Open 143: Jungle Republic (Game Over!) before 787

[gorckat]

vote: AA23

So is that a for or against RVS or are you just buddying right from the start?

Vote count

nothing yet...

[dejkha]

Do you think it's scummy to say that an RVS shouldn't be conducted? What would you prefer as an alternative? Do any of you have interesting meta on other players?

Not necessarily. It could be a good alternative, since it may stir up discussion. I have a meta on Emp and Zwet. They both suck and should be lynched right off the bat, IMO. That doesn't keep me from discussing others behavior. But I'll "random" vote anyway.

Vote: Emp

[dejkha]

vote: AA23

So is that a for or against RVS or are you just buddying right from the start?

Is that a random vote or because it sounds like he's buddying to you?

[Mixologist]

I have a meta on Emp and Zwet.

Who doesn't?

vote zwet

Because I hear it's the thing to do.

[Percy]

WHY I THINK THE RANDOM VOTE PHASE IS AWESOME

In the random vote phase, everyone is looking at how everyone else works, with no good grounding on any good reads. Some people know each other, and are scumbuddies together. We want to find these people!
We can start by flinging accusations around (and most games start this way). They're lighthearted, the reasons are usually pretty lame, but hopefully we can start to see some personalities. If someone's personality appears to change later in the game, we have something to call them on!
We take our notes, but keep the search wide and make sure everyone gets a look-in.

Eventually, we'll get something weird, something good, something worth seriously investigating. We do that, and see how people react - do they like the proceedings? Do they participate, or shrink away? Before long people are screaming at each other, and we have to sort through the confusion, keep our heads and keep looking for the knowing glances between the scum.

This is how the day proceeds, whether we get out of the RVS sooner or later. But later is better - it's the best way to prepare us for the day. It generates content for everyone, and establishes personality reads that can be scrutinized later.

There, I've said it. I like the RVS, and I think it's a good thing to have. Do you disagree, Dust?

*glares at Percy*

*glares back*

Vote: Khamisa

[AshMC1984]

Do you think it's scummy to say that an RVS shouldn't be conducted?

Not necessarily.

What would you prefer as an alternative?

Something to trigger discussion like you have done seems fine.

Do any of you have interesting meta on other players?

I've never played with anyone in this game before as far as I recall.

Having said that...

Vote: Dust

How you gonna act?

[Dust]

@AA23- I agree with Gorckat. Take a position on the issue.

@Percy- So, yes, the RVS can accomplish what you posted. I think my way works faster than RVS. Is this method working sufficiently well?

@Ash- First, point out the irony between our names. Dust and Ash? Ha-ha~ Other than that, nope, don't really find it interesting. What's the reason behind the vote?

@Dej- For those of us who have never played with them before, explain why they're worth votes, that is, Empking and Zwet.

@Mixo- Are you only voting them because other people say to do so?

FoS: AA and Mixo

[Mixologist]

@Mixo- Are you only voting them because other people say to do so?

Why do you assume I'm following what other people say to do?

As far as your methodology, you can play your way and I'll play mine. I actually enjoy a little laughter and light-heartedness before I get all seriousface.

[AshMC1984]

What's the reason behind the vote?

Tongue in cheek. Thought it was obvious. No?

[AA23]

I think I made my position pretty clear in my post where I answered and chose not to put a vote down, guys lol - she's staying that way. Kind of glad someone brought it up actually, I recently played with others who had the same style and wanted to try it.

@Gorckat - - If you re-read my response, can you please explain how me answering a question exactly how it was asked is buddying up? I was asked about what my opinion on the matter was - my answer gave an opinion on both sides, and my choice was in the post itself (no vote).

@Dust - - That being said, why so quick to turn on someone that answered a question for you? Should we expect this lose/lose sentiment with everything you present to us? lol

@Everyone - - Why is meta being brought up so soon on Zwet and Emp? It's only fair to let each game be it's own, and they'll dig their own holes all by themselves (besides, as I understand it, Zwet has been trying to spruce up his gameplay, and successfully at that)

[AA23]

oooo - and Dust - - in your opening questions - - why start off with "is this scummy?" and hop right into asking us about interesting meta on other players? I was sitting there thinking Dejkha started it, twas you sir - - why the meta discussion so soon, are you trying to point us in a different direction off the bat?

[Mixologist]

...besides, as I understand it, Zwet has been trying to spruce up his gameplay, and successfully at that)

Yeah, just throw classical music somewhere into your argument and he'll probably hit us with a wall-o-text.

[AA23]

I'm sorry? Am I missing something?

[Empking]

Vote: Dust

Yes. Nothing. No.

[Dust]

@Mixo:

vote zwet

Because I hear it's the thing to do.

This indicated to me that you were just doing it for the sake of conformity. Is that the case, or no?

@Ash- Nah, that's what I was thinking. Was wondering if there was anything else to it, though.

@AA- Only trying to start discussion, in this case. Your answer seemed the most likely to provoke a more interesting discussion, considering you didn't really explain where you stood on the issue, even if you didn't vote. As for my opening post, the idea was two-fold: open up two routes of discussion, one in playstyle, one in meta, and follow them, whether alone or in tandem, into a proper-style debate. RVS and meta, in my experience, are two things most players can bring an opinion on to the table, and thus, we open up more opportunities.

Likewise, I didn't expect for everyone to just follow along and not 'random vote'. However, a random vote in the context of what I've said is entirely different than a 'random vote' in the context of a game where nothing is said against them. In a way, 'random votes' are now more viable for analysis and discussion, because they're significantly less random. Look at Dej and Mixo: from what I understand, those aren't random votes, and are totally serious, and as such, more viable for discussion. Fun stuff, eh?

@Empking- my twofold question to you is this:

1. Why?
2. Why is Dej so against your playing style, as can be attested to by his sig.

[Empking]

@Mixo:

vote zwet

Because I hear it's the thing to do.

This indicated to me that you were just doing it for the sake of conformity. Is that the case, or no?

@Ash- Nah, that's what I was thinking. Was wondering if there was anything else to it, though.

@AA- Only trying to start discussion, in this case. Your answer seemed the most likely to provoke a more interesting discussion, considering you didn't really explain where you stood on the issue, even if you didn't vote. As for my opening post, the idea was two-fold: open up two routes of discussion, one in playstyle, one in meta, and follow them, whether alone or in tandem, into a proper-style debate. RVS and meta, in my experience, are two things most players can bring an opinion on to the table, and thus, we open up more opportunities.

Likewise, I didn't expect for everyone to just follow along and not 'random vote'. However, a random vote in the context of what I've said is entirely different than a 'random vote' in the context of a game where nothing is said against them. In a way, 'random votes' are now more viable for analysis and discussion, because they're significantly less random. Look at Dej and Mixo: from what I understand, those aren't random votes, and are totally serious, and as such, more viable for discussion. Fun stuff, eh?

@Empking- my twofold question to you is this:

1. Why?
2. Why is Dej so against your playing style, as can be attested to by his sig.

Why what?
2. Because he's a really bad player.

(LOL at me not seeing the second page)

[Dust]

Why vote me?

Any reason why you think Dej is a bad player?

[dejkha]

@Dej- For those of us who have never played with them before, explain why they're worth votes, that is, Empking and Zwet.

Because they don't help town, they distract town away from our primary objective of finding scum by getting into arguments that won't back down from, and refuse to listen to reason. It's this playstyle that people know about and don't lynch them right away because you can never get an accurate read on them no matter what. Emp has always been that way, but Zwet wasn't always as bad. In fact, he's actively trying to set a meta for himself where everything is a null tell, so I encourage you all not to buy into it.

But my position is that if we were to leave them until endgame, it would be disastrous because you'd have to pick between a dumbass who might be scum, but can't tell(Zwet/Emp), or another player that may have evidence against them. The earlier they're both lynched the better. There's no advantage to having them in the game since they help scum regardless of their alignment.

I'm not blinded by them though, so if someone else catches my attention, I'll play my part like I should and pressure them and maybe vote for them as long as Emp and/or Zwet are soon to follow.

(besides, as I understand it, Zwet has been trying to spruce up his gameplay, and successfully at that)

I've heard that he's trying to also, but since he's continuing to be in nearly every one of my games, I can say that he's not successful nor does it even look like he's trying to change.

2. Why is Dej so against your playing style, as can be attested to by his sig.

Clearly you have not played with him, so it's only a matter of time before you see what I'm talking about.

[Empking]

Why vote me?

You're the scummiest player.

Any reason why you think Dej is a bad player?

Why would an old man be a bad football player?

[Dust]

@Dej- Wow, that's a pretty compelling argument. Let's see how they perform in this particular game though, before casting any die, so to speak.


@Empking- Alright, whatever you want to think. I don't, however, think your analogy applies. Tell me in Mafia terms why Dej is a bad player.

[dejkha]

Why would an old man be a bad football player?

Are you trying to say my bones are weak and I have a bad hip?

[dejkha]

@Dej- Wow, that's a pretty compelling argument. Let's see how they perform in this particular game though, before casting any die, so to speak.

After what must be 50+ games of playing the same crappy way, I doubt they'd change in this one.

[Empking]

@Dej- Wow, that's a pretty compelling argument. Let's see how they perform in this particular game though, before casting any die, so to speak.

Yay, my random vote turns out to have hit scum.

Dust: He acts scummy and refuses to hunt scum.

[Dust]

Wait, what? How is that remark scummy? Could you explain your reasoning?

Could you provide examples, Dej and Emp, of each other's ineptitude? Links to past games?

[dejkha]

I don't need to link to past games. He's the same in every game (I'm not kidding, choose any game he's been in and check it).