Open 155 - Jungle Republic - Game Over before 816

[orangepenguin]

Mod, please replace me. I lost interest a long time ago, and it's not fair to you or the other players. Sorry.

[Crazy]

To be honest, I've kind of lost the reasoning that we don't just lynch Netlava today. If he's a werewolf, great; if he's mafia, we still have a chance of winning.

Sure, a werewolf lynch would be great today, but if a townie is lynched, then we absolutely lose a town majority. If we lynch Netlava, we have no possibility of losing our majority.

Can someone convince me otherwise? This makes sense to me.

We also can't count on that the mafia would counter-claim. To be honest, I wouldn't counter-claim as mafia in this situation.

[Netlava]

That makes sense. I fakeclaimed mafia as town, but since this day is stalling out, having my lynch go through might be better for the game as a whole.

[Crazy]

I fakeclaimed mafia as town,

OMG, you're not serious, are you?

[Netlava]

I'm serious. I calculated that it would be about equal to just allowing my lynch to go through, maybe out the mafia, and hopefully make the game more interesting, but it's a bit of a lurkfest right now.

[Netlava]

Actually, I think we should lynch the lurkers instead. Namely, OP & dizzyizzy.

[mykonian]

I fakeclaimed mafia as town,

OMG, you're not serious, are you?

okay... I am not going to react to this 0.35 am. But this is seriously weird.

[Flava Flave]

Unvote

Netlava is mafia unless he is counterclaimed. We know for sure that he's scum of some sort. Even if he's a werewolf, he has a scumbuddy out there. Netlava is NOT being lynched today unless he is counterclaimed.

didn't the previous two post say the same?

you're posts always were better then this.

No, they weren't the same. You said with certainty that he's lying and we should get a counterclaim. Crazy seconded the request. I basically thirded, but made it clear that Netlava is NOT today's lynch unless we actually get a counter.

To be honest, I've kind of lost the reasoning that we don't just lynch Netlava today. If he's a werewolf, great; if he's mafia, we still have a chance of winning.

Sure, a werewolf lynch would be great today, but if a townie is lynched, then we absolutely lose a town majority. If we lynch Netlava, we have no possibility of losing our majority.

Can someone convince me otherwise? This makes sense to me.

We also can't count on that the mafia would counter-claim. To be honest, I wouldn't counter-claim as mafia in this situation.

Wait, I thought a mafia lynch was a werewolf win.

*Counts*

Oh, wow. We'd still get another day.

Unvote, Vote Netlava

. I'd rather lynch claimed scum than take a chance at lynching town.

That makes sense. I fakeclaimed mafia as town, but since this day is stalling out, having my lynch go through might be better for the game as a whole.

Bullshit.

[orangepenguin]

Actually, I think we should lynch the lurkers instead. Namely, OP & dizzyizzy.

Funny that you say this shortly after I request replacement. If you have ever played with me, you will see that I have NEVER done this (well, I attempted to in Risk Mafia, but the mod could never do it.. so whatever...) .

Vote: Netlava

for being CLAIMED opportunistic scum.

[orangepenguin]

Don't understand the case on me, besides me not posting at all and not contributing, and my failed case on ChaosOmega. I suck at analytical posts and mostly go off gut, which is why I suck at Mafia games and why I have a terrible record, so sorry if I might not have the best cases in the world, but from my POV, I thought CO was completely scummy. I am not going to bother with a case on him, a) because none of you could care less and it's one more post by me that would be overlooked or twisted and b) because I will probably be replaced -- which is for the best, I think.

I really lost interest in Mafia altogether, but I want to complete my commitments to the games I am in, but it's hard, because you are attacked for not reading or contributing, but it's hard to read when you are not interested, and when you aren't interested, it's hard to analyze anything whatsoever, besides regurgitating what others have basically said, which I do in every game, cause I fail at this game. Not all that surprised that two players I've played with multiple times are pushing for my lynch. It's a quite simple lynch. You know, instead of waiting for a replacement.

[Crazy]

I understand, OP, I've also felt like that before in regards to playing mafia.

I wasn't pushing for your lynch because it was "easy," though. Your case on Chaos didn't make sense to me and it sounded contrived. The thing is, if you were town, you must have had some train of thought that led you to believe Chaos was scum, right?

[Crazy]

Oh yeah, and I seriously don't think that Netlava fake-claimed mafia as town.

[Netopalis]

Based on a very, very quick reread, here are my cursory findings.

Scumminess is rated on a scale of 1 being innocent and 10 being guilty (in my mind)

Flava Flave - leans town in my mind, but I am slightly concerned about a few of his posts which seem at first glance to have a great deal of information in them, but realistically have little to offer. 5/10

DizzyIzzyB13 replaces Mastin - Mastin is, to me, rather unreadable. His walls are difficult to interpret as town or scum. We also haven't seen enough of Dizzy to really say one way or another. Still, entirely possible that he's scum. 4/10

ZazieR replacing Slicey - Seems solid and logical, but a few questionable plays, such as the support of Netlava on day 1. 3/10

orangepenguin - Seems lurkerish. Very little information to go on, could easily be scum. 7/10.

Crazy - Very townish. Makes solid, logical and reasonable arguments without any constructed attacks. That being said, there are a few questionable statements, such as his suggestion of a 12 day lurk being a hint at innocence. 4/10

Netlava replacing molestargazer - Very scummy, IMO. Wanted to lynch Hero instead of Noramp day 1 for rather tenuous reasons. Also, advocated lynching a 3rd party day 1 after a deadline was posted and it was unlikely that discussion could rally together in time to build such a consensus. Seemed as if he would do *anything* to avoid a Noramp lynch. 8/10.


Netopalis replacing ChaosOmega - Obviously, I'm going to say I'm not scummy. 0/10

mykonian replacing Cephrir - Some questionable logic shortly after replacing, especially regarding his analysis of the day 1 voting patterns. Could easily be mafia, but not nearly as strong of a case as that against Netlava. 6/10.


In my opinion, at least one scum is among the following 3:
Netlava
Mykonian
Orangepenguin

[Netopalis]

EBWODP - I wasn't calling the Hero wagon tenuous, just Netlava's reasons for supporting it tenuous.

[orangepenguin]

Your case on Chaos didn't make sense to me and it sounded contrived. The thing is, if you were town, you must have had some train of thought that led you to believe Chaos was scum, right?

The thing is, there was never really a 'case' on Chaos. I just got a very strong gut feeling against Chaos, yet couldn't exactly explain why in words. Chaos/Relacee won't be lynched. Besides my gut, I have nothing on them. But yes, I had some train of though.

I am so out of this game, that I can't recall much about any of the actions within the thread, which is maybe why I was hanging onto my suspicions of Mastin so much. But being suspicious of Mastin is foolish in mafia, cause .. he is Mastin.

[ZazieR]

since it started with why I wouldn't react on that other post, which I explained in the same post, I didn't bother reading your posts either. Also, ask constructive questions, in stead of making me search through half a page of posts to find your questions.

No, you didn't explain why. You just said that you wouldn't react to my post.
And in some cases, like this one, it's good to be not specific and link to all those posts so that you'll read everything you've missed.
Now search and answer/explain.

and no, my vote on netlava wasn't reasonless. I had voted him before for a gut feeling,

I stated that his votes sucked

,

and that he looked like searching for a good spot to place it, in stead of searching for scum

.

You did state the part in italics, but not the part in bolded. There's a huge difference between the two. It's also interesting that you mention 'votes' in this quote, while you only commented on Netlava's vote towards Crazy. Want to explain why you only commented when he made the Crazy vote, but not towards the OP or Dizzy votes?

Another thing, your reasons for voting Netlava the second time were already present when you unvoted him. So why did you unvote?

I think zazie missed the scumclaim, so I think this is an ideal way to see how he is actually defending someone who was scummy. This stinks of scum intent

Nope, I didn't. Now that Netlava has finally responded, I can ask you this: Why did you believe it was true while there was a smiley attached to it?
Also, why is it scummy to defend somebody I think is town?

[ZazieR]

Flava, Crazy and everybody else who thought that Netlava was serious with his claim

, the same question for you: Why did you believe Netlava's claim was true while there was a smiley attached to it?

[ZazieR]

In other words, you stated that if the last Mafia claims, he'll be save from both lynches and NK's in your opinion. How is this not stating what you think optimal mafia play is in this situation?
Also, the explanation why you wouldn't follow your own optimal mafia play if you were mafia according to you is much appreciated.

No... that's what myko said. I said I didn't want the mafia to claim, because I thought that would hurt the town, because it nulls the possibility of the werewolves accidentally killing the mafia. I suggested that the mafia only claim if they're about to be lynched.

What Crazy said:

Okay, Myko's right... we should definitely lynch a werewolf today. A mafia lynch would lead to a 2:4 mylo situation with no confirmed innocents. Not a great situation.

^^Save from lynches.

However, I don't agree with his plan, mainly because it nulls any possibility of the werewolves accidentally killing the last mafia, which is something that would be awesome. Having the mafia claim now makes that impossible.

^^Saying indirectly that he'd be save from a NK.

I do not believe that the werewolves would want to kill the mafia. Hence why I was against the mafia claiming.

^^Saying directly that he thinks the last mafia would be save from a NK.

I think that the quote at the top of this post says exactly what you said Crazy, namely that you think the last Mafia would be save if he claims. So don't state that this is what Myko said. He did, but so did you. Now, explain what I asked you to explain in the top quote.

Need to look at the part about OP.

Netlava did make a contradiction, dude. And what do you know, HE WAS SCUM! I seriously just caught a scum; you can't say that my case was nothing, since several people agreed with it, which caused Netlava to claim, and HE WAS SCUM!!!

No, he's not. Also, those players who agreed with you have either ignored Netlava's arguments or misrepped them just like you.
I want each of you to respond to Netlava's explanations.

About Netlava, there's no use arguing about whether he's scum or not. He was scum; I win. And if he's a werewolf, I bet that you're his partner.

Don't have a partner and Netlava isn't scum.

[ZazieR]

As stated above, I want

everyone who thinks that Crazy is right about Netlava's contradiction

to respond to this:

The following times are based upon my time (GMT +2):
-Hero claims Seer on the 15th.
-Netlava unvotes and votes Falko on the 16th. Because Netlava thinks it's better to not lynch a claimed seer, even though he's scummy.
-In his next post, he switches back to Hero. Because it seems that Falko won't be lynched, he thinks that Yabba is the seer and Noramp isn't on his scumlist. This was still on the 16th.
And if you had looked back, you'd have known that there was a deadline for the 18th.
-Netlava unvotes on the 18th.

[ZazieR]

And if you are really mafia, please try to find mafia, and not call me a lurker, and say that I don't have enough suspects. Which are simply not true. Please work on those points yourself though.

Zaz Reminder

[ZazieR]

already got anything neto?

Zazie and Izzy, what did you think about the wagon on Netlava?

Bad, which you should have known if you had read my posts.
Players I'm willing to lynch today:
-Crazy
-Myko

Player who should be lynched after the Wolves are lynched:
Flava


It's that simple.

[ZazieR]

Unvote, vote: orangepenguin

This day is getting too long.

Your last vote was better.

[ZazieR]

To be honest, I've kind of lost the reasoning that we don't just lynch Netlava today. If he's a werewolf, great; if he's mafia, we still have a chance of winning.

Sure, a werewolf lynch would be great today, but if a townie is lynched, then we absolutely lose a town majority. If we lynch Netlava, we have no possibility of losing our majority.

Can someone convince me otherwise? This makes sense to me.

For this to go right, Netlava has to be scum. Which I don't think he is.
And it was suggested to lynch Wolves first in order to avoid mylo.

[ZazieR]

Actually, I think we should lynch the lurkers instead. Namely, OP & dizzyizzy.

No.

[ZazieR]

I fakeclaimed mafia as town,

OMG, you're not serious, are you?

okay... I am not going to react to this 0.35 am. But this is seriously weird.

I found it weirder that there were players who believed the claim.