Wheel of Time Mafia: Rip in the Pattern (GAME OVER)

[Kinetic]

Also, Balefire kill, since I promised to release it even if it wasn't used.

Balefire - One Power - Daybreak - This ability completely removes someone from the pattern. This cannot be used when you are the target for the lynch. The last vote that your target cast will be removed.

(Mod Note: This ability can cause a retroactive No-Lynch)

[Goatrevolt]

The confusion in the Mafia thread was so amusing for much of the game. Goat's Indirect Kill would never work correctly, JVM kept getting blocked, it was madness.

Hahaha, yeah...

Both times I tried the indirect approach it didn't succeed as expected. The first time was Slicey dead from bodyguarding. The 2nd was Benmage to SpyreX but SpyreX didn't die, so I was like WTF? I was so happy when he eventually died.

By the end of the game I think I had a good grasp on everything, though. I think we actually worked pretty well together as a team, from planning out how I could kill someone like Armlx and claim a track on Yosarian to give myself some more +town points, or spreading JVW and Sajin out for sleeping locations so I could claim a track on either of them instead of having to claim to have actually targeted MacavityLock.

Controlled madness.

[Sajin]

So would anyone have bought the I was cut off from the one power because I lied (using my statement where I called Kairyuu confirmed town). I am curious.

[hasdgfas]

so, why was I killed, exactly? Also, I stopped paying attention partway through day 2 since I didn't really want to read up on the game when I was dead.
I thought I saw something about the kill of me being copied to shadowknight, who I was attempting to protect.

[Kinetic]

so, why was I killed, exactly? Also, I stopped paying attention partway through day 2 since I didn't really want to read up on the game when I was dead.
I thought I saw something about the kill of me being copied to shadowknight, who I was attempting to protect.

Isaac targeted you with assassinate. Since your ability copied anything that happened to you to your protection target it also killed SK.

[Yosarian2]

For the most part, the detection ability that nearly every player had was borderline useless.

Not at all. For one thing, it made it impossible for the scum to lie about where they were. And there was a town role that could catch you if you told the truth about where you were. It also forced all black aes sedi to claim aes sedi, and there was a town role (that we had no way of knowing about ) that could catch you if you claimed aes sedi, so that was basically another cop. Plus it's kind of annoying that basically everyone in the game was an aes sedi, and we had no way of knowing that; it was basically just blind luck that the whole scum team wasn't caught in bad fake clams because of that.

I'm glad we managed to pull out a win, my team mates played really well. I'm especally glad of the way me and my team mates managed to make moretoriom look bad, and the pre-planned bus goat did on me (where he "nailed" me with a tracker claim proving I lied; he actually killed someone else that night who just happened to be in the same locaton I was at) worked well too. Still, even with the double kill, this game was weighed pretty heavily against the scum team; town had more then enough information to figure out almost everything, and by the end game, nearly the entire scum team was already lined up in to be lynched. If anything had gone even slightly wrong at any point, we would have been toast.

[Sajin]

I agree it was not useless. We had to claim one power user of some sort as well as what room we were in truthfully.

The massive amount of information in investigative roles was supposed to disallow misslynches, or make them very uncommon. Armlx, silent speaker and seteal were all hard information roles. The only balancing factor was 6 scum (and we never even got to use Mr Flays abilities before he was being strung up, the forsaken may as well have been goons, Issac doubled his incinerate and his truth detection was meant to be good against Issac or to find the other forsaken).

If we lied about locations to dodge a role (seteal) then another role could catch us (MBL), not to mention explaining the saidar detections.

the innkeeper, butler and the green ajah could get confirmed town in addition to the aforementioned roles. I am glad everyone got stuck in solve the puzzle mode instead of find the scum mode. That made us able to eek out the game.

[Kinetic]

For the most part, the detection ability that nearly every player had was borderline useless.

Not at all. For one thing, it made it impossible for the scum to lie about where they were. And there was a town role that could catch you if you told the truth about where you were. It also forced all black aes sedi to claim aes sedi, and there was a town role (that we had no way of knowing about ) that could catch you if you claimed aes sedi, so that was basically another cop. Plus it's kind of annoying that basically everyone in the game was an aes sedi, and we had no way of knowing that; it was basically just blind luck that the whole scum team wasn't caught in bad fake clams because of that.

I'm glad we managed to pull out a win, my team mates played really well. I'm especally glad of the way me and my team mates managed to make moretoriom look bad, and the pre-planned bus goat did on me (where he "nailed" me with a tracker claim proving I lied; he actually killed someone else that night who just happened to be in the same locaton I was at) worked well too. Still, even with the double kill, this game was weighed pretty heavily against the scum team; town had more then enough information to figure out almost everything, and by the end game, nearly the entire scum team was already lined up in to be lynched. If anything had gone even slightly wrong at any point, we would have been toast.

I disagree a bit here Yos.

You're looking at this from the perspective of knowing exactly what was there, and having no fog of war (and indeed, the scum knew a lot more about what was true and what wasn't).

However the town had a much greater Fog of War to deal with. Each of the Black was given the full Color Role PM, your PM was identical to the other player who had your color in the game.

Additionally the amount of Aes Sedai in the game worked toward your favor in many instances, and the nature of your kills (A MidDirected Kill and a Delayed Kill) put even more mis-information in the town's hands.

The amount of "good" information that town had to deal with was very small (really, the only "cop" in the game was TSS, Seteal and Sajin were supposed to duel with information and misinformation all game, and Sajin's worst case scenario was throwing misinformation on a location Seteal did a true information gathering on). And even TSS's role was intended to be not a "true" cop, as there were about 10 roles which he got a "Not tied to the Pattern" result which didn't rule them out as town.

[Kinetic]

I agree it was not useless. We had to claim one power user of some sort as well as what room we were in truthfully.

The massive amount of information in investigative roles was supposed to disallow misslynches, or make them very uncommon. Armlx, silent speaker and seteal were all hard information roles. The only balancing factor was 6 scum (and we never even got to use Mr Flays abilities before he was being strung up, the forsaken may as well have been goons, Issac doubled his incinerate and his truth detection was meant to be good against Issac or to find the other forsaken).

If we lied about locations to dodge a role (seteal) then another role could catch us (MBL), not to mention explaining the saidar detections.

the innkeeper, butler and the green ajah could get confirmed town in addition to the aforementioned roles. I am glad everyone got stuck in solve the puzzle mode instead of find the scum mode. That made us able to eek out the game.

Fabian's role was supposed to even out this a little bit (Greater Still and Compulsion), Green Ajeh could have bonded ANY of the non-Aes Sedai (including the two Forsaken, but not Isaac as he was immune), and Armlx's role was supposed to be virtually useless, and I only threw it in there so it looked like it wasn't useless.

Seteal and TSS were the only hard information roles, and they each has scum counters (Sajin and a little less than half the scum being "Godfathers" to his cop ability and about 7 "millers")

[Sajin]

Which happened! I panicked so much when that worst case scenario happened.

[Kinetic]

The fact was though that, yes, you may have not been able to lie easily about your location (which was intended, or else the locations would have been virtually useless without a mod confirmation on who slept where), and the detections were intended to be a Red Herring for most of the important information (kills), and even misleading (such as Goat's Misdirect Kill).

[Kinetic]

Which happened! I panicked so much when that worst case scenario happened.

It was unlucky, but it was well defended by you indeed. It helped that Seteal's role was in very poor hands previously (Mindrunner, then Zwet)

[Kinetic]

What I felt the game represented was this:

The town played a spectacular early game, and with the mafia very disorganized (intended) they were able to jump on a lot of early tells.

Near the mid game Goat, with some help from Sajin, was able to make a VERY great turning point play.

The end game could still have gone either way near the end, and I'm happy with how the game turned out.

[Goatrevolt]

I'm happy with the way the game turned out too.

[Goatrevolt]

A funny quote from our quick topic:

Yosarian: "I think the last people in our scumgroup who have a chance of making it to endgame are Goad and KOC."

KoC wasn't in our scum group .

[Tarhalindur]

You know, Kinetic, if you weren't running WoT games all the time I would be /in for your games like a ton of bricks.

[Kinetic]

Lol. My next game will have nothing to do with wot.

[MacavityLock]

Sajin, reading through scum quicktopic, I love how you pegged me as White Ajah for

completely the wrong reason.

[Sajin]

I thought you were far more powerful then you were. I figured town had a lie detector somewhere if we did.

[Kinetic]

Actually, my next game will be a Theme Big Game and Mini Combination. Both the Mini and Large game will start at the same time and will share a player list.

Hmm, that seems like a lot of players, maybe I should re-think this.

Alright, here is some more stuff on how I designed the game. It took me the better part of 5 months of just thinking of how to balance this game. Since the Aes Sedai was such a unique role I wanted to really make the game about Aes Sedai.

The mini was designed to tell me how powerfully I could make a single town role without it being over powered.

Obviously... something went wrong, lol. Thus, I nixxed Ward and a few of the other Aes Sedai powers were altered (Detect Saidar was WAY too powerful in the mini).

The biggest hurdle for me was how many Aes Sedai I could put in the game. I was trying originally for between 5 and 7. Then I came to an impasse and decided I NEEDed at least seven.

The original concept was to have all 7 Aes Sedai in the same quick topic. From there, I would build the rest of the game. I initially decided on 2 black from the 7 Aes Sedai, and then built about a 20 player game around that.

After thinking about it a lot though, I couldn't, in my opinion, fairly balance the game with only 7. So I doubled the number, and eventually came up with the 14 Aes Sedai and 4 scum ratio.

This still felt a little stronger in favor of the scum, so I added two more Aes Sedai and created the 16 Aes Sedai as we know them now.

From there I designed each of the Ajeh abilities, and left the Amylin and Keeper open for anything I felt I might miss, or for powers I felt too powerful to have two of (for instance, the Keeper's ability was actually a rough draft of the White's original ability that I nixxed.)

Then I randomly distributed the black among the 14 originals, and paired them all up randomly, with only one caveat, I needed one of the pairs to be completely black.

From there I then designed the Black versions of each ability (the easiest was the red, since there didn't need to be a Black version, and by far the hardest was the Brown, which I felt came out pretty well).

With the kills split up evenly, I then started working on the Forsaken, making one the epitome of subversion and the other more of a hammer. I really liked both roles, and then paired them with the appropriate black who didn't have a partner.

From there I designed most of the other town roles, save the Tav'r'en, that one came up very late in production.

So, I then had I think 21 roles, all roles were pretty close to their final versions, and the Male Channeler, Gholam, Gambler, and Tav'r'en weren't implemented yet.

After looking at it, the game was I felt a little balanced toward town, so I added a virtually Neutral role in the Gambler to throw some suspicion sideways.

I then added the Gholam, because I really wanted a spanner in the works with all the Aes Sedai running around. He was intended to cause all sorts of mischief... but if I had to do it over again I realize now there was virtually no way for this role to win. Sorry Isaac .

Now with 23 roles, it was shaping up, but I wanted to add the Male Channeller. I decided I wanted to maybe have two versions of the role, but I couldn't decide which one, the "Corrupt" version from the Mini, or a new "Town" version I was making up and having fun with. Eventually I made the Tav'r'en role to balance it out. The Tav chose their side and the Male Channeler would be forced to the opposite side.

The Tav, if he chose Dark, would have gained the Mafia WC, the Forsaken would have been informed that the Tav had chosen Dark, but not who it was, and the Tav would not be told who the Mafia were.

So then I had my 25, and I was pretty happy with it.

[Kinetic]

Confirmed, my next game (Large Theme) will be a theme about Wizard of Oz.

I've been waiting a LONG time to do this game.

Knowledge of the books and movies is completely and totally unnecessary as neither will be used as a reference.

[Konowa]

Very fun game to read from an outsider's perspective.

[MacavityLock]

I thought you were far more powerful then you were. I figured town had a lie detector somewhere if we did.

Least powerful ability in the game, what what. (Except of course for SpyreX post-gentle.)

[Kinetic]

I thought you were far more powerful then you were. I figured town had a lie detector somewhere if we did.

Least powerful ability in the game, what what. (Except of course for SpyreX post-gentle.)

lol, actually, it was your ability that made me curse myself the most. You could have single handedly found Isaac Day 1.

[Sajin]

From your perspective, sure.

The fog of war does many things.