answer questions so far. Are you afraid that you will drop scumtells?

[DarkLightA]

vote: Ox1de

I'm going back on ox1de, due to him lately not contributing a lot, but still posting lots of small ones, showing activity (scummish), but an unwillingness to contribute.

@all: If I am lynched, and flip town, who is then scum?

[hohum]

Official Vote Count:

DarkLightA(2): 0x1de, Oman

0x1de(2): hiphop, DarklightA

Not Voting(1): GreenDude

With 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch.

Note: Please remember to BOLD your requests so that I don't miss them when skimming!

Deadline is October 7