Open 124 (2:10 Bugs Bunny -- GAME OVER) before 761


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Post Post #350 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:21 pm

Post by dejkha »

Giuseppe wrote:
Dej wrote:Since you voted Emp, it'll only reinforce your connection to him if you flip scum because it would be seen as obvious distancing.
I apologize, but I don't find anyone else scummy, at the moment. My V/LA made it difficult for me to have any say in the matter up until this point, and I can't exactly vote for someone I don't find scummy. Allow me to reread the game, and I'll produce another suspect, if Empking doesn't satisfy you all. It seems like distancing, yes. Is it distancing? No.

My vote to Empking is based around the severity of his Ad Hom this game. In my previous game, he was much, much more mild with his critiques. These seem defensive, angry, and scummier than he played before.

I, once I finish my homework, will reread the topic and find Empking's partner, and post my findings.
No need to apologize. I'm not using your vote as evidence against you. I'm only saying that, if you are scum, it won't help to distant you from him.

C:\>votecount

Running VoteCount
TM


Giuseppe - 1 - dejkha
AndyTony - 1 - Empking
Empking - 1 - Giuseppe

Grimmy - 0
dejkha - 0
zwetschenwasser - 0
Pablo Molinero - 0
Zachrulez - 0
Cephrir - 0
madeofphail - 0

Not Voting: zwetschenwasser, millar13, AndyTony, roflcopter, Cephrir, Pablo Molinero, Grimmy, Zachrulez, madeofphail

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Post Post #351 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:22 pm

Post by zwetschenwasser »

So you're communicating with your scum buddies, eh dej?
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Post Post #352 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:24 pm

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Why do you say that?
"You say that all my posts are stupid like a motherf***ing SOB. I'm sick and tired of your constant BS." - Zwet to me.

"Fuck you... You're a pompous, ignorant fool, dejkha, and I don't appreciate your incessant badmouthing of me." - Zwet
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Post Post #353 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:25 pm

Post by zwetschenwasser »

"If you were scum...
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Post Post #354 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:27 pm

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1. I said "If you are scum"
2. Why is suspicious? I don't know who scum is. Why would I not us "if"?
"You say that all my posts are stupid like a motherf***ing SOB. I'm sick and tired of your constant BS." - Zwet to me.

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Post Post #355 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:59 pm

Post by AndyTony »

Phail - thanks for the wishes - - the bday is great minus the homework (they really ram you in second year, eh? Make you know who's boss and cry uncle lol)

-------------------
I'm torn between voting Emp or Guiseppe.

Guiseppe
-In addition to the valuable points that I'm for the most part inclined to agree with (Dej and Ceph)...
-I think that somebody trying to scumhunt does so for their own reasons. There is nothing wrong with agreeing, going off someone else and adding etc - but I personally draw the line when someone changes their vote for
other people
.
I think Guiseppe has been put against a wall and is trying to people please to save his life in a failed attempt to distance himself from Emp, his potential scum partner.
-He chose when to and not to acknowledge Emp's meta and furthermore let it effect him.
-He is now twice going after the easier lynch

Unless the above is cleared up to my standards, I'm going to vote Guiseppe.
---------
Emp
-Going off of wheat I'm hearing about the guy, and Guiseppe's comparisson to a previous game, I reckon it's hard to tell if he is ever scum or towny, that he just plays hard headed and crosses his fingers.
-Emp has been unclear, OMGUS, negative, unproductive, and fails to scum hunt in an adult, concise, and clear manner that this game demands. These things are harmful to town, scum or not. However, I am inclined to think scum.

Vote: Emp


I agree with Dejkha that we wouldn't want Emp around for lylo and that his demise is a matter of when, not if. My vote remains on Emp - but if Guiseppe is not cleared in the above by deadline, and done so well, I will change my vote to him. - it remains on Emp because frankly, I'm hoping for better from Guiseppe. Emp looks worse, he gets my present vote - - Guiseppe not being cleared in time or doing a poor job - he'd look worse.

You could be both scum and this could all be less troubling for me than I know.
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Post Post #356 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:43 pm

Post by zwetschenwasser »

dej, it's a scumtell by association.
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Post Post #357 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:47 pm

Post by dejkha »

It's really not.
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Post Post #358 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:52 pm

Post by zwetschenwasser »

It really is.
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Post Post #359 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:53 pm

Post by dejkha »

Alright then, let's take a poll so I don't get stuck in another stupid conversation.

Who thinks that saying "If you are scum[...]" is a scumtell and who thinks it isn't?
"You say that all my posts are stupid like a motherf***ing SOB. I'm sick and tired of your constant BS." - Zwet to me.

"Fuck you... You're a pompous, ignorant fool, dejkha, and I don't appreciate your incessant badmouthing of me." - Zwet
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Post Post #360 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:54 pm

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I don't think it really matters. It's WIFOM, and mostly pointless, but not a scum tell.
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Post Post #361 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:54 pm

Post by zwetschenwasser »

Stop trying to distract us away from your scumminess.
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Post Post #362 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:58 pm

Post by dejkha »

zwetschenwasser wrote:Stop trying to distract us away from your scumminess.
No no no. You be quiet. I asked for other peoples opinions. I'm giving people a chance to agree with your case and I'm bringing attention to what you consider a scumtell. I'm helping you with your case against me.
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Post Post #363 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:05 pm

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I think (If we are really going to press this, because If we are not, then we are just wasting time). we should treat this like the basics of an american court trial, because it is basically the same thing. We have the defense and defendant (dejkha), the prosecution (zwet), and a jury deciding the end result.

As such, I would like Zwet to post an exact reason as to why that action by dejkha is scummy, and dejkha will argue to the contrary. This will help people make an educated decision. (or at least me, because quite frankly, i do not understand the prosecution's argument.)
The name is quite fitting, don't you think?
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Post Post #364 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:24 pm

Post by Cephrir »

zwet, you're wrong. Can we move on now?
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Post Post #365 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:44 pm

Post by madeofphail »

If you say that he's wrong, you know what he is saying, can you please explain to me what zwet is arguing?
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Post Post #366 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 3:01 pm

Post by dejkha »

He's saying post 353 is a scumtell with his reasoning in 356.
"You say that all my posts are stupid like a motherf***ing SOB. I'm sick and tired of your constant BS." - Zwet to me.

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Post Post #367 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:11 pm

Post by Pablo Molinero »

Random things I’m think about this game:

millar13 - 6 - Zachrulez, madeofphail, Giuseppe, roflcopter, Cephrir, Empking, AT

These are who we should be looking at, admittedly I haven’t been active enough in this game, but I got one hellova bad vibe from the way things rolled along yesterday. Not gonna do a whole “told ya so” bit, but the likelihood of scum pushing this along is higher than average.

zwet
millar was too erratic to be left alive.
Yikes, looks like you’re justifying the lynch of a townie. Never good.

Zwet:
Andy hasn't done a particularly good job defending his.
I respectfully disagree. It’s something like AT’s reaction to the lynch/hammer that gives me a town read. While it was somewhat fence-sitting, I can personally appreciate the cautious mindset. However,

AT
I find "hammering" to be vulgar and blunt
Come on. I don’t know if this is honest confusion or overreaction. “Hammer” is the term, get over it.

I think Grimmy’s first self-vote is a nonfactor and those that jumped on it are trying a bit too hard (slightly scummy).

Emp is consistent, at least, and I agree with dejkha’s point that he’s pretty much unreadable. Frustrating and a liability. That doesn’t make him lynchable… yet.

Emp:
AT's last post is just BS, unbacked statements, and insults. So I'll ignore it.
It’s this kind of crap that pisses me off, emp. I know it’s the style you’ve been toting for a while now, but in the same vein that you keep on calling people out for ‘active lurking’, do some damned scumhunting yourself. That said, this:

dejkha
Emp is a matter a 'when' and that when isn't now, it's later.

…Lynching Giuseppe gives us more answers, and a better chance at winning, than lynching Emp does. As of right now that is.
makes me nervous in the way that it implies Emp getting lynched ‘has’ to come in the future no matter what. Ignore the fuck for now, I agree (AT!), but let’s wait for more data to come in.
Emp, make sure you're truthful about your age, because the older you say you are, the worse it'll look.
Why say this? Wait til he responds to explain to lessen a chance of a lie. Slight, unnecessary coaching.

Giuseppe
1. My treatment of Millar was in the hopes of drawing useful information out of an erratic player who was heading towards a lynch. If he claimed a scum buddy, got lynched, flipped scum, that would have been good, no?
And? Instead of defending yourself, tell us what you figured, otherwise I’m going to assume this is a after-the-fact attempt to cover yourself …the later part is just laughable, too. Awful.

phail
Therefore, my post which "justified" voting for giuseppe is invalid proof. I did not think that far through. My error in judgement is directing negative attention to me.
I disagree. I’m starting to think that the standard ‘WIFOM’ argument of NK’s is bull, considering what I’ve seen in both this game and two recent games of mine with scum furthering their agenda and eliminating dangerous players. It seems widely accepted on this site that you can just whip out this defense and move on your merry way, what better for scum to exploit it? I know it sounds like simple agreeing to the dej/phail point, but I’m bringing two recent relevant experiences to back it up, one in where the NK had scum
pegged
and would not let up, and another where they were meddling heavily and got iced.

And lookie, I just got to Giuseppie’s 336 in where he votes Empking. I’m not thoroughly satisfied with his explanations with his Day 1 actions, but they’ll have to do and they don’t scream scum. I do agree that policy lynches are kinda silly.

Giuseppe
Examples of Leadership Include:

1. Defending Empking from a quick lynch.
2. Voting Millar13 for his scum claim. *People started voting for him after I did, and for the same reasons*
What the hell is this? Examples of leadership? Is that supposed to clear you, for heading up a mislynch?
If he was town, he hurts the town through his behavior. He's not an isolated player; his actions affect which ever side he's on. He was a threat to the town because he was acting anti-town, there's not much more to say about it.
Aha, what happened to “town is town,” G? I’ve seen how you play (ongoing game, can say nothing more), and this is a departure. You end up voting for Emp, be he scum or town, in a very obvious attempt to distance yourself from that train wreck.

FoS: Giuseppe


(This recent exchange... well, it’s well-documented that zwet’s an idiot, so no worries dejkha, I saw nothing wrong with what you said.)
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Post Post #368 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:25 pm

Post by AndyTony »

AndyTony wrote:
Vote: Emp


I agree with Dejkha that we wouldn't want Emp around for lylo and that his demise is a matter of when, not if. My vote remains on Emp - but if Guiseppe is not cleared in the above by deadline, and done so well, I will change my vote to him. - it remains on Emp because frankly, I'm hoping for better from Guiseppe. Emp looks worse, he gets my present vote - - Guiseppe not being cleared in time or doing a poor job - he'd look worse.

You could be both scum and this could all be less troubling for me than I know.
In addition to my feelings to Guiseppe - I think that it's narrow minded to kick up a fuss about basing suspicions on NK's - - They are actually VERY valuble to us. We're not supposed to ignore scum actions. If we understand why they do what they do, we can lynch them silly.

Vote: Guiseppe
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Post Post #369 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:26 pm

Post by AndyTony »

Unvote
Vote:Guiseppe
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Post Post #370 (ISO) » Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:42 pm

Post by Giuseppe »

Town is Town is gone... I've gotten over that, after seeing the disasters of Millar, and Empking in another game. Never, ever gonna use that phrase again. Consider it a portion of my newbie experimentation within that game.

As for the list, I was providing examples of times when I did the exact opposite of what Dej said I was doing. I felt he was misrepresenting my behavior, and put forth examples to the contrary.

Anyway, I stand by Empking being scummy. However, in the spirit of open-mindedness, I've found another player worthy of examination.

Let's look at Zachrulez, shall we? He's been flying way low on the radar. Zach's last real detailed post was back on page 10, where he voted AndyTony. Since then, he hasn't posted often, nor has he put forth an original idea. He seems to be riding low, staying neutral, and his lack of opinion on every matter is conspicuous. It's not 'crap' as he calls it in last post: there's nothing really convoluted to look at in this game.

In his post 247, he calls and votes AT. And then... an unvote. And then nothing. I think that when potential for an AT lynch fell through, he abandoned his position because it wasn't going anywhere. Zach's behavior is 'Opportunistic' in this regard. He didn't even really offer an explanation for why his suspicions of AT fell through. He just unvoted. Watch for actions he's done that seem to be committed with less than full effort behind them, and you'll see he's playing in the outfield, and not really involved with the discussion that occurs closer to the front.

Contrast him with Grimmy, who when he appears, at least puts forward interesting and original opinions.



The above is just an observation I made while nodding off to sleep, and one I feel hasn't received enough attention. I'll read in more detail later today, because it's an unreasonable hour of the morning right now.
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Post Post #371 (ISO) » Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:18 am

Post by dejkha »

Pablo wrote:makes me nervous in the way that it implies Emp getting lynched ‘has’ to come in the future no matter what. Ignore the fuck for now, I agree (AT!), but let’s wait for more data to come in.
I do ignore him unless he asks a question that isn't stupid. Guess what? Scum want you to ignore them and I don't care how much we do, but it's stupid to let him live until lylo.
Pablo wrote:Why say this? Wait til he responds to explain to lessen a chance of a lie. Slight, unnecessary coaching.
My post was not game related, so it has no effect as evidence. I said that because if Emp says he's 18 or something, then he would just look like an idiot 18 yr old. But if he says he's , then ok, at least it's understandable.
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Post Post #372 (ISO) » Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:19 am

Post by dejkha »

Andy, I think you should make up your mind, because you certainly seem to be trying to get on certain wagons early in case they catch fire.
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Post Post #373 (ISO) » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:47 am

Post by AndyTony »

I definately made my mind up above with the Guiseppe vote. He didn't clear himself up for me, and his latest post barely touched on why he was innocent, it seemed more like "why these people are more guilty" - - - the unfortunate thing about that is everyone he's saying is more guilty seem to be guilty for the exact things we brought up against him. In that most recent post, he tried to shift all the htins we have on him, onto Zach - -

Zach told me the vote on me would stand until I better explained my actions - after I did that and things were picking up, he unvoted - I think Guiseppe was reaching trying to put someting on Zach.

He then made a more solid decision on Emp instead of his last seemingly people pleasing attitude of switchign the vote to what wouldn't piss anyone off

and then ended the message with an apologetic and non commital description of his circumstance - - don't get me wrong, we've all been tired, and we all share things like that - but he attached it to his full body reasoning so that he could say "hey, I understand you're mad, but like I said, I was out of it"
----------
My votes gonna stay - - and I don't think hopping off Emp is running from a burning wagon lol you've given him the mark of death and feel confident he shouldn't live, everyone is uneasy with him etc. - - I'm just living up to what I said in my post when I balanced these two players, and Dej, I've gotta go with Guiseppe.
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Post Post #374 (ISO) » Wed Mar 25, 2009 5:38 am

Post by Zachrulez »

I guess I should play with a full effort, voting for someone without all of the facts while I'm STILL behind on my reading eh Giuseppe?

The large exchange between Emp and AT, and then later Zwet and Dejkha has not done much to motivate me to catch up either.

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