Phables: Death Note Mafia (Game Over)

[Lamont_Cranston]

Why did you ask Kai and Kevin for their reads?

I see Kai, KMD & Zee on the opposite sides of an issue with Philly & Spoilum.

The issue revolves around death note speculation; specifically the way that death notes are used. The way that the issue is being discussed makes me feel

uncomfortable

.

I thought I would draw attention to it and see if it interests anyone else.

Votecount
Kise - 3 (mykonian, Starbuck, ortolan)
Spolium - 1 (Kmd4390)
Lamont_Cranston - 1 (magnus_orion)
mykonian - 1 (LlamaFluff)
Not voting: zwetschenwasser,

cateraction

, Kairyuu, Benmage,

ZazieR

, Jebus, populartajo, Budja, Gorrad, Albert B. Rampage,

semioldguy

, Kise, Seraphim, Stephoscope, ZEEnon, PhilyEc, Spolium, WeyounsLastClone, Lamont_Cranston

If you use your head, you won't get fat even if you eat sweets.

With 25 alive, it's 13 to lynch.

[Lamont_Cranston]

I wouldn't rule out Kise and LC pairing still. LC was quick to unvote based on nothing other than Zazier requoting what his original reason for voting Kise was. It's that or mykonian. I'll stick with Kise I think. He did enough that was scummy independently of LC.

Vote: Kise

Also, what's your response to this Lamont?

I have explained that I can see his case of terrible inconsistency but I do not see scum being able to do that intentionally and it is within Kise's meta to act such.

I actually pointed this out as he mentioned that he wouldn't rule out a Lamont - Kise pairing. And because he states that

your reason for unvoting was the same reason as you voted him for

.
Those are the reasons why I quoted this post from Orto, so it would be nice to see some responses to that.

Well I haven't agreed with everything Orto has said about me but I don't respond to every wrong statement that is made either.

Since you have brought it up, it

does

need some clarification.

Even a brief glance will show Orto's assertion to be false:

1) I voted him because (as scum) he is obviously setting up mislynches and responding incorrectly towards Mastin (as scum would not as town would).

2) I unvoted him because he cannot be scum using the criteria cited in #1 because:

a) He clearly has a reason for believing in Mastin's townliness (though a terribly flawed reason) and it is within his meta to believe that.

b) He clearly cannot be making that up which is 99% in line with his meta.

/fixed

Carry on.

[Lamont_Cranston]

Also, I just realised that you're talking about a lot of Kise meta. How many games is this meta based upon, and which?

It is based on one game that unfortunately ongoing (we are both dead). I have enough of a read of him in these two games to be certain of things about his level of play; i.e. this fits his meta.

[mykonian]

@orto. I asked Mastin if he had a deathnote, because of this reasoning:

Mastin is not a fool
Mastin claimed shinigami
shinigami could easily have a deathnote
claiming shinigami is practically a scumclaim.
because mastin is not a fool, he couldn't be hurt by the claim, and doesn't have a deathnote.

I ended the post with asking confirmation of my reasoning.

and I hoped, and think, that without Mastin, it is not that easy for scum to say that they can't read the posts, and just stay out of the thread.

@lamont. If I read you correctly, Kise more often doesn't understand the rules/plays a little weird, and it can't be that he uses it as an excuse for his mistake?

[Lamont_Cranston]

@lamont. If I read you correctly, Kise more often doesn't understand the rules/plays a little weird, and it can't be that he uses it as an excuse for his mistake?

Ya. I see his play in this game as 99.99% probable of being genuine.

I will point out that he

could

still be scum here but I just don't have a case on him any longer.

[Spolium]

I think those that can kill are the mafia teams: the one mello worked for and the organization that Light entrusted his death note to. In addition to this there are Death notes lying around belonging to SKs. If a mafia team kills someone with a death note, they gain the death note along with an additional kill.

I don't find this very likely due to the fact that our win conidition is the destruction of all death notes.

Think about it; if scum could kill without possessing a death note, why would the game end when the death notes are gone? Given that there are likely to be multiple death notes - all of which could potentially end up in the hands of mafia - I am willing to bet that the scum can't kill without them.

--

Mastin claimed shinigami
shinigami could easily have a deathnote

Further reason to consider Mastin's death being the work of scum.

claiming shinigami is practically a scumclaim

Please expand upon this.

--
I look back on Kairyuu's #477 with concern, principally because he didn't consider the possibility of a specified cause of death (for the uninitiated, this is a heavily-used plot device in Death Note). I cannot fathom why a townie familiar with the Death Note story would dismiss that hypothesis and can only presume there is an ulterior motive.

vote: Kairyuu

[Budja]

I find it unlikely that Mastin's death was deathnote related as he was shot. This would require control of the shooter which while possible seems much less likely than an ordinary kill.

I thought exactly the same as myk when I saw Mastin's claim. A shinigami with a death-note would be very foolish to claim.

I am pretty busy for the next few weeks (Exam period) and if the game continues at this pace, I won't be able to keep up. I have only really read up to page 8/9.

[Lamont_Cranston]

@Phily: You obviously aren't paying attention. According to the flavor in the first post, Mastin was shot. I would assume that means he was shot. The likelyhood of that being a Death Note kill is somewhat low.

@all: Trying to catch up. Not really succeeding.

Quote #477 for convenice of viewing.

[Spolium]

I thought exactly the same as myk when I saw Mastin's claim. A shinigami with a death-note would be very foolish to claim.

Why would a Shinigami with a deathnote be very foolish to claim, Budja?

[mykonian]

Mastin claimed shinigami
shinigami could easily have a deathnote

Further reason to consider Mastin's death being the work of scum.

claiming shinigami is practically a scumclaim

Please expand upon this.

I don't know what your wincondition is, but I want deathnotes to be destroyed. Lynching a person with a deathnote would generally do this. Claiming that you are likely to have a deathnote, means that you are a target of my win condition. as in: scum.

[mykonian]

I thought exactly the same as myk when I saw Mastin's claim. A shinigami with a death-note would be very foolish to claim.

Why would a Shinigami with a deathnote be very foolish to claim, Budja?

scumslip. Really, it won't get more obvious.

unvote vote Spolium

[ZazieR]

I thought exactly the same as myk when I saw Mastin's claim. A shinigami with a death-note would be very foolish to claim.

Why would a Shinigami with a deathnote be very foolish to claim, Budja?

scumslip. Really, it won't get more obvious.

unvote vote Spolium

Why is this a slip? (clarifiaction purposes, because if I think correctly what you mean, it's not)

[ZazieR]

Also, I just realised that you're talking about a lot of Kise meta. How many games is this meta based upon, and which?

It is based on one game that unfortunately ongoing (we are both dead). I have enough of a read of him in these two games to be certain of things about his level of play; i.e. this fits his meta.

Ok, I understand your unvote now.
However, meta that is based upon 1 game is not meta to me.

[ZazieR]

@orto. I asked Mastin if he had a deathnote, because of this reasoning:

Mastin is not a fool
Mastin claimed shinigami

shinigami could easily have a deathnote
claiming shinigami is practically a scumclaim.

because mastin is not a fool, he couldn't be hurt by the claim, and doesn't have a deathnote.

I ended the post with asking confirmation of my reasoning.

and I hoped, and think, that without Mastin, it is not that easy for scum to say that they can't read the posts, and just stay out of the thread.

@lamont. If I read you correctly, Kise more often doesn't understand the rules/plays a little weird, and it can't be that he uses it as an excuse for his mistake?

Bolded is unknown:

This game contains Shinigami. Shinigami are powerful, invincible neutral roles with unique win conditions. Shinigami cannot be lynched or killed. If they would be lynched, instead their rolename is revealed, they lose their Death Note if they possess one as per the rules above, and the game continues as normal (the day still ends). If they would be killed, the same is true except that their rolename is not revealed.

[ZazieR]

I look back on Kairyuu's #477 with concern, principally because he didn't consider the possibility of a specified cause of death (for the uninitiated, this is a heavily-used plot device in Death Note). I cannot fathom why a townie familiar with the Death Note story would dismiss that hypothesis and can only presume there is an ulterior motive.

vote: Kairyuu

Can you elaborate on this?

[mykonian]

I thought exactly the same as myk when I saw Mastin's claim. A shinigami with a death-note would be very foolish to claim.

Why would a Shinigami with a deathnote be very foolish to claim, Budja?

scumslip. Really, it won't get more obvious.

unvote vote Spolium

Why is this a slip? (clarifiaction purposes, because if I think correctly what you mean, it's not)

It doesn't seem to me that he understands that we have to destroy deathnotes, and if he was town, he would know that was his wincondition.

[mykonian]

@orto. I asked Mastin if he had a deathnote, because of this reasoning:

Mastin is not a fool
Mastin claimed shinigami

shinigami could easily have a deathnote
claiming shinigami is practically a scumclaim.

because mastin is not a fool, he couldn't be hurt by the claim, and doesn't have a deathnote.

I ended the post with asking confirmation of my reasoning.

and I hoped, and think, that without Mastin, it is not that easy for scum to say that they can't read the posts, and just stay out of the thread.

@lamont. If I read you correctly, Kise more often doesn't understand the rules/plays a little weird, and it can't be that he uses it as an excuse for his mistake?

Bolded is unknown:

This game contains Shinigami. Shinigami are powerful, invincible neutral roles with unique win conditions. Shinigami cannot be lynched or killed. If they would be lynched, instead their rolename is revealed, they lose their Death Note if they possess one as per the rules above, and the game continues as normal (the day still ends). If they would be killed, the same is true except that their rolename is not revealed.

based on the story, it wouldn't be weird that they would have a deathnote.

[ZazieR]

I thought exactly the same as myk when I saw Mastin's claim. A shinigami with a death-note would be very foolish to claim.

Why would a Shinigami with a deathnote be very foolish to claim, Budja?

scumslip. Really, it won't get more obvious.

unvote vote Spolium

Why is this a slip? (clarifiaction purposes, because if I think correctly what you mean, it's not)

It doesn't seem to me that he understands that we have to destroy deathnotes, and if he was town, he would know that was his wincondition.

Thought so already.
If this hasn't been mentioned before this post, you're definitly wrong.
If it has been mentioned before this page, you might be right, but I won't vote him for it.

[mykonian]

? I don't understand you...

[ZazieR]

@orto. I asked Mastin if he had a deathnote, because of this reasoning:

Mastin is not a fool
Mastin claimed shinigami

shinigami could easily have a deathnote
claiming shinigami is practically a scumclaim.

because mastin is not a fool, he couldn't be hurt by the claim, and doesn't have a deathnote.

I ended the post with asking confirmation of my reasoning.

and I hoped, and think, that without Mastin, it is not that easy for scum to say that they can't read the posts, and just stay out of the thread.

@lamont. If I read you correctly, Kise more often doesn't understand the rules/plays a little weird, and it can't be that he uses it as an excuse for his mistake?

Bolded is unknown:

This game contains Shinigami. Shinigami are powerful, invincible neutral roles with unique win conditions. Shinigami cannot be lynched or killed. If they would be lynched, instead their rolename is revealed, they lose their Death Note if they possess one as per the rules above, and the game continues as normal (the day still ends). If they would be killed, the same is true except that their rolename is not revealed.

based on the story, it wouldn't be weird that they would have a deathnote.

I don't remember all the names of the shinigami, but Misa's shinigami had given its Death Note to Misa, and that duck-like shinigami hadn't one as he came to the real world to look for its.
So not every shinigami had one.

[ZazieR]

? I don't understand you...

this

[Budja]

Well I losing their deathnote is most likely bad for a shinigami and the mod said shinigami may or may not have a deathnote.

Considering Mastin was encouraging attacks on himself, and the fact that being a shinigami isn't very pro-town by itself lead me to believe that Mastin had nothing to lose from a lynch, i.e no deadnote.

@Myk, how is Spolium's question a scumslip?

[Lamont_Cranston]

Well I losing their deathnote is most likely bad for a shinigami and the mod said shinigami may or may not have a deathnote.

Considering Mastin was encouraging attacks on himself, and the fact that being a shinigami isn't very pro-town by itself lead me to believe that Mastin had nothing to lose from a lynch, i.e no deadnote.

@Myk, how is Spolium's question a scumslip?

Yes, but that's the problem with Jackassery, it creates a

huge

WIFOM confusion problem for the town.

[Stephoscope]

My point was that you thought Mastin, Magnus and Lamont were all town. Yet, you only explained why you thought this about Lamont, not about the other two. So why didn't you felt the need to point out why you thought Mastin and Magnus were town?

And actually, I didn't know you had played Prisoner's Dilemma II. I was talking about Nasubi large theme. Now that I know you've played 2 large theme games before this one, I really don't like the 'newbie defence'.

I didn't "feel the need" to do anything in particular, I just caught up with the game and posted my thoughts. I got the strongest townvibes from Lamont, therefore I felt obliged to explain my thoughts on him in particular.

I don't have any specific posts to mention. If I found a scumtell somewhere, I would of course point it out. But what I'm saying is that I looked at the entire bodies of work to date, and found nothing of concern.

Nasubi was nothing like this. There were probably only half as many players. If you review my play here to date and compare this game to my others, it should be obvious why I said what I did.

[mykonian]

Well I losing their deathnote is most likely bad for a shinigami and the mod said shinigami may or may not have a deathnote.

Considering Mastin was encouraging attacks on himself, and the fact that being a shinigami isn't very pro-town by itself lead me to believe that Mastin had nothing to lose from a lynch, i.e no deadnote.

@Myk, how is Spolium's question a scumslip?

spolium seems not to understand that claiming you might have a deathnote gets you lynched. (= scumclaim)

zazie points out he did know it was the wincondition of the town, but his thinking there doesn't show that.