Mini 732: Dr. Horrible's Sing-Along Mafia (Game Over!)

[Empking]

If neither one is scum then we'll still have another day and can work it out from that.

Poro, I think you should vote Gorrad.

[Porochaz]

If I vote before you lynch me, I will vote for who I think is scum. Not before.

[Empking]

Do you not want town to win?

[Porochaz]

and if yos2 is scum? Unlikely but still a possibility we should take into account,

[Empking]

Then we evaluate his play and lynch him tomorrow.

[Yosarian2]

Ok, since like 3 people who should know better have suggested they think I might be scum:

Yesterday, there were 2 votes on Gorrad and 2 votes on Porochaz. If I was scum, they would have both been town, and I could easily have pushed the lynch either way by supporting one wagon or the other. If Gorrad was town and I had pushed for Gorrad to be lynched, then there would have been 2 scum last night, and between the scum kill and my vig kill, since town would have had no way to prevent either one with Gorrad dead, scum would have won last night.

If I was scum, the game would be over now. Instead, I caught a different scum, someone no one else suspected at all, and ran him up to a lynch.

[Empking]

That's WIFOM. I don't think you're scum but I haven't ruled it out.

[Gorrad]

Anyone else getting really bad vibes from Empking?

[Porochaz]

Ok, since like 3 people who should know better have suggested they think I might be scum:

Yesterday, there were 2 votes on Gorrad and 2 votes on Porochaz. If I was scum, they would have both been town, and I could easily have pushed the lynch either way by supporting one wagon or the other. If Gorrad was town and I had pushed for Gorrad to be lynched, then there would have been 2 scum last night, and between the scum kill and my vig kill, since town would have had no way to prevent either one with Gorrad dead, scum would have won last night.

If I was scum, the game would be over now. Instead, I caught a different scum, someone no one else suspected at all, and ran him up to a lynch.

Thats true, I still havent rules you out but for the purposes of where we are just now I think I have to. As for Empking, yep Im getting very bad vibes from him especially the conversation at the top of the page. I want to compare both him and Gorrad before I vote for either. I also want has and Plum to post more.

[Empking]

If neither of you two are scum then I don't want scum to walk it the last day by getting us to lynch one of you.

[Yosarian2]

That's WIFOM. I don't think you're scum but I haven't ruled it out.

No, it's not. If, as scum, I could have won by doing X, and I did not do X, then that pretty much proves I'm not scum.

WIFOM would be if you're suggesting that I delibratly chose not to win as scum when I could have just in order to make people think that I was town, and that would be incredibly stupid.

Do you disagree that, if I was scum, I could have easily and safely lynched a townie yesterday and won last night?

[hasdgfas]

That's WIFOM. I don't think you're scum but I haven't ruled it out.

that's not WIFOM. That's common sense. Slow-rolling a win is stupid, because then there's plenty of ways to lose.

[Plum]

Anyone else getting really bad vibes from Empking?

Me. I want to do some sort of reread, but am short on time, so it's not happening right this minute.

I agree with Yos2 and Hascow that there's no WIFOM involved - scum-Yos2 could have easily not voted Ruck, helped lynch town-Gorrad, and the scum would've killed two townies, leaving 2:2, leading to a scum win. He did not do that and win, as he easily could have, and, as scum, should have, as if scum-Yos bussed Ruck as he must have if he

were

scum, as Hascow said there'd be plenty of ways for the game to screw him. Thus Yos2 is basically confirmed, for the same reason that anyone who posts in three-player LYLO a player at one vote and doesn't hammer isn't scum, as hammering a townie right there wins the game, no questions asked.

[mith]

Vote Count:

4 to lynch.

Porochaz: 3 (Gorrad, Plum, Yosarian2)
Gorrad: 1 (Empking)

[Porochaz]

vote empking

[Empking]

That's WIFOM. I don't think you're scum but I haven't ruled it out.

No, it's not. If, as scum, I could have won by doing X, and I did not do X, then that pretty much proves I'm not scum.

WIFOM would be if you're suggesting that I delibratly chose not to win as scum when I could have just in order to make people think that I was town, and that would be incredibly stupid.

Do you disagree that, if I was scum, I could have easily and safely lynched a townie yesterday and won last night?

I think its possible but unlike the rest of you, I don't think getting two votes on someone as easy as you think. Especially when one of those votes belongs to a person who would self hammer.

I want Has and Plum to defind WIFOM.

[mith]

Mod Note:

Will be prodding everyone later. Just bumping for now.

[hasdgfas]

I want Has and Plum to defind WIFOM.

I can't tell if you're saying define or defend.

[Empking]

Define.

[hasdgfas]

WIFOM is something that can be logically shown to be circular logic.

That is, scum saying "why would I do X?" if it can be shown that what they did was in their best interest.

Yos not hammering is not in his best interest simply because there is no way to say that not winning the game there is better than waiting a day.

This probably doesn't make sense, but it's hard to explain the way it sounds in my head.

[Empking]

I think I should point out (because I haven't mentioned it) Yos couldn't have predicted that the last to votes on MR could be there. Especially the last one.

[Yosarian2]

I think I should point out (because I haven't mentioned it) Yos couldn't have predicted that the last to votes on MR could be there. Especially the last one.

Sure I could have. If I had gone hard after Gorrad and backed that wagon, I have no doubt Gorrad would have been lynched yesterday.

Other people who expressed suspicion on Gorrad:

Post 279 - Yos2: I agree with Yosarian2 about Gorrad.
Post 285 - Gorrad: Why do you find him suspect? I haven't seen you express any reasoning for it, and with the fact that Yos was supicious of you first, this seems like pure OMGUS to me. I also don't think it's a bad idea to keep him from killing if we mislynch.
...
I'm going to

FoS: Gorrad and Porochaz

I feel them as scum right now. I really don't like Post 285 where he expresses suspicion of Yos2 with no reasoning and says that a self-vig is a good idea.
Porochaz has done nothing, which is probably the best scum play right now.

In conclusion: Gorrad is scummiest in my mind and quite frankly my preferred lynch. Deadline appears to be Saturday. Unless some stuff changes I'll probably prefer to be voting Gorrad. If I'm very lucky I'll get the time to do a brief reread on some players before deadline, too.

Porochaz was voting Gorrad, and remember he has 2 votes.

Me+Plum+Porochaz+hascow=5 votes. Plus, if I was scum with master ruck as you are suggesting, then one would assume he would also have been willing to hammer Gorrad in order to win the game for the scum. The only other person who didn't express suspicion on Gorrad was Malyss, your predecessor, and that was probably just because she wasn't around at the time.

Do you really think that it would have been that hard for me to lynch Gorrad in that situation?

[Gorrad]

He's got a point, there. I figured I was pretty dead. I'm just lucky it got turned around to MR.

Ok, Yos is off my list. Porochaz and Empking are not. It's probably best for the town if we go ahead and lynch 'Chaz today and I get vigged tonight, to clear the air from yesterday if nothing else. If 'Chaz IS town, then y'all can get rid of Empking, Plum, or Fhwgwgads tomorrow.

[Porochaz]

I disagree. I think it would be better if Empking was lynched tonight and then have yos kill me or you off. (Probably me for my double vote)

[Yosarian2]

Gorrad: I'm a little confused; no matter what your alignment is, why would you let me vig kill you when you can prevent me from doing so?