Mini 2308 | Blood over Utopia | Utopia fell.

[biancospino]

Votecount 1-X

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to hammer.

flavor

Spoiler:

execution votes

SirCakez (4):

Cat Scratch Fever (444), PenguinPower (477), marcistar (492), Merlyn (543)

PenguinPower (3):

camelCasedSnivy (88), meowmeow (387), SirCakez (557)

Merlyn (2):

Aureal (212), Roden (250)

camelcasedSnivy (1):

Deal With The Devil (182)

Flavor Leaf (1):

RCEnigma (407)

Not voting (2):

Random Nurse, Flavor Leaf

projects votes

Bureau of Investigations (6):

Aureal (110), meowmeow (258), camelCasedSnivy (259), SirCakez (267), Deal With The Devil (565), Flavor Leaf (608)

Trading Outpost (3):

PenguinPower (86), RCEnigma (159), Merlyn (538)

Intelligentia (2):

Roden (503), Cat Scratch Fever (560)

Elected Jury (1):

marcistar (294)

Printing Press (1):

Random Nurse (345)

Not voting (0).

notes

• The Deadline is due in (expired on 2023-08-08 09:00:00).
  
• Random Nurse is V/LA on Thursdays, Frydays and Saturdays.
  
• Please use [
  hurt] tags to vote for projects to help me out with the tally. Since the intention is obvious, I'm still counting 608 as a project vote for Bureau of Investigations.

[RCEnigma]

My vote on flavor is just because I am going to prioritize sorting him before anyone else in this player list, no offense to anyone else. But for my game and how I’m going to view the game on a given day is going to be more tied to what alignment I think FL is moreso than the rest of the lobby.

That said he hasn’t done anything yet so mounting a wagon without his input doesn’t get me anywhere. So I haven’t pressed it too hard. If my vote wasn’t here it would be on devil for the record.

[meowmeow]

i've played with you before, but it was a long time ago now - it's true i don't have recent experience with you and i guess i'll check your games from 2022?

i wouldn't expect you or most people to do things with the sole intention of 'advancing the gamestate' but usually that just happens naturally by like, pushing people or asking questions when you're suspicious etc. like, the intention reading part of your post - i think you did that with cakez, and maybe a bit with drew, but it doesn't feel like a big focus for you so far. i understand if you're town you probably have been thinking things and just not posting about them that much, and i don't really intend to vote you out d1 unless we get in a deadline rush and it's you or someone i townread

re: fl, i don't mind that you prioritise sorting him but i don't really see how your vote goes about doing that? since i don't think fl has really entered the game yet and i don't think fl is going to like feel pressured by the vote or whatever. it's not the biggest deal because townies do things i don't understand frequently, but it does just feel a bit strange that you didn't seem to have anything else going on at the time i guess

[Merlyn]

RCE can you move your votes onto one of the two wagons

Personally I think leaf is towny even though they don't have many posts

wtf is this post

found RCEs vote strange whats the matter

Okay, I'll break it down.

1) You asked someone to move their vote to 'one of the the two wagons' . It's weird to me. It's like, not only do you want them to move their vote, but you want them to move it to where it will be the most likely to get someone limmed- but you don't care who of the two gets limmed. We have a decent amount of time left, so we don't need to be worried about a no lim or something.

2) Why do you feel either wagon is okay? You've mentioned more than once that you find penguin sus, but you've never even talked about cakez. It makes me wonder if you're fine with either lim bc you know they're town.

3) You didn't build a case to try and sway RCE onto a particular person or offer any reasons one of those two would be the right vote- why would they listen to you and stop voting for someone else and specifically jump onto the top two wagons with no reasoning from you?

4) Why do you care about RCE's vote anyway? Like, so what if you find FL town- FL literally has one vote. If you thought FL was town and in danger of being limmed this would make some sense, but literally what does it matter to you?

[Merlyn]

My vote on flavor is just because I am going to prioritize sorting him before anyone else in this player list, no offense to anyone else. But for my game and how I’m going to view the game on a given day is going to be more tied to what alignment I think FL is moreso than the rest of the lobby.

That said he hasn’t done anything yet so mounting a wagon without his input doesn’t get me anywhere. So I haven’t pressed it too hard. If my vote wasn’t here it would be on devil for the record.

I've never seen anyone do this before so I have no idea if it's a good idea or not. I do have a question- if your game is going to be FL only why aren't you pushing for a policy lim? It kind of feels like you're saying- don't count on any analysis from me that isn't tied to one player until they are resolved. If you're town, you're basically taking us down a player who could paying attention to the game and looking for solves. If you truly can't play the game until you know FL's alignment isn't it better for you to advocate we lim him regardless of what he's done?

[Merlyn]

looks like bureau of investigation is a lock, so I'm moving off trading outpost since we can't have both. What about election security? What if the 'wind' coming in tonight means votes will shift?

HURT: election security

[RCEnigma]

It not FL only, but I know if FL is scum or *I think* FL is scum then he has the ability to pull me into a rabbit hole that may be detrimental to town. Whether that be a tunnel or gets me to scum side.

And if he’s town then it makes it infinitely easier to make town cohesive. I know he has the ability to do so and I am fairly err…tenacious when I feel the solve is correct.

But I don’t really know that to be true of the rest of the player list.

The vote isn’t going to pressure him into anything by itself, but we aren’t at deadline and fl hasn’t weighed in on the game. So I don’t feel the need to put my vote anywhere I don’t really believe in.

[RCEnigma]

I’m still evaluating outside of fl and always will. Like for example I still don’t feel comfortable with the devil hydra. Or I just have theories that have a layer of tinfoil that don’t really help the game. Like….”what if snivy got the go ahead in scum hat to open wolf because one or multiple partners is being widely townread and the outlook for them to push to endgame is strong?”

I don’t have basis for something like that, but they are things I’ll keep in mind.

[RCEnigma]

Err sorry meow I don’t particularly remember when we may have played. I’m not a heavy voter in particular. In the sense I don’t throw them around often.

[SirCakez]

why is this random mini theme so hard for me to find scum
I'm just gonna town hunt instead

[SirCakez]

UNVOTE:
I don't feel good about this vote anymore

[camelCasedSnivy]

RCE can you move your votes onto one of the two wagons

Personally I think leaf is towny even though they don't have many posts

wtf is this post

found RCEs vote strange whats the matter

Okay, I'll break it down.

1) You asked someone to move their vote to 'one of the the two wagons' . It's weird to me. It's like, not only do you want them to move their vote, but you want them to move it to where it will be the most likely to get someone limmed- but you don't care who of the two gets limmed. We have a decent amount of time left, so we don't need to be worried about a no lim or something.

2) Why do you feel either wagon is okay? You've mentioned more than once that you find penguin sus, but you've never even talked about cakez. It makes me wonder if you're fine with either lim bc you know they're town.

3) You didn't build a case to try and sway RCE onto a particular person or offer any reasons one of those two would be the right vote- why would they listen to you and stop voting for someone else and specifically jump onto the top two wagons with no reasoning from you?

4) Why do you care about RCE's vote anyway? Like, so what if you find FL town- FL literally has one vote. If you thought FL was town and in danger of being limmed this would make some sense, but literally what does it matter to you?

1) fair enough ig
2) i dont scumread cakez as much as i do penguin but sometimes i dont see them being a town a lot, so both wagons seemed ok, except one has a lot bigger of a chance at flipping scum
3) true i shouldve done that
4) i stared at the VC for a hot minute then saw RCE's vote looked back at their reason and thought that their reasoning wasnt exactly valid anymore

[PenguinPower]

UNVOTE:
I don't feel good about this vote anymore

[Aureal]

none of my reads are that strong so far - honestly, i'm a little worried about it, it feels like the gamestate isn't that advanced and we're halfway to deadline. i was hoping we'd be able to, uh, walk and chew gum when it comes to the mechanical stuff, but maybe we need to cut down on it and focus on the mafia side of things

Yeah, I agree with this. This setup triggers my mech-based instincts to want to try to break it, but motivation sank and now I still barely even have any reads.

Hmmmm. What do you suppose is the meaning of the fact that there was a bunch of talk about the Merlyn wagon but nobody ever asked me why I voted her? Was it that obvious to everyone?

I figured you were sheeping me bc I remember I asked merlyn a question around the same time

Why is your motivation so low? What would get you more engaged

Good question. I'd say a decent bit out of game factors, and this game just feeling a bit of a chore to get into. Like, if I were solely in charge of deciding what to do, I'd make my own mind up. But I'm not much of a leader and it sorta feels like sometimes when I'm trying to get input to get brainstorming on something, it falls flat. So that kinda feels discouraging, when I can't do something myself but efforts to engage the group don't accomplish much.

[Merlyn]

RCE can you move your votes onto one of the two wagons

Personally I think leaf is towny even though they don't have many posts

wtf is this post

found RCEs vote strange whats the matter

Okay, I'll break it down.

1) You asked someone to move their vote to 'one of the the two wagons' . It's weird to me. It's like, not only do you want them to move their vote, but you want them to move it to where it will be the most likely to get someone limmed- but you don't care who of the two gets limmed. We have a decent amount of time left, so we don't need to be worried about a no lim or something.

2) Why do you feel either wagon is okay? You've mentioned more than once that you find penguin sus, but you've never even talked about cakez. It makes me wonder if you're fine with either lim bc you know they're town.

3) You didn't build a case to try and sway RCE onto a particular person or offer any reasons one of those two would be the right vote- why would they listen to you and stop voting for someone else and specifically jump onto the top two wagons with no reasoning from you?

4) Why do you care about RCE's vote anyway? Like, so what if you find FL town- FL literally has one vote. If you thought FL was town and in danger of being limmed this would make some sense, but literally what does it matter to you?

1) fair enough ig
2) i dont scumread cakez as much as i do penguin but sometimes i dont see them being a town a lot, so both wagons seemed ok, except one has a lot bigger of a chance at flipping scum
3) true i shouldve done that
4) i stared at the VC for a hot minute then saw RCE's vote looked back at their reason and thought that their reasoning wasnt exactly valid anymore

Snivy, can you give me a readslist? Doesn't have to be elaborate, but who are you thinking might be town and might be scum

[Merlyn]

none of my reads are that strong so far - honestly, i'm a little worried about it, it feels like the gamestate isn't that advanced and we're halfway to deadline. i was hoping we'd be able to, uh, walk and chew gum when it comes to the mechanical stuff, but maybe we need to cut down on it and focus on the mafia side of things

Yeah, I agree with this. This setup triggers my mech-based instincts to want to try to break it, but motivation sank and now I still barely even have any reads.

Hmmmm. What do you suppose is the meaning of the fact that there was a bunch of talk about the Merlyn wagon but nobody ever asked me why I voted her? Was it that obvious to everyone?

I figured you were sheeping me bc I remember I asked merlyn a question around the same time

Why is your motivation so low? What would get you more engaged

Good question. I'd say a decent bit out of game factors, and this game just feeling a bit of a chore to get into. Like, if I were solely in charge of deciding what to do, I'd make my own mind up. But I'm not much of a leader and it sorta feels like sometimes when I'm trying to get input to get brainstorming on something, it falls flat. So that kinda feels discouraging, when I can't do something myself but efforts to engage the group don't accomplish much.

I mean, I'm down to brainstorm. The thing you're voting for is winning atm, do you still want that or no? If so what's the second thing you think we should get?

[Aureal]

marci, roden
merlyn
csf, snivy
cakez, flavor leaf, random nurse
devil, rcenigma
aureal, penguinpower

i think i'm here right now. i don't really get common townreads on RCE. none of my reads are that strong so far - honestly, i'm a little worried about it, it feels like the gamestate isn't that advanced and we're halfway to deadline. i was hoping we'd be able to, uh, walk and chew gum when it comes to the mechanical stuff, but maybe we need to cut down on it and focus on the mafia side of things

Listen, I am letting Alianna deal with the mech stuff, so we can tussle and throw hands on the mafia side of things if you want.

Especially since we have some clear differences in our reads.

Snivy that high? RC and Aureal that low?

-Drew

snivy is... really not that high. he is one tier above random nurse. i get slight town vibes from his attitude, but nothing specific

rce feels off to me and i don't understand townreads there. although i wouldn't call flavour leaf towny - why his vote is on flavour leaf is a good question? for someone who has so many posts, i don't think he's doing much to advance the game honestly.

why shouldn't i have aureal that low? originally, i had aureal as a bit towny for her insistence on pushing mechanically good ideas. you didn't agree with them, so i'm not sure why you think i should be townreading her. there's not really a case for me to make here, i just feel very uneasy with her posts and extensive mechanical focus she had for the entire game to the point she had like one blank vote in terms of reads content despite being around quite a bit. something about her interaction with me and roden felt off to me, too. it's mostly a gut thing but if i have to put it into words, i guess it's responding to my post and not roden's (she responded to a post before that that came after roden's chronologically, so this wasn't a convenience thing) to say she wasn't doing what roden thought? and then like, poking at me for the first time after roden said he would townread her poking at people? i don't think it's especially unreasonable to ask me about that, but i don't think it's an especially baffling read to make either, so asking about that as your first question of the game does feel ??? to me

You think it's suspicious to respond non-sequentially? Man, I knew there had to be someone out there that I was paranoid of feeling that way when I hold back posts because I'm not keeping up well and don't want to seem like I'm ignoring things.

I'm posting from mobile while doing other things a lot and might get a little scattershot in responses at times. Like right now, there was some other post in here I saw and want to respond to and didn't immediately find so it's probably before this one a ways.

I saw Roden's post about me but didn't immediately feel moved enough to comment on it until you did as well because you both validated my feeling that it was kind of an odd take, and came to a different conclusion about him based on it. So I asked, and realized I liked your reasoning better than my own. I've seen a good few fake townreads on me in recent games, and you made me realize it didn't really resemble those, even though it seemed inaccurate in the reasoning.

[SirCakez]

UNVOTE:
I don't feel good about this vote anymore

I did some ISOing to verify what you were saying and unfortunately for me and my lack of scumreads this game your claims about talking about votes every game early day one check out - it's more specific meta then just the lackadaisical Penguin meta I was thinking of

So now I literally have like nothing I feel good about pushing
Someone make a scummy post

[SirCakez]

Aureal who do you think is scum? It's not really clear from your iso

@Aureal did you see this?

[Aureal]

none of my reads are that strong so far - honestly, i'm a little worried about it, it feels like the gamestate isn't that advanced and we're halfway to deadline. i was hoping we'd be able to, uh, walk and chew gum when it comes to the mechanical stuff, but maybe we need to cut down on it and focus on the mafia side of things

Yeah, I agree with this. This setup triggers my mech-based instincts to want to try to break it, but motivation sank and now I still barely even have any reads.

Hmmmm. What do you suppose is the meaning of the fact that there was a bunch of talk about the Merlyn wagon but nobody ever asked me why I voted her? Was it that obvious to everyone?

did you see this setup as like, especially breakable? i mean, there's certainly engagement to be had over which options will be better for town and that's totally fine, but even in the best case scenario, are any of these options really that good?

i can't speak for anyone else, but i thought it'd be more interesting to wait and see if you talked about merlyn, or anyone else, without prompting

Oh, it was the next post, lol.

I guess breakable might not have been the best description. It's a bianco design, I'm not mech-headed enough to think I can literally break it. But I'm a micromanager who wants to optimize things to an obnoxious extent. Like today I'm kicking myself because I missed a Paypal offer to get $5 back if I'd just used it for one more $50 transaction by yesterday. Surely I could have found something else I could've paid with PayPal for in the last couple of weeks and I would have gotten free money.

And we're on the same page regarding talking about Merlyn, lol. I was kind of waiting to see if anyone asked about it!

Seeing as nobody did, I started theorizing about what that might imply. Then I went back and looked at the actual wagon composition and decided I didn't really like my theory after all.

[Aureal]

My vote on flavor is just because I am going to prioritize sorting him before anyone else in this player list, no offense to anyone else. But for my game and how I’m going to view the game on a given day is going to be more tied to what alignment I think FL is moreso than the rest of the lobby.

That said he hasn’t done anything yet so mounting a wagon without his input doesn’t get me anywhere. So I haven’t pressed it too hard. If my vote wasn’t here it would be on devil for the record.

What do you expect to do to be able to sort FL? And how is a vote without his presence going to help with that?

[biancospino]

Prodding marcistar.

[Aureal]

i've played with you before, but it was a long time ago now - it's true i don't have recent experience with you and i guess i'll check your games from 2022?

i wouldn't expect you or most people to do things with the sole intention of 'advancing the gamestate' but usually that just happens naturally by like, pushing people or asking questions when you're suspicious etc. like, the intention reading part of your post - i think you did that with cakez, and maybe a bit with drew, but it doesn't feel like a big focus for you so far. i understand if you're town you probably have been thinking things and just not posting about them that much, and i don't really intend to vote you out d1 unless we get in a deadline rush and it's you or someone i townread

re: fl, i don't mind that you prioritise sorting him but i don't really see how your vote goes about doing that? since i don't think fl has really entered the game yet and i don't think fl is going to like feel pressured by the vote or whatever. it's not the biggest deal because townies do things i don't understand frequently, but it does just feel a bit strange that you didn't seem to have anything else going on at the time i guess

Okay, well, uh, thanks for reinforcing my townread on you by thinking the same sort of things as me again???

Sigh

[Aureal]

It not FL only, but I know if FL is scum or *I think* FL is scum then he has the ability to pull me into a rabbit hole that may be detrimental to town. Whether that be a tunnel or gets me to scum side.

And if he’s town then it makes it infinitely easier to make town cohesive. I know he has the ability to do so and I am fairly err…tenacious when I feel the solve is correct.

OK now I'm kinda weirded out that you described FL in a way that very accurately matched my experience before and then say this, which doesn't match at all.

[RCEnigma]

It not FL only, but I know if FL is scum or *I think* FL is scum then he has the ability to pull me into a rabbit hole that may be detrimental to town. Whether that be a tunnel or gets me to scum side.

And if he’s town then it makes it infinitely easier to make town cohesive. I know he has the ability to do so and I am fairly err…tenacious when I feel the solve is correct.

OK now I'm kinda weirded out that you described FL in a way that very accurately matched my experience before and then say this, which doesn't match at all.

That he’s strong as either alignment and can heavily influence a gamestate but is prone to strong arming theories to march his solve instead of vice versa?

Well I didn’t specify that but still.

I don’t get what you mean and I’m sure we have different experiences of FL.