Mini 727 - Mafia in Standardville - Game Over

[LlamaFluff]

Vote Count

Danchaofan (3) - Charter, Lowell, Darox
Darox (2) - Master Ruck, Freeko

Not Voting (2) - Danchaofan, Tubby216

Two weeks to deadline.
With seven alive its four to lynch

[Master Ruck]

I'm happy to claim now, but I see the consencus is to wait for freeko to claim targets so I shall wait unless it changes and I am asked by all to claim before that.

[Danchaofan]

How is that buddying?

I'm not saying you're buddying, I'm just saying you're scumbuddies with Panzer.

Because if you say I'm buddies with pz, I'm buddies with pz. QED?

This is simple stuff, and I don't think anyone could accidentally misinterpret this. I think he's doing this on purpose to avoid the actual point.

He pulled out a quote of me questioning his logic and says I'm buddies with pz because of it. How is it obvious that I am scum because I question his train of logic?

Just saying "why the lies?" counts as saying nothing against Xdaamo.

voting before re-reading, attempted quick hammer are the unmentioned things that I felt were add worthy at the time of vote, other things also convinced me he was scum.

This is very vague generic stuff that anyone could throw together in two seconds. It hardly looks sturdy to me. What are the 'other things'?

Your post looks generic and thrown together in two seconds so bite me. I also voted him for his lack of content, suspicions were confirmed by his self-preservative attitude, threat of a self-hammer, and some other things that I'm too lazy to re-read now.

Saying 'charter did something more than me' isn't a defense of your actions.

You're either a hypocrite, ergo scummy or not scummy thus what I did isn't scummy either.

The difference between Charters actions and yours (Talking about positions on Xd and Panzer) is Charter did something about it and provided reasons. Trying to shrug off the accusation of back-pedalling by accusing charter of it too is not only again trying to distract from you and the points against you, but also really not applicable because what Charter did and what you did really aren't in the same league.

The degree to which our perceptions changed were different. He moved his vote to who he thought became the most suspicious person, I kept mine on who I felt was still the most suspicious person. Comparing myself to Charter is relevant because he is holding me to a double standard and calling me scummy for doing something very similar to what he did. 398 I point out why I was becoming more suspicious of pz. xd was part vibe part me falling out of the game and not reading deeply into his end of day behavior.

I'm not saying you're suspicious because you didn't change your vote. I said you were backpedaling by saying you were less suspicious of Xdaamo and distancing from Panzer by saying you were more suspicious of him. Your post there was a pretty clear cut case of scumbuddy distancing.

So if someone behaves a bit more town I can't be less suspicious of them? If someone began to act scummy I can't say I'm more suspicious?

Appeal to ridicule, etc.[/quote]It's not appeal to ridicule, what he said was ridiculous.

[freeko]

Freeko should claim his targets first, then have Ruck claim.

Request denied.

[Lowell]

I'm happy to claim now, but I see the consencus is to wait for freeko to claim targets so I shall wait unless it changes and I am asked by all to claim before that.

^^^ scummy.

MR should claim, THEN folks can go back and tell us their targets.

[Lowell]

Dammit. Fix that,

mod

?

Triple post cleaned up

[charter]

It doesn't freaking matter. Someone just claim. Both of you are so scummy it isn't funny.

[charter]

V/LA for a couple days

[Master Ruck]

Doesn't really matter when I claim. I'm a town vanilla, so I wouldn't have affected the results of the watcher anyway.

[freeko]

Fair enough. aside fromt ehre being a few too many town vanilla roles. here are the watch results

N1: my predecessor chose to watch charter, and failed to do so. This is consistent with the claim of hider. Therefore I believe charter's claim and have no reason not to. Though it is also plausible that my predecessor was roleblocked, I do not believe this to be.

N2: I chose to watch lowell. He did not go anywhere. This could substantiate his claim of being vanilla. Though it also doesnt mean anything conclusively.

[freeko]

tubby216 = 1 shot vig and already used
Master Ruck = vanilla
Danchaofan = vanilla
Darox = paranoid gun owner
Lowell = vanilla
charter = hider
freeko = watcher

seems to be the final claim summary.

[Master Ruck]

Freeko, you're confusing watcher with tracker. If you watched lowell last night and nothing happened, that means nobody targetted Lowell not that he targetted no one.

[freeko]

You are right, I am a tracker. I thought they were the same thing. looking at the wiki on the roles confirmed to me that I was confusing the roles. I had assumed that since I watch the targets to see where they go that a watcher and a tracker were the same thing.

My role says that I am a tracker.

Sorry for the confusion.

[Master Ruck]

Not much I can say about that except that's quite a fundamental error.

[Lowell]

I say freeko is telling the truth anyway.

[tubby216]

ok so now that all is said and done is dan the best lynch??

[Danchaofan]

I say we lynch lowell.

[Master Ruck]

Wow. Thank you dan. Thanks to your great insight I suddenly see the light. Though, for the benefit of the non-believers, perhaps you should explain to them why we should do such an act.

[freeko]

I am going to do an exercise in the theoretical here.(REMIND YOU THIS IS THEORETICAL) As it is clear that someone is lying. There will be many crazy accusations here, and most of them really have no merit aside from my crazy little mind thinking them up.

tubby: Roleblocked SK on N1? Scored a kill on N2? As much as I want to believe this claim of 1shot vig. There is also this plausible scenario. Guess the thought process hinges on what happens on N3.

Darox: PGO seems like a convenient excuse to not have someone target them for an ability when they are something else. I think if someone is most likely lying about their claim then the person doing so would be this one (aside from the vanilla claimers). I certainly cannot risk using my ability here to track him as it would kill me in doing so if his claim was truthful. This becomes the worst question ever then, is it worth the risk to check his claim? I will say that I have never seen a PGO in a game before so I have no idea what to do here.

vanilla claimers: obviosuly the most likely to be lying and/or scum. Could be trying to hide a power role, they could be scum, they could be telling the truth, and its all a big circular logic battle to see if its worth trying to figure out. Though to go off on the tubby tangent , I think one of these is plausibly a roleblocker. If 2 people are killed again at night. Which could likely mean that tubby and a vanilla are lying. I will most likely track someone other than lowell that is alive from this group.

Im not really sure if this is in any way helpful, but it made me think laterally a bit to see if I could find possible holes in someones claim. Tthis is all speculation as I have no firm reason to not believe any of the claims that were made for now.

[tubby216]

wow well that all seems plausible but i asure you freeko i am a one shot vig,

[Master Ruck]

Freeko, you basically end your post by saying "these are all my thoughts, but of course, I could be completely wrong" giving yourself a wonderous out as well as making it look like you are posting some kind of content, which is actually what all your posts seem to look like to me. Your posts have been very short with little scum hunting at all which combined with Artifex's behaviour (posted some content but rarely posted) makes you look like scum.

Unvote
Vote: Freeko

[freeko]

I made it clear that its speculation right from the start. Which by its nature is a exercise it what could be, might be, but very well is not to be.

Your posts have been very short with little scum hunting at all...

pot.. kettle.. black... Something seems to not fit in here. You are doing the exact same thing as what your excuse for voting for me is. Shall we look back at your last 5 posts? 10 posts? I could keep going but I think the point is made.

I cannot help but think that since I did not reveal my targets, you were thinking of a way to throw up a fake claim that would have gotten yourself a mislynch. Instead you had to take the safe play and claim vanilla since you couldnt counterfeit anyone. I could speculate on this and you further, but I think its not worth it. It really all boils down to what would be WIFOM arguments anyway.

unvote

[Master Ruck]

Let's get rid of the wifom then. Yes, the pot is calling the kettle black. I'm being a hypocrit as I'm not posting much content myself, but my lame excuse is that I'm still a bit new, not that good at scum hunting and I'm trying and learning to be better. It does not, however, excuse the act from being scummy so anyone else is equally viable to use the same excuse on me and I won't contest it.

If it were contested, however, then I would think even worse of the person. In fact, you've done exactly what I thought you would do. Be defensive of your views (though no as overly defensive as I thought you would be) then turn on the spot and point your finger at me. Heck, the only reason you didn't vote me is because that would be so omgus it wouldn't even be funny, but that unvote is close enough to say the same thing. Why did you unvote then and not earlier? Why do my actions suddenly absolve Darox? Could it be because there's suddenly less of a chance of a wagon forming on him? or is it because if he is lynched and flips town you don't want to look like one of the sole primary pushers of his lynch?

[freeko]

Why did you unvote then and not earlier? Why do my actions suddenly absolve Darox? Could it be because there's suddenly less of a chance of a wagon forming on him? or is it because if he is lynched and flips town you don't want to look like one of the sole primary pushers of his lynch?

Ok, I will ignore the first part. Just for the record I joined a little over a month before you and have a whole 2 games experience, so Iill leave it at I personally dont buy the whole "woe is me" line.

1) I actually forgot to unvote earlier.
2) There are more options than just Darox, and I plan on exploring them.
3) A wagon at this point? ummm. ok. Though you initially seemed happy to hop aboard yourself. Maybe I should ask the same question to you?
4) If he is lynched and fips town then it is the majority of the towns fault, not just my own. I cant lynch him by myself. I can only go with what I know.

[Master Ruck]

I can only take you on your word for 1 which is not much at all in this game. Question 2 is only in part answered if I believe the answer to 1. If 1 is bull, which I think it is, then 2 remains unanswered. 3 you have missed the point completely. It's four to lynch now, and someone with two votes has a much better chance of being lynched than someone with only one vote. With two people who haven't yet voted, one of which being dan who would obviously not want to be lynched being at L-1, any other possible lynch will save him and his scum partner will do what they can to try and provide.

I would also like to remind you that my vote on Darox was made for the sole purpose of getting him talking. I said this very clearly right next to my vote on him, so this clearly shows you have made no effort to go back and check, instead trying to turn the argument around on me with no apparant knowledge it would fail.

As for 4, I see that vote of yours as a way of hiding thanks to your own argument. You vote Darox as he put dan at L-1 and is an ideal place for scum to hide. You made sure your vote was only L-2 so if he is lynched then you weren't in the same scummy position. My vote, as said already, was just to get him talking so for today at least you would have been seen as the initial mover of his wagon if it built up. You can't lynch him by yourself, no, but you can help it along then step back from the brawling dust cloud that would ensue. That is, only if you nudged it forward instead of starting it.