Mini 745 - Moving Day Mafia (GAME OVER!)

[Zer0ph34r]

True, but I claimed to be a cop, just a cop, and I think the message telling me role would've told me that I was mafia, which it didn't.

Top of page 26 vote count:

Porkens 2 (Erratus Apathos, ac1983fan)
ac1983fan 2 (don_johnson)
Zer0ph34r 1 (Porkens)
Jazzmyn 1 (Looker)

Not voting: Jazzmyn, Sotty7, Zer0ph34r, Herodotus

With 9 still packing it takes 5 to lynch.

Note: this vote count should be accurate as of this post.

Prods: None

Still looking for a replacement for EA.

[ac1983fan]

True, but I claimed to be a cop, just a cop, and I think the message telling me role would've told me that I was mafia, which it didn't.

...but you have no evidence that suggests this, do you?

[ac1983fan]

True, but I claimed to be a cop, just a cop, and I think the message telling me role would've told me that I was mafia, which it didn't.

...but you have no evidence that suggests this, do you?

Oh wow, I totally misread your post. Sorry, my bad.

[Looker]

vote jazzmyn

Well this is certainly new and different.

What's your reasoning?

Nothing more than to be new and different, wondering why the three that noticed my vote (exlcuding jazzmyn because she was the one voted) did and why others didn't.

vote jazzmyn

tl;dr

Seriously though, anything to back that up with?

I don't know what that means. But no, just trying to get into the game while simultaneously reading. I do understand, though, that jazzmyn doesn't have any other votes on her and that we're not lynch-or-lose or whatever that acronym is. Speaking of...

vote jazzmyn

Awesome - something new to talk about. Welcome aboard, Looker.

Regards,
Jazz

...thanks! Since I voted you for no reason, I would like to give you the pleasure of informing me who, out of the following five, you think is scummy (and why).

erratus, don_johnson, zer0ph, scotty, herodotus

[ac1983fan]

vote jazzmyn

Well this is certainly new and different.

What's your reasoning?

Nothing more than to be new and different, wondering why the three that noticed my vote (exlcuding jazzmyn because she was the one voted) did and why others didn't.

I noticed it because you gave a vote with absolutely NO reasoning.

vote jazzmyn

tl;dr

Seriously though, anything to back that up with?

I don't know what that means. But no, just trying to get into the game while simultaneously reading. I do understand, though, that jazzmyn doesn't have any other votes on her and that we're not lynch-or-lose or whatever that acronym is. Speaking of...

tl;dr = too long didn't read

But what protown reason is there behind voting while providing no reason?

[Looker]

Testing the waters. And that's exactly it, are you the only one with eyes in this game? No one else caught the fact that I voted with absolutely no reason behind it? Are you the smart guy of the bunch...?

[Herodotus]

vote jazzmyn

Well this is certainly new and different.

What's your reasoning?

Nothing more than to be new and different, wondering why the three that noticed my vote (exlcuding jazzmyn because she was the one voted) did and why others didn't.

I'm pretty sure everyone noticed, but as for myself, I didn't mention it because someone else had already asked you for your reasons. There didn't seem to be much to say about your vote until you either provided your reasons or made it clear you weren't going to.

Since I voted you for no reason, I would like to give you the pleasure of informing me who, out of the following five, you think is scummy (and why).

erratus, don_johnson, zer0ph, scotty, herodotus

I can understand excluding yourself and Jazzmyn, and acfan because of his claim, but it's interesting that you left off Porkens... please remember to let us know at some time why you did that.

Also, have you completed a read-through? Do you have any comments about anything from before you entered the game?

[ac1983fan]

Testing the waters. And that's exactly it, are you the only one with eyes in this game? No one else caught the fact that I voted with absolutely no reason behind it? Are you the smart guy of the bunch...?

Plenty of people did, we're not idiots...
Most of the people prolly didn't wanna be to redundant...

[Porkens]

Looker and Zer0 for maf.

[Herodotus]

Looker and Zer0 for maf.

Tovarish's last post makes him/Looker look relatively pro-town. He asked the mod to replace Killer -- if that had happened, the Killer lynch would have been much less likely.

[Zer0ph34r]

How exactly does his last post make him seem pro-town? I think they are, but not from that post.

[Herodotus]

Well, it's not a definite thing, but it seems to me that if Tovarish had been mafia, he would not have wanted K7 to be replaced, because he'd rather that K7 be lynched.

[don_johnson]

isn't that called "distancing"? looker's recent "gambit" seems more designed to make people look scummy than to actually find scum. also, tov had a lot of opinions on alignments. you should be asking yourself, "was he right about you"?

looker: how do you feel abnout our current situation? do you believe acfan's sk claim? also, i second the "why is porkens not a suspect" question. he has been pushing for an ac lynch as much as i have and should be under a good amount of suspicion.

[Jazzmyn]

This is such a scummy post.

What is scummy about it?

Porkens, you haven't answered my question. Perhaps you missed it. What is scummy about that post by Sotty that you were referring to?

Since I voted you for no reason, I would like to give you the pleasure of informing me who, out of the following five, you think is scummy (and why).
erratus, don_johnson, zer0ph, scotty, herodotus

And I would like you to give all of us the pleasure of sharing your thoughts about the game so far, your suspicions, observations, and analysis. Once you've read the thread, we can engage in a thorough exchange of ideas. When I replace into a game, I find it useful to do a thorough read while generating my own ideas, suspicions, observations and analysis rather than just asking someone else who they find suspicious.

In the meantime, though, I am presently most suspicious of acfan, Zero, and you conditionally. acfan, because (a) I am not entirely sold on his SK claim, in which case he would be scum fake-claiming SK and (b) if he is a SK, he's admittedly anti-town in any event; Zero because his play strikes me as bizarre and I'm not entirely sold on his cop claim, (but those with more experience than I seem to think it's plausible so I'll have to think about that some more); and you, conditionally, because it is scummy to vote for someone without any rationale at any time (except in the random vote stage), let alone on Day 2, page 25, without having even read the thread. I'll leave it at that for now, and we can discuss further once you've read the thread.

Tovarish's last post makes him/Looker look relatively pro-town. He asked the mod to replace Killer -- if that had happened, the Killer lynch would have been much less likely.

I didn't get any scum vibes from Tovarish at all while he was here, but I'm not sure that I agree with your point about his last post. He was pretty clear in his posts that he found killa to be legitimately scummy (as did I and several others), and he had his vote on killa for a couple of weeks by that point. He certainly had the option to unvote if he changed his mind about his belief in killa's scumminess but he never did. So, I don't think your logic on that one holds.

But, as I said, I felt that Tovarish was pro-town throughout. His replacement, well, we'll see once he reads the thread and offers his insights and thoughts. It is entirely possible that Tovarish was good as scum and had me completely fooled (it certainly wouldn't be the first time).

Regards,
Jazz

[Porkens]

I'm not voting because I'm torn on what to do right now.

Non-commital

We have one replacement, I'm more than willing to let him catch up with us all

. Withholding opinions and ideas until someone else speaks for reasons I can't understand.[/b]

In the mean time I will probably have to give the last few pages another read.

I'll believe it when I see it; classic scum active lurking.

I'm not sure what to think about Zero's half assed cop claim. Scum coming out like he did really makes little sense.

Town coming out like that makes little sense

Maybe we have two cops. One for mafia, one for the SK? Right now I'm not sure. [/b] whats the competing hypothesis?[/b]

Zero really needs to come back in here and you know.. Start making some sense. That would be helpful.

pointless and obviously not going to happen

[Porkens]

screwed up my bold tags twice; sweet.

[raider8169]

Sotty7 has been proded.

[Sotty7]

Apologies. Got caught up this week.

I wanted to see who would catch it, it may seem untrue, but I wanted to see who was actually paying attention, and as a result, only one person mentioned it.

And don, I tried investigating killaseven for suspicion of scum. And by the way, does anyone have a suggestion as to who I should investigate tonight?

You wanted to know who was paying attention?

Looks to me like you need to be the one who is paying attention. You

still

haven't given us any thoughts on the SK situation with Ac we have going.

I'm finding Don is asking/suggesting seemingly innocuous questions to which the scum would want to know the answers more than the town would. If Zero is telling the truth, I don't see what information we can derive from his selection, but the scum might figure he'll try the same target again. If he's lying, I don't know whether stating a particular target would likely help us to figure that out (though I suppose it might.)
I could be wrong about the usefulness of knowing his selection, and I also don't yet know Don's motive. Just pointing this out.

I, personally, wanted him to answer to see if he continued to make absolutely no sense at all.

He didn't disappoint.

So making no sense = scum to you? Do you really think a scum would make this kinda play right now, especially seeing that no one was actively looking in his direction. I had asked him to actually participate in the convo, but no one was making cases on him.

It just screams confused/out of depth townie to me.

can't hurt to know. mafia is a game of connecting the dots as the corpses pile up. unfortunately, zero is connecting himself to a dead townie. does seem par for the course.

i guess i'm okay if someone would like to claim roleblocker. it could play to our favor now.

Do you think Zero is telling the truth?

Anyway, I asked previously whether it is normal to have a role such as a paranoid cop in a mini normal game where there is already another cop, and a couple of you seem to have indicated that it is possible. Has anyone ever played in a 12 player game with two cops? I haven't completed very many 12 player games yet so I'm just not sure how common or how rare it might be.

No I haven't. Although I have played a 10 player game with 2 cops (don't ask horribly balanced)

vote jazzmyn

Awesome - something new to talk about. Welcome aboard, Looker.

Regards,
Jazz

Awesome? That's a strange reaction.

i guess i'm okay if someone would like to claim roleblocker. it could play to our favor now.

THERE! AGAIN!
Seriously, you might have a pro-town reason for wanting to know this, but do you have any explanation for why it's okay to inform the scum who, if anyone, has this role? And what the town has to gain from a claim? Maybe start with that explanation,

then

invite someone to claim. Or, if you're mafia, please keep doing what you're doing. Or just claim.

This is a good point. Not sure what a RB claiming at this point would do to help us, or even

if

there is one at this point.

claims can help to clear things up. if we are not going to lynch acfan then we need to do something. a roleblocker claim narrows down our targets for lynch and gives us the option to test acfan's claim by blocking him.

Yeah but it also gives the scum more info. Considering that Zero looked into a dead player, we don't need to clear up anything.

...thanks! Since I voted you for no reason, I would like to give you the pleasure of informing me who, out of the following five, you think is scummy (and why).

erratus, don_johnson, zer0ph, scotty, herodotus

Umm this is a good question and all, but I would like to know your feelings on the players in this game since you just replaced in. I would also like to know the reasons for a Jazz vote.

Looker and Zer0 for maf.

Why?

Looker and Zer0 for maf.

Tovarish's last post makes him/Looker look relatively pro-town. He asked the mod to replace Killer -- if that had happened, the Killer lynch would have been much less likely.

Oh please. He may have done that but he made sure to leave his vote on Killa when he did. If he wanted a replacement so bad he would have unvoted he just said that for appearances I think.

That post got him scum points from me, not town.

I'm not voting because I'm torn on what to do right now.

Non-commital

We have one replacement, I'm more than willing to let him catch up with us all

. Withholding opinions and ideas until someone else speaks for reasons I can't understand.[/b]

In the mean time I will probably have to give the last few pages another read.

I'll believe it when I see it; classic scum active lurking.

I'm not sure what to think about Zero's half assed cop claim. Scum coming out like he did really makes little sense.

Town coming out like that makes little sense

Maybe we have two cops. One for mafia, one for the SK? Right now I'm not sure. [/b] whats the competing hypothesis?[/b]

Zero really needs to come back in here and you know.. Start making some sense. That would be helpful.

pointless and obviously not going to happen

1) I have already stated once in the thread (Post 550) that I am willing to vote Ac. As of right now, he is still my top suspect.

2) Well before this post I was adding to the discussion active lurking is a harsh conclusion to draw. That said, I can't really defend this point because I have been missing the last few days and I haven't done the re-read.

3) Scum coming out like that makes no sense. Especially with a dead cop already.

4) Not sure what you mean here. Could you explain?

5) Well yeah... Maybe you're right. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

[Sotty7]

Okay I have just read day 2 again.

My worry was that Hero and Ac had this all planned out. There are instances where Hero seems to be directing the scum team almost. (Post 470) As well as almost hand holding Ac (Post 482) Still, this is a pretty big stretch and would only probably work if the scum could day talk or if they had knowledge of SK at the start of the game. (Maybe one of them is SK skill immune).

I'm going to

Vote: Ac

Basically I believe him to be mafia with his seeming knowledge of a “pro town” roleblocker. Even if he isn't he has shown himself to be a pretty unhelpful SK. I don't trust him and I don't want to put the game in his hands.

Looker really needs to weigh in and get his opinions on record. Also what's the status on EA's replacement?

[don_johnson]

Do you think Zero is telling the truth?

i really don't know what to think about him. i am trying to figure out if he's dumb or just really good at playing dumb.(no offense)

This is a good point. Not sure what a RB claiming at this point would do to help us, or even if there is one at this point.

rb claim: narrows down lynch choice if we choose not to lynch acfan. gives us option of blocking fan if we leave him alive and lynch doesn't flip sk. scum may fakeclaim and real rb may counterclaim or vice versa. in short, claims force scum into a corner and narrow our pool of suspects. if we are going to continue discussion for today, then it doesn't hurt to talk about the possibilities.

[Herodotus]

@Don
I guess that logic isn't bad, but if the mafia have some (unlikely) means of neutralizing the RB's action, we'll have a false scum-read, and otherwise they may kill the person. Whether we have a doctor is not public knowledge. I suppose that if we do, that supports your plan, while if we don't, it would just throw away a town PR.
Another problem is that we'll have trouble telling the difference between a scum RB and a town RB. Either might have a motive to block acfan.
Also, it's worth noting that if we do not in fact have any role blockers, the scum may find that knowledge useful as well.

There are instances where Hero seems to be directing the scum team almost.

I hereby direct the mafia to send in one of their own names as their NK tonight.
But seriously, if I were mafia, I'd be claiming right now in order to get acfan lynched. It's a little frustrating that they're hurting their team along with the town, presumably because of the preconceptions people have about the scum role. People play it like a survivor, when it's a team role.

[Zer0ph34r]

Well, if it has to be either I'm dumb or I'm good at playing dumb, it must be that I am dumb, because that's what people have implied in the past and I don't intend to be dumb.

What/who is SK, Sotty? But I do have high suspicion of ac, but like pretty much every other time in the past, I have made the mistake of voting for the person I find most suspicious. [BTW, I've never lynched a mafia member in all of my 5 games, so that sucks.] I wanna go with my instincts, but I want to be 99% sure first.

[Looker]

well thanks, now I feel dumb! but yeah...let's see, i think...YOU'RE scummy...you, the one reading this post...

you mull that over while i give the thread a THOROUGH lookin over

[Porkens]

Porkens Post 639 wrote:
Sotty7 wrote:
I'm not voting because I'm torn on what to do right now. Non-commital
We have one replacement, I'm more than willing to let him catch up with us all. Withholding opinions and ideas until someone else speaks for reasons I can't understand.[/b]

In the mean time I will probably have to give the last few pages another read. I'll believe it when I see it; classic scum active lurking.

I'm not sure what to think about Zero's half assed cop claim. Scum coming out like he did really makes little sense. Town coming out like that makes little sense

Maybe we have two cops. One for mafia, one for the SK? Right now I'm not sure.

whats the competing hypothesis?

Zero really needs to come back in here and you know.. Start making some sense. That would be helpful. pointless and obviously not going to happen


1) I have already stated once in the thread (Post 550) that I am willing to vote Ac. As of right now, he is still my top suspect.

2) Well before this post I was adding to the discussion active lurking is a harsh conclusion to draw. That said, I can't really defend this point because I have been missing the last few days and I haven't done the re-read.

3) Scum coming out like that makes no sense. Especially with a dead cop already.

4) Not sure what you mean here. Could you explain?

5) Well yeah... Maybe you're right. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

If you're nor sure, what's the other idea you have floating around in your head to make you unsure?

[Herodotus]

BTW, I've never lynched a mafia member in all of my 5 games, so that sucks.

Neither have I ever been on a successful wagon that lynched scum -- in fact, no scum has ever been lynched in any game I was in (though I don't have 5 completed games.)

What/who is SK, Sotty?

SK stands for Serial Killer.

well thanks, now I feel dumb! but yeah...let's see, i think...YOU'RE scummy...you, the one reading this post...

you mull that over while i give the thread a THOROUGH lookin over

I've mulled it over and decided it's something scum would say.

vote: Looker