Mini 801- Kubrick Mafia (Over)

[cateraction]

Wait, which is it? Do you share his concern? Or do you think misspelling doesn't make a difference? Or do you believe my claim based on breadcrumbing I tried to do.

[BloodCovenent]

Wait, which is it? Do you share his concern? Or do you think misspelling doesn't make a difference? Or do you believe my claim based on breadcrumbing I tried to do.

1. I don't really think that misspellings make a difference.
2. i share his concern regarding your claim, and Orto's. It just seemed out of place, almost opportunistic.
3. I did notice that you bread crumbed, but the manor of your claim didn't seem to align. Maybe you're bread crumbing for something else that we don't know about yet. Since i think most everyone had the name Spartacus in their PM, bread crumbing for that almost seems unnecessary, or would have been. Of course, we didn't know that page 1. You seemed hesitant in your claim of Spartacus, as if you would get NK'd or lynched that day. That's why i'm slightly suspicious.

[cateraction]

I didn't know what it meant to claim Spartacus, I was just told that it might be advantageous to do it. I thought I'd give it a bit instead of blurting it out right away, but I bread crumbed in case something went wrong. I didn't know that everyone was Spartacus, and I think that's clear.

[BloodCovenent]

I didn't know what it meant to claim Spartacus, I was just told that it might be advantageous to do it. I thought I'd give it a bit instead of blurting it out right away, but I bread crumbed in case something went wrong.

I didn't know that everyone was Spartacus, and I think that's clear.

I agree with the bolded. It was never advantageous for you to do it. Orto said something along the lines of "all you spatacaians, claim now! Do it!" And that was after you claimed. before you claimed, no one said anything about whether or not you should claim it.

[AshMC1984]

Pads - I'm curious, why the unprompted claim in the first place?

[AshMC1984]

'Not having much time to read and post' doesn't work for me when it was a single line claiming a role that he didn't claim in his first post after the claim, but then tried to claim later on the same page.

I can buy this. Seems as good a place to start as any right now.

Vote: lazarusmoth

[Fishythefish]

cateraction is, of course, Spartacus. The misspelling in meaningless, the crumb is convincing.
On reflection, enough people have convinced me that they have the same (or practically the same) information on Spartacus that I think that all townies are Spartacans, and possibly all scum as well. If this is not the case, I no longer want to know- any role that is not Spartacus is probably pretty special. I think that the only thing, if anything, to be drawn from this episode is that non-Spartacans are likely scum.

[ortolan]

When I said I thought Blood and Ash very likely town, I meant Pads and Blood, the two spartacus claimants. However, I no longer believe this is a way to confirm people.
I strongly disagree all townies should claim spartacus. From the scum's pov, spartacus may well not exist (except, of course, that I am him). Spartacus is a likely protown role. So are his followers- ie. his fellow claimants. People with information about spartacus are likely to be protown. Everyone claiming spartacus negates this absolutely. I would strongly encourage any townie who does not have a good reason from claiming spartacus to refrain from doing so, or to withdraw their claim if they have claimed already.
lazurus posted immediately after the spartacus claim. I am surprised and suspicious at the lack of an immediate counterclaim here.

unvote, vote: lazurus

How appropriate that your name is Fishythefish, for that is exactly what you are doing.

1) Making a hesitant Spartacus claim in post 36

"hesitant"? What do you mean exactly?

2)

Suddenly urging everyone else to claim Spartacus in post 44

.

aaand...you have utterly failed to explain in any way why these actions are scummy.

This is along the lines of what I was thinking. For people who posted after this post by Fishy, however, it's a bit muddier. Still, there were some reactions to the Spartacus claiming that struck me as unnatural. Ortolan's Post 36 and Cateraction's Post 41, complete with misspelling of the Role Name, specifically.

for cateraction you've at least given a reason (albeit a weak one), but you have failed to explain what you found unnatural about ortolan's reaction.

However, it seems unlikely that we'll be able to find scum solely by figuring out who is not Spartacus, but it's as good of a place to start as any.

Um...no.

2. i share his concern regarding your claim, and Orto's. It just seemed out of place, almost opportunistic.

and why is this?

3. I did notice that you bread crumbed, but the manor of your claim didn't seem to align. Maybe you're bread crumbing for something else that we don't know about yet. Since i think most everyone had the name Spartacus in their PM, bread crumbing for that almost seems unnecessary, or would have been. Of course, we didn't know that page 1. You seemed hesitant in your claim of Spartacus, as if you would get NK'd or lynched that day. That's why i'm slightly suspicious.

All signs point to this paragraph being penned by inexperienced scum.

It was never advantageous for you to do it.

This makes me wonder about the contents of your role pm.

Orto said something along the lines of "all you spatacaians, claim now! Do it!"

No, I can assure you I didn't. "Everyone" picks out every player of the game, none of this "all you Sparticans" stuff.

I think that the only thing, if anything, to be drawn from this episode is that non-Spartacans are likely scum.

Why?

Vote: BloodCovenent

Obvscum.

[Empking]

The one where bandwagons start to form.

Vote Count 4

Lazurusmoth (4): Spolium, Fishy, Pads, Ash
Bloodcovenent (3): Cateraction, Muzzz, Ortolan
Ortolan (2): Skitzer, Lazurusmoth
Fishy (1): Archon
Not Voting (3): Bloodcovenent, Infinis,

7 to Lynch

[muzzz]

I completely agree with Ortolan's reply to BC. I'm 99% certain that BC did

not

get the same PM as I did. The same goes for Fishy and, by association, Ash. Lazarus just seems scummy.

Also, I have no reason to assume that people claiming Spartacus are more likely to be townies.

We should probably lynch Lazarus today. But before that, I'd like to bandwagon BC into a claim.

[Fishythefish]

I've not said that people who claim Spartacus are more likely townies. However, if there are some players who have no reference to Spartacus in their pm, I think the scum are more than averagely likely to be among those players.
When I asked for non-Spartacans to claim, I was of course explicitly asking for role related information. The attack of rolefishing, while technically true, does not really apply here- my request was completely explicit, and my logic there for potential claimants to agree or disagree with.
I fail to see the merit in bandwagonning BC for a claim. From my pov, there is a good chance that his Spartacus related info is the same as mine. He also claimed Spartacus second, and so almost certainly has a reference to spartacus in his pm. I can't see how his claiming could be protown except in the context of an impending lynch.

[BloodCovenent]

When I said I thought Blood and Ash very likely town, I meant Pads and Blood, the two spartacus claimants. However, I no longer believe this is a way to confirm people.
I strongly disagree all townies should claim spartacus. From the scum's pov, spartacus may well not exist (except, of course, that I am him). Spartacus is a likely protown role. So are his followers- ie. his fellow claimants. People with information about spartacus are likely to be protown. Everyone claiming spartacus negates this absolutely. I would strongly encourage any townie who does not have a good reason from claiming spartacus to refrain from doing so, or to withdraw their claim if they have claimed already.
lazurus posted immediately after the spartacus claim. I am surprised and suspicious at the lack of an immediate counterclaim here.

unvote, vote: lazurus

How appropriate that your name is Fishythefish, for that is exactly what you are doing.

1) Making a hesitant Spartacus claim in post 36

"hesitant"? What do you mean exactly?

2)

Suddenly urging everyone else to claim Spartacus in post 44

.

aaand...you have utterly failed to explain in any way why these actions are scummy.

This is along the lines of what I was thinking. For people who posted after this post by Fishy, however, it's a bit muddier. Still, there were some reactions to the Spartacus claiming that struck me as unnatural. Ortolan's Post 36 and Cateraction's Post 41, complete with misspelling of the Role Name, specifically.

for cateraction you've at least given a reason (albeit a weak one), but you have failed to explain what you found unnatural about ortolan's reaction.

However, it seems unlikely that we'll be able to find scum solely by figuring out who is not Spartacus, but it's as good of a place to start as any.

Um...no.

2. i share his concern regarding your claim, and Orto's. It just seemed out of place, almost opportunistic.

and why is this?

3. I did notice that you bread crumbed, but the manor of your claim didn't seem to align. Maybe you're bread crumbing for something else that we don't know about yet. Since i think most everyone had the name Spartacus in their PM, bread crumbing for that almost seems unnecessary, or would have been. Of course, we didn't know that page 1. You seemed hesitant in your claim of Spartacus, as if you would get NK'd or lynched that day. That's why i'm slightly suspicious.

All signs point to this paragraph being penned by inexperienced scum.

It was never advantageous for you to do it.

This makes me wonder about the contents of your role pm.

Orto said something along the lines of "all you spatacaians, claim now! Do it!"

No, I can assure you I didn't. "Everyone" picks out every player of the game, none of this "all you Sparticans" stuff.

I think that the only thing, if anything, to be drawn from this episode is that non-Spartacans are likely scum.

Why?

Vote: BloodCovenent

Obvscum.

I wasn't sure your claim was authentic. you show hesitance, and then you claim, and immediately say, all of you are pretenders. seems suspicious to me.

You say that post 76 points of inexperienced scum, how so?

when i said it was never advantageous, i meant that the town never deemed it advantageous, in fact, quite the opposite.

Post - 44

everyone claim Spartacus. Now. I mean it. Just do it.

why don't you read the thread before you post. because you most certainly did say this.

I disagree with fishy, i think everyone was given the initial role Spartacus, but it had no actual substance.

and Orto, didn't you accuse Fishy of role fishing? isn't that what you're doing now?

[muzzz]

After his most recent post, I am absolutely, positively, one-hundred-percent certain that BC is

not

a generic townie. If I figured it out than it's extremely likely that the scum did as well. So BC needs to claim before he gets NK'ed.

Do I need to be any more explicit?

[Fishythefish]

I missed what you were referring to in BC's second last post. With the latest post, it is much clearer. I support a BC claim, though this should of course not come until it has been further discussed.

[ortolan]

We should probably lynch Lazarus today. But before that, I'd like to bandwagon BC into a claim.

Why would you possibly want to bandwagon someone to a claim then lynch someone else? The only good reason for someone to claim is if they are otherwise going to be lynched.

if there are some players who have no reference to Spartacus in their pm, I think the scum are more than averagely likely to be among those players.

There is no reason to assume this, especially taking into account the experience of the mod, and whether or not the setup was reviewed (if you are correct that scum are more prevalent among the non-Sparticus claimers then that entails a somewhat unbalanced setup).

Mod: was the setup reviewed?

I wasn't sure your claim was authentic. you show hesitance, and then you claim, and immediately say, all of you are pretenders. seems suspicious to me.

Hesitance? What, saying "I'm not sure this is a good idea" but then doing it in the same post? How is that form of "hesitance" scummy?

You say that post 76 points of inexperienced scum, how so?

Perhaps that was a bit mean of me. Ok, deconstructing what you said in 76:

Wait, which is it? Do you share his concern? Or do you think misspelling doesn't make a difference? Or do you believe my claim based on breadcrumbing I tried to do.

1. I don't really think that misspellings make a difference.
2. i share his concern regarding your claim, and Orto's. It just seemed out of place, almost opportunistic.
3. I did notice that you bread crumbed, but the manor of your claim didn't seem to align. Maybe you're bread crumbing for something else that we don't know about yet. Since i think most everyone had the name Spartacus in their PM, bread crumbing for that almost seems unnecessary, or would have been. Of course, we didn't know that page 1. You seemed hesitant in your claim of Spartacus, as if you would get NK'd or lynched that day. That's why i'm slightly suspicious.

Point 1 was fine.
Point 2- "it just seemed out of place, almost opportunistic." Very vague language (often a scum-tell) and you fail to tell us how the claims were vague or opportunistic, and it is certainly not immediately apparent to me how they are

And I only just noticed this one upon my re-read. In post 35 you invite more people to claim. You already know at least one person seems to have the same desire to claim as you do, which should be odd enough for you. Having invited anyone else to claim, knowing the claim is already present for at least two roles, I do so in the very next post, then you claim I am scummy and/or opportunistic for doing so. This makes little sense.

Point 3:

3. I did notice that you bread crumbed, but the manor of your claim didn't seem to align.

Again, vague language. You don't tell us what exactly about his claim didn't align.

Maybe you're bread crumbing for something else that we don't know about yet.

The film itself is called "Spartacus". As far as I'm aware it's the only Kubrick film with gladiators in it (and one of the relative few Kubrick films I haven't seen alongside Barry Lyndon ). I don't see how the claim is particularly open-ended.

Since i think most everyone had the name Spartacus in their PM,

If almost everyone had it in their pm why did you specifically attack the people who claimed it third and fourth?

Since i think most everyone had the name Spartacus in their PM, bread crumbing for that almost seems unnecessary, or would have been. Of course, we didn't know that page 1.

You make a point only to immediately negate it. This whole passage is therefore meaningless filler.

You seemed hesitant in your claim of Spartacus, as if you would get NK'd or lynched that day. That's why i'm slightly suspicious.

Again, totally vague language. Exactly what about his claim was hesitant? Also, why do you say he, or indeed I are more hesitant to claim than say, the people who actually claimed chronologically after us?

[muzzz]

Why would you possibly want to bandwagon someone to a claim then lynch someone else? The only good reason for someone to claim is if they are otherwise going to be lynched.

"I'm 99% certain that the scum know what I am, so I'll just give you what little information I have before I get NK'ed and hope it makes a difference" is also a valid reason. At least in some situations.

But that aside, you're right in that we should lynch BC if he refuses the claim.

[ortolan]

Please don't call for claims until he has ~half the town voting for him

[BloodCovenent]

Here's my claim.

C

an you explain that a little more? How would this make my attack on Pads bogus? I honestly thought he was lying, but now i don't. I'm sure he was given the name Spartacus, but then again, who wasn't? And frankly, we got this out kinda early, which is almost surprising, and maybe even good. Imagine if we were 20 pages in.

O

f course, the way it looks right now, is that everyone, or almost everyone was given the name Spartacus. But each one has a specific role under that. So claiming Spartacus right now, is actually, and probably was pointless from the beginning. the only one that i don't know about, is Spolium. Thus why i Originally voted for him.

P

roblem is, we were all given the name Spartacus. I don't know why, i guess it was just to confuse us or something. So, my suggestion... is that we disregard the whole Spartacus debate, on who really is. We probably all are. But one person i didn't get, was Spolium.Like, i have no idea what Spolium is talking about, it doesn't sound like something from a Gladiator movie. Does anyone else have any history or knowledge of other Kubrick films?

[cateraction]

BC didn't get the same role as me, that's good enough for me to press him. Also, I agree with Orto, the vagueness and style of play are consistent with how I've seen BC play scum before.

[Fishythefish]

Here's my claim.

C

an you explain that a little more? How would this make my attack on Pads bogus? I honestly thought he was lying, but now i don't. I'm sure he was given the name Spartacus, but then again, who wasn't? And frankly, we got this out kinda early, which is almost surprising, and maybe even good. Imagine if we were 20 pages in.

O

f course, the way it looks right now, is that everyone, or almost everyone was given the name Spartacus. But each one has a specific role under that. So claiming Spartacus right now, is actually, and probably was pointless from the beginning. the only one that i don't know about, is Spolium. Thus why i Originally voted for him.

P

roblem is, we were all given the name Spartacus. I don't know why, i guess it was just to confuse us or something. So, my suggestion... is that we disregard the whole Spartacus debate, on who really is. We probably all are. But one person i didn't get, was Spolium.Like, i have no idea what Spolium is talking about, it doesn't sound like something from a Gladiator movie. Does anyone else have any history or knowledge of other Kubrick films?

I think it is sensible to ask BC to flesh this out with character name at least, and possibly with Spartacus information.

[BloodCovenent]

BC didn't get the same role as me, that's good enough for me to press him. Also, I agree with Orto, the vagueness and style of play are consistent with how I've seen BC play scum before.

Did you even read that whole game? Besides, i've only been scum in one game, i don't think that's enough meta for your evidence.

[cateraction]

That was pretty darn rash.

[BloodCovenent]

i don't know what to say, i was given the name Spartacus. I don't get the cop abilities until some special group recognized me, i don't know how they will, or what they have to do to recognize it. they must have some thing special in their given PM, that lets them know to look for me.

[ortolan]

Unvote

So your character is actually called Spartacus?

[Fishythefish]

Oh.... you really are Spartacus. I didn't really expect that tbh.