Newbie 803 - Game Over.

[jammer]

Meh, I haven't paid much attention towards HV or Ein.

If HV is town, we don't lose much if he is playing like this the next day. I can't see anything particulair scummy in the play.

Just a point I want to bring in. It seems HV is getting lynched last second and as far I see. Porkens is better, but anyway.

I think HH mentioned it, but.
When HV flips town, I'd prefer to

not

have a doc on Porkens. If Porkens is real cop, and there is a doc. He would be roleblocked anyway. So all we would get is a unverified cop with possibly living unverified innocent in lylo. I rather have the doc protecting Vino, who is more likely to be town then Porkens. (pending the wifom that scum would fake a innocent random)

I do

NOT

want the doc to waste a save on Porkens, anyone disagree with this stand?

[Vino]

<IC time>I don't disagree, but by saying all that stuff you just admitted that you're not the doc. You have to be careful the way you phrase stuff like this because you've effectively just claimed vanilla townie. That gives scum more clues in their doc-hunting, if that's what they're trying to do.

The other thing is that directing the doc makes them more predictable to scum. In fact, since just about anybody can do it, nothing keeps scum from directing the doc, and thus telling the doc what they want him to do. As a doc it's generally a bad idea to listen to any directing.</IC time>

[Head_Honcho]

Vino I think that's probably a faux paus if you've never actually ICed. On the other hand I suppose you get to save some money on a colonoscopy. And directing the doc is not that big of a deal, it's a question of theory, it's directing the cop that's bad because it is scummy.

Jammer makes a good point, I had forgotten that if we have two power roles cop would get roleblocked. So yes, no point protecting Porkens regardless.

[Zorblag]

Vote Count 2.8

The numbers by the voters indicate the order in which the vote was cast. If two or more players are tied for the most votes to lynch at the deadline the tiebreaker will be the player who has the earliest active vote.

Hurleys_Van: 4: Col.Cathart (11), Head_Honcho (12), Porkens (13), Vino (14)
Porkens: 2: Hurleys_Van (3), Einlanzers (5)

Not voting: jammer

With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch.

Hurleys_Van, mafia goon

is lynched.

It is now night two. Night actions are due by 3:00 PM EDT/12:00 PM PDT on Friday, July 31st.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Zorblag]

Night Two is now over.

Porkens, cop

is killed Night Two.

Vote Count 3.0

The numbers by the voters indicate the order in which the vote was cast. If two or more players are tied for the most votes to lynch at the deadline the tiebreaker will be the player who has the earliest active vote.

Not voting: Col.Cathart, Einlanzers, Head_Honcho, jammer, Vino

With 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch. Currently no one would be lynched at Deadline. Deadline is 3:00 PM EDT/12:00 PM PDT on Friday, August 21st.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Head_Honcho]

Jammer I find it interesting that you were adamant on lynching Porkens until HV was at L-1.

[Vino]

So Porkens' story was true. That means I'm a confirmed townie. *dance*

Honcho, I know it doesn't matter now, but I still think that directing the doc is a bad idea. Scum get a night kill, and if the doc becomes predictable then it makes it easier to make a correct NK without doc interference.

Anyway, we now have two possibilities. Mafia with RB and doc, or no doc and no RB. The way I see it, either are equally viable.

So the question of the hour is, who is the most likely partner of the late Hurleys_Van?

[Head_Honcho]

The doc doesn't have to listen, so it's still as much of a guessing game as ever

[Vino]

The doc doesn't have to listen, so it's still as much of a guessing game as ever

How's the cop any different?

[jammer]

Jammer I find it interesting that you were adamant on lynching Porkens until HV was at L-1.

It was mainly vino who made me doubt. Late in the day I was looking at Porkens and you as a scumpair, you where actively defending him. Vino came in and was also in favour of letting him live. Made me rethink it, as Chia was willing to lynch Porkens before.

So the question of the hour is, who is the most likely partner of the late Hurleys_Van?

*shrug* At first sight anyone who isn't on the HV-wagon. That makes me and Ein.


Also, can both of you stop the doc/cop discussion. Post a thread in mafia-discussion if needed. You'll get more usefull info that way, then a discussion in here.

[Vino]

Quiet you, you're interrupting our

argume

-- discussion.

I'll have to do a re-read before I can really determine who I think is the best HV partner. That will come eventually.

[Col.Cathart]

*Looks at his list of suspects*

HV... Check. Porkens... Check, but it's not a good news.

So that leaves Ein. I didn't have time to reread everything, so for now I can only point out, that in previous days, they were both voting at the same person. More observations to come.

Also Ein, I hope that Honcho an Vino both explained, what inconsistence we see in you post, so maybe now, you'll give us a proper answer.

[Head_Honcho]

vote: ein

good morning how are you

[jammer]

Also, here are the D1 and D2 votecounts. I did town in blue and mafia in red. HV and Ein did vote along D1 and D2.

Einlanzers: 4: jammer (4), Claramata (9),

Porkens (10), Santos (12)

jammer: 1: Lupo El Loco (5)

jonnydelawelsh:

1: Einlanzers (11)
Claramata: 1:

VP Baltar (13)

Not voting:

Cartza,

jonnydelawelsh

Santos: 5: Porkens (15), VP Baltar (18)

, jammer (25), Col.Cathart (30), Head_Honcho (31)

Porkens: 4: Chiarosicada (23)

,

Hurleys_Van (24),

Einlanzers (27),

Santos (28)

Hurleys_Van:

4: Col.Cathart (11), Head_Honcho (12),

Porkens (13), Vino (14)

Porkens: 2:

Hurleys_Van (3)

, Einlanzers (5)

Not voting: jammer

Also,

Ein--

Again very defensive of everything directed at him, could just be the beginner in him. Also, I didn't see anything else on your vote on Jammer, do you still believe them to be scum?

He is very defensive but just a beginner. Makes a argument on Ein then close to nullifies it.

*Going to look into Ein more, some time later.*

[Head_Honcho]

So, I assume you guys are all waiting on Ein too. If he doesn't show up soon I'm going to think that's a pretty telling sign.

[Col.Cathart]

I was looking for some connections between HV and several other people (mainly Ein as a main suspect), and I didn't found much. This however is interesting:

Well I'm not much of the wall of quotes type of guy so I'll just give it simply.

Firstly, was the fact that he jumped on the wagon for Ein's and put him at L2 with just a single reason, (something about knowing so much about someone), which was a weak accusation, and he didn't even comment on anyone elses reason for voting for him.

Shortly thereafter precedes to say he will keep his vote on Ein's as "pressure" till Ein's post again.

refuses to comment on anyone else, besides Ein

Goes back to pushing for an Ein lynch

Switches gears over to Santos, without a mention as to why Ein was cleared, simply that he believed the claim

Goes quite

This is about Porkens and vote for him, if I recall correctly. As you can see, the main reason to lynch Porkens was because Porkens was attacking Ein.

Apart from that we have lots of Off-topic posts, active lurking, and no real connections with anyone, except maybe Santos.

Running away from uneasy questions, inconsistence, the same voting pattern as HV. Maybe Porkens was really right about you.

vote: Einlanzers

Because of above, and lack of any other suspects. Vino is confirmed townie. HH is playing very well, and aside from sudden D1 hammer, and Lupo's behavior, I have no suspicions ATM. Jammer was trying to lynch Porkens, but so do me for a long time, because I didn't believe him as well. Apart from that, he played really well. The only thing that bugs me was that strange unvote, when HV reached 3rd vote. Possible bussing? Maybe...

Anyway, I hope Ein will post soon with some defense.

[Einlanzers]

OK it makes sense that you guys suspect me because I was on the opposite wagon than the scum wagon, but to keep bringing up stupid crap like this:

...

what.

THE POINT IS YOU DID NOT THINK SANTOS WAS TOWN, YOU ARE JUST USING IT TO MAKE YOURSELF LOOK ADORABLE TODAY. IT IS NOT COMPLICATED.

I am down to

Vote Hurley's Van

I wasn't trying to use it to make myself look adorable/intelligent/scum-hunter-ific today/yesterday/any-day. I merely was stating that I didn't think he was a prime candidate for a lynch and I was sad to see a towny lynched. Can we just drop this now...?

Speaking of lynches, I am glad you guys managed to get ahold of a scum and go through with the lynch and rather quickly in fact:

List of Votes for HV

Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:38 pm - Col.Cathart
Wed Jul 29, 2009 12:25 am - Head_Honcho
Wed Jul 29, 2009 7:12 am - Porkens
Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:26 am - Vino

Now I have 2 theories about this:
#1) Remaining scum stayed away from the wagon. Jammer or myself.
#2) Scum bussed on the wagon to draw suspicion away from themselves.

I'm really thinking it's #2, but it is possible for Jammer to be scum aswell. For #2 to be possible we have to exclude Porkens and Vino. That leaves Col. Cathart and Head_Honcho. I thought Col. Cathart started that wagon with a good post (and what scum would START a wagon against their ally?):

In Porkens case, really nothing changed in my opinion. We are in dead end here, and only way to know the truth is to lynch Porkens. And I want to wait with this especially because, of HV.

Yes, I know, I will sound like a hypocrite here. Really sorry for this once again.

HV was called for active lurking. In response he gave us a one liner, which helped nothing and solved nothing. He went silent once again (isn't that 3 prod for him already?), and that's about it. If Porkens is ignoring call on him for playing scummy, then HV is doing it in spades.

So my current list of suspects right now:

1) Hurleys Van
2) Einlanzers
3) Porkens

Unfortunately, lynching the first one seems impossible now, but I'm gonna try anyway. I wanted to hammer Porkens several times already, but HH's and Vito's explanations made me change my mind. It's actually a bit weird, that two other players did it, instead of Porkens himself ~^

vote: Hurley's Van

Head_Honcho's was a bit lacking (see first quote above ^^).
So my list right now signs of:
1) Head_Honcho
2) jammer

[Head_Honcho]

I didn't really feel a need to articulate why I was okay with lynching HV. I kind of thought his play spoke for itself.

Ein. I would love to let this go but at this point at the least I want acknowledgment that this actually happened.

Towards the end of day one you posted:

New list:
1) Porkens
2) jammer
3) Santos

Day two you said you thought he was a townie before he was lynched.

Do you understand? (Yes/No)

[jammer]

Some information

My Wagon:
jammer, Claramata, Porkens, Santos

Santos' Wagon:
Porkens, Head_Honcho, VP Baltar, jammer

Porkens' Wagon:
Chiarosicada, Hurleys_Van, Einlanzers, Santos

Porkens and jammer were both on my wagon and now are on Santoses wagon.
Santos was on my wagon and is now on Porkens' wagon.

It seems highly suspect to me that Porkens and/or jammer are scummer.
This also makes Santos look scummy, but it seems less so.

New list:
1) Porkens
2) jammer
3) Santos

Santos is third on you list, and you suspect Porkens and me for being on the wagon of Santos. How is someone voting someone you find suspicious, suspicious?

I assume at least one of those is scum (if not 2). And seeing as CC and HH were the last 2 to vote on him make them the most suspicious in my books. The last thing we need right now is another mislynch.

I'm glad that I was correct in my assumptions of Santos being town

, but saddened that he was mislynched :/.

Day later you

knew

Santos was town. While you didn't communicate it yesterday.

[Head_Honcho]

posting bros

[Head_Honcho]

I'm going to

unvote

for now because it's early for l-1 but pretend I have a vote on you

[Vino]

Speaking of lynches, I am glad you guys managed to get ahold of a scum and go through with the lynch and rather quickly in fact:

List of Votes for HV

Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:38 pm - Col.Cathart
Wed Jul 29, 2009 12:25 am - Head_Honcho
Wed Jul 29, 2009 7:12 am - Porkens
Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:26 am - Vino

Now I have 2 theories about this:
#1) Remaining scum stayed away from the wagon. Jammer or myself.
#2) Scum bussed on the wagon to draw suspicion away from themselves.

I'm really thinking it's #2, but it is possible for Jammer to be scum aswell. For #2 to be possible we have to exclude Porkens and Vino. That leaves Col. Cathart and Head_Honcho. I thought Col. Cathart started that wagon with a good post (and what scum would START a wagon against their ally?):

...

Head_Honcho's was a bit lacking (see first quote above ^^).
So my list right now signs of:
1) Head_Honcho
2) jammer

Well I WAS going to agree with #1. Cathart was suspect because of Clara's play, but his later play has been better so I was willing to forgive it due to newbieness on her part. You seemed pretty town in your claim post and afterwards and so I was leaning away from you. My re-read had me leaning towards jammer due to sketchiness between him and HV, but that was before I read this post.

Honcho not only has been hugely active this game (unusual for his meta) but he called for me to place the hammer on Hurley, his accused "scum buddy" according to you. I would say he was instrumental in getting HV lynched. So, this attempt to frame Honcho as the scum when the facts don't look anything like that are quite odd. Seems like a gross misrepresentation to me.

I just don't see Honcho's behavior as consistent with bussing, unless he was SOOO confident that he could last three days without being lynched that he thought it was okay to get his buddy killed.

[Einlanzers]

Honcho not only has been hugely active this game (unusual for his meta) but he called for me to place the hammer on Hurley, his accused "scum buddy" according to you. I would say he was instrumental in getting HV lynched. So, this attempt to frame Honcho as the scum when the facts don't look anything like that are quite odd. Seems like a gross misrepresentation to me.

see, THAT is wifom. In a non lylo situation it does not inherently make him scummy when nobody hammers him. We have a deadline midday tomorrow, I don't know if this has been made clear, but basically we lynch somebody else or our claimed cop gets lynched. We are in a much better position information wise to decide whether or not we want to believe porkens tomorrow. It is nonideal to lynch him today.

Basically, if Vino and Porkens don't vote HV Porkens gets lynched. Hopefully Porkens will check in, which makes it kind of up to you Vino.

I don't know how I missed that post. Thanks for pointing that out. That post does make him very much so less suspicious.

Day two you said you thought he was a townie before he was lynched.

Do you understand? (Yes/No)

Yes

New list:
1) Porkens
2) jammer
3) Santos

I'm glad that I was correct in my assumptions of Santos being town

You guys keep quoting the above and I can see how you can be confused. I guess I did misspeak there. I guess what I meant to say is:

I'm glad to see that my assumption of Porkens being more scummy is correct, but....

I apologize for misspeaking can we move on?

Knowing that Vino is town and we have in-depth posts from Col.Cathart and Head_Honcho it makes jammer quite suspect in my eyes.

Vote: jammer

[Einlanzers]

The site was acting up/temporarily down earlier:

Mod Note: Please remove my double post

[Zorblag]

Einlanzers's double post was taken care of. Beyond that this a filler so that the vote count goes at the top of the next page.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh