Mini #764: Notre Dame Mafia, Game Over

[Kast]

Hmm. I'm not sure if DGB actually claimed any of her picks, but since I passed them to her, I know that the second and third are not Rats.

[Kinetic]

However, charter's speculation strikes at the heart of one of my outstanding questions to you; why did you choose to CLAIM your night 1 action? Nobody was pressing you to claim whether you used a plague (or anything else for that matter). I'd like to hear a reason for why you thought it would help the town to make that unprompted claim.

Charter has proposed a reason why Kinetic as scum would want to make that claim (hides your real night actions, sets up to "prove" that you did not plague any players other than CTD on Night 1).

Because I did... I noticed it, I even went so far as to double check that he was my target because I was surprised.

I initially made CTD a conditional target and intended to go back, look over the thread, and maybe change it, but stuff came up and since I disappeared it was taken as my target.

Plus I already said previously I would claim my target after they died, I didn't expect them to die from something that wasn't my plague though. On Day 3 my target would have been asked for and if I said CTD then I'd have these questions (and maybe more) coming then.

Figured I'd just get it out of the way and we'd move on, I honestly didn't think it would be this big of a deal.

[AceMarksman]

It's a big deal because CTD was a very pro-town feeling player. I see no town motivation behind plaguing him.

[Kast]

@Kinetic-
To be clear, your reason for

USING

the plague on Night 1 is that you felt scum would be immune to plague on any future night?

To be clear, your reason for using the plague on

CTD

is that you felt the Budja lynch must have at least one scum, and you felt CTD was the most likely scum out of the seven players on the wagon.

Also to be clear, your reason for

CLAIMING

your night action is that you were afraid that people would be suspicious if you claimed on Day 3.

Is all of that correct?

[Kast]

I initially made CTD a conditional target and intended to go back, look over the thread, and maybe change it, but stuff came up and since I disappeared it was taken as my target.

Wait...I don't think I follow this part exactly.

Does this mean you told PJ to use your Plague card against CTD unless you told him otherwise (and then you were gone so you never told him otherwise)?

If that is a correct understanding of what you posted, at what point in time did you decide on CTD as your target?

What made you decide on him as a target?

[Kinetic]

@Kinetic-
To be clear, your reason for

USING

the plague on Night 1 is that you felt scum would be immune to plague on any future night?

To be clear, your reason for using the plague on

CTD

is that you felt the Budja lynch must have at least one scum, and you felt CTD was the most likely scum out of the seven players on the wagon.

Also to be clear, your reason for

CLAIMING

your night action is that you were afraid that people would be suspicious if you claimed on Day 3.

Is all of that correct?

That is part of the reason but not the only one. There were other motivations as well, such as I said I was going to use it Night 1. If someone was to kill me holding onto it would be useless. Pretty much all the reasons I gave night 1...

On two, yes, based on my limited knowledge I felt that CTD could be the scum and he was my best guess.

Three, not exactly the only reason. My primary reason was I said I would and I thought it was interesting that he was killed which I have mentioned before. That reason was more something I thought after the fact when I said "If people are getting this bent out of shape today, just imagine what they would think if I'd claimed tomorrow".

I initially made CTD a conditional target and intended to go back, look over the thread, and maybe change it, but stuff came up and since I disappeared it was taken as my target.

Wait...I don't think I follow this part exactly.

Does this mean you told PJ to use your Plague card against CTD unless you told him otherwise (and then you were gone so you never told him otherwise)?

If that is a correct understanding of what you posted, at what point in time did you decide on CTD as your target?

What made you decide on him as a target?

Yes.

The day closed, I knew I needed to send in a target with a card or one would be randomized, I took about 5-10 minutes to pick a target on the first day of the night with the intent to come back and maybe switch it.

And how many times do I have to answer that question?

I've said my peace, at this point I'm done. I've answered 20 different times as honestly as I can, but now you're asking the same questions over and over. If you have anything else to ask I'll try to answer it but I'm not answering the same question I've already answered again.

[Rishi]

Wow. A lot of reading. You guys really need to post less often. I've said this before in this thread, but if you want to people who are less active to post more, you all have to post less. Counterintuitive, I know.

A couple things left over from yesterday and from today. I don't understand why people are going after DGB. I'm sure a lot of you have played with her before, and her aggressive style isn't anything unusual. Plus, I find it really hard to believe she would have defended Budja so vehemently, even towards the end of the day if she knew he was going to flip scum. Maybe that's WIFOM.

Here's a point against zwet that no one has really brought up. The reason I felt like I had to drop the hammer is that zwet disappeared the day of the deadline. He generally posts at least 5-6 times a day, and had not posted at all in the 36 hours or so before deadline. In fact, I don't think he ever really gave an opinion on Budja on Day 1. This seems like a good way to avoid hammering your scumbuddy.

Vote: zwet

[DrippingGoofball]

vote: zwet

[ortolan]

I will post some other stuff later, but DGB:

on a scale of 1-100%, how sure are you that I am scum? be totally honest. 100% means it is metaphysically impossible for me not to be scum, in your view.

If you now think zwet is more scummy than I (as would be implied by your vote), please also answer this question for zwet.

[DrippingGoofball]

I will post some other stuff later, but DGB:

on a scale of 1-100%, how sure are you that I am scum? be totally honest. 100% means it is metaphysically impossible for me not to be scum, in your view.

Despite your uber scummy actions, there was something in your tone that sounded town. Though I reckon Budja had me completely fooled, tone-wise. So maybe I should not let players pull at my heartstrings, it's not that trustworthy.

If you now think zwet is more scummy than I (as would be implied by your vote), please also answer this question for zwet.

His cards are scummy. He will plague townies. He is lurking hard by zwet standards.

I don't know.

Now that you ask me the question, I think you're scummier than zwet, still.

And Kinetic doesn't smell right, either.

So sorry, no, I can't put numbers and I could change my mind.

There are 3 players I'd be willing to lynch.

Yeah I might go back to voting you later today. I have to think this through but I'm seeing a RL client most of the day.

[ortolan]

So, basically, you're leaving the door open to lynch either me or zwet, and when/"if" we flip town, lynch the other. Then Kinetic will probably become obv-scum and what'd'ya know you just endgamed.

It's very, very transparent I'm afraid.

I am still more than happy to be lynched today if DGB is lynched the next day if I flip town. Does anyone have any objections to this plan?

[charter]

FOS Rishi. Entirely ignored giving an opinion on ortolan.

[ortolan]

I am still more than happy to be lynched today if DGB is lynched the next day if I flip town. Does anyone have any objections to this plan?

charter. please comment.

[charter]

Well, last time I followed your "listen to me and kill me if I'm wrong plan" and I vigged you and it didn't work out very well. I would rather determine who is scum without having to lynch townies first. Why cant you try and get DGB lynched without dying first? No one is going to listen to the last thoughts of a dying townie, it never happens, so I would prefer not lynching you if you are town.

[ortolan]

Well, last time I followed your "listen to me and kill me if I'm wrong plan"

This is not the same thing and it's not like I had a choice in that game, anyway. Your response is noted, though.

Why cant you try and get DGB lynched without dying first?

Duh. Who do you think I'm voting for?

I don't think you ever explained why I became so obv-scum as soon as today began. When I re-read, at a certain point you were

very

sure of Budja's alignment yesterday. How come you didn't make the connection that I was scum even then?

Another question: If I were lynched today and flipped town, would you think DGB was likely to be scum? If not, who else?

[charter]

You are obvscum because the entire day yesterday, you always said you were suspicious of Budja, but your vote was always on someone else, and you were always pushing a case on someone else. Then at the very end of the day, you switched to Budja. True your actions could have come from town, but it looks very very bad for you.

How come you didn't make the connection that I was scum even then?

Because obviously I wasn't sure. I said you were 100% scum today, but I'm not even voting you anymore. Not 100% sure either..

Another question: If I were lynched today and flipped town, would you think DGB was likely to be scum? If not, who else?

Honestly, I would think Kinetic is scum because of his cards and card usage. It would mean one of the scum has a rat card. DGB could be scum, but I'm not going to blindly lynch her because we lynched you and you were town.

[ortolan]

Well, last time I followed your "listen to me and kill me if I'm wrong plan" and I vigged you and it didn't work out very well. I would rather determine who is scum without having to lynch townies first. Why cant you try and get DGB lynched without dying first? No one is going to listen to the last thoughts of a dying townie, it never happens, so I would prefer not lynching you if you are town.

Actually, I'm gonna need clarification on this too. Do you think I am scum, or misguided townie. You have never suggested anything but the former this game. So it is odd that you would just out of the blue say you don't trust my (and CTD's) read on DGB, even if I am town.

[charter]

At the beginning of the day, I thought you were scum, now I'm not sure.

It's not that I don't trust dead townies read's, but I don't agree with blindly listening to them. It's possible they are wrong. I would rather be able to follow what they say and be able to agree with it, and then vote. I don't really know what the case against DGB is though, other than trying furiously to get someone but Budja lynched yesterday.

[ortolan]

But that is the same as your case against me? (in fact your case against me is weaker)

[ortolan]

and that's not the only reason DGB is scum anyway, I will probably do a post on her tomorrow then you can tell me exactly which parts you object to

[petroleumjelly]

Day Two: Vote Count #3

3 ortolan (AceMarksma, zwetschenwasser, Kast)
3 zwetschenwasser (Kinetic, Rishi, DrippingGoofball)

1 DrippingGoofball (ortolan)
1 Kinetic (ac1983fan)

With

10

alive, it takes

6

to lynch, and

4

to lynch at deadline. Deadline is May 9, 9:59 pm CDT.

Not Voting – 2 – charter, Looker

[charter]

Also, Looker needs to make some substancial posts, preferably give opinions on several players and why he holds those. That player slot has said barely anything the entire game, which is disastrous if he's scum.

[AceMarksman]

charter, why aren't you voting anyone? you seem to be adamant about the ortolan lynch, so why is your vote not there?

[charter]

If you read my posts, you'll find I'm currently unsure on an ortolan lynch. I am waiting for his DGB case.

[AceMarksman]

Bah I'm stupid. I posted that and then saw the post where you said you would hear ort out.