open 894: near vanilla (game over)

[Afrayed Knott]

Hello All, game looked way off staring mid week. But great it’s kicked off.

VOTE: Dannflor

[Aisa]

T3 is probably town.

Curious to hear why you think so

Trying to jumpstart discussion in RVS, even if on a fairly reachy basis, feels fairly townie to me. In general I think scum are more likely to wait for other people to start pushing wagons rather than try to jumpstart one themselves. I also think the reachiness of it is actually +town since I feel like scum would probably be angling for a good first impression here.

I appreciate the reply! I think I disagree with most of this though lol

As both alignments I usually try to reach to start discussion. You modded that Estonia Micro Normal - I believe the one in which I figured out that ceejay and Eira were Masons, in which I was scum and did the same.

Excuse me

Sir
You just called my magnum opus "Estonia Micro Normal"
I really want that to be intentional

[Aisa]

T3 is probably town.

Curious to hear why you think so

Trying to jumpstart discussion in RVS, even if on a fairly reachy basis, feels fairly townie to me. In general I think scum are more likely to wait for other people to start pushing wagons rather than try to jumpstart one themselves. I also think the reachiness of it is actually +town since I feel like scum would probably be angling for a good first impression here.

I appreciate the reply! I think I disagree with most of this though lol

Could you describe what specifically you disagree with? Just to get a peek into your thought process.

I think I've seen scum do the things you describe enough times that I wouldn't be so quick to say they are town-indicative. For example, I think good scum players know not to come off as too polished or calculated and could try to imitate the "reachiness" of town.

Also, my impression of T3 as far as scum players go is that he enjoys the alignment and thrives off trying to look towny. I think he could definitely pull off the things you've listed as scum (and he's said so himself).

[T3]

T3 is probably town.

Curious to hear why you think so

Trying to jumpstart discussion in RVS, even if on a fairly reachy basis, feels fairly townie to me. In general I think scum are more likely to wait for other people to start pushing wagons rather than try to jumpstart one themselves. I also think the reachiness of it is actually +town since I feel like scum would probably be angling for a good first impression here.

I appreciate the reply! I think I disagree with most of this though lol

As both alignments I usually try to reach to start discussion. You modded that Estonia Micro Normal - I believe the one in which I figured out that ceejay and Eira were Masons, in which I was scum and did the same.

Excuse me

Sir
You just called my magnum opus "Estonia Micro Normal"
I really want that to be intentional

Oh wait, it was Southern France, the Estonia one was a newbie that fferyllt modded lol

[shaddowez]

Hello All, game looked way off staring mid week. But great it’s kicked off.

VOTE: Dannflor

Do you have a reason for this vote, or a belief that the game is still in RVS?

[shaddowez]

Aisa

Why is T3's 15 bad vs no comment on Bella's 13?

[Afrayed Knott]

Hello All, game looked way off staring mid week. But great it’s kicked off.

VOTE: Dannflor

Do you have a reason for this vote, or a belief that the game is still in RVS?

Still RVS for me, but I’m considering making Dannflor a policy vote each game we are in….


Why do you ask?

[shaddowez]

Hello All, game looked way off staring mid week. But great it’s kicked off.

VOTE: Dannflor

Do you have a reason for this vote, or a belief that the game is still in RVS?

Still RVS for me, but I’m considering making Dannflor a policy vote each game we are in….


Why do you ask?

There's less than 3 pages to read through, but there's been some non-RVS like interactions. I was curious if you had read and decided to still RVS, or if you had seen something to make a legit vote against Dann.

[Dannflor]

Hello All, game looked way off staring mid week. But great it’s kicked off.

VOTE: Dannflor

Do you have a reason for this vote, or a belief that the game is still in RVS?

Still RVS for me, but I’m considering making Dannflor a policy vote each game we are in….


Why do you ask?

that ain’t very fun

[Dannflor]

VOTE: shaddowez

[Kurtapika]

Interesting; so it's more of a rxn-based meta?

My feeling is that Bella's lack of disclosure on the tr itself after being challenged reads as scum. Initial post could be an attempt on getting a foot in first with an easy read to present with towny appearance, coupled with the openness of Bella's #41 leaving ambiguity in the conversation from T3's #26.

Not a strong presentation per se but it's notable imo. Dannflor reads as town to me as of this vote. I'm mainly in agreement with shaddowez on Aisa, no comment on the others for now.

[Nono]

will join later today, promise, no prod please)

[JupiterXV]

got some free time to hang out & unwind so i'll read through the thread will not be here much tomorrow though, just so you all know. stuff's going good though i'd say

[T3]

Aisa

Why is T3's 15 bad vs no comment on Bella's 13?

I don't want to answer for Aisa but I think that because my statement in 15 was intended to play on Bella's statement in 13, my 15 could appear to be more abrasive, in a sense.

[JupiterXV]

may i inquire why you scumread bella?

"Is it bad to already have a tr" indicates to me that Bella has a degree of self-consciousness and feels the need to ask permission from the thread to express her thoughts.

disagree! i haven't been able to fully play a game in a while so i might be wrong on this, but i don't think self-consciousness is inherently scummy but tbf i don't know what general scum meta on this site is & how bella plays in specific. i mean i tend to be pretty self-conscious regardless of my alignment due to overthinking a lot of things, and i know some other people who are more self-conscious as town and more confident as scum. i think people who are more unfamilliar with scum positions tend to be more self-conscious, and those who are more familiar tend to be less self-conscious, actually. and since bella's been on this site a while, i'd assume they've played scum roles a number of times.
this is actually rather anecdotal but i have fun in scum positions but i've only played a non-town role maybe... three times? and so i'm absolutely incredibly VERY self-conscious of what i'm posting and very aware of every minute detail, more than i would be as town
anyways, that being said, i'll pose a question. if bella was new to the site do you think this post of hers would be more or less scummy?

T3 is probably town.

Curious to hear why you think so

Trying to jumpstart discussion in RVS, even if on a fairly reachy basis, feels fairly townie to me. In general I think scum are more likely to wait for other people to start pushing wagons rather than try to jumpstart one themselves. I also think the reachiness of it is actually +town since I feel like scum would probably be angling for a good first impression here.

tbh i actually think whether people start wagons or not isn't inherently alignment indicative. i think what's AI is

why

they're starting a wagon, like trying to figure out the reason / motivation behind it. t3's read does seem a bit genuine to me, though i could be reading it wrong. obviously the reason doesn't stand for me (because i would personally not be making such a read) but i can see why they would think that. my standards are personally just different and bella's post does not ping me one way or another.
that being said it isn't a bad thing to have an early townread who is the townread tho

i think aisa is towny to me! out of all the players so far they seem the towniest
posts seem to have genuine thought behind them, they're putting out some original takes, but not trying too hard (trying hard is cool but i think i tend to generally associate that trait with scum)

kurtapika, out of curiosity, what was the mafia you played like? it seems to be of a different style

OK i gotta go now. bye gang i got some more stuff but business calls! see ya

[T3]

My feeling is that Bella's lack of disclosure on the tr itself after being challenged reads as scum. Initial post could be an attempt on getting a foot in first with an easy read to present with towny appearance, coupled with the openness of Bella's #41 leaving ambiguity in the conversation from T3's #26.

What differentiates Bella from being town and having a genuine read on someone and then being playful in 41 from Bella being scum and having a fake read on someone?

[T3]

disagree! i haven't been able to fully play a game in a while so i might be wrong on this, but i don't think self-consciousness is inherently scummy but tbf i don't know what general scum meta on this site is & how bella plays in specific. i mean i tend to be pretty self-conscious regardless of my alignment due to overthinking a lot of things, and i know some other people who are more self-conscious as town and more confident as scum. i think people who are more unfamilliar with scum positions tend to be more self-conscious, and those who are more familiar tend to be less self-conscious, actually. and since bella's been on this site a while, i'd assume they've played scum roles a number of times.
this is actually rather anecdotal but i have fun in scum positions but i've only played a non-town role maybe... three times? and so i'm absolutely incredibly VERY self-conscious of what i'm posting and very aware of every minute detail, more than i would be as town
anyways

As I said before: In a vacuum that post is objectively more likely to come from scum than town, but there are factors such as personality and experience that may affect that vacuum. Also, I wanted to start discussion. If I go ahead and say that "this post from Bella is completely NAI" then there's nothing to discuss, is there!

that being said, i'll pose a question. if bella was new to the site do you think this post of hers would be more or less scummy?

If Bella was new to the site then that post would definitely be more scummy.

Why did you ask this question?

[T3]

i think what's AI is why they're starting a wagon, like trying to figure out the reason / motivation behind it

Would the motivation for me starting a wagon not be that the game's discussion starts rolling? It doesn't seem like you're interpreting OWER's post correctly.

[Dannflor]

the motivation can be to look town, t3

surely you are aware of that

[T3]

Yeah that's true, I'm not even sure what I thought Jupiter was saying.

[JupiterXV]

As I said before: In a vacuum that post is objectively more likely to come from scum than town, but there are factors such as personality and experience that may affect that vacuum. Also, I wanted to start discussion. If I go ahead and say that "this post from Bella is completely NAI" then there's nothing to discuss, is there!

ehh fair. willing to let it slide ig

If Bella was new to the site then that post would definitely be more scummy.

Why did you ask this question?

wondering if you would see it differently if the person posting it was different in some manner, i think, if that makes sense. kinda hard to explain but your take on bella seems more like of a... sort of, more theory-based scumread? like less on what bella did and more like "this post is traditionally very _ or _"
what do you feel about bella now? still scum? or nah

[T3]

But I guess it's basically impossible to tell whether someone trying to start early discussion is doing it from a place to look town or scum, unless they're being super LAMIST. I don't know if I'm right. I don't think this matters anyways.

[T3]

If Bella was new to the site then that post would definitely be more scummy.

Why did you ask this question?

wondering if you would see it differently if the person posting it was different in some manner, i think, if that makes sense. kinda hard to explain but your take on bella seems more like of a... sort of, more theory-based scumread? like less on what bella did and more like "this post is traditionally very _ or _"
what do you feel about bella now? still scum? or nah

Null, maybe. a little scummy

[Kurtapika]

What differentiates Bella from being town and having a genuine read on someone and then being playful in 41 from Bella being scum and having a fake read on someone?

Again the town reading while possible, I would view it as less sensical to have to test waters before putting forward reads in the first place when playing as town. 41 mainly contributes to the feeling of Bella giving the appearance of bringing up discussion but not actually furthering it in this case, IMO, which scum can tend more towards doing as mentioned.

kurtapika, out of curiosity, what was the mafia you played like? it seems to be of a different style

It was on night start with faster games and generally smaller table sizes, so it didn't have as heavy of a reliance on solely post analysis during D1. New territory for me.

If Bella was new to the site then that post would definitely be more scummy.

I'm curious regarding the thought process behind this. Would have thought other way around with new players seeming given to uncertainty in general and thus posts like these usually being regarded as NAI.

[schadd_]

;