MtG: Parallel Universe Mafia (Tar's subgame): Game Over

[Pyromaniac]

I am

v/la until the 22nd

. I will be able to post. I won't be very active, though.

[ChaosOmega]

I will be v/la until the 17th. I might post, but it's fairly unlikely.

[Sajin]

Kairyuu, who is scum?

[Pyromaniac]

This game is dead.

[Pyromaniac]

By dead, I mean it needs a good bandwagon. Kairyuu is lurking.

[Sajin]

prods please Tar

[Papa Zito]

By dead, I mean it needs a good bandwagon. Kairyuu is lurking.

Vino needs moar votes.

[Vino]

What is your obsession with me? I'll vote how I please and at the moment I see no cause to vote.

[Sajin]

Vino, who is scum?

[Papa Zito]

What is your obsession with me? I'll vote how I please and at the moment I see no cause to vote.

Wat.

[Kairyuu]

By dead, I mean it needs a good bandwagon. Kairyuu is lurking.

Kairyuu is busy. Note my sig. Getting ready to leave for college is annoying.

Kairyuu, who is scum?

The ones who are trying to kill us. I dunno. I'm at a loss for reads right now. On an iso reread Pyro looks more like a townie getting backed into a corner than scum, but that's pretty much it. I could see a Chaos or Vino wagon, but only for lurking, which I too am guilty of, so I'm not going there.

Gut says you could very well be scum though. Your play thus far is somewhat reminiscent of the WoT large, and it's bothering me, because I can't tell if the change is because of alignment, or because you're becoming a better player.

@Papa Zito: Any clue as to why you might have been pulled into this game?

@Vino: Please summarize what you feel the case against you is, and then please summarize why it is wrong.

[Sajin]

Kairyuu, who is scum?

The ones who are trying to kill us. I dunno. I'm at a loss for reads right now. On an iso reread Pyro looks more like a townie getting backed into a corner than scum, but that's pretty much it. I could see a Chaos or Vino wagon, but only for lurking, which I too am guilty of, so I'm not going there.

Gut says you could very well be scum though. Your play thus far is somewhat reminiscent of the WoT large, and it's bothering me, because I can't tell if the change is because of alignment, or because you're becoming a better player.

How is my play at all reminiscent of WoT?

Meta, I have played with you 3 times and every time you have been town. Also, every time you were aggressively trying to scumhunt and were questioning statements made by players. Lurker hunting is not like the kairyuu meta I know....but I can't tell if its because of your college thing or your alignment.

What are your thoughts on Mastin? What are your thoughts on Budja (aware he is not here anymore)?

[Papa Zito]

@Papa Zito: Any clue as to why you might have been pulled into this game?

My best guess is that there's a pro-town player in this game that has the ability to swap people. I think this player decided that Budja was likely scum and I was likely town, so they switched us to give this game a further advantage.

Or we could have been picked at random by some sort of Tar game mechanic. Who knows?

[veerus]

Zito, why are you pushing for Vito so hard? And could you also explain your reasoning for joining that absurd alliance in FL's game?

[Sajin]

@Zwett- What is your role name? (Someone please copy this over to SSKs game)

[Pyromaniac]

Mastin seems town from when I have played with him. Although one game I only played for 2 days irl.

[Papa Zito]

Zito, why are you pushing for Vito so hard? And could you also explain your reasoning for joining that absurd alliance in FL's game?

I think a better question is: Why aren't you pushing anyone at all?

I explained my reason for joining THE UNBREAKABLE ALLIANCE already. You seem to be reading the other games, why are you asking this again?

Mastin seems town from when I have played with him. Although one game I only played for 2 days irl.

Mastin doesn't seem like Mastin at all.

[Vino]

Sajin, I haven't been impressed by just about anybody in this game so far. I was particularly unimpressed with Kinetic before he died. I was previously unimpressed with Pyromaniac for things he said early D1, but no so much anymore.

Kairyuu, what case? Nobody's made any case.

[Papa Zito]

There goes Zwet. Wonder if we'll see more people move around now.

Also, I can't believe this game is at the bottom of my watch list. Jeez.

Vino, you never answered my question. Who should I be voting?

[Sajin]

What happened to this game?

3 V/LAs.....sigh

Vino- stop fence sitting or you earn my vote.

[ChaosOmega]

Would you like a case, Vino? Here's one. Let's go through your posting history this game:

0: confirm
1: random
2: another random vote
3: reading other games
4: watching/Benmage
5: Benmage
6: Benmage
7: Benmage
8: DDD/quoting
9: busy/no content
10: SpryeX/Pyro/Benmage

I want to stop here for a moment. This is an interesting post for two reasons. Here's what you posted about Pyro:

In any case, I know that the prevailing winds are to lynch Pyro, and I'm not particularly against that except to play the devil's advocate. He's done a lot of scummy stuff so far and he seems like a good lynch candidate, but he would be a mistake to lynch so quickly, for two reasons. One, we'd miss out on a lot of good information to be had in this early stage, and two, well fuck I forget two, but I had a good two. Anyway it's a bad idea to quicklynch D1, so I won't be joining that wagon.

For starters, it's pretty non-committal. You're not really taking a stand on his alignment, you're just stating things, like quicklynching is bad. Well thanks.

The more interesting thing is that later, I posted asking Vino why he hasn't commented on Pyromaniac at all day 1. I'm now aware this is false, as I missed this part of his post on my reread, but he responded as though my accusation was true:

I was trying to find something to say, but I stopped understanding what was going on when the discussion turned to heavy MTG terminology, and I'm not that proficient at the game. And then the day ended so it seems like a moot point now. I'll address it D2 if it's still relevant.

That's a bit odd to me. Either you forgot about it, or you were just being extra defensive. Not really sure which.

The other reason I found this post interesting was your opinion on Benmage. You proposed he should be lynched, and I've already discussed in regards to Pyromaniac why I see that as scummy. The difference here is that Pyromaniac looks to have a decent excuse for his reasoning. With his claimed role, it makes sense to worry about a cult. Here's your reasoning:

In other words, I think Benmage is a good, safe lynch.

Do you mean a good, safe mislynch?

Anyways, back to the post analysis.

11: no content
12: response to my Pyro comment; previously explained
13: other game/alliance talk
14: anecdote/useless
15: outside game voting
16: same
17: same
18: same
19: useless
20: defensive

Let's take a look at this post. This was after both Papa Zito and I voted you. Your response to me:

Omega, I had a busy weekend, and this game turned to a lot of Magic-related technical talk at the same time, so I had not much to say. You'll notice my posting fell off in all of the games I'm involved in, so not so much lurking as having friends in town.

Interesting how you defend yourself against something I didn't attack you for. I said that for all you posted, there was hardly any useful content (as I'm illustrating with this post), which I called active lurking.

I don't see defensiveness as a scumtell, as it makes sense for people regardless of alignment to defend themselves. My problem is in the way you defend yourself. I'm having problems explaining it, but it's like you're just pulling canned responses or something and just throwing them at whoever attacks you for any reason. You don't really interact with the case, you just brush it aside.

Zito though, I don't see where your vote is coming from, care to explain?

Going back to my previous point, defensiveness is not necessarily a scumtell. However, a post like this really makes sense from you if you're scum. You want to respond to every attack on you to allay suspicion, and then suddenly, you're voted without an attack, and that bothers you. You can't refute it, but you're worried he knows something. So, you ask him why he voted for you. I can see town doing it as well, but I think it's more likely done by scum.

21: response to Zito's attack

And may I say, one of the better rebuttals I've seen in a while:

Well that's just not true.

Well I'll be damned. I'm so glad you're here, Vino, clearing up things like that for us. How could we possibly have believed you've done nothing with such a thorough and useful response?

22: concern, avoidance
23: non-committal

You seem worried about Papa Zito's persistence, like he's on to you or something. You also refuse to answer his question, which allows you to sidestep having to state your suspicions of people in the game. Your next post continues the trend of not providing substantial opinions of any player.

So how haven't you been overwhelmingly useless?

[Sajin]

I like how I could summarize this whole case into fence sitting. Thanks for writing it all out though.

[Papa Zito]

I like how I could summarize this whole case into fence sitting. Thanks for writing it all out though.

I was going to do this soonish since Vino seriously needs more attention and everyone is sitting on their hands.

Goodposting, ChaosOmega.

[Kairyuu]

vote: Vino

Good enough for me.

See sig. I moved in yesterday, and orientation runs from 8am-11pm for the next 3 days, and then Welcome Days does practically the same thing for the rest of the week. Then classes start. So yeah. Minimal access if any for a week or two. Just a heads up.

[Tarhalindur]

"'Hidden within the clicking, chittering swarm is a unique mind, still young, but growing more aware as time passes.' - flavor text, Sliver Legion"

Posting this since the moderating team's inboxes have been flooded with questions/concerns:

I do not believe Yosarian2 intentionally broke the rules, and I would ordinarily recommend an Official Warning in this situation. However, I instead recommended a modkill in this situation for two reasons:
1) multiple players were breaking Rule 1a in a way that I thought posed an IMMINENT threat to game integrity and
2) given how players reacted to Official Warnings in my game I thought there was a severe risk that players would continue to break Rule 1a if the moderating team only handed out Official Warnings.

As for the prodding situation:
- Mastin will not be prodded due to extenuating circumstances, though I will remind him that this game exists if he does not post in a day or two.
- malthusis is being prodded
- Pyromaniac's V/LA (until Saturday) is noted.

That should be all. - Tar

The Fourth Vote Count (aka the "Grandeur" Vote Count)

2) veerus (0) -
4) ChaosOmega (1) - Sajin
6) malthusis (0) -
7) Pyromaniac (0) -
9) Sajin (0) -
10) Mastin (0) -
11) Vino (3) - Papa Zito, ChaosOmega, Kairyuu
12) Kairyuu (0) -
26) Papa Zito (0) -

Not Voting (5): veerus, malthusis, Pyromaniac, Mastin, Vino

Votes required to lynch:

5

Current Deadline:

August 26, 2009 at ~6:00 P.M. CST (GMT -6)

First Mod Deadline Review:

August 19, 2009 at ~6:00 P.M. (GMT -6)