War in Heaven II - Spirit of Vengeance (Over!)

[populartajo]

WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?
In all scenarios PEOPLE HURTING WHOEVER THINK THEY ARE SCUM are blatantly antitown since they are giving scum (if they are not) the free pass of being aggressive and random hurting that WE KNOW its detrimental to town in the long game
THIS WOULD NOT HAPPEN IF WE USED THE VOTING SYSYEM

WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?
In all scenarios PEOPLE HURTING WHOEVER THINK THEY ARE SCUM are blatantly antitown since they are giving scum (if they are not) the free pass of being aggressive and random hurting that WE KNOW its detrimental to town in the long game
THIS WOULD NOT HAPPEN IF WE USED THE VOTING SYSYEM

Spread the word!

Hehehehe, good idea.

[populartajo]

Fixed Votecount.
10 to massive hurting

Rolf 4 (Hoopla, Tenchi, Shinen, Nuwen)
Xyl 4 (viqles, zwet, Drench, Juls)
Shinnen 3 (Fonz, Tajo, ABR
Kinetic. 3(Shinnen, Cybele, rolf)
Viqles 2 (Kinetic, Nuwen)
ABR 2 (Hoopla, q21)
Walwishbone 2 (Xyl, DGB) --> This case is retarded and I would expect more from DGB and Xyl.
Cybele 1 (Kinetic)
Seraphim 1 (rolf)
Hoopla 1(Tenchi)

Not voting 4 (Giuseppe, Seraphim,The Fonz,WaltWishbone)

Lurker count 1 (Giuseppe)

[Kinetic]

Giuseppe... Have we heard from him at all?

[Kinetic]

I also would like to request to be healed please. I'm under my starting HP, so I'm effectively -2.

[Hoopla]

I'll heal, we need to stop hurting until we select a kill.

Heal: Kinetic

[populartajo]

Flay, tally please.

[Xylthixlm]

Next people that hurts anyone for whatever stupid reason should be hurted to death.

No.

[populartajo]

Next people that hurts anyone for whatever stupid reason should be hurted to death.

No.

Im giving you IMPORTANT reasons to avoid this stupid "Ill hurt whoever I like" idea. Its DETRIMENTAL to town in the long game when we are going to have all people at L-2 and scum distributing rage points for winning the game. IT HAS HAPPENED BEFORE.
We should be in control of who gets hurt and healed. That means that we DONT hurt anyone until we reach majority. If you are town, you are giving scum the free pass to hurt anyone they like.

[Xylthixlm]

I'm thinking the pushers for attacks are right. Once we have decided on a "lynch" can we at least agree that it isn't a bad thing to heal the other players if there is a lot of harm going around?

Healing up people who aren't under active attack is a good idea. Healing up people who have a real wagon on them is counterproductive.


People arguing about voting systems, random hurting, etc, etc, need to keep in mind two indisputable facts:
1) In the end, the thing that will determine whether the town wins or loses is

the order in which people die

. Nothing more, nothing less. We need to make sure scum die before townies as much as possible.
2) The scum get more influence over who dies with every week that passes.

#2 means that, if they're smart, the scum will be trying to slow the game down. Keep an eye on who is acting to slow the game down, and who is acting to keep it moving. If we're willing to punish people for slowing the game, that will mean the scum will have to help keep the pace up, which will be good for the town.

Here's some math:
The scum get a kill roughly every 2 weeks (more if we bring people down to low HP and leave them there a lot, less if we kill several scum early).
The town gets as many lynches as we want.
There are probably at most 5 scum.
If scum get close to a majority, they can heal to prevent the town from killing in a reasonable time, and force a win using rage. Call that -2 mislynches.
So, depending on our lynch speed, our number of mislynches before we go lose goes down:
If we kill once a day, we get around 8 mislynches.
If we kill once every 2 days, we get around 7 mislynches.
If we kill once every 4 days, we get around 6 mislynches.
If we kill once every 7 days, we get around 5 mislynches.
If we kill once every 10 days, we get get around 4 mislynches.
If we kill once every 14 days, we get get around 3 mislynches.


So... how much deliberation before each kill do you think is worth losing a mislynch?

[Xylthixlm]

Its DETRIMENTAL to town in the long game when we are going to have all people at L-2 and scum distributing rage points for winning the game.

In the long game TOWN LOSES. We have to win fast or we won't win at all.

[populartajo]

I know that town loses if we dont get to fast decisions. (more rage points).
The voting system doesnt delay the game as it has the same power of a hurt but with no damage of possible townies. What I dont want is a hurt-fest. We need to be in control of the hurting. How do we do this?: with a voting system like any other game. Lycnh majority. Massive hurting.
Nobody else gets hurt. Nobody else heals anyone.
The scum want an sceneario of all people hurting each other and people with low HPs. I know that we can catch scum in the disorder but at this point of the game the odds are low as shit.
Really, is that so hard to understand?

[Xylthixlm]

Majority voting is too slow.

[Tenchi]

Fixed Votecount.
10 to massive hurting

I wouldn't wait that long. I'd rather have a deadline, and see who has the most votes by then. Getting a majority with 10 people usually ends up with a lynch that "everyone agrees with". And you know what happens when "everyone agrees"...

...Townies get lynched.

Let's agree on a deadline. Better if somebody does the math.

[populartajo]

Kay. Replace voting with intent to hurt. Better?

[Xylthixlm]

Intent to hurt is fine. A fixed deadline is fine too.

[Xylthixlm]

But if we have a fixed deadline it should be something like 48 hours.

[Xylthixlm]

And while we argue about this stuff, I'm going to help DGB with WaltWishbone.

2 hours until I recharge.

[populartajo]

Fixed Votecount.
10 to massive hurting

I wouldn't wait that long. I'd rather have a deadline, and see who has the most votes by then. Getting a majority with 10 people usually ends up with a lynch that "everyone agrees with". And you know what happens when "everyone agrees"...

...Townies get lynched.

Let's agree on a deadline. Better if somebody does the math.

I agree with a deadline. 48 hours? Why is that? We know that scum possibly gets rage poitns after a week.
Also, if my calculations are right, scum can only

kill

someone (Ophan with 7 HPs) with rage points after 2 weeks. Assuming 4 scum, every scum gets 1 rage point every week.
If we control the random hurtings, scum wouldnt even have a chance to hurt secretly people since everyone but the current suspect would be at their toppings and we could heal everyone attempted to get hurt. They will have to waste all their rage points in someone to kill it.

[populartajo]

And while we argue about this stuff, I'm going to help DGB with WaltWishbone.

2 hours until I recharge.

Kay, Im talking to a wall here.

[populartajo]

Xyl, just a hint, not everyone can post as much as you do. What is the case on Walt again?

[Xylthixlm]

Fixed Votecount.
10 to massive hurting

I wouldn't wait that long. I'd rather have a deadline, and see who has the most votes by then. Getting a majority with 10 people usually ends up with a lynch that "everyone agrees with". And you know what happens when "everyone agrees"...

...Townies get lynched.

Let's agree on a deadline. Better if somebody does the math.

I agree with a deadline. 48 hours? Why is that? We know that scum possibly gets rage poitns after a week.
Also, if my calculations are right, scum can only

kill

someone (Ophan with 7 HPs) with rage points after 2 weeks. Assuming 4 scum, every scum gets 1 rage point every week.
If we control the random hurtings, scum wouldnt even have a chance to hurt secretly people since everyone but the current suspect would be at their toppings and we could heal everyone attempted to get hurt. They will have to waste all their rage points in someone to kill it.

I just did the complete math a couple of posts ago. You're underestimating how powerful 1 kill / 2 weeks is.

[Xylthixlm]

Xyl, just a hint, not everyone can post as much as you do. What is the case on Walt again?

Every word he's written has been scummy and noncommittal.

[populartajo]

Xyl, just a hint, not everyone can post as much as you do. What is the case on Walt again?

Every word he's written has been scummy and noncommittal.

With 1 post, wouldnt hurt to hear more about him, dont you think?
Thoughts about viqles, Shinnen, Kinetic and DGB?
I like your math. Doesnt mean that we should take hasted decisions.

[Xylthixlm]

With 1 post, wouldnt hurt to hear more about him, dont you think?

If Walt is scum, we kill a scum.
If Walt is town, we kill someone who is slowing the game down.

Seems like win/win to me. And I think Walt has a pretty good chance of being scum.

Thoughts about viqles, Shinnen, Kinetic and DGB?

I haven't looked at Shinnen. Kinetic and DGB are both posting enough that I don't want them to die too early. vIQ is vaguely scummy but there are better people to kill.

[zwetschenwasser]

IMO, this game is exploding too fast. I can barely keep up with it.