Mini 749 - Antarctic Mafia [Game Over]

[HowardRoark]

Backtrack.

SOLD!

vote freeko

What exactly are you looking for here?

I redirect that queston to you.

When life offers you a dream so far beyond any of your expectations, it’s not reasonable to grieve when it comes to an end.

Fishythefish - 1 (pacman281292)
Debonair Danny DiPietro - 1 (freeko)
Light-kun - 1 (na85)

freeko - 7 (Debonair Danny DiPietro, HowardRoark, Light-kun, Fishythefish, Nuwen, DraketheFake, JereIC)

pacman281292 - 2 (ZEEnon, Amished)


12 alive, 7 to lynch.

-Mod

(Vote Count accurate as of Post 329)

[JereIC]

God bless this mod and his soft orange belly.

Self-hammering strikes me as exactly what an emo player, townie or scum, would do. Then claiming that he meant to not unvote all along feels scummy to me.

Howard's vote puts you at L-1. How about a claim now, buddy?

[freeko]

How about a claim now, buddy?

My balls are on your chin?

[DraketheFake]

Hahahahahahahahahaha.

Trying to pass it off like he fake self-hammered intentionally. Classic.

[JereIC]

Screw it

Vote: freeko

[Amished]

Thank you Jere for getting rid of him. Wow.

[Nuwen]

The only thing more absurd than self-hammering while still claiming town is faking a self-hammer while still claiming town, with a twist of "little clue as to my intent" as an explanation.

[Light-kun]

I dunno, and I almost wish I could unvote now. *If I am not mistaken, I am voting Freeko, yes?*

Well, with Freeko's lynch, I'm going to be very surprised if he isn't mafia, but I have a sneaky suspicion he's going to flip town solely because of his play at the end almost doesn't strike me as scum somehow.... I think it is the meatbags comment. *Yay! I'm a bag of meat!*

*write Freeko's name in the death note. Sayonara , my little stupid*

[orangepenguin]

There’s a very good chance that they will eliminate us all—though in your case it won’t be punishment so much as dinnertime.

Fishythefish - 1 (pacman281292)
Debonair Danny DiPietro - 1 (freeko)
Light-kun - 1 (na85)

freeko - 7 (Debonair Danny DiPietro, HowardRoark, Light-kun, Fishythefish, Nuwen, DraketheFake, JereIC)

pacman281292 - 2 (ZEEnon, Amished)

The citizens of Antarctica could not decide who amongst them could be scum. They had just lost their kind, wise, and very old leader - he was at the great age of 17 - a tremendous life span for a simple minded penguin, especially under the circumstances. Everyone was questioned, even Ms. Penguita Jones, the town darling. It was when they heard they quiet, high-pitched shrieks from a tiny krill.

Nobody had noticed this krill before. It was so small...so insignificant. "It's always the quiet ones!" shouted one of the more abrasive penguins of the every increasing mob.

"Yes- I saw the krill walking outside my window during the night!" said the widow of one of the victims.

"Let her neck break for what he has done to our community!" shouted the mayor.

In Antarctica, there has always been a bit of superiority towards krill. Nobody takes them serious. Nobody thinks they are a real threat. But what if it was their arrogance that was leaving them blindsided. What if the krill seeked revenge? After all, the krill were among the common diets of all the Antarctic creatures.

"I am innocent!" squeaked the krill. Nobody would listen. One of the more eager members of the mob had a noose in hand...actually, it was way to small to be considered a noose, ignoring altogether the fact that it was made of ice, not rope.

The krill wanted to take matters into his own hands. He knew he was as good as dead. Even if he wasn't lynched, the town would've surely ate him..sooner or later. But the krill was too weak, and the town somehow managed to get the rope around it's tiny head.

Some say he died in an instant. Others said it took hours. But when he was dead, you realized...you made a mistake.

A card fell from freeko's pocket. It was an identification card. It explained everything. Even explaining that freeko wasn't even in town the night before..meaning..he wasn't mafia.

freeko -

Town Commuter / Krill

- Lynched Day 1.

It is now night 1.
Please send in your night actions before Friday, March 13 9 PM CST.

ZEEnon has requested replacement. Still awaiting response from pacman281292. Won't start Day 2 without the replacements (or pacman, if he returns + just ZEEnon's replacement.).

[orangepenguin]

The night was a long one. It was also very cold. Too cold. There was an eerie feeling in the air. As you did a quick head count before it was time for sleep, you realized that

pacman281292

was missing. Actually, nobody really saw him for a long time.

ZEEnon

volunteered to go look for him, hoping that they'd be able to find him. But ZEEnon was gone for long time. Finally, two figures emerged in the darkness. But it wasn't ZEEnon nor pacman281292. They looked...different. "I found him" panted

hohum

, who had his hand grasped around

Jazzmyn

, who was clearly not pacman. "Get to bed" yelled one of the elders.

So the town went off to bed. When they woke up and did a quick headcount...there was two people missing. TWO.

It wasn't long before the mangled remains of

Amished

were found, feathers everywhere, as was blood. But where was the other missing penguin?

"Over hear" screamed Jazzmyn. "Hurry" added Fishy.

On the opposite side of the town was

Debonair Danny DiPietro

, laying on his back. There was a red circle on the white of his coat in the center of his chest; the snow surrounding it also full of blood. Mrs. DiPietro, his penguin mate, let out a high pitched penguin squawk of pain, which echoed off the barren icy landscape.

Debonair Danny DiPietro, Vanilla Townie / Adelie Penguin, Killed Night 1

Amished, Vanilla Townie / Adelie Penguin, Killed Night 1

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

(hohum replaces ZEEnon and Jazzmyn replaces pacman281292 effective immediately)

P.S. I am adding the Vanilla Townie role PM to the first post.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Best of luck fellow penguins.

[Light-kun]

My first guess is serial killer, third guess vig, and beyond that; I have no idea why we have a second death. Hm... under the assumption of a 3 person mafia team and 1 serial killer, we might be in a bit of trouble tomorrow. With a vig, we could instruct their actions. And if we're lucky, assuming sk, the sk might listen as to, at least, appear to be vigilante. This could be useful for the time being if nothing else.

Other than that, I can't think of a reason for the kill. Except for some bizzare (though allowed) role like...naive doctor or something.

[Light-kun]

Also: Very angry at Freeko's lack of a claim.

I think I have an idea on who's scum. I'll read them in isolation later/tomorrow and post thoughts then.

[HowardRoark]

Interesting. There are several possibilities for the second kill. I don't know if any constructive discussion can come of it at this point.

mod: prod na85

-- Last post Mar 04, 2009 9:29 pm (I realize that there was a RL issue, but I want to make sure that we are moving forward with a full deck. Thank you.)

Since Day 1 ended March 9 and the thread was locked, I'll give them two more days to respond (a "week"). If na85 hasn't posted by then, I will give him a prod. But since the thread was locked, I'll wait awhile before giving him a prod.

Welcome, hohum and Jazzmyn.

[Light-kun]

I disagree Howard. It tells us that there is a second killing role out their. So, we can keep our minds open to the possibility that a serial killer is roaming, which means watching for someone who seems particularly scummy but isn't connected to anyone else.

[Nuwen]

I disagree Howard. It tells us that there is a second killing role out their. So, we can keep our minds open to the possibility that a serial killer is roaming, which means watching for someone who seems particularly scummy but isn't connected to anyone else.

It's in a serial killer's best interest to play with the town during the day. A scum lynch and townie lynch both have the same value towards an SK's win condition, but actively scum-hunting has the added bonus of garnering town support and possible doc protection.

LA until Monday or Tuesday, one of my desktop's disk partitions shit out. My other partitions have experimental crap on them that I don't want to deal with, so I'll be sitting on my hands until my shiny new laptop arrives. I must also take time to mourn my lost Vig comics.

[Amished]

*cry* Bah. Good luck everyone.

[Light-kun]

I disagree Howard. It tells us that there is a second killing role out their. So, we can keep our minds open to the possibility that a serial killer is roaming, which means watching for someone who seems particularly scummy but isn't connected to anyone else.

It's in a serial killer's best interest to play with the town during the day. A scum lynch and townie lynch both have the same value towards an SK's win condition, but actively scum-hunting has the added bonus of garnering town support and possible doc protection.

LA until Monday or Tuesday, one of my desktop's disk partitions shit out. My other partitions have experimental crap on them that I don't want to deal with, so I'll be sitting on my hands until my shiny new laptop arrives. I must also take time to mourn my lost Vig comics. :(

Interesting theory, but we should still be wary of possible serial killer.

[Jazzmyn]

Hello, all.

I am the replacement for pacman. I am reading the thread and hope to be sufficiently up to speed by Sunday to post something substantive about my thoughts and observations of the game thusfar.

Regards.
Jazz

[JereIC]

Welcome Jazzmyn and hohum!

HowardRoark, I asked you a question in posts 298 and 300, would you mind answering it now?

[DraketheFake]

Doing a re-read, taking a look especially at Light-kun and na85. Results in a while.

[HowardRoark]

@DraketheFake: I believe that your main point was his vote hop. JereIC believes that your case was based on a poor argument from him. Perhaps you can clarify.

[DraketheFake]

I mean, does it

really

matter? I haven't felt misrepresented by either of your viewpoints, and both of those things are reasons that I voted for DDD.

I see the "textbook" comment and the latter half of the argument as one in the same. Perhaps I am missing the difference. Thank you for clarifying.

This is essentially correct. Back to scum-hunting.

[DraketheFake]

The conduct of Light-kun and na85, together and separate, bothered me during my re-read, starting with Light-kun's oddity in post 132:

Excellent, thank you Nuwen.

If you do not contribute more than a single line in agreement with an argument, I will write your name in the Death Note.

You do NOT post like this in order to appear to be actively playing a game when your not.

I would prefer you type a [valid] post when you have the time to this crap, but if you can only do the latter, I request you replace yourself. This doesn't help town for you to just say, "This person is right." Oh, and as a note, I will refer to you as "Cow" since I don't really like using "na" as a name of reference, and I am much to lazy to recall alphanumerics.

Light-kun here attacks na85 for a ridiculous and completely misinterpreted reason; na85's one-line quoted post is in reference to a question he asked about typical roles in a Normal game that Nuwen answered with a link. However, there is a kernel of truth to Light-kun's basic accusation: while this was still the early game, na85's only truly contentful post was 107:

Drake, I agree with your read on ZEEnon, but I'm not sure why you find DDD scummy when Nuwen is using basically the same arguments. Could you point out what exactly made DDD's post scummy and Nuwen's posts not? Is the fact that he's jumping votes while Nuwen is just backing up her original vote with a serious argument?

DDD's vote was opportunistic and there is no real reason to push zeenon to L-2 when the explosion we witnessed was a clear indication that he already feels the pressure is real.

IMO Nuwen's case is different because she backed up her opinions with sound logic and she did it first (i.e. no opportunity to say "Yeah I like that argument, let's go with it").

A sentiment I agree with. na85 had previously expressed a number of mostly joking things (concordance with my joke case on ZEEnon, for instance), and had responded to ZEEnon's wall-o-text return with due levity.

na85 responds to Light-kun's 132 in 140:

Here's a thought, how about you calm the fuck down?

I had a question that was relevant to the game we're playing, and Nuwen was kind enough to repond and point me in the right direction. I then thanked her for taking the time to help a new player like myself.

As for your assinine comments about my level of activity: I play how I want to play. You do NOT get to dictate my play style, and certainly not in insulting, superior tones the way you did. If you can't handle people who don't post every day, I request you get down on your knees and kiss my ass since it doesn't help town for you to just say "You're a bad player."

[Insults snipped]

unvote: Drake the Fake, vote: Light-kun

Why am I voting for you? Because town has no use for trolls.

As a town we want people who will calmly and rationally debate and discuss.

You don't seem interested in doing that so you're either scum or you're a poor town player. Either way, you aren't pro-town.

The bolded part is mine, and important down the road.

na85 made a number of useful posts on page 7, going back and forth with DDD, coming down on Mizz.Mafia with an example from real life, and
discussing that with JereIC, and then Light-kun makes this post:

I have to agree with na85 that Light-kun’s post was picking a troll. You can argue that na85 is active lurking by just agreeing with other people, but Light-kun’s post was just picking a fight without reason.

Did you even read my post?

The cow thing was approximately 1/8th of my post's point and was generally tongue in cheek. (Granted, I assumed cow could handle it better, but I don't really care as it is all very unimportant and beside the point.)

I would like it noted that while Cow acted within reason, everything else in the post was actually game related and ignored:

Big, fat, meaningless FoS Danny and ZEEnon.

Thus far, I have seen several different arguments and am ready so:

0=Town, 100=mafia

DraketheFake - 29%
Fishythefish - 38%
JereIC - 32%
Light-kun - 100% (This is joke, as I am "Obvious Kira")
pacman281292 - 37% (Mostly due to the WTF-O-Meter
ZEEnon - 41%
Mizz.Mafia - --
na85 - 30%
Amished - 38%
Debonair Danny DiPietro - 40%
freeko - 31%
Nuwen - 27%

I don't really have much analysis at this moment, and I won't be making a joke at another player's expense. Sorry since that pissed people off enough to ignore the rest of my post. However, ZEEnon and Danny still owe me responses for that post.

Admittedly, I've fallen into the same trap as the other people he's accusing of short-sightedness here, so I'll mention that the other game-related bits of 132 involved asking ZEEnon and DDD questions.

I'm not a huge fan of meaningless percentages to begin with, but at least his are generally consistent with who he'd been hounding/voting for so far. It confuses me that Amished/Fishy were so high, given that I can find him having posted anything about them, and it seems like if he's just giving out higher numbers for less active players then certainly pacman should have been higher. The only troubling thing here, I suppose, is that he goes out of his way to prove he's not particularly suspicious of na85, putting him in the bottom 3. This seems like a pretty severe backtrack from somebody who just accused another player of active lurking to the point where he asked that player to replace himself, and Light-kun never acknowledges that aspect of his original post, only the "Cow' thing.

na85 has this to say in 176:

The cow thing was approximately 1/8th of my post's point and was generally tongue in cheek.

Take note, kids, this is what a weeaboo looks like when he backpedals. My vote's staying on you, douchebag.

And here's me in 189, to na85:

Take note, kids, this is what a weeaboo looks like when he backpedals. My vote's staying on you, douchebag.

I'll give you your first response rant because Light-kun overstepped his bounds, but if he got under your skin to the point where you can't rationally analyze his behavior anymore then you're going to be a big burden to this town. Be the bigger person, it's way more satisfying I promise.

That said I see this less as backpedaling and more as him - again - misconstruing the problem other people had with his response to you.

I see it less as this now having re-read both L-k posts, but at the time I was more concerned with DDD.

Light-kun, in your percentages, Amished and I follow your two explained suspects by a mere couple of percents, at 6% clear of the approximate baseline. You haven't mentioned either of our names yet, and we happen to be two of the very few other players who have criticised you. Can you explain your suspicions?

Fish, I will only respond to you at the moment: You seem to have indicated, either subconsciously or unintentionally, something that I feel should be considered a bit of an assumption. It could, also, be a jest, but this mark is one of the few telling comments I've seen. I'm not going to comment on it just yet as I need to reread that post to decide and look at your play in isolation.

Fishy's is a good question and one I just wondered about myself.

In 207, Light-kun responds to na85's 176:

Take note, kids, this is what a weeaboo looks like when he backpedals. My vote's staying on you, douchebag.

I just realized this post exist reading from page 6-7 and I failed to acknowledge you attacking me. Is calling one who uses a dancing cow for an avatar really offensive to you? I suppose I've being seeing a lot of overreaction from you, but you never actually asked me to not call you cow. (And if you did, do tell me where, because I have surely missed it.)

L-k responds, but again fails to address the main point of contention between them. Hint: I don't think he ever minded that you were calling him Cow.

L-k then spends much of the next page attacking DDD, most notably in 215:

Of course, I'm most concerned about getting out of suspicion.

1 I have one piece of confirmed information. I win with the town. If I focus on getting someone else lynched there's a 20-35% "random" chance we lynch correctly and a 65-80% random chance we lynch a fellow pro-town player and that's assuming

I somehow move the attention off me while spending more time examining other people.2 If I fail in moving suspicion off me and I'm lynched then there's a 100% chance a pro-town player has been lynched.

3 It's simple math that I should dedicate the bulk of my time to not being lynched and yes, I have done some hunting in my defenses.

1. This is a scum type play no matter your alignment. You seem to then spend the rest of the paragraph giving town reasons to defend your scum type play.

2. Why are you not devoting you time to examining other players? Why are all your posts primarily defensive? I think that while you should acknowledge cases against you, most of your time, effort, and posting space should be dedicated to catching scum and not in constantly back tracking to clarify a previous post's meaning. You to be doing the latter a lot and failing to make persuasive arguments to prove people are scum.

3. This is a plea to emotion or majority or both. In any of these cases, it is still a logical fallacy and does nothing to sway me away from voting you.

But L-k never votes for DDD. In fact, on the very next page, he votes freeko on what appears to be the most cursory of reasons:

Now for that solo post look at Debonair.

Unvote; Vote Freeko

I believe his last post is scumhunting, thus your post is a lie.

He announces that he'll be taking a look at Danny's posts solo, and then, based on the idea that Danny's last post was "scumhunting," and that freeko has said that DDD did "no scumhunting," he votes for freeko. This seems mildly inconsistent at best. Then comes 244:

I call "I win with town" as a plea to majority, which is scummy in my book.

I was getting a slight "survivor" vibe off of him, but if he were, I'm pretty sure claiming it would result in his lynch anyway. And...

Hm... You still lie, you still say he did zero scum hunting. I see some.

Vote Freeko

Needless speculation about DDD being a survivor (?), followed by a re-assertion of weak reasoning and an unnecessary re-vote. L-k then responds directly to freeko in 256, and further re-states his agreement with the wagon on freeko in 268 while clarifying which post of DDD's he deemed to be scumhunting (225).

And then he finally answers Fishy's question from way back when about what made him so scummy, in 305:

My high percent on the fish is due to an extremely far reach that can conclude he is scummy off a statement made during the rvs, which might be reading too much into flavor. I am not too informed on the matter and due to his play (versus a reading in his word choice), he looks to be one of the more town aligned players. Making the assumption I live to see the point where it is irrelevant (he's dead, or we are in lylo, or I'm about to be lynched.) I'll be sure to explain, but it really isn't anything to concern yourself with and it certainly isn't damning. (If it were damning, not mentioning it would be stupid.)

Which... well... I don't even know.

na85's last post yesterday came at the 258 mark, the result of some outside-the-game events and mostly pre-freeko's immense meltdown. na85 ended the day voting for L-k, and hasn't posted since.

This post is a monster, and I apologize, and I'm not even sure how much can be gleaned from it. The reason I went back looked at this interaction is because the reactions seemed to be disproportionate: na85's initial rage, Light-kun's seeming inability to address what was actually the most insulting part of his first post, and then the delay in addressing it again. na85's disappearance, while legitimate, doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't also useful in keeping distance between the players. Right now of the two I'm more concerned about Light-kun, for general weak reasoning and his list of percentages, to the point where I suppose I can cast the first stone today, especially considering his early-day set-up speculation that seems more alarmist than practical.

Vote: Light-kun

.

[JereIC]

I don't want to distract from DtF's points about Light, but this is bugging me:

@DraketheFake: I believe that your main point was his vote hop. JereIC believes that your case was based on a poor argument from him. Perhaps you can clarify.

My question isn't about DtF's rationale, it's about why you were integrating it into your case against me. How do you get from "JereIC was wrong about DtF's early post" to "JereIC is scum"?