Mafia 96 - Murder in Emerald City (Game Over!)

[Xylthixlm]

unvote, vote: mastin

ckool: if mastin flips scum you should kill kmd tonight, if he flips town you should kill me

Works for me even at the risk that Mastin actually is scum. It's just one more way that my top suspect can be eliminated.

Unvote, Vote Mastin

I think we can rule out Kmd as Cerulean scum here.

Still - Kmd, why did you think Mastin was so town that you would agree to be vigged if he wasn't?

[Kmd4390]

I didn't think he was "so town". I just figured that one of two things would happen:
1) Mastin is scum. Good lynch.
2) Mastin is town. Rofl dies at night. Good because I think Rofl is scum.

Either way, we end up with dead scum or my top suspect dead. No way it could go wrong.

[Xylthixlm]

Could you summarize your case on roflcopter again in light of Mastin's flip?

[Xylthixlm]

Reasons I think roflcopter is town:
1) Defense of Kublai Khan
2) Attempts to get Mastin lynched
3) Attack on me (misguided)
4) Doing whatever it takes to kill scum

Reasons I'm not sure roflcopter is town:
1) Willingness to be vigged as a distraction

[roflcopter]

the fact that i had put forward my version of how things should go down regarding the vig doesn't mean nobody else could have too.

You were willing to die yesterday, yet today you don't want to reveal your role? Seems inconsistent.

yesterday it was unknown whether or not i was right about mastin, and if i were wrong i would have been easy lynchbait - thats a good person to have vigged. that fact that i wasn't wrong means i'm no longer willing to die. no inconsisitency.

why do you think "forcing a claim" out of me is a good idea? how does that benefit the town?

same question to kmd, who agreed like a little lap dog.

[roflcopter]

unvote, vote: mastin

ckool: if mastin flips scum you should kill kmd tonight, if he flips town you should kill me

Works for me even at the risk that Mastin actually is scum. It's just one more way that my top suspect can be eliminated.

Unvote, Vote Mastin

I think we can rule out Kmd as Cerulean scum here.

Still - Kmd, why did you think Mastin was so town that you would agree to be vigged if he wasn't?

what other course of action did kmd have that would not have looked scummy as fuck?

[roflcopter]

We should aim to get a role-claim from roflcopter today. There's something fishy about him.

this is a stupid plan. see kmd sheep onto it immediately for evidence.

Yeah, there's no way I thought you were scum before Khan said you were, right?

there's no way you had the balls to vote me before he said a claim should be forced, thats for sure. ckool really should have vigged you.

Because I didn't vote you yesterday at all, right?

the fact that you voted me yesterday is irrelevant to this discussion. we're talking about today, and today is a whole new ballgame. today you didn't vote me until khan suggeted the town force a claim. today all you did was encourage hayker to attack me.

[Kmd4390]

Xyl, this was my original case on Rofl:

Rofl, more organized version of my case that I found by viewing my own posts:
-lurked
-only went after easy targets
-predetermined who was votable a little early
-Declared Khan town on next to nothing, very early in the game
-buddies to Khan by giving him and award for "knowing what to do".
-Wrong on Mastin's vote. He called it OMGUS, not a policy miller vote.
-Takes the easy Mastin vote, apparently knowing his meta
-Comment on the NK
-threatened to vote MM over asking for reasons for your vote

For sake of fairness, here is his defense:

Rofl, more organized version of my case that I found by viewing my own posts:
-lurked

true

-only went after easy targets

false

-predetermined who was votable a little early

your opinion

-Declared Khan town on next to nothing, very early in the game

wrong

-buddies to Khan by giving him and award for "knowing what to do".

wrong

-Wrong on Mastin's vote. He called it OMGUS, not a policy miller vote.

wrong

-Takes the easy Mastin vote, apparently knowing his meta

wrong

-Comment on the NK

what about it

-threatened to vote MM over asking for reasons for your vote

what about it

my comments in bold. this still looks like a lurker hunt when you could be going after mastin, who you've already admitted you find scummy.

View us both in ISO if you want to see further discussion.

[Xylthixlm]

Kmd, you don't think Mastin's flip affects your case at all?

[Xylthixlm]

Could you summarize your case on roflcopter again

in light of Mastin's flip?

Re-pasting your case from yesterday does not answer this

[Kmd4390]

Reasons I think roflcopter is town:
1) Defense of Kublai Khan
2) Attempts to get Mastin lynched
3) Attack on me (misguided)
4) Doing whatever it takes to kill scum

Reasons I'm not sure roflcopter is town:
1) Willingness to be vigged as a distraction

How do 1 and 2 make him town? 3 and 4, I could see normally, but maybe he is scum who thinks he's found opposing scum.

Reasons I'm not sure roflcopter is town:
1) Willingness to be vigged as a distraction

To be clear, do you mean this is a scumpoint against him OR do you mean that you aren't using this as reasoning why he is town.

why do you think "forcing a claim" out of me is a good idea? how does that benefit the town?

same question to kmd, who agreed like a little lap dog.

Well I want you lynched and usually a claim happens before a lynch.

We should aim to get a role-claim from roflcopter today. There's something fishy about him.

this is a stupid plan. see kmd sheep onto it immediately for evidence.

Yeah, there's no way I thought you were scum before Khan said you were, right?

there's no way you had the balls to vote me before he said a claim should be forced, thats for sure. ckool really should have vigged you.

Because I didn't vote you yesterday at all, right?

the fact that you voted me yesterday is irrelevant to this discussion. we're talking about today, and today is a whole new ballgame. today you didn't vote me until khan suggeted the town force a claim. today all you did was encourage hayker to attack me.

Well my opinion didn't change over night.

[iamausername]

-=Vote Count #39=-

roflcopter (2) - Kublai Khan, Kmd4390
Wickedestjr (1) - Xylthixlm
Hayker (1) - roflcopter

Not Voting (9) - Achilles, curiouskarmadog, Faraday, Hayker, Lowell, molestargazer, Namttam, SerialClergyman, Wickedestjr

7 to lynch.

[roflcopter]

your opinion didn't change despite the fact that the situation clearly has?

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, you don't think Mastin's flip affects your case at all?

I suck at seeing connections.

<I had a paragraph here explaining why Rofl is scum, and then realized it was a terrible argument, so that's gone>

Actually, if he is scum with Mastin, he made a terrible play or has another scumbuddy still alive. If he's scum opposing Mastin, he made a dumb move offering to be vidged. Fuck.

Unvote

.

[roflcopter]

so kmd, who's scum?

[Xylthixlm]

To be clear, do you mean this is a scumpoint against him OR do you mean that you aren't using this as reasoning why he is town.

Scumpoint against him.

Rofl, more organized version of my case that I found by viewing my own posts:
-lurked
-only went after easy targets
-predetermined who was votable a little early
-Declared Khan town on next to nothing, very early in the game
-buddies to Khan by giving him and award for "knowing what to do".
-Wrong on Mastin's vote. He called it OMGUS, not a policy miller vote.
-Takes the easy Mastin vote, apparently knowing his meta
-Comment on the NK
-threatened to vote MM over asking for reasons for your vote

I count 4 of the 8 points here are attacking roflcopter for thinking Kublai Khan was town (apparently correct) and Mastin was scum (definitely correct). And you think this doesn't have any effect on your case?

[Xylthixlm]

Crossposted yay.

[Faraday]

Nice activity

First off 3 men scum-teams seem likely to me, thus rofl as mastin's partner is something I'm in no way buying and any potential bussing would have to assume rofl is suicidal and pretty much ends his factions victory chances.

i suspect thats also why the obv vermillion nightkill hit ckool instead of hunting for opposing mafia. they need to save the opposing mafia now so they can look like they're honestly scumhunting in the day time.

I like this reasoning.

so basically one with 3 and one with 4. But who knows what the gm has in store for us really, this is all speculation. As of now, I think it unlikely for there to be a town bg.

Speculation, yes. Not useless though, as it's reasonable to assume a mafia with a doctor and rb'er wouldn't have 2 more members in a game this size with 2 scum factions.

Are uneven scum groups especially common? this seems a weird conclusion to jump to based on 1 vermillion flip.

I think the Ceruleans may have been planning to kill VP once Mastin was dead. Does anybody else think this?

I'm not sure what you mean here, we know this happened, so yeh I do think this.

This descision is based purely on gut. Rofl, you've convinced me to not be the best target for today, but don't think you're in the clear yet.

This rubs me the wrong way, not sure why but the 'warning' at the end is a bit odd.

Reasons I think roflcopter is town:
1) Defense of Kublai Khan
2) Attempts to get Mastin lynched
3) Attack on me (misguided)
4) Doing whatever it takes to kill scum

Reasons I'm not sure roflcopter is town:
1) Willingness to be vigged as a distraction

Re the reason you're not sure; he's getting shit now that he was right about mastin,, there's some weird potential bussing thing being mentioned that I find absurd, can you imagine what'd have happened if mastin hadn't been scum, he's probably right in that it would have taken up the whole day and led to a rofl lynch, so I can see why rofl town would see this as a good idea.

Vote Hayker

, I find him the scummiest of those posting, although would like achillies to post too. So second the prod request on him.

[roflcopter]

i think i've been forgetting something. did mastin ever claim to have blocked vp baltar? i know baltar was part of that fantasy scumteam he was trying to pitch us. if he was blocked by mastin that explains why its been so hard to find evidence of investigation results in his posts.

[roflcopter]

the idea that i would offer to be vigged as non-mastin-team scum if mastin flipped town without being 110% sure mastin was scum is absurd

[Faraday]

i think i've been forgetting something. did mastin ever claim to have blocked vp baltar? i know baltar was part of that fantasy scumteam he was trying to pitch us. if he was blocked by mastin that explains why its been so hard to find evidence of investigation results in his posts.

mastin claimed to have blocked KK and Lowell I think.

[Kmd4390]

-=Vote Count #28: The End of Day One Votecount=-

MafiaMann

(11) - SerialClergyman, Wickedestjr, roflcopter, Lowell, Faraday,

Empking's Alt

,

Mufasa

, Kmd4390,

VP Baltar

,

ckool5000

, Hayker

VP Baltar

(3) -

Kise

,

Mastin

, Namttam

Mufasa

(2) - curiouskarmadog, molestargazer
Kublai Khan (1) -

ZazieR

ckool5000

(1) - fallen angel

Not Voting (3) - Achilles,

MafiaMann

, Kublai Khan

There is scum on the MM wagon. Likely more than one. I remember voting because it was MM or no lynch, and Hayker voted later than I did. That means that we can find scum in the following list:
Serial
Wicked
Rofl
Lowell
Faraday

As I determined in my last post, Rofl is either town or dumb. I'd lean town. Serial has given me town vibes all game, but I'm going to remember that his name was here.

Wicked, Lowell, and Faraday are left as likely scum

. I'd say at least one of these 3 (4 including Serial) is scum. Probably even 2. Maybe 3, but that may be pushing it.

Nam voted VP. As did Mastin. I don't see scumbuddies voting together as 2nd and 3rd votes on a wagon of 3 players. Nam is more likely Vermilion than Cerulean.

CKD and Molest were alone in voting a known townie. Slight scum points, but not as much as the 11 player lynch wagon on a known townie.

FA (now Xyl) same thing, but even less than CKD and Molest.

I don't like Achilles not voting, although he has been rather inactive lately. And Khan is probably town anyway.

Summary of Day 1 analysis reads:

Scummiest:
Wicked
Lowell
Faraday

Scummy:
Nam
Molest
CKD

Keep an eye on, but nothing major:
Serial
Xyl
Achilles

Town:
Rofl
Hayker
Khan
Kmd

-=Vote Count #38=-

Mastin

(9) - curiouskarmadog, roflcopter, Kmd4390,

ckool5000, VP Baltar

, Xylthixlm, Wickedestjr, SerialClergyman, Kublai Khan
roflcopter (2) - molestargazer, Namttam
Hayker (2) - Lowell, Faraday

ckool5000

(1) - Hayker

VP Baltar

(1) -

Mastin

Kublai Khan (1) -

Empking's Alt

Not Voting (1) - Achilles

Mastin's wagon probably included one Vermillion. Again, I'm leaning town on Rofl. I know I'm town. I think Khan is town. That leaves this list:
CKD
Xyl
Wicked
Serial

Ok, so Serial is on both of those lists. So is Wicked. L-2 and L-1 votes, specifically. If they are both Vermillion, it means Xyl and CKD are likely town, especially CKD. Xyl could have bussed as Mastin was going down anyway, but I'm not so sure he'd have done so.

Molest and Nam were voting Rofl. No known alignment, but I do think he is town. This gets looked at the same way as the votes on Mufasa Day 1. Molest was on that too. Lowell and Faraday voted Hayker, which can be looked at the same way.

So, conclusions:
Vermilion is 2 of:
Wicked
Nam
Serial

Cerulean is 1 of:
Lowell
Faraday
Molest
Xyl

I'm going to ask Rofl and Khan. Which team does it benefit town to lynch? The last Cerulean or a Vermilion?

[Kmd4390]

so kmd, who's scum?

See my newly posted analysis.

To be clear, do you mean this is a scumpoint against him OR do you mean that you aren't using this as reasoning why he is town.

Scumpoint against him.

Why? As Mastin's buddy, he leaves himself alone as the last scum on his team facing 2 opposing scum, assuming 3 on each side. As Vermilion, he can't be THAT confident in Mastin's alignment and ends up fucking himself if Mastin is town.

[Lowell]

vote hayker

.

Is he kidding me? He was scummy as hell D1, all but disappeared, then came back immediately after the thread opens to say "ouch, bad day to be a citizen." Easy vote.

More in-debts thoughts coming when I get around to it. Specifically I want to look at those leading the mastin wagon, and those derailing it.

[Xylthixlm]

To be clear, do you mean this is a scumpoint against him OR do you mean that you aren't using this as reasoning why he is town.

Scumpoint against him.

Why? As Mastin's buddy, he leaves himself alone as the last scum on his team facing 2 opposing scum, assuming 3 on each side. As Vermilion, he can't be THAT confident in Mastin's alignment and ends up fucking himself if Mastin is town.

It was more I couldn't make sense of it from rofl-town, and roflcopter worries me when I can't figure out what he's up to. Faraday has convinced me that it was reasonable from rofl-town's POV.