War in Heaven II - Spirit of Vengeance (Over!)

[DrippingGoofball]

We HAVE to follow the plan. I never said dont follow the plan...

But the plan has you being next in line for elimination. Are you fighting it? I'm not being facetious, I really don't quite understand what you're trying to accomplish.

...and then they are trying to kill me which at the same time Im obv town.

But that's the plan... if it was up to me, copter would go before you... and now out of the blue you think that copter, who has been uber-scummy all game, is more scummy than Yos who has just replaced. And yet, if we follow the plan, Yosarian will die in due time... quite possibly before sunday, before the scum gets new rage points. So I'm not sure what you want, and what difference it makes anyway, since the end point is the same. The only difference might be if we stall and the scum get more rage point. No???

[populartajo]

We HAVE to follow the plan. I never said dont follow the plan...

But the plan has you being next in line for elimination. Are you fighting it? I'm not being facetious, I really don't quite understand what you're trying to accomplish.

...and then they are trying to kill me which at the same time Im obv town.

But that's the plan... if it was up to me, copter would go before you... and now out of the blue you think that copter, who has been uber-scummy all game, is more scummy than Yos who has just replaced. And yet, if we follow the plan, Yosarian will die in due time... quite possibly before sunday, before the scum gets new rage points. So I'm not sure what you want, and what difference it makes anyway, since the end point is the same. The only difference might be if we stall and the scum get more rage point. No???

dgb, two things:

a) I still think yos-rolf is a likely scumpair and Ive always thought that since many pages ago but if we assume rolf is scum, then we dont want he working for scum, we want he working for us, right? Anyways, it doesnt matter what we think about him right now, since at the end I trust you and q21 will make a fair call about him.

b) the plan assumes that we kill scummy player A and then go with kill scummy player B and then with scummy player C. If A is town and B and C are scum, do you think B and C are likely to follow the plan, or would they likely hurt townies?

c) the plan on q21 is good and now its our only chance to win but killing me and having yos and prob fire alive is going to lead to a hurt race that we know town cant win. Therefore, there wont be more plan. However, if you keep me alive and have Yos and Fire in the same L-1 situation, the chances that scum are messing with the plan will be low. You'll only need one hurt to kill them. I just want to say that I have been pro town all the game, my plans are NOT a way to give scum auto-wins and Im doing my best to prove Im town. Please, think in that.

Love
Alpaca Tajo.

[Yosarian2]

No, you are scum for other reasons.

Reasons you continually refuse to actually, like, give.

We HAVE to follow the plan. I never said dont follow the plan..

Yes, you did. The "let's massclaim and then put a bunch of people to lynch -1 while the scum keeps raging us all to death" plan is completly different from q21's plan, and your plan would cause a town loss, guarneteed.

Also; why do "we HAVE to follow the plan" when you were just saying a few pages ago that the plan would cause a town loss? Really feels like you're just grasping at straws here, tajo...

What Im preventing is the extremely likely scenario of all scum alive against q21-Nuwen/rolf and DGB. If you and Fire are scum, you wont obviously hurt each other and start a damage race against the three prob townies alive.

Ok, so convince us that fire is scum and you're not. Or convince me that we should lynch rofl today instead of you. Or something. You know, play mafia, try to lynch the scum, all that; basically, the exact opposite of what you've been doing since I joined the game.

I think this is the scum plan and this was all the time since they first killed fonz which was obv town and then they are trying to kill me which at the same time Im obv town.

I need to go back and count how many times you've called yourself town while giving no reasons at all for it in the last 20 pages. You've probably set a new record.

I really think you are better than this, yos...

I think that you're better then this; I think if you were town, you would actually be scumhunting, or defending yourself, or proposing good plans, or something. All you're doing is to keep suggesting new plans that would screw the town, repeately contradicting yourself, finding weak excuses to attack me and rofl, and refusing to answer questions or respond to anything.

[populartajo]

No, no, Yos, too much stalling.
We need you, me and Fire at L-1.
That way we cant kill all the remaining scum and me at the same time.
Who do you think is town and scum?

[Yosarian2]

No, no, Yos, too much stalling.
We need you, me and Fire at L-1.

Um...putting us at lynch -1 IS stalling; we should just be killing the scum instead of playing games with the hit points, we don't have that kind of time to screw around.

That way we cant kill all the remaining scum and me at the same time.
Who do you think is town and scum?

At this point, if there are 3 scum, I think the most likely scenerio is you are scum, nuwen is scum, and fire is scum.

If you are town, then that would probably have to mean...I don't know what that would mean. ROFL scum+Nuwen scum? Or perhaps ROFL scum+Nuwen scum+fire scum? I donno. I have trouble coming up with a likely scenerio that involves you being town.

[DrippingGoofball]

We need you, me and Fire at L-1.

That's what, almost 20 hurts? Most of us are spent for today.

The plan called for players to be eliminated from scummiest to least scummy, not for putting a bunch of players at L-1. It's the same, only slower, and with one point fewer per player!

[populartajo]

We need you, me and Fire at L-1.

That's what, almost 20 hurts? Most of us are spent for today.

The plan called for players to be eliminated from scummiest to least scummy, not for putting a bunch of players at L-1. It's the same, only slower, and with one point fewer per player!

yes but if im dead, fire and yos wont hurt each other, they'll hurt you and q21.
if im alive, youll save hit points for me and ill use my hurts to bring these players (or at least one of them) closer to death, meaning that when Ill be dead it will be easier for you to control them.
anyways, why i am considered the most scummy of the three alive?

[populartajo]

No, no, Yos, too much stalling.
We need you, me and Fire at L-1.

Um...putting us at lynch -1 IS stalling; we should just be killing the scum instead of playing games with the hit points, we don't have that kind of time to screw around.

That way we cant kill all the remaining scum and me at the same time.
Who do you think is town and scum?

At this point, if there are 3 scum, I think the most likely scenerio is you are scum, nuwen is scum, and fire is scum.

If you are town, then that would probably have to mean...I don't know what that would mean. ROFL scum+Nuwen scum? Or perhaps ROFL scum+Nuwen scum+fire scum? I donno. I have trouble coming up with a likely scenerio that involves you being town.

Im town that means you are scum, right yos?

[DrippingGoofball]

yes but if im dead, fire and yos wont hurt each other, they'll hurt you and q21.
if im alive, youll save hit points for me and ill use my hurts to bring these players (or at least one of them) closer to death, meaning that when Ill be dead it will be easier for you to control them.

I think I see what you're taking about, at last.

So, what you're saying is that instead of killing off players right now, we leave you alive, and bring Firestarter and Yosarian to low HPs. Although, if they're scum, they're going to lie, and say that they have low HP when they might have higher HP.

anyways, why i am considered the most scummy of the three alive?

Not by me. I consider copter the scummiest player alive, but I'm not getting any traction. I don't understand why you changed your mind about him in the past couple of pages. Quite a turnaround.

[Yosarian2]

Im town that means you are scum, right yos?

Pfft, like I'm going to be scared off by something like that. Been around the block too many times to be scared off a good wagon by that kind of scum tactic, tajo...

Either you're scum, or one of our other assumptions is incorrect. (the other assumptions being; there are exactally 3 scum; one and only one of the serephem is scum; q21 is town; dgb is town) Out of all those assumptions, the two I'm least confident about are the "there are exactally 3 scum" one and the "one and only one of the serephem are scum" one. Still, I think there's about a 90% chance you're scum based on the setup information we have, higher because of your scummy behavior.

[populartajo]

Different stances towards rolf

On a different note, Rofl feels quite town to me, in his own way.

Alright Xyl, I don't believe Rofl should be able to be acting as unilaterally as he is. I've been saying all game I don't believe in unilateral action, and I'll stand to it.

I'm not tolerating anything unilateral. Heal Xyl right now to make up for Rofl's work.

I totally disagree that Rofl is obvtown. He's been doing nothing but undermining our attempts at organization this entire game, and pretty much arranged all on his own for Kinetic to get killed by Rage Points.

ORLY?

I don't recommend healing Walt. We need to see his flip, and I'm proposing this as a new policy. Everything up to now would be exempt.

This was when Walt Seraph Town was obv town. Of course you want to see him dead, scum.

I'm glad people finally have common sense and are using the system. Those against the system are the least town among us, as they represent a willing disapproval of a method created by an incredibly pro-town player *Tajo*, and seek to undermine his attempts at restoring order to the town.

Hm, well, judging by my presence on Tajo's big, all-caps list of Non-Town players, I suppose at the very least I should follow his instructions, that I might work towards validating myself in his eyes.

Kay, good to know. But things change drastically when Xyl was the lynch of the day. These all posts fell extremely dumb and fabricated, like he knew Xyl was town and wanted to stay away of the lynch and make me look bad.

Tajo, seriously, that's not an argument I can accept. I want to make the right choice for the town, and taking your word for it isn't something I cant just do.

We're close to death and doom and fire and brimstone at the hands of the scum.
I don't see how protecting the Ophan from a scum rage kill is anti-town though! Is that it? Is that really all?

Hi, everyone, replacing in.
I'll try to get caught up as quickly as possible. Until then, anything urgent I need to know or need to do?

This was the first time you reading the thread and you know that there is something urgent you need to know?

Page 22:
I thought populartajo’s stratagy suggestions sounded reasonably pro-town when he first made them, but it’s really starting to seem like he’s just repeating his stratagy argument over and over again while not hunting for scum at all. Fos:tajo

This is false. I was on the players that hunted shinnen and called her obv scum since day 1.

q21: Interesting. I'm not really sure why you first hurt Nuwen and then unloaded your firepower onto Albert, though.

last try to make q21 look bad before he becomes prob confirmed town. Also, I love how yos didnt protect ABR when he thought he was obv town and he even asked if he was at L-1.

Hmm...I did a quick skim of Fonz's posts, and wasn't impressed by most of what he's done since the Shin lynch. We're about to go out to the grocery story in a few minutes, and I should probably use my hurt first .

Hurt:Fonz

But after this, we need to get rid of Tajo.

Setting up mislynches, huh? With NO CASE on him and you havent even read the thread entirely.
Then it all comes garbage attacks that make no sense to answer since Yosarian is TWISTING my words every time he can and trying to make me look bad.
Also, have you already answered this?
WHEN THE FUCK DID I SAY THAT NUWEN AND ROLF HAVE TO BE SCUM TOGETHER?

[populartajo]

yes but if im dead, fire and yos wont hurt each other, they'll hurt you and q21.
if im alive, youll save hit points for me and ill use my hurts to bring these players (or at least one of them) closer to death, meaning that when Ill be dead it will be easier for you to control them.

I think I see what you're taking about, at last.

So, what you're saying is that instead of killing off players right now, we leave you alive, and bring Firestarter and Yosarian to low HPs. Although, if they're scum, they're going to lie, and say that they have low HP when they might have higher HP.

anyways, why i am considered the most scummy of the three alive?

Not by me. I consider copter the scummiest player alive, but I'm not getting any traction. I don't understand why you changed your mind about him in the past couple of pages. Quite a turnaround.

DGB, please read point 1 in post 4001.
If what we are assuming is right, Yos and Fire have to be scum too. Its probable once is the Fallen Arel. The other is prob a Cherub. Thats why massclaiming when all people left are in their majority scum was a good plan.

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB, please read point 1 in post 4001.
If what we are assuming is right, Yos and Fire have to be scum too. Its probable once is the Fallen Arel. The other is prob a Cherub. Thats why massclaiming when all people left are in their majority scum was a good plan.

Yes, I got that.

[Yosarian2]

Different stances towards rolf

On a different note, Rofl feels quite town to me, in his own way.

Alright Xyl, I don't believe Rofl should be able to be acting as unilaterally as he is. I've been saying all game I don't believe in unilateral action, and I'll stand to it.

I'm not tolerating anything unilateral. Heal Xyl right now to make up for Rofl's work.

I totally disagree that Rofl is obvtown. He's been doing nothing but undermining our attempts at organization this entire game, and pretty much arranged all on his own for Kinetic to get killed by Rage Points.

ORLY?

So...he thought rofl was obvtown, then he was unhappy about rofl taking unilareral action, and then finally, after Kinetic died due partly to ROFL's unilateral damage, he thought rofl was scummy?

That's not exactally inconsistant, you know...looks more like a perfectly normal changing of the mind based on new information.

Hi, everyone, replacing in.
I'll try to get caught up as quickly as possible. Until then, anything urgent I need to know or need to do?

This was the first time you reading the thread and you know that there is something urgent you need to know?

Um; I knew it was a speed game, I knew it had gotten to 145 pages in only a few weeks, and I knew that every town person had a chance to do a point of damage once every 24 hours from my role PM. You really think that's an unreasonable question, to check if there was anything urgent I needed to do before taking the time to read the thread?

Not really sure what to say about the rest of Giu's posts...looks like he changed his mind about if healing was a good idea along the way, but he certanly wasn't the only one who did.

Also, it's rather scummy for you to try to do a WIFOM attack here where that you're attacking Giu because YOU were trying to lynch a townie, Xyl, and Giu wasn't willing to just trust you and follow your lead.

Page 22:
I thought populartajo’s stratagy suggestions sounded reasonably pro-town when he first made them, but it’s really starting to seem like he’s just repeating his stratagy argument over and over again while not hunting for scum at all. Fos:tajo

This is false. I was on the players that hunted shinnen and called her obv scum since day 1.

Yeah, I know you were on the Shinnen wagon, but that dosn't make my comment any less accurate; other then that, you really seemed to devote all your time to stratagy to the complete exclusion of anything else; you went as far as to just basically copy and paste the same ALL CAPS LETTERS post over and over again for pages while all kinds of interesting scum hunting was going on without you. So, yeah, your play really does look like you using stratagy arguments to avoid actually hunting scum or analyzing players.

q21: Interesting. I'm not really sure why you first hurt Nuwen and then unloaded your firepower onto Albert, though.

last try to make q21 look bad before he becomes prob confirmed town. Also, I love how yos didnt protect ABR when he thought he was obv town and he even asked if he was at L-1.

I thought he was obv town for part of my read through, then had doubts in the later part of the readthrough, if you were paying attention.

Anyway, what do you mean "protect"? What, do you expect me to heal him or something? Wouldn't that have been a terrible play? Also, what's wrong with pointing out when someone was at L -1 because I didn't want anyone to hammer him without knowing.

Hmm...I did a quick skim of Fonz's posts, and wasn't impressed by most of what he's done since the Shin lynch. We're about to go out to the grocery story in a few minutes, and I should probably use my hurt first .

Hurt:Fonz

But after this, we need to get rid of Tajo.

Setting up mislynches, huh? With NO CASE on him and you havent even read the thread entirely.

No; q21 was right, I needed to just hurt someone fast at that point for the good of the town, rather then wait any longer and waste my "vote". I wasn't especally happy about the Fonz lynch, I would have much rather lynched you as I made it clear, but since I hadn't read the whole thread yet, I was willing to follow along the two people I was most sure were pro-town at the time, q21 and DGB, especally since the need for town concensuss seemed obvious.

Then it all comes garbage attacks that make no sense to answer since Yosarian is TWISTING my words every time he can and trying to make me look bad.

Twisting your words? How the hell am I twisting your words? You keep saying this, claiming I'm "misrepresenting" you or whever, but you keep refusing to explain why. As far as I can see, I haven't misrepresented you at all.

Also, have you already answered this?
WHEN THE FUCK DID I SAY THAT NUWEN AND ROLF HAVE TO BE SCUM TOGETHER?

You were being damn confusing with the argument you were trying to make, Tajo, and I was trying to figure out what you were getting at, which is why I *ASKED* you about that.

I thought that was what you were saying here:

the plan wont work if all the players left alive with q21, rolf-nuwen and dgb are scum. stalemate there and they wont hurt each other anymore

Although, reading it again, I guess that's not what you were saying. So, my mistake. It'd sure be a lot easier to figure out what you were talking about if you actually answered questions once in a while, though, rather then just shouting the same garbage over and over again in all caps.

[Mr. Flay]

SECOND DAMAGE TALLY OF THE TWENTY-FIFTH ÆON

DrippingGoofball and Yosarian2 are both at normal HP.

Nuwen has 2 damage.
Firestarter has 3 damage.
roflcopter has 6 damage.
populartajo has 8 damage.
q21 has 10 damage.

[q21]

pop's actions make sense as both scum and town. Scum flailing to keep himself alive or town who genuinely believes killing him will screw up the game. I think I'm going to suggest that myself and Yos continue to kill pop and everyone else (bar FS who should heal me as he's said he would do) should move on to Yosarian.

That should kill tajo in 2 days and get yosarian very close to being dead in the same time. Just in case pop is being genuine.

Just a suggestion. I'm open to anyone who isn't pop or yos themselves shooting it down if they have a good reason to.

[DrippingGoofball]

pop's actions make sense as both scum and town. Scum flailing to keep himself alive or town who genuinely believes killing him will screw up the game. I think I'm going to suggest that myself and Yos continue to kill pop and everyone else (bar FS who should heal me as he's said he would do) should move on to Yosarian.

Don't you get ZPs if we hit scum? I think we should finish off tajo, then if you get ZPs from that, you'll have them earlier. Mostly, we'll know tajo's alignment earlier.

[DrippingGoofball]

Going through the plan's motions.

hurt:populartajo

[q21]

hurt populartajo

You never get anywhere in life without a few gambles. Hope this one pays off.

[roflcopter]

in about an hour i'll be recharged and i'll take the plunge

[Firestarter]

Guys, hopefully, Pop is scum.

If not, Im very confident that Yos & roflcopter are.

Q21, Im happy to keep healing you, I'd prefer to hurt Yos.

BTW, just so you know, this plan is going to get Town killed if Pop is NOT scum.
If he is town, he is the only player against this plan.
And if this plan is gonna win it for Town, why is there only 1 player against it?????
Think about it.....

Everyone else is going along with it, so if Pop is town, I'd seriuosly suggest looking at one of his main attackers over the last few pages.

[DrippingGoofball]

Guys, hopefully, Pop is scum.

If not, Im very confident that Yos & roflcopter are.

Q21, Im happy to keep healing you, I'd prefer to hurt Yos.

BTW, just so you know, this plan is going to get Town killed if Pop is NOT scum.
If he is town, he is the only player against this plan.
And if this plan is gonna win it for Town, why is there only 1 player against it?????
Think about it.....

Everyone else is going along with it, so if Pop is town, I'd seriuosly suggest looking at one of his main attackers over the last few pages.

The scum won't recharge another 6 rage points until Sunday anyway, if my assumptions are correct.

Wait for me Firestarter, I thought of something, but I'd rather talk only after tajo is dead, because it hinges on tajo's alignment.

I'll be back in 3 hours from now. Please hold off any action.

[roflcopter]

hurt: tajo

with a blade and a prayer

[populartajo]

Means Im dead now.
Thx for at least giving me a chance.
Yos and Fire should be obvious scum right now.
Go town. I doubt you can still make it but hey, you never know,

[populartajo]

Guys, hopefully, Pop is scum.

If not, Im very confident that Yos & roflcopter are.

Q21, Im happy to keep healing you, I'd prefer to hurt Yos.

BTW, just so you know, this plan is going to get Town killed if Pop is NOT scum.
If he is town, he is the only player against this plan.
And if this plan is gonna win it for Town, why is there only 1 player against it?????
Think about it.....

Everyone else is going along with it, so if Pop is town, I'd seriuosly suggest looking at one of his main attackers over the last few pages.

Thank you FUCKING EINSTEIN.