/in-vitational 3: Brass & Shrapnel. Over. before 831

[Korts]

DEATH SCENE

hasdgfas, Pro-Town Blank Vigilante, killed Day 2

Vote Count

(1) Kublai Khan- molestargazer

(1) molestargazer- Kublai Khan

not voting:

Budja, ChannelDelibird, curiouskarmadog, MacavityLock, Porochaz

4 to lynch

Deadline is September 23rd 6 PM EST.

[molestargazer]

Now you're accusing me of being reaching and chainsaw-y because it lynched an innocent townie.

What...? the result of the lynch had nothing to do with why I voted for you on D2. I freely admitted that I would have been happy with a Quag lynch. I don't think you scum just because he flipped town. I think you scum because I found the case itself reaching and chainsaw-y. A bad case on anyone is scummy, regardless of the resulting alignment when the object of that case dies.

2. When you made your case against Quagmire (post 147), you linked back to post 117 where you note that my observation of Quagmire's "wishy-washy playing both sides of the fence" is valid. Then you note that his hasdgfas case has no merit, which I had already questioned him on.

And here we reach one of those points where there's sod all I can do to convince you that you're wrong.
The case on Quag was valid. I noted that, called him out on the points regardless of what anyone else did or thought, and said I would've been happy with his lynch. There's nothing else I can say on the matter.

[curiouskarmadog]

going to be gone this weekend....posting agian on Monday..

[Budja]

A bad case on anyone is scummy, regardless of the resulting alignment when the object of that case dies.

Quagmire had a pretty poor case on has at that point. Doesn't that mean by your own logic he would be scummy.

I am alright with Kublai's attack on Quag. If Quagmire had a reasonable point against has, then it would be bad, but I think Quagmire was reaching with his case and Kublai's vote was a decent reaction.
Doesn't look chainsaw-y to me.

People need to post more, even a little. I have limited reads right now.
(I little hypocritical I know but still... ).

[MacavityLock]

I didn't really pick up on anything game-changing in my re-read. I think this game needs a wagon, so I'm happy to go back to

Vote: Kublai

.

[Kublai Khan]

@Mod: I voted for molestargazer in post 199.

I didn't really pick up on anything game-changing in my re-read. I think this game needs a wagon, so I'm happy to go back to

Vote: Kublai

.

WTF? Really? You don't find molestargazer to be scummy? Even slightly?

On Day 1 he's agreeing with me on all levels and calling for the Quagmire lynch, even offering to hammer.
On Day 2 he's suddenly suggesting that my case was "reaching and chainsaw-y". When I called him on it he's simultaneously standing by what he said and backing off. Note the following bolded parts:

What...? the result of the lynch had nothing to do with why I voted for you on D2. I freely admitted that I would have been happy with a Quag lynch. I don't think you scum just because he flipped town.

I think you scum because I found the case itself reaching and chainsaw-y.

A bad case on anyone is scummy, regardless of the resulting alignment when the object of that case dies.

And here we reach one of those points where there's sod all I can do to convince you that you're wrong.

The case on Quag was valid.

I noted that, called him out on the points regardless of what anyone else did or thought, and said I would've been happy with his lynch. There's nothing else I can say on the matter.

How can the preceeding two opinions be held at the same time? How can a case be both valid and reaching & chainsaw-y? He's waffling because he's scum.

I'm staggered by your blindness and the apathy of the rest of the town.

Mod: Is anyone due for prodding?

[Korts]

No-one has a prod due. CDB is V/LA until today, Prozac is sort of V/LA, and everyone else has posted within the last 72 hours.

I will, however, try asking Prozac whether his connection is fixed by now. If he doesn't reply within 72 hours I will start looking into a replacement.

[MacavityLock]

Kublai, your bolded contradiction is a good catch. I missed it. Any reason that you pointed this out to me, rather than questioning molestargazer directly?

Even so, this game desperately needs a wagon. When I voted you, the vote count listed only molestar's vote on you, and given that I still think there are a few day 1 scumtells from you, I was willing to be a part of that wagon. However, now that there are two options, I think I'm willing to switch to

unvote, vote: molestar

. molestar, please explain the contradiction Kublai notes.

[molestargazer]

1. I'm not called molestar.
2. I believe it's a case of when KK first brought it up, the look of it to me was that it was reaching a chainsaw-y. At the time when I joined it, I looked more in-depth and found it to be a valid case.

I'll explain more if needs be.

[MacavityLock]

1. I'm not called molestar.

Apologies, I won't abbreviate your name anymore.

2. I believe it's a case of when KK first brought it up, the look of it to me was that it was reaching a chainsaw-y. At the time when I joined it, I looked more in-depth and found it to be a valid case.

I'll explain more if needs be.

Are a player's reasons for voting locked in stone at the time of his/her vote? Do you feel that Kublai's were?

[curiouskarmadog]

Mole,

what was the difference between your case and KK's case of Quag?

[Kublai Khan]

@Mod: It canz be prodz tiem nao?

(w/LOL cat picture)

[Korts]

Budja and ChannelDelibird will be prodded. Prozac hasn't picked up his unofficial prod yet, but he still has 24 hours.

[Porochaz]

Hi guys still here and now officially at uni. So will have slightly more access. Not 100% though. Not even 50%. Well maybe 50%

[molestargazer]

Seems what we have here is a classic case of foot-in-mouth syndrome.
I will try, however, to answer your questions to your satisfaction.

Are a player's reasons for voting locked in stone at the time of his/her vote? Do you feel that Kublai's were?

Reasons aren't set in stone, no.
More reasons can be added as time goes by, and reasons could be mistakes. If a mistake is found, said player should seriously consider their position on the player they're voting.

To answer your second question, here is the post where KK voted Quag (Quoting only the relevant bits. If you want to check for yourself, it's KK ISO 6.

Are you seriously expecting air-tight cases on the first few pages? hasdgfas' case may be weak, but it's kick-starting discussion. He's looking more town than you.

unvote
Vote: Quagmire

It's not much, IMO.
I hope you can see why I may have interpreted this to be mildly chainsaw-y. It appears to be attacking Quag in the defence of Has and his case.
Before this post, there was barely anything in KK's posts that referenced Quag at all.
So, no, reasons weren't set in stone, and more were clearly added afterwards, if I'm being accused of copying his case.

Mole,

what was the difference between your case and KK's case of Quag?

When I voted, my case on Quag was really 2 things:
- His wishy-washiness.
- His lack of a case on Has when he voted.
A quick look at KK in ISO seems to reveal that the second point wasn't brought up by KK until after my vote during D1.
So there's your difference.

[Budja]

I did interpret moles original post as that you had a bad reasoning for the case while he had good reasoning.

I dislike the chainsaw defense argument here. Attacking a player for a weak/non-existent attack on someone else is not scummy. If Quag had a good case, you would have a point but he certainly did not.

Quagmire had a pretty poor case on has at that point. Doesn't that mean by your own logic he would be scummy.

Well?

Yeah, I do see mole as scummier than Kublai but my vote still withheld. I don't really want L-1right now.

[Korts]

Vote Count

(2) molestargazer- Kublai Khan, MacavityLock

(1) Kublai Khan- molestargazer

not voting:

Budja, ChannelDelibird, curiouskarmadog, Porochaz

4 to lynch

Deadline is September 23rd 6 PM EST.

MacavityLock has been prodded.

[Kublai Khan]

Hmm.. The low participation is really hurting this game.

I'm happy with the molestargazer bandwagon. For his somewhat hypocritical accusation against me, and because he brought up a case against me, then immediately backed down from it, giving the excuse that it was a lame weak case.

Since Budja is offering a virtual L-1 at this point. If someone else feels like they might vote, molestargazer should consider roleclaiming.

[MacavityLock]

Prodded. Not much to add at this juncture. Poro and CDB should weigh in.

[ChannelDelibird]

I'm so sorry for needing a prod. I've been, uh, revelling, shall we say, in the happy freedoms of student accommodation.

molestargazer is being pretty strange - clearly doesn't believe in his case, but still voting anyway. That doesn't really compute. His wagon makes sense.

[molestargazer]

clearly doesn't believe in his case, but still voting anyway.

Would you rather I cast no opinions at all and continued to lurk? At the time when I voted, I honestly couldn't see a better case.

There's really not much I can say to defend myself. It's a bad case. I knew it was a bad case. I made it anyway.
I did this to try and get myself interested in the game again, and to try and get some new discussion rolling. In that aspect, it worked - perhaps with a less desirable outcome than I had originally imagined.

If you want me to claim, I'll do so, just say the word. Seems I'm near-lynch anyway.

[Kublai Khan]

I'd like a claim, but I think that either Porochaz or ChannelDelibird should be the ones to make a formal request.

[curiouskarmadog]

if we are looking for a wagon, I think there are better people to do it on. WE got Poro and CDB who are lurking, though it should be noted that they are lurking across the board. But I answer so? If they are scum, the only case that could be made against them right now with their lack of post would be consider weak...

ML is suspect with his voting hoping around and request for a wagon.

this being said, mole, you knew it was a bad case when pushing it? In your words what was bad about it?

[MacavityLock]

Was anything going to get accomplished in this game without a wagon?

[molestargazer]

this being said, mole, you knew it was a bad case when pushing it? In your words what was bad about it?

It was really quite reaching, and normally wouldn't be anywhere near vote-worthy.