Mini 780 - Chosen - Game over

[Incognito]

Vote Count #4 of Day 1

hp [leaves] (3) <-~ Nuwen, ekiM, Albert B. Rampage
Nuwen (2) <-~ hp [leaves], q21
AceMarksman (1) <-~ springlullaby
Lawrencelot (1) <-~ Claus
q21 (1) <-~ AceMarksman

Not voting (1) <-~ Lawrencelot

With 9 alive, 5 will do it.

Saturday, May 16th at 7 P.M. EDT.

[AceMarksman]

ABR seems to have disapeared off the map. Going back and viewing his (scant) posts in isolation, he is looking quite scummy to me. All he has really done is parrot SL's vote of q21 because he "doesn't have anything to add to [sl's] amazing post." Then he randomly bandwagons the vote(s) on hp [leaves] without reason (and fails to give one even when I ask him about it)

I am also minorly suspicious of claus as well. Claus seems to be leading ABR (scumcoaching?) in a lot of his posts, including where he asks why ABR is "Agreeing with SL's bullshit." He also aknowledges ABR's lack of response to my question, but writes it off (and even gives it a slightly pro-town spin) as meta.

Vote: ABR
FoS: Claus

[AceMarksman]

In case this is needed:

Unvote, Vote: ABR

[AceMarksman]

Also notice how the hp [leaves] wagon was the one with the most suport at the time. Is this possible pushing for a quicklynch? Note, he put hp [leaves] at L-2.

[hp [leaves]]

Mod: V/LA until Saturday

[q21]

I'm starting to get pretty far behind in this game and won't have much time for the foreseeable future. As much as I hate to do this its probably for the better if I'm replaced.

Mod, please replace me

Replaced by populartajo. - Incog-Mod.

[Incognito]

Searching for a q21 replacement. hp [leaves]'s and Claus's V/LAs acknowledged. Prodding Albert B. Rampage.

[Incognito]

populartajo is in for q21 effective immediately. Thanks, tajo!

[ekiM]

Welcome, tajo!

Ugh, so hp has spent a week being completely useless and is now V/LA for another week. That's two thirds of D1 with no contribution or interaction. I don't like this situation at all, but I don't think we're gonna be lynching him for it.

Unvote

I'm liking Ace less and less in this game.

• 66: active-lurking trying to look pro-town without actually saying anything.
  
• 70, 72, 75: evasive responses to SL asking for suspects.
  
• 95: Votes for q21, contradicting his earlier reasoning.
  
• Ignored 96 and 97 where SL and myself question 95, preferring to...
  
• Move his vote to ABR in 101.

His reasoning looks very insincere to me---he's quite ready to abandon a position and move on, and is uninterested in engaging with questions or explaining his change of stance.

Vote: AceMarksman

[springlullaby]

I'm starting to get pretty far behind in this game and won't have much time for the foreseeable future. As much as I hate to do this its probably for the better if I'm replaced.

Mod, please replace me

Replaced by populartajo. - Incog-Mod.

For serious? This kinda make me want to revote q21 because it looks like scum panic. 5 pages, there is litterally nothing to catch up on!

My vote stays on Ace for now: the scumslip is the fact that he seems to be considering me to be town whereas he can't know were he town. Plus I don't understand what he doesn't understand in my asking him to name names in whom he thinks is scum, and whom he thinks is town.

[Nuwen]

I'm still comfortable with my lynch on HP [leaves]. He doesn't seem apologetic or mournful at all that he has missed (and will be missing) almost all of day 1. In the time he has spent playing, he has put forth zero scumhunting. He has made no effort to comment on contemporary events, answer questions/attacks. He hasn't even voted outside of the random stage. The correct pro-town play would have been to request a replacement before a

week long

V/LA in a game with three week deadlines. His behavior has been sufficiently anti-town enough to convince me that he's either scum or a town player that's playing towards the scum win condition instead of his own.

Q21 is replacing out of games en masse. Framing his replacement request as panic or a tactical withdrawal is suspect - I think a town player would have made the effort to click his recent posts to confirm that Q21 is replacing out of this game exclusively. Rather than eliminate all possibilities, however, Spring latched on to the most convenient scummy explanation.

[Lawrencelot]

Post 108 is pretty similar to my thoughts on Ace. Plus that he keeps avoiding to attack hp, which would be consistent with his other posts. I do wonder though where 109 comes from, could you quote that scumslip for me springlullaby? Because I haven't noticed it.

I'm still not that sure about q21. I'll wait for his replacement to catch up and then reconsider. But for now,

Vote: AceMarksman

.

[Lawrencelot]

For the record, this is lynch -2. Not that a quicklynch is likely with these V/LA's.

[ekiM]

Nuwen, I agree with what you're saying about hp; he's blatantly anti-town. If there was no other lynch target and enough people agreed, I would be OK with an hp lynch. However I think there are scummy players worth pursuing. What is your opinion on Ace and Lawrence?

Lawrencelot, are you planning on thinking for yourself at any point?

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'm V/L/A during the weekends and this is my finals week so I don't have a lot of time to post.

[AceMarksman]

My vote stays on Ace for now: the scumslip is the fact that he seems to be considering me to be town whereas he can't know were he town. Plus I don't understand what he doesn't understand in my asking him to name names in whom he thinks is scum, and whom he thinks is town.

I'm scum because I have a town read on you? How exactly does that work? As for naming names of who I think is scum, I think this quote speaks for it's self:

Vote: ABR
FoS: Claus

Newsflash: The people I vote and FoS are the people I think are scum.

As for town-seeming players: you and newen are playing a good town game, and ekiM hasn't given me anything to complain about. hp [leaves] is slightly scummy for his cronic lurking, law is leaning scum at the moment.

[Nuwen]

Re: The "slip" & Ace.

spring, I don't think you understand my position. I meant that if we carry on with this argument amongst ourselvs, then scum will start to lurk and let us kill each other. I'm starting to notice patterns of lurking from q21 and hp, so they are at the top of my suspect list at the moment. I would say q21 is more scummy than hp, because q21 started this entire argument in the first place. So,

Unvote, vote:q21

I'm trying to evaluate how likely it is for this to be awkwardness/newbishness because, well, I kinda expect scum to be better than that.

But bottom line is, it's one hell of a scumslip. So yeah, my vote is probably sticking, short of scum claiming scum.

Ace used plural pronouns such as "we" and "us" when he expressed an earlier opinion that the town was cannibalizing itself while scum lurked through the debate; I don't think his opinion that Spring is town constitutes a slip of known information. In fact, I find Spring's emerging pattern of contrived case material a bit disconcerting.

ABR, take a quick look at Spring's last two posts and tell us what you make of them

.

Here are Ace's past posts where he begins to lay out a we-arguing-town versus they-lurking-scum mentality:

(between Q21 and Nuwen)

I can't help but feel that this argument is between two players of the same alignment, either both scum or both town. I'm thinking both town atm.

(ABR, Claus, Lawrence, and Spring enter the foray)

What started as a theory discussion has turned into a heated argument. I don't like the feeling I'm getting from all of this. I think scum lurking at the moment, trying to get us to kill each other off.

So it isn't a great stretch to believe that the quote Spring calls a "slip" is a continuance of the above:

spring, I don't think you understand my position. I meant that if

we carry on with this argument amongst ourselvs

, then scum will start to lurk and let us kill each other. I'm starting to notice patterns of lurking from q21 and hp, so they are at the top of my suspect list at the moment. I would say q21 is more scummy than hp, because q21 started this entire argument in the first place. So,

Unvote, vote:q21

What I find anti-town about Ace

(and irritating to boot)

is his past reluctance to name his lurking suspects individually. Learning that he believes q21 and HP are likely scum (with Q21 more likely to be scum) was worse than pulling teeth. However, in a gut-based personality read, I think his hesitation stems from being unsure or self-conscious unwillingness to present "only" a lurker case. He's still in my

neutral

list of gut reads.

As for town-seeming players: you and newen are playing a good town game, and ekiM hasn't given me anything to complain about. hp [leaves] is slightly scummy for his cronic lurking, law is leaning scum at the moment.

Why is Lawrence leaning scum? Besides cursory comments about ellipsis, this is the first time you mentioned him.

[AceMarksman]

@ law leaning scum: he jumped on my bandwagon here based on gut right at the moment my wagon is picking up steam. He then unvotes me (when my wagon is cooling off), promising a case (which has not come yet), and the re-votes me once my bandwagon picks up steam again. He hasn't made much of a case against me. He's being really opportunistic.

[Nuwen]

Re: Lawrencealot

What I do find scummy is q21, Claus, and Ace's behaviour.

q21 mostly because I disagree with everything he says

, Claus for his first reaction to 'theory discussion' and his latest post, though in both these players I might be biased, I'm not going to vote anyone just because I think they're wrong.

This is the item standing out to me from Lawrence. Disagreement, especially about theory (or how useful theory is, which ironically constitutes a theory discussion unto itself) is not a reliable scum tell. I understand that Lawrence's reads are primarily gut-based and there might be currently-unknown reasons for his suspicions besides patent disagreement.

[populartajo]

Im here rereading.

[Incognito]

Bump.

[Claus]

Back from my trip. I'll re-read and post later.

[springlullaby]

Q21 is replacing out of games en masse. Framing his replacement request as panic or a tactical withdrawal is suspect - I think a town player would have made the effort to click his recent posts to confirm that Q21 is replacing out of this game exclusively. Rather than eliminate all possibilities, however, Spring latched on to the most convenient scummy explanation.

Lol, no. There was nothing in what q21 said that made me suspect he replaced out of more than 1 game, so I didn't even think of verifying. However, I didn't bother voting him either because if replacing out tend to make people look scummy, it is generally a crapshoot call at best.

Nuwen, a couple of questions:
1. What do you think is contrived in what I have posted so far?
You have criticised my Ace vote, and my Ace vote only (whereas you have implied plural in 'contrived cases"). But from what you are saying you seem to disagree on me on 'gut read' - this doesn't tie in with you saying that my case is contrived.

2.How familiar are you with ABR's meta and what do you think of Ace's vote and FOS on ABR and Claus?
My thoughts on it is that it is very cliché and easy. I don't see Claus/ABR interraction as coaching, more as two people familiar with each others meta - which is a nulltell at best.

Fixed a quote tag. - Incog-Mod.

[springlullaby]

Sorry mod, broken tags again :c

[populartajo]

Tonight. I promisse.