The Manor: Chzo Mafia (Game Over!)

[Percy]

Zazier is a she and therefore its OK to keep your vote on her.

...

[Lamont_Cranston]

Are you through?

[Lamont_Cranston]

No its very simple. You ARE scum. There is no other option (unless you believe in some bizarre double GF theory or our town cop being naive with no flavor to match it) and it has nothing to do with what you think type or don't think or don't type.

The fact that you haven't acted as a townie in the face of the facts just reinforces the fact that you are obv-scum -- but you are scum either way.

The difference between me and you is that I've consistently pointed it out and you haven't.

Nice try Percy but too little too late.

[Percy]

OK, so I just re-read the entire game from about Day 3. I can see L_C scum, but I think I got a little tilted with his utter stupidity. I can see ZazieR scum, but her reaction when Dev claimed seems pretty convincing to me. Steph is very town, I get strong vibes. I have no reason to doubt her investigations any more, and at the very least this clears populartajo, for reasons I stated before.

In short, I couldn't find anything convincing, and I'm just very confused. However, I am going to

Unvote

, and float an idea.

Also, after checking the flavour and the wiki again, one thing had me wondered.
When Xtoxm died, it was stated that the bridge was open for 1/3 as he was the body of John DeFoe. The other two parts are the spirit and the mind of John DeFoe.
The spirit is locked up inside of an idol, which is very likely the doll. The only possible exceptions is that it''s just a doll, or it''s the idol, but without the spirit in it.
However, the part of the mind is interesting. The manor contains it. In the game, the mind gets destroyed when the manor is burned down.
So I need to think if scum want to have those matches gone or not.

I want to ask this:
In the Chzo Manor game, who are the bad guys? Can someone clarify who this "Order" is?

Note this:

Story

A cat burglar named Trilby goes to a large mansion called DeFoe Manor, in hopes of an easy score of expensive loot, as the owners had died shortly beforehand. However, Trilby finds himself inexplicably sealed inside the house, along with four other people, who had come to the manor for various reasons of their own.

As the five prisoners seek answers to their predicament within the house, two of them are murdered in two different instances. The killer is found to be Trilby, possessed by the vengeful ghost of the second son of Sir Roderick Defoe, the house's original owner. Sir Roderick blamed his deformed son for causing his wife's death and chained him to a wall in the basement, regularly abusing and neglecting the boy (which Trilby speculates to have resulted in mental retardation and violent insanity.) Fifteen years later, Sir Roderick severely beat his son with an African wooden idol. His other son, Matthew, attempted to help his twin brother, but John (a name given by Trilby to the younger DeFoe for convenience) murdered both his brother and his father with a machete before dying of his own injuries.

John's ghost still haunts the mansion within the tribal idol which killed him, possessing anyone who touches it and murdering anyone he encounters, wearing same blacksmith's apron and welding mask he did when he killed his father and brother.

Trilby and the other two survivors perform a magic ritual to rid the house of the John's ghost;

they are able to force John's spirit into his remains and kill him. John's body falls into a fire and catches the house alight, Trilby and the other two escape before the house burns down

. Trilby allows the other survivors to believe he died in the fire so as to avoid the inevitable police interest and assumes that John DeFoe is finally at rest.

There is only one bad guy faction. I think the "POTENTIAL LYLO" is a mod mindfuck, and it's entirely possible that we have only one scum faction, perhaps only one scum.

This gets rid of the "Innocent role PM" issue. It gets rid of why everyone is showing up Innocent to investigates and lynches. I think it's a theory worth considering.

I advocate a massclaim.

[dramonic]

ITT, people have gender problems

Zazie and Steph are both MALES.

[Devestation]

Its more likely that the evil player(s) know who the last outright "good" aligned player(s) are, and if they die, the evil players win?

@Lamont: http://www.nationstates.net/nation=lamont_cranston - You or some random raider with imagination? (not seeking a large convo over this).

[populartajo]

Work. Busy. Shit. V/LA. Tomorrow night.

[Lamont_Cranston]

I've played Nation States but not under Lamont Cranston.

Why is the town considering anyone other than those not cleared by cops and PR performance?

The list is only:

Lamont_Cranston
Zazier
Percy

Everything else is just mumbo jumbo.

Yes the evil players (Percy, Zazier & one more person) know that I am the last town aligned player. You can see Percy doing his best to confuse the town. The 3rd person may also try. Zazier when she shows up will also try.

But regardless of all this distraction we need to vote either Zazier or Percy today.

Anyone foolish enough to buy the multiple GF theory or that somehow Stepho is naive deserves to lose.

[dramonic]

Zazie's odd of being scum are about 95%

It's a fair lynch if you ask me.

[Percy]

Flavour analysis:

As night fell in the halls of the Manor, a dark force awoke, and cast off the skin of the poor unfortunate he had possessed prior to entering.

Standing fully 8 feet tall, the pale, faceless being raised his arms, and summoned a spear with a cruel, hooked blade

, before stalking down the corridor, towards the room of the one who called himself "The Replacement".

The creature knocked on the door softly. "W-w-who is it?" called The Replacement.
The next knock burst the door wide open, splinters flying. The spear flew through the gap, impaling The Replacement through the heart. As the world went dark, he saw the creature walk up to him, felt it tear him in half...and then peace.

On the other side of the manor, the oldest resident cast off the mantle of youth under which he had disguised himself during the day, and dragged his rotting bones to find the one he thought threatened his home.

Sajin stood no chance, as the wraith hacked him apart with a massive machete

, he head cleaved in two, his chest torn apart by the vicious steel.

So we had 2 NKs on the first night. One perpetrated by a thing with a spear, another by a wraith with a massive machete.

the second night had fallen upon the Manor, and

the creature that slew The Replacement once again took to the corridors, hunting a very specific prey

. As it arrived at Xtoxm's room, it found the door wide open, and a trail of bone-dust leading away into the east wing of the building.

Stalking down the corridor,

clawed spear in hand

, the creature followed the trail all the way to the room where Sajin's corpse had been found. Hearing a scuttling behind, it span to face the grinning wraith who had mutilated Sajin, parrying the machete it wielded with ease.

If the Body of John DeFoe had had any emotion but rage left in it, it might have screamed as the spear impaled it through

the tattered blacksmith's apron

that held it's decomposing body together. With no more effort than a father lifting a new-born baby, the pale servant of Chzo carried the second son of Roderick DeFoe to the fire in the meeting hall, and forced it in,

destroying the wraith's body

.

When the remnants of the Manor's population awoke, they found the burning bones under a message painted in blood:

"And I saw the Body of the Bridge cast into flame, and the way was

one third open

."

The thing that killed the Replacement, also a wraith, kills Xtomx with a spear. Xtomx was wearing an apron. The bridge becomes a third open.

As night fell, the corridors were oddly silent. Only one lone figure trod the ancient floorboards,

their mind no longer their own for this night

. Reaching into the fire, feeling no pain, they took up

the blackened apron and welding mask

, wiped the soot away to reveal the killing edge of the blade, and shambled to Elmo's room. The poor fellow... he was already sickly, he never stood a chance.

Apron and mask again - seems like a different kill from the group that killed Xtomx. However, now that XtomX has died, there is mention of their "mind no longer their own" - recruitment?

Sajin, Innocent, impaled with a claw spear and guts torn out by hand, Day 5

Apologies for the lateness and lack of flavour. Flavour will be added tomorrow...

Spear again, same as what killed Xtomx.

Stood in the door was

his target, and another of the housemates - now that he thought about it, they had been a little friendly

.
"Hello Lenkmann." said one. "It's been a while."
Pyromaniac swallowed as he realised why this particular one had seemed so familiar: all this time, under the false beard and prosthetics, it had been Canning. Canning, here, in the house. His eyes flicked to the other man.
"Hired muscle, Canning? Bit below Order standards, isn't it?"
Canning smiled, and his mute partner stepped forwards.
"Actually, my dear sir, we have granted you a very special honor."
The Prince shrugged off his skin, and stood fully revealed. His weapon appeared in his hand, and stabbed down once, twice, three times.
Pyromaniac lay, coughing up blood, for a good three hours before his life finally ebbed away.

Two people, one of whom seems to correlate strongly with the person who killed on nights 1, 2 and 4.



From this, I conclude that there is probably more than one scum faction. There is the DeFoe killer, who killed on nights 1 and 3, and this Order faction, who killed on nights 1, 2, 4 and 5. I would not find it outrageous at all to suspect that the DeFoe killer would show up innocent to investigations, given that there seems to be some possession going on.

I would say that, given the drink and the shotgun were almost certainly going to be in the hands of townies and cause them to die, a 17 player game which started with three scum, but would have another recruited later, sounds perfectly reasonable. I think that "POTENTIAL LYLO" may very well be a red herring.

Also this:

N1- Protected zwet. (changed at the last minute. didn't like amished assuming that there would be another doc) N2 protected lamont. you will see me saying that lamont should be inspected. N3 Protected Siro. N4 protected Lamont. I hinted that he should be investigated again. My vote for the inspection goes to popultajo or lamont, as one of them is scum.

Pyro's N5 target was a bad guy, just check the flavour. Now who would Pyro have protected last night? Perhaps Lamont, as Pyro wanted him to be investigated, just like on N4? Tastes like WIFOM, but there's something there.


Someone who knows about this game needs to help me out here. I am nowhere near certain enough of the ZazieR case to be voting for it.


I think a massclaim may still be a good idea.

@Steph: Have you received a result other than "Innocent" since Trilby?

[Lamont_Cranston]

After all that you throw in the cop question (the only thing that matters) at the end. Your post should of been shortened just to that line alone.

[Stephoscope]

Flavour analysis:

As night fell in the halls of the Manor, a dark force awoke, and cast off the skin of the poor unfortunate he had possessed prior to entering.

Standing fully 8 feet tall, the pale, faceless being raised his arms, and summoned a spear with a cruel, hooked blade

, before stalking down the corridor, towards the room of the one who called himself "The Replacement".

The creature knocked on the door softly. "W-w-who is it?" called The Replacement.
The next knock burst the door wide open, splinters flying. The spear flew through the gap, impaling The Replacement through the heart. As the world went dark, he saw the creature walk up to him, felt it tear him in half...and then peace.

On the other side of the manor, the oldest resident cast off the mantle of youth under which he had disguised himself during the day, and dragged his rotting bones to find the one he thought threatened his home.

Sajin stood no chance, as the wraith hacked him apart with a massive machete

, he head cleaved in two, his chest torn apart by the vicious steel.

So we had 2 NKs on the first night. One perpetrated by a thing with a spear, another by a wraith with a massive machete.

the second night had fallen upon the Manor, and

the creature that slew The Replacement once again took to the corridors, hunting a very specific prey

. As it arrived at Xtoxm's room, it found the door wide open, and a trail of bone-dust leading away into the east wing of the building.

Stalking down the corridor,

clawed spear in hand

, the creature followed the trail all the way to the room where Sajin's corpse had been found. Hearing a scuttling behind, it span to face the grinning wraith who had mutilated Sajin, parrying the machete it wielded with ease.

If the Body of John DeFoe had had any emotion but rage left in it, it might have screamed as the spear impaled it through

the tattered blacksmith's apron

that held it's decomposing body together. With no more effort than a father lifting a new-born baby, the pale servant of Chzo carried the second son of Roderick DeFoe to the fire in the meeting hall, and forced it in,

destroying the wraith's body

.

When the remnants of the Manor's population awoke, they found the burning bones under a message painted in blood:

"And I saw the Body of the Bridge cast into flame, and the way was

one third open

."

The thing that killed the Replacement, also a wraith, kills Xtomx with a spear. Xtomx was wearing an apron. The bridge becomes a third open.

As night fell, the corridors were oddly silent. Only one lone figure trod the ancient floorboards,

their mind no longer their own for this night

. Reaching into the fire, feeling no pain, they took up

the blackened apron and welding mask

, wiped the soot away to reveal the killing edge of the blade, and shambled to Elmo's room. The poor fellow... he was already sickly, he never stood a chance.

Apron and mask again - seems like a different kill from the group that killed Xtomx. However, now that XtomX has died, there is mention of their "mind no longer their own" - recruitment?

Sajin, Innocent, impaled with a claw spear and guts torn out by hand, Day 5

Apologies for the lateness and lack of flavour. Flavour will be added tomorrow...

Spear again, same as what killed Xtomx.

Stood in the door was

his target, and another of the housemates - now that he thought about it, they had been a little friendly

.
"Hello Lenkmann." said one. "It's been a while."
Pyromaniac swallowed as he realised why this particular one had seemed so familiar: all this time, under the false beard and prosthetics, it had been Canning. Canning, here, in the house. His eyes flicked to the other man.
"Hired muscle, Canning? Bit below Order standards, isn't it?"
Canning smiled, and his mute partner stepped forwards.
"Actually, my dear sir, we have granted you a very special honor."
The Prince shrugged off his skin, and stood fully revealed. His weapon appeared in his hand, and stabbed down once, twice, three times.
Pyromaniac lay, coughing up blood, for a good three hours before his life finally ebbed away.

Two people, one of whom seems to correlate strongly with the person who killed on nights 1, 2 and 4.



From this, I conclude that there is probably more than one scum faction. There is the DeFoe killer, who killed on nights 1 and 3, and this Order faction, who killed on nights 1, 2, 4 and 5. I would not find it outrageous at all to suspect that the DeFoe killer would show up innocent to investigations, given that there seems to be some possession going on.

I would say that, given the drink and the shotgun were almost certainly going to be in the hands of townies and cause them to die, a 17 player game which started with three scum, but would have another recruited later, sounds perfectly reasonable. I think that "POTENTIAL LYLO" may very well be a red herring.

Also this:

N1- Protected zwet. (changed at the last minute. didn't like amished assuming that there would be another doc) N2 protected lamont. you will see me saying that lamont should be inspected. N3 Protected Siro. N4 protected Lamont. I hinted that he should be investigated again. My vote for the inspection goes to popultajo or lamont, as one of them is scum.

Pyro's N5 target was a bad guy, just check the flavour. Now who would Pyro have protected last night? Perhaps Lamont, as Pyro wanted him to be investigated, just like on N4? Tastes like WIFOM, but there's something there.


Someone who knows about this game needs to help me out here. I am nowhere near certain enough of the ZazieR case to be voting for it.


I think a massclaim may still be a good idea.

@Steph: Have you received a result other than "Innocent" since Trilby?

No comment at this time.

[Stephoscope]

Sorry to quote that whole thing just to respond to the last line.

However, I disagree with Lamont...I appreciate your going over the flavor, regardless of what your intentions are.

I am very strongly leaning toward a ZazieR lynch, but it's only fair to allow her time to speak.

I am not in favor of a massclaim.

[Percy]

I advanced the theory of there being only one scum group. This seems unlikely, as it would mean the scum killed one of their own.

However, a 2v1v16 game is actually quite plausible, especially if we need to kill the "1" faction more than once and there are dangerous items floating around.

If it's currently 2v1v5, then we could potentially be down to 2v1v2 tomorrow. Whilst it may not be LyLo, it's not looking good at all.

Of course, it could be 3v1v4, in which case it's still not LyLo, but could become a loss for the town after the night kills.


@L_C:

1. Can you put together a case against ZazieR, rather than just insisting that it's obvious and that anyone who doesn't agree with you is obvscum?

(In fact, I'd like dramonic to do the same)

And before you spout your tripe about how I'm obviously scum from the numbers game, I'll point out that yesterday you were insisting that Pyro, zwet and tajo were scum. Also,

rule 13

means you need to use your brain and that this is difficult for the town. Not only is your theory about me being scum not true, but given the nature of this game isn't even

likely

to be true.

2. Can you indicate to me why you think the scum have the Innocent PM?

(I think there is one piece of information from the Innocent PM that I believe has not been made public knowledge)

[dramonic]

I've got no case on Zazie. What I have is fact.

1-The only unconfirmed players are you three
2-The odds of only one of you being scum is... almost null
3-Zaz is alive. Wether scum or town, the right move for you would have been to hammer. I think you are both scum.

[Percy]

As I already pointed out, I was never in a position to hammer.

I think lynching someone before they get a chance to talk is always, always a bad idea.

Spin it into a scumtell if you want. It's not.

[dramonic]

You had a 4 hour window in which you were active during which you could hammer.

[Percy]

No.

The most votes ZazieR ever got to was 3. She was never at L-1, because with 8 players, 5 is a lynch.

[dramonic]

there are 7 of us...

wait, what?

[dramonic]

oops <<

YOu have now scrapped my complete theory.
This tends to happen often lately.

[Lamont_Cranston]

Sorry to quote that whole thing just to respond to the last line.

However, I disagree with Lamont...I appreciate your going over the flavor, regardless of what your intentions are.

I am very strongly leaning toward a ZazieR lynch, but it's only fair to allow her time to speak.

I am not in favor of a massclaim.

Truthfully I appreciate the analysis too but I also understand that it is nothing more than just razzle dazzle and have a duty to say so.

[Lamont_Cranston]

I advanced the theory of there being only one scum group. This seems unlikely, as it would mean the scum killed one of their own.

However, a 2v1v16 game is actually quite plausible, especially if we need to kill the "1" faction more than once and there are dangerous items floating around.

If it's currently 2v1v5, then we could potentially be down to 2v1v2 tomorrow. Whilst it may not be LyLo, it's not looking good at all.

Of course, it could be 3v1v4, in which case it's still not LyLo, but could become a loss for the town after the night kills.


@L_C:

1. Can you put together a case against ZazieR, rather than just insisting that it's obvious and that anyone who doesn't agree with you is obvscum?

(In fact, I'd like dramonic to do the same)

And before you spout your tripe about how I'm obviously scum from the numbers game, I'll point out that yesterday you were insisting that Pyro, zwet and tajo were scum. Also,

rule 13

means you need to use your brain and that this is difficult for the town. Not only is your theory about me being scum not true, but given the nature of this game isn't even

likely

to be true.

2. Can you indicate to me why you think the scum have the Innocent PM?

(I think there is one piece of information from the Innocent PM that I believe has not been made public knowledge)

OMGOSH. Are you STILL bringing that up?? The role PM is a red herring and you need to stop bringing it up because it has nothing to do with the scum list anymore. It has nothing to do with anyone agreeing with me. It has only to do with the town agreeing with the cleared persons from our power roles and you trying to confuse things. Not only is it likely that you are scum its CERTAIN unless you want to believe that other garbage you floated about Stepho being naive or there being more than one GF.

[Lamont_Cranston]

I've got no case on Zazie. What I have is fact.

1-The only unconfirmed players are you three
2-The odds of only one of you being scum is... almost null
3-Zaz is alive. Wether scum or town, the right move for you would have been to hammer. I think you are both scum.

Thank you finally some logic. Look at my post record. I am the ONLY one that has been saying this the whole time. Percy should of known this if he was town and been saying it too. Instead he has tried every way from Sunday to confise things by discrediting the town cop, saying there are multiple GF's, saying there is only 2 scum, I mean what's next??

[Percy]

Lamont, dramonic has already retracted that post.

Your record is not good, don't appeal to it.

You've already been saying that the only way for me to be a good townie is to say you're scum. That is, if I had been agreeing with you from the start and saying "Lamont is obviously scum!", that would make you more likely to agree with me and accept the fact that I'm town.

There are only two conclusions to draw from this:

1. You are an Innocent and, without even realising, acknowledging a huge flaw in your analysis of the situation.
2. You are scum, and slipped big time.

---

I don't see why the role PM is a red herring. As far as I can tell, Dev quoted it, populartajo unvoted, and ZazieR was the first person to confirm most of the details. Just because ZazieR-scum makes sense in you're little world doesn't make it obvious, unavoidable fact.

If it's true that the scum have the role PM, I would be more inclined to believe you

and

ZazieR are scum. Your reaction to Dev's claim is not good, at all. Whether you-as-scum have it, or you-as-town have it, it's important to note that ZazieR prompts you multiple times to look at your PM. Apparently you just forgot to look at it, and then never touched the subject again for "tactical" reasons.

The most interesting thing from that exchange is that ZazieR did not jump on you, and essentially let you not address the issue. Scum coaching other scum is a great fit for that back-and-forth.




As far as I'm concerned, the assumption that the scum have the role PM is not an irresistible conclusion. Not yet. Perhaps after this:

@L_C: If the scum have the role PM, then I'm sure you wouldn't mind providing me with the few details that haven't already been publicly aired. If you can, I'll throw out this theory. If not, why not?

[Lamont_Cranston]

Lamont, dramonic has already retracted that post.

Your record is not good, don't appeal to it.

You've already been saying that the only way for me to be a good townie is to say you're scum. That is, if I had been agreeing with you from the start and saying "Lamont is obviously scum!", that would make you more likely to agree with me and accept the fact that I'm town.

There are only two conclusions to draw from this:

1. You are an Innocent and, without even realising, acknowledging a huge flaw in your analysis of the situation.
2. You are scum, and slipped big time.

---

I don't see why the role PM is a red herring. As far as I can tell, Dev quoted it, populartajo unvoted, and ZazieR was the first person to confirm most of the details. Just because ZazieR-scum makes sense in you're little world doesn't make it obvious, unavoidable fact.

If it's true that the scum have the role PM, I would be more inclined to believe you

and

ZazieR are scum. Your reaction to Dev's claim is not good, at all. Whether you-as-scum have it, or you-as-town have it, it's important to note that ZazieR prompts you multiple times to look at your PM. Apparently you just forgot to look at it, and then never touched the subject again for "tactical" reasons.

The most interesting thing from that exchange is that ZazieR did not jump on you, and essentially let you not address the issue. Scum coaching other scum is a great fit for that back-and-forth.




As far as I'm concerned, the assumption that the scum have the role PM is not an irresistible conclusion. Not yet. Perhaps after this:

@L_C: If the scum have the role PM, then I'm sure you wouldn't mind providing me with the few details that haven't already been publicly aired. If you can, I'll throw out this theory. If not, why not?

1) He didn't retract the portion of the post I referenced.
2) My record is perfect, yours however is the opposite.
3) Yes. If you are town you should of been calling me and Zazier scum without question but you didn't and that is because you are scum. It is you who have slipped.
4) The town role PM is useless and unnecessary to determine the scum. You want to look EVERYWHERE other than our approved power roles to somehow distract the town from the obvious truth; you have tried everything possible to do this. I on the other hand have remained consistent based on the facts that we clearly have.
5) I don't care if the scum have the town role PM or not. At this point it is 100% irrelevant and only a distraction to the discussion (something which you have been doing all day but who can blame you? I must say you are playing it much better than I would of if I was scum).