Mini 745 - Moving Day Mafia (GAME OVER!)

[Porkens]

First of all, I have to apologize to the game at large for my last post. I perceived what dejkha said to me as calling me stupid. I don't play mafia to be personally insulted. However, my reaction was out of proportion and petulant. I will continue to participate in the game and interact with everyone.

@the "brothers" situation

: In answer to dejkha's question, and the question from Zer0ph34r and ac1983fan; no, being brothers doesn't make you scummy. Posting from the same i.p. or home doesn't make you scummy. However, your reaction to Herodotus' accusation, that you wrote Zer0's wiki entry, makes it seem like you were deffinetly trying to hide something.

When Hero said that you wrote the wiki, your reaction was over-the-top defensive. Then, after Hero pointed out the i.p. addresses, you blurt out that you two are, in fact, brothers who post from the same computer (which, by the way, still doesn't eliminate the possibility that you wrote his wiki).

To me, you clearly felt like you had something to hide. That is what was scummy about the exchange.

Zer0, why didn't either of you tell us that you were brothers right away when Herod asked dej about the wiki?

All

I'm really surprised at dejkha's death.

I'm still confident with my scumlist from yesterday, with a little re-ordering (and dejkha being killed shortens it for the time being).
ac1983fan
Tovarish (who still hasn't answered my question from yesterday)
Zer0f34r

[Herodotus]

I'm really surprised at dejkha's death.

Why? I'm more surprised about the fact that q21 was a cop.

@Zero: So is everything on your wiki page written by you?

[Porkens]

Why? I'm more surprised about the fact that q21 was a cop.

Given that he was chopped up into bits, I'm assuming he was SK'd and not vig'd. He was a strange choice for a scum kill imo.

[don_johnson]

i am always suspicious of the first to post on day 2. especially when they write:

Well, that sucks... we lost our cop and a townie.

we can all read. added commentary like that above is usually considered a "scum tell".

ac: i don't get your vote. what is your actual reasoning?

i am not sure what to make of the "brothers", but it seems we won't be getting answers. the one who reacted suspiciously is no longer among us.

[Herodotus]

Why? I'm more surprised about the fact that q21 was a cop.

Given that he was chopped up into bits, I'm assuming he was SK'd and not vig'd. He was a strange choice for a scum kill imo.

I agree that the flavor text does suggest non-vig. Why do you think he was a strange choice for a SK? And why are you not considering a second mafia?

[Porkens]

He was a strange choice for an SK because he had a lot of suspicion on him (might have gotten hung if I hadn't hammered K7) and probably would have gotten himself hung sooner or later. Seems like a waste of a nightkill.

I think the flavor is not only non-vig, but also non-maf. I've also never seen 2 mafia groups in a mini normal.

[Herodotus]

He was a strange choice for an SK because he had a lot of suspicion on him (might have gotten hung if I hadn't hammered K7) and probably would have gotten himself hung sooner or later. Seems like a waste of a nightkill.

Ok, I agree with this... though there could have been a motive we can't see. Maybe if Zero is the SK, he was worried his brother might be able to figure it out from out-of-game information. Or something Dejkha said worried the SK.
Regardless, we now have three confirmed innocents, and the game deserves a re-read from all town-sided people with that in mind.

[Zer0ph34r]

Yes, everything in my wiki page was written by me.

[q21]

typical...

BAH!

[dejkha]

Consider this post BAH'd!

[ac1983fan]

i am always suspicious of the first to post on day 2. especially when they write:

Well, that sucks... we lost our cop and a townie.

we can all read. added commentary like that above is usually considered a "scum tell".

ac: i don't get your vote. what is your actual reasoning?

i am not sure what to make of the "brothers", but it seems we won't be getting answers. the one who reacted suspiciously is no longer among us.

Discussion = good for town.
Hammering when good discussion is going on = bad for town.
I don't really think it's a scumtell, I guess I just type out whatever I'm thinking at the time of my post. Obviously it's not really necessary, but I don't know, I feel compulsed to say whatever I think, regardless if it is necessary/obvious.

He was a strange choice for an SK because he had a lot of suspicion on him (might have gotten hung if I hadn't hammered K7) and probably would have gotten himself hung sooner or later. Seems like a waste of a nightkill.

Ok, I agree with this... though there could have been a motive we can't see. Maybe if Zero is the SK, he was worried his brother might be able to figure it out from out-of-game information. Or something Dejkha said worried the SK.
Regardless, we now have three confirmed innocents, and the game deserves a re-read from all town-sided people with that in mind.

I'm assuming by three confirmed innocents, you mean three

dead

confirmed innocents, right? Unless you have some triple cop investigative ability.

[Herodotus]

He was a strange choice for an SK because he had a lot of suspicion on him (might have gotten hung if I hadn't hammered K7) and probably would have gotten himself hung sooner or later. Seems like a waste of a nightkill.

Ok, I agree with this... though there could have been a motive we can't see. Maybe if Zero is the SK, he was worried his brother might be able to figure it out from out-of-game information. Or something Dejkha said worried the SK.
Regardless, we now have three confirmed innocents, and the game deserves a re-read from all town-sided people with that in mind.

I'm assuming by three confirmed innocents, you mean three

dead

confirmed innocents, right? Unless you have some triple cop investigative ability.

Do you think these are the only interpretations of what I said? If so, do you think they are both possible? How would you even rate the possibility that we would have more than one cop?

[ac1983fan]

Ok, I agree with this... though there could have been a motive we can't see. Maybe if Zero is the SK, he was worried his brother might be able to figure it out from out-of-game information. Or something Dejkha said worried the SK.
Regardless, we now have three confirmed innocents, and the game deserves a re-read from all town-sided people with that in mind.

I'm assuming by three confirmed innocents, you mean three

dead

confirmed innocents, right? Unless you have some triple cop investigative ability.

Do you think these are the only interpretations of what I said? If so, do you think they are both possible? How would you even rate the possibility that we would have more than one cop?

I was just clarifying. I severly doubt we have multiple cops, but I just wanted to make sure you meant killa7, q21, and dejkha are three confirmed innocents.

[Herodotus]

I just wanted to make sure you meant killa7, q21, and dejkha are three confirmed innocents.

yes.

[Porkens]

The following is pure speculation.

Three things from last night just blow my mind a little:

1. Dejkha was killed by an SK
2. The Mafia killed our cop
3. Herod is still alive

An alive dejkha today would be a strong candidate for lynch, in my opinion. So I'm guessing his kill was an attempt to create confusion, or the SK thought he was a power role. Either would indicate either a very smart or very nervous SK.

The dead cop could be random luck by the mafia, but I think more likely that q21 got pegged by a smart maf.

I thought for sure Herod would be dead this morning. He's a strong player, and I just don't see any of the scum leaving him alive on purpose. Which, and it's not a good reason to lynch, I know, suggests that Herod is scum :p

But let's play with that idea for a minute;

Herod is one of the mafia; he accurately pegs q21 as the cop (which I believe he could do). Who's his partner?

Zer0, as it's been suggested, killed dejkha because he was worried that the crap yesterday would implicate him as scum.

Still unexplained in this setup is the connection between tovarish and AC.

So, let me beg you one last time Torv; Why did you spend so much time defending AC yesterday? Is there any way you can explain your connection to one another?

[Erratus Apathos]

The dead cop could be random luck by the mafia, but I think more likely that q21 got pegged by a smart maf.

I thought for sure Herod would be dead this morning. He's a strong player, and I just don't see any of the scum leaving him alive on purpose. Which, and it's not a good reason to lynch, I know, suggests that Herod is scum :p

So you're saying that the mafia knew q21 was the cop, but the most plausible reason they didn't kill Herodotus is because he's mafia?

[raider8169]

Just so everyone knows I will start checking for Prods tomorrow morning.

[don_johnson]

i am going to reread. dej seems an odd choice for sk. the whole "brothers" thing is definitely odd now. of course, if zero killed his brother he's not going to cooperate with an investigation, so i am not sure if that is even a plausible avenue.

i am still flustered by ac's opening post.

Discussion = good for town.
Hammering when good discussion is going on = bad for town.
I don't really think it's a scumtell, I guess I just type out whatever I'm thinking at the time of my post. Obviously it's not really necessary, but I don't know, I feel compulsed to say whatever I think, regardless if it is necessary/obvious.

of course you don't think its a scumtell.

Porkens hammer was quick, however, he stuck to his word. of course, he was replacing plonky, who left some unanswered questions, and the Herodscum theory is also extreme wifomic speculation.

^ Right now I see AC as eager to lynch k7 precisely because he's so unhelpful. While I see it as tunnel-vision, it's not particularly scummy. Yet.

reading tov in isolation i see this as out of place. prior to this, tov had only voiced suspicion of K-7, with some suspicion on me for what seemed like a misunderstanding. what sticks out to me is the "yet". at what point was this going to be "scummy"? Tov's case on K7 was extremely similar. i.e. "k7 is scum because he's unhelpful." if you simply add the word "scum" to ac's accusations then you have a match. was this post a distancing attempt?

[Porkens]

The dead cop could be random luck by the mafia, but I think more likely that q21 got pegged by a smart maf.

I thought for sure Herod would be dead this morning. He's a strong player, and I just don't see any of the scum leaving him alive on purpose. Which, and it's not a good reason to lynch, I know, suggests that Herod is scum :p

So you're saying that the mafia knew q21 was the cop, but the most plausible reason they didn't kill Herodotus is because he's mafia?

Ohhh that is a good, good point. If the scum really thought q21 was cop, they wouldn't have hit Herod.

And the SK would have assumed the scum would hit herod so...they...hit...dejkha. ok well that part still doesn't make sense but it's not as important as the first. Good call EA.

[Zer0ph34r]

I'm not the serial killer and if I was, wouldn't it seem a bit too obvious of me to kill dejkha? I too was surprised because I never even took into consideration that a serial killer could be in the game. And I'm not saying this to get attention off me, but the fact that herodotus is still in the game means one of two things (to me) 1: He is mafia. 2: The mafia knew that we would lynch him because he seems scummy. So this kind of confuses me as what to do because he is currently my number one concern.

[ac1983fan]

We need more posts from tovarish, ZEEnon, and Jazzmyn (although I understand some of you had limited access, RL troubles etc). We're playing a nine person game at this point, and all three of you (esp ZEEnon) contributed rather little day one. We can't have just six people talking.

Discussion = good for town.
Hammering when good discussion is going on = bad for town.
I don't really think it's a scumtell, I guess I just type out whatever I'm thinking at the time of my post. Obviously it's not really necessary, but I don't know, I feel compulsed to say whatever I think, regardless if it is necessary/obvious.

of course you don't think its a scumtell.

I wouldn't think it was a scumtell had anyone else done it, either.

[Porkens]

I'm not the serial killer and if I was, wouldn't it seem a bit too obvious of me to kill dejkha? I too was surprised because I never even took into consideration that a serial killer could be in the game. And I'm not saying this to get attention off me, but the fact that herodotus is still in the game means one of two things (to me) 1: He is mafia. 2: The mafia knew that we would lynch him because he seems scummy. So this kind of confuses me as what to do because he is currently my number one concern.

Umm, so you think Herod is scum? Why?

Your list leaves out the 3rd option that EA brought up. #2, again, doesn't make much sense. How does he seem scummy?

[Herodotus]

Sorry I won't be able to say much today. I've been playing in marathon day, and now I need to get some work done. I plan to make a full reread tomorrow if I can.

The assumption that I should be dead because I am a strong player is wrong. Setting aside that it's WIFOM, there's the more important fact that I'm no stronger than others here. My best guess is that the mafia left me alive on the assumption that I would lead the lynch against Dejkha. They did not know he would be NK'ed, but they knew he'd be a wasted lynch, and that I'd probably support and argue for it.
That's assuming the flavor means what it appears to mean.

[Zer0ph34r]

That third option does make sense, but ultimately ends up being a form of #1. And based on memories of what I read, or at least in my eyes, herodotus would have gotten at least some votes on the first day had it not been for kill7's lack of posting.

[Porkens]

That third option does make sense, but ultimately ends up being a form of #1.

How?

If the scum really thought q21 was cop, they wouldn't have hit Herod.