Mini 727 - Mafia in Standardville - Game Over

[Lowell]

I'd be willing to jump ship from xda to artem if others are.

[Artifex]

I promise you I did read your post. You say Xdaamno's posts following the whole Artem pressure vote thing you are marking down to frustration rather than scummy behavior, right?

I tend to be more sceptical of how scummy things said while frustrated are compared to things said while not under pressure.

I'm saying I dont agree with this statement. So what didnt I get?

[Darox]

I promise you I did read your post. You say Xdaamno's posts following the whole Artem pressure vote thing you are marking down to frustration rather than scummy behavior, right?

I tend to be more sceptical of how scummy things said while frustrated are compared to

things said while

not

under pressure.

I'm saying I dont agree with this statement. So what didnt I get?

Darox - I also dont agree with the theory that responses made while frustrated arent as relevant to

responses made under pressure.

Players get frustrated because of the pressure- I find this sort of thing just as telling because they're related to each other.

Pay close attention to the things I highlighted.

[Artem]

@Xd:

You've repeatedly hit L-1 and with the current state of the game, you will be deadline lynched. If you were town, you would be concentrated on getting information into the hands of town while you still can. The fact that you haven't been too concerned with it makes you either a lazy townie or a scum. Good riddance in either case, imo. The argument about your post having to be the last one of the day doesn't hold any water. As somebody already mentioned, all eyes are currently on you and whatever you post about other players will not simply be brushed off when (and if) you cardflip town.

And if you need more motivation to get cranking:

Unvote; Vote: Xdaamno; FoS: Panzer

This

is how you pressure vote.

This is not the time for pressure voting, as we are approaching a deadline. This is my last post until Artem unvotes.

I absolutely disagree;

pressure votes are useful at any stage

- and of course pressure votes are useless after being pointed out, I left it until a whole few pages had passed until I showed my hand. I agree that basing votes purely off vibes is very impractical.

Die scum die?

(I disagree on the "useless after pointed out" part by the way)

@Panzer & charter: Thanks for responding. I'm stilling thinking about what you've both said.

@Artifex:

Artem- I think he's genuinely scumhunting here. I do disagree with what seems to be his main issue with Panzer- this rolefishing business. If I'm understanding you correctly, youre are saying you preemptively called out role fishing in order to gauge peoples reactions to it. You find Panzer's reaction scummy cause he pushed hard when you were at L-1 but didnt when Xda hit the same count...right?

Yes, more or less. Both Panzer and charter pushed hard for a claim for me but not Xd.

My problem with this is that I dont get the 'preemptive' part. When you posted that, I thought you were dead on- we were a long ways away from deadline and had yet another player at L-1...if there had been calls for another role claim I'd have been very wary at that point. So, if your main point is inconistency in another's play, I dont see an inconsistency.

You just posted the inconsistency in the quote above. It's an inconsistent treatment of two players who both hit L-1. Yes, the difference is that in Xd's case we had my "we have rolefishers" looming over them. My "prediction" that we will have claim demands served several purposes, one of which was to see if anybody would take a cup of WIFOM. But like I said, I'm still thinking about Panzer & charter's responses to why they didn't ask for a claim. The only difference between the two right now is that Panzer wants Xd to claim, while charter hasn't stated such desires. Not quite sure what to make of it.

[Master Ruck]

Gkkt, dammit Artem! I was gonna point out Xdaamno's contradiction! Went back to look at Xda in isolation, saw that, then saw you do it. I looked at Panzer in isolation as well to compare and I'm leaning towards Xda after that. I'm not ignoring Charter's points as I did see his reasoning, but (which is somewhat annoying to say) he just doesn't have as much as Xda to look at and find anything wrong with. He's changing a lot but he keeps his posts relatively small so I can't pick out as much.

Xda, on the other hand, I've expressed my views a couple of times with my most recent one being that I was on the fence as he could just be an angry townie. Right now, he still could be, but he's being incredibly unhelpful by being stubborn with some players (not all his fault as tubby seems to be equally as stubbron with Xd) and refusing to help unless it's his dying breath.

The approaching deadline is showing that Xdaamno will likely be lynched, and while I would prefer the chance to put Panzer in the hot seat and get him enter the discussion more, we simply don't have the time. In case we can make this fit within 24 hours, Panzer, what is your view on all of this? From what I've seen in my isolation read on you, do you have any thoughts on anyone besides Artem and Charter?

[Xdaamno]

Ah, good catch Artem. I was exaggerating on both occasions.

If you don't believe me, give a moment's thought to why the hell such a contradiction could possibly be relevant to my alignment.

[Xdaamno]

Mod: Deadline extension, please.

Deadlines should be for promoting activity, and we're doing fine.

[Lynx The Antithesis]

This is not the time for pressure voting, as we are approaching a deadline. This is my last post until Artem unvotes.

This is not townie behavior. Why be so stubborn when you can help out the town if you really are being mislynched? If you're gonna give us anything do it soon or you will be lynched by deadline or another player. This refusual only reassures you as scum for me. It's not the end of the game if you die so stop playing like it.

I'd be willing to jump ship from xda to artem if others are.

Why do you want to shift a major wagon so close to deadline? It's very scummy that you need the rest of the town's approval before doing so as well. And the fact that you give no reasons doesn't help your case either.

FOS:Lowell

On a side note, I admit I am seriously wrong about a pressure vote being nullified after being pointed out. This event especially proved it to me. I do believe in some cases though that it holds true though.

[Xdaamno]

This is not the time for pressure voting, as we are approaching a deadline. This is my last post until Artem unvotes.

This is not townie behavior. Why be so stubborn when you can help out the town if you really are being mislynched? If you're gonna give us anything do it soon or you will be lynched by deadline or another player. This refusual only reassures you as scum for me. It's not the end of the game if you die so stop playing like it.

I intended to take a chance to convince Artem to unvote. I am trying to play the game optimally up until the point where it starts to not become fun. That is something which I will absolutely never sacrifice.

Also, are you

seriously

trying to say that because townies can still win if they die, there is no reason to stay alive?

[LlamaFluff]

Mod: Deadline extension, please.

Deadlines should be for promoting activity, and we're doing fine.

Days in this game have automatic three week deadlines which are not negotiable outside of need for a replacement in the closing days. This was stated in the both sign up queue and in the rules for the game.

[LlamaFluff]

Vote Count

Xdaamno (6) - Lynx the Antithesis, Danchaofan, Panzerjager, Lowell, Tubby216, Artem
Panzerjager (3) - Xdaamno, Charter, Darox
Darox (1) - Artifex

Not Voting (2) - Master Ruck, Afatchic

Deadline hits in about 22 hours

[Lynx The Antithesis]

I intended to take a chance to convince Artem to unvote. I am trying to play the game optimally up until the point where it starts to not become fun. That is something which I will absolutely never sacrifice.

Also, are you

seriously

trying to say that because townies can still win if they die, there is no reason to stay alive?

But it's not fun when people deliver ultimatums saying that they won't post until somebody unvotes if you want to to talk about playing the game for enjoyment.

I wasn't saying that townies should try to stay alive. But they should accept the fact that they could be lynched and aid the town with the time they have left. Even from a townie's death the rest of the town gains info. So they should strive to give any possible information to the rest of the town in that time instead of trying to desperately stay alive. In your case, I'd be trying to persuade the rest of the town why Panzer is the better lynch candidate for today. Now it's definitely come down to just the two of you so now's the time to present your Panzer case.

[PJ.]

@Lowell, I currently like how Artem is acting


@The crowd skeptical about me calling scumbuddies, I'm really skeptical about buddying up because to me it represents people being to comfortable and the only people who would buddy would be scum. That's why I keep mentioning a charter/Artem pair, but I can keep that in my notes if you'd like. All I'm saying it a playstyle nulltell, not a scumtell.

[Master Ruck]

Panzer, what is your view on all of this? From what I've seen in my isolation read on you, do you have any thoughts on anyone besides Artem and Charter?

[PJ.]

Panzer, what is your view on all of this? From what I've seen in my isolation read on you, do you have any thoughts on anyone besides Artem and Charter?

Well If you read my post you'd know I have thoughts on people other then them. That's kinda what I'm under the microscope from charter about supposedly, because I latched on to some views(Note:This is not true)

What more of all of this do you want?

[Master Ruck]

The aim of that question was to see what you thought of the other users instead of focusing on Charter and Artem the entire game. Unless I've missed something, and feel free to prove me wrong, those two and a bit of Xdaamno are the only people you've even mentioned.

[charter]

I think it's Panzer and dan. I don't think Xdaamo is scum anymore. I got all excited about his mishammer and got carried away.

I add dan to my list because of his earlier ties to Panzer and his most recent post, saying he finds Xdaamo more town and Panzer more scum but doesn't change his vote.

[PJ.]

Um...You must not know how to read.

I'm mentioned how I agreed with Darox on Lynx and I have expressed that I felt XD was scum. I was also skeptical of Darox claim. I have expressed both of these things lately and in the past. So to answer your question, yes I have thoughts that aren't about Artem and Charter. I have express heavy suspicion of XD, very minor suspicion of Lynx, and have been skeptical of Darox.

[Lynx The Antithesis]

I think it's Panzer and dan. I don't think Xdaamo is scum anymore. I got all excited about his mishammer and got carried away.

I add dan to my list because of his earlier ties to Panzer and his most recent post, saying he finds Xdaamo more town and Panzer more scum but doesn't change his vote.

This to me reeks of scum trying to renounce the wagon he was part of creating. Sounds very scummy to take back all your suspicion of Xdaamno just as he's on the brink of being lynched right before deadline. First you move to Panzer, then later completely remove all suspicion you have of Xdaamno. Trying to wipe your hands perfectly clean of his lynch?

Major FOS:Charter

If it wasn't deadline I might consider more strongly changing my vote to you.

[Lynx The Antithesis]

Oh and by the way I probably will be done for the rest of the night. I might be able to check the thread, but I probably won't be in the right state of mind to post sufficiently(college sorry kiddies). I probably won't be up until after the deadline which is tomorrow I believe. But if I wake up I'll try to get a post in or something. Otherwise, I'm still happy with Xdaamno lynch. God's speed everyone.

[PJ.]

Who'd Support a Charter wagon before deadline?

[Danchaofan]

I think it's Panzer and dan. I don't think Xdaamo is scum anymore. I got all excited about his mishammer and got carried away.

I add dan to my list because of his earlier ties to Panzer and his most recent post, saying he finds Xdaamo more town and Panzer more scum but doesn't change his vote.

It's like saying ooo the pacific ocean got smaller but this puddle seems to be getting a bit bigger. Now, should I vote for the puddle as the biggest body of of water in the world? (a bit exaggerated but seriously...)

So xda has been pulling 180s on his survivor list and his principles so that he can attack more people? [sarcasm]That's not scummy[/sarcasm]

[Artifex]

Pay close attention to the things I highlighted.

Chill, chill! I get my mistake, you dont have to break out the bbc size code anymore. You're saying that you really are more skeptical of 'scummy things said while frustrated'. I was confused because I thought you were referring to Xdaamno when referencing a player that was making posts that came across as frustrated.

@Charter- You're pretty excited about Panzer, too. An honest question- why is this time different from when you were excited about Xda (how can I know you arent being 'carried away' again?

[afatchic]

Mod: Deadline extension, please.

Deadlines should be for promoting activity, and we're doing fine.

Days in this game have automatic three week deadlines which are not negotiable outside of need for a replacement in the closing days. This was stated in the both sign up queue and in the rules for the game.

Do i not count? Sorry guys, but i got called into work tonight, so wasn't able to read tonight as i had planned. without any type of an extension i won't be caught up by deadline. However i was warned ahead of time of a deadline closing in, so i take full blame for not catching up in time.

Any chance we could get like a 15 hour deadline extension? then i would be able to catch up and post my thoughts tomorrow night after church.

[charter]

@Charter- You're pretty excited about Panzer, too. An honest question- why is this time different from when you were excited about Xda (how can I know you arent being 'carried away' again?

Can I give you a cut and dry reason? No. It's mostly how the different wagons formed. I feel like Xdaamo's wagon is scum driven and Panzer's is town driven.






I would bet my life that Artem is town.