Mini 720 - SPQR Mafia {Game Over}

[Coriolanus]

charter's early posts (18th-19th): pretty solely focus on dahill. he even makes a post just with "I'd like a dahill lynch from today.".
posts 4-5: finds xtoxm to be town, and he again uses that to focus on dahill. [i approve of this, by the way. i think charter's reasons here are very valid.]
post 6 comes on the 23rd, three days since his last. he defends xtoxm, but the defense doesn't put forward any points, just reiterates what he says before. he moves on to me [i've already commented on these points.] to close his post, he again defends xtoxm, this time with legitimate points [again, i completely agree with him here.] and forwards me as a second possible scum.
next few posts: throws a few questions at RV for being close minded.
27th: after not posting for a few days, he shows up again to say he was busy.
next post: starts out by defending his reasoning on dahill. he criticizes dahill for not doing much scumhunting. i find this point particularly interesting. until this point, he has been hunting dahill, threw a couple comments on me and challenged RV. that's not a spectacular resume. but that doesn't bother me much. what bothers me is that he is criticizing dahill for it.
his later posts continue to forward dahill, call me on my mistakes [which were admittedly stupid], and once asks xtoxm for clarification.

conclusions: when i started this case, i thought i would hit a goldmine, but it turns out, i didn't, and my opinion of charter has gone way up for doing it. there still is some fishy material out there (i don't like how sporadic his early posting was, and i don't like his hypocritical attack on dahill), but there's not enough for a vote right now.

charter: has anything changed for you since yesterday?

[dahill1]

i don't see how i flip-flopped on xtoxm
yes, he does had done stuff like that in previous games but by the time i voted him he was legitimately scummy

and i still can't see tuber's reasons for voting me

[dahill1]

EBWOP:

does

[Yosarian2]

I don't really see a problem with Glork's hammer, personally. If you're not going to be around before deadline, better to drop the hammer then to not.

[charter]

i don't see how i flip-flopped on xtoxm
yes, he does had done stuff like that in previous games but by the time i voted him he was legitimately scummy

and i still can't see tuber's reasons for voting me

First you say you'd lynch Xtoxm but you know he acts anti town in his games even as town. You also don't mention any reasons why you suspect him or anything. Then you later vote him, for those same reasons. Why didn't you bring this up yesterday when I said you flip flopped on Xtoxm?

meh. i was merely citing it as one of the opposing viewpoints to the situation. i wasn't necessarily agreeing with it, and i have questioned when people do this in other games iirc. i dislike using info outside of mafia games in general, so i don't consider this telling of any particular alignment.

The first part I can possibly see, but I'm confused by the last sentence; if you don't consider it telling of any particular alignment, why did you use it as a reason to vote Tuber? Am I missing something?

i was referring to using info outside of mafia games, not tuber

and wait xtoxm, claimed? when/where?

Xtoxm claimed vanilla townie in Post 117. Any thoughts on that?

Patrick.

i would be 100% down for lynching xtoxm except for one thing. he has done stuff like this before in games, as town. i wouldn't put against him to be lying, even if he's town.

Then you go to voting for him. You make no mention of him in between these posts.

Yuck...xtoxm claimed vanillia? WTF?

Xtoxm, what the heck are you doing this game? So far you've self-voted and claimed vanillia on day 1 with no reasoning very early. Do I need to explain how anti-town either of those actions are?

On a side note,

unvote:incognito

; it was a random vote, and Incog's actions so far give me pro-town vibes, so I don't want to keep it on. If I was going to vote now, it'd probably be for xtoxm, but I think I'll hold off for the moment.

Sounds like someone knows i'm town.

...
...

vote xtoxm

you are just not being helpful at all and pretty much all of your actions so far have been anti-town

Your reason for voting him is not being helpful and being anti-town, which you know he does as town! It looks (to me) like you just put the vote on Xtoxm because you knew he would be an easy lynch, not because you thought he could be scum.

I don't really see a problem with Glork's hammer, personally. If you're not going to be around before deadline, better to drop the hammer then to not.

Got anything else to say about today so far? (Or yesterday, or who you think might be scum...)

[OhGodMyLife]

Vote Count:

6 to lynch.

dahill1: 2 (charter, Tuberkulos)
Assmaster: 1 (Coriolanus)
Coriolanus: 1 (Rally Vincent)

Not Voting: 6 (Yosarian2, dahill1, Incognito, Erratus Apathos, Glork, Assmaster)

[Rally Vincent]

the more things change... pleased to know that you haven't decided to take a new look at the game after two townspersons died.

Giving the game "a new look"... did anything happen that should've changed my opinion on

you

? Voting you does not mean that I draw no conclusions about the two deaths. I might think different about someone else, but I also like to think about it. In the meantime, voting you is okay with me, as I still see you like yesterday.

[Incognito]

I don't really see a problem with Glork's hammer, personally. If you're not going to be around before deadline, better to drop the hammer then to not.

This seems odd since it's not really the hammer in and of itself that I have an issue with. I wasn't even

completely

suspicious of Glork until he began responding to my questions in the manner he did today. I have more of an issue with the fact that Assmaster could have had an opportunity to get at least a final say before a hammer was dropped, but Glork completely shut down that opportunity by laying down the hammer a bit earlier than he

himself

said he would. I'm fairly suspicious of Assmaster so the fact that Glork laid down the hammer when he did thereby completely disallowing a possible pre-N1 Assmaster-post really bothers me.

[charter]

charter: has anything changed for you since yesterday?

No

[Coriolanus]

Giving the game "a new look"... did anything happen that should've changed my opinion on

you

? .

unless the name of the game was suddenly changed to "determine whether coriolanus is scum", then yes, two townie deaths should force you to analyze things differently in respect to that change, or at least state why the change in circumstance means absolutely nothing in terms of my alignment.

[Assmaster]

Primate is unfortunately not doing anything noteworthy to me. Nothing. He's half-assing in Assmaster. I would like to see him actually assemble a case against me similar to yours. This is primate, of course, that I'm talking about here. But anything's better than nothing.

No.

PS: I'd stop with the rhetoric, just makes you look a bit pretentious.

[Coriolanus]

PS: I'd stop with the rhetoric, just makes you look a bit pretentious.

don't give a shit. you'll live.

and by the way, that wasn't a request. i was describing what i would like to see. i wouldn't expect it, because you haven't done anything here for at least a year.

[Assmaster]

Honestly though I don't think this terse playstyle and I'm going to have to change it because I'm simply not good enough to make it viable. I'm a little too fond of it as well, I reckon. Anyway.

[Assmaster]

The reason I was originally suspicious of you was that I agreed with Glorks two points, that of you not hunting scum despite saying thats what we should be doing and that you were curtailing discussion by putting dampers on the Xtoxm without providing another possible way for the day to move, also I felt your actions were unatural, like you were projecting an attitude. I was aware that this was probably because you were an alt, but it could also be a cc related thing, because on site where games reach 40 players and the most common way to get people to do what you want is yell and scream until they do it, or more commonly, put across an air of superiority that makes people follow you, and that seemed to be something you were doing here, but it wasn't working because the people weren't buying it. For a while I suspected you were a MTGS alt because you used the phrase gimmick, whilst CC use sockpuppet and MS use alt, but I left that path fairly quickly because it's a fairly small group of people who'd be MTGSers with Ms alts, and I didn't think any of them made sense (I did consider Sim, c'est la vie). I looked into Glorks argument when he originally made it, and put my vote on you primarily because if you were the egotistical CC type I thought it was probable you were, you'd probably go apeshit at me putting a vote on you for no specific reason, and then I'd know properly. When you started to kick off properly with Glork, I looked again to see how legitimate the two points Glork made were and found that I found the first point lacking, as I thought that you didn't follow the mindset you were espousing and were not doing a massive amount to catch scum, but I thought what you were doing was within reasonable levels, considering you were also trying to stop the xtoxm wagon, so I couldn't really agree with that one. The second point was fairly true though, I don't think that trying to stop the Xtoxm wagon contributes an increase in discussion, particularly with the way you were doing it, not responding to points in a more persuasive fashion and dropping your attacks in order do it. I think that was a definite curtailing of discussion, even if not an intentional one.

I didn't want to post a case on you primarily because I think it's outdated at this point (my fault for not replying), and also because your flip flop on charter made me think a bit better of you, and I hate posting anything against people I don't think are scum. FYI you're slightly pro-town in my book atm, based on your activity and the failed charter case, which made sense and had enough in it unexplained for me to beleive in the thought processes involved. I'd quite like to know what intentional devations you're making from normal playstyle with this account. Not so I can meta you, more just so I know when you're being intentionally a bit ridiculous.

[Coriolanus]

i haven't read your latest post yet, but i'd like to apologize for my comments in 411, which were uncalled for.

[Assmaster]

i haven't read your latest post yet, but i'd like to apologize for my comments in 411, which were uncalled for.

I appreciate the fact you're willing to say it, tbh. I've been given such a huge amount of leeway regarding my lurking on this site it's obscene.

[Yosarian2]

I don't really see a problem with Glork's hammer, personally. If you're not going to be around before deadline, better to drop the hammer then to not.

This seems odd since it's not really the hammer in and of itself that I have an issue with. I wasn't even

completely

suspicious of Glork until he began responding to my questions in the manner he did today. I have more of an issue with the fact that Assmaster could have had an opportunity to get at least a final say before a hammer was dropped, but Glork completely shut down that opportunity by laying down the hammer a bit earlier than he

himself

said he would. I'm fairly suspicious of Assmaster so the fact that Glork laid down the hammer when he did thereby completely disallowing a possible pre-N1 Assmaster-post really bothers me.

Well, I'm not really interested in defending Glork here, because I still do find him suspicious based on his day 1 play in general. I'm not really buying this argument, though; yes, Glork had easier mentioned he might try to hammer via phone on the way out, but Xtoxm was acting so unbelivably scummy right up to the end there, I don't blame Glork for just dropping the hammer and getting it done. I'm not sure why you think Assmaster would have said anything different about Xtoxm if given another few hours, either. This whole argument kind of confuses me. And yeah, Glork's over-reaction to the question is fairly bizzare as well.

[Glork]

I got upset because Incog is claiming that there is an in-game reason for me changing when I was going to hammer, when the reason was completely out-of-game, and he can't seem to accept that. I'm one of those people who believes that out-of-game circumstances are "sacred," if you will. You will never ever see me lie about out-of-game circumstances, there is evidence elsewhere on the site (namely V/LA) that I had limited access during the holidays.

It's a bullshit, illegitimate argument in my opinion. I've made my explanation, it had to do with out-of-game circumstances that caused me to change when I was going to hammer, and Incog's still going on about it.


Incidentally, Incog, two questions for you:
Given how little Assmaster has been here all thread, and given that he posted he had been ill, did you expect him to post that afternoon/evening?
If I had not hammered at the time, and failed to hammer later due to being away from the site, would your suspicion of me likely have grown, shrunk, or stayed the same?

[Erratus Apathos]

(For the record, yes, I still firmly believe that dahill is protown.)

When did you firmly believe he was protown prior to this?

Vote: Glork

[dahill1]

i'm sorry guys i'll have

limited access

again
my aunt just died so the funeral is soon and lots of relative staying at my house and stuff
only posting in this game since i believe it is my only current game i'm in
i'll try and answer some questions soon

[Simenon]

My condolences.

[dahill1]

My condolences.

thanks

@charter, brief answer to your questions re: me flip-flopping on xtoxm

in between when i had posted about him and voted him, he had clearly, IMO, committed many scummy acts that i thought was clear everyone had seen and recognized. i guess i probably should have mentioned some of them in my vote, and you're right i was wrong for not doing that. but i thought it was kinda obvious on what i thought of his behavior

[Glork]

(For the record, yes, I still firmly believe that dahill is protown.)

When did you firmly believe he was protown prior to this?

Vote: Glork

If I gave off any other impression, please point that out.

[Incognito]

I haven't read up on the recent stuff or done the targeted analysis yet, but I'll respond to some questions.

Given how little Assmaster has been here all thread, and given that he posted he had been ill, did you expect him to post that afternoon/evening?

Possibly, yes.

If I had not hammered at the time, and failed to hammer later due to being away from the site, would your suspicion of me likely have grown, shrunk, or stayed the same?

I wasn't suspicious of you yesterday so it probably would have stood at about the same level as it was yesterday. I only called attention to Patrick's question today because I thought it was an interesting point that might imply some sort of linkage between you and Assmaster, and I wanted to see your answer to it. At this time, I'm actually more suspicious of your reaction to the question (needless ad hominem remarks towards me and becoming slightly defensive) as opposed to the actual action itself.

[Assmaster]

If I had not hammered at the time, and failed to hammer later due to being away from the site, would your suspicion of me likely have grown, shrunk, or stayed the same?

I wasn't suspicious of you yesterday so it probably would have stood at about the same level as it was yesterday. I only called attention to Patrick's question today because I thought it was an interesting point that might imply some sort of linkage between you and Assmaster, and I wanted to see your answer to it. At this time, I'm actually more suspicious of your reaction to the question (needless ad hominem remarks towards me and becoming slightly defensive) as opposed to the actual action itself.

Explain your thoughts behind this post please because currently it's ludicrous. None of those things are scummy except contextually and you have failed to explore the contexts at all.