Open 99: Mayo Clinic (Game Over!) before 703

[GnKoichi]

Kmd, would you prefer I not answer questions honestly? I never said to ignore my other posts. I've said in the past that if I get voted out for that behavior, I did it to myself, and it would be understandable.

[Kmd4390]

It's "understandable" because you are the scummiest player in the game. If you weren't, then I wouldn't be thinking you are scum, and I wouldn't be voting you.

[Wall-E]

It's "understandable" because you are the scummiest player in the game. If you weren't, then I wouldn't be thinking you are scum, and I wouldn't be voting you.

This post is meaningless drivel, as it includes nothing that can be debated.

[charter]

I don't really see the need to debate GK being lynched. He needs to, there's really no other side of it. Look at what he's doing now. It's almost the same thing as me saying I lied, he's admitting to playing scummily. By his own logic he should be lynched. I've said that phrase about him too many times to count now...

[Wall-E]

I don't really see the need to debate GK being lynched. He needs to, there's really no other side of it. Look at what he's doing now. It's almost the same thing as me saying I lied, he's admitting to playing scummily. By his own logic he should be lynched. I've said that phrase about him too many times to count now...

Do you truly believe GnK to be scum?

[Wall-E]

Also, if it's almost the same thing as you saying you lied, why don't you self-vote?

[charter]

I don't believe in that logic. I'm pointing out that he's applying it to me, but it doesn't hold try to himself.

Obviously I truly think GK is scum.

What do you think, Charter, about Wall-E and about Ani?

I think ani is your scumbuddy and Wall-E is more likely town than scum.

[GnKoichi]

Charter, please elaborate on that in terms of Ani & Wall-E. I don't think you've given anything more than "GnK is scum" and single sentence opinions on everyone else all game.

[charter]

That's a blatent lie.

I think animorph is your scumbuddy based on how he applies situations to you differently than others. Wall-E I don't think is scum with you and animorph. Seriously, I've said this plenty of times and explained it several times as well.

[animorpherv1]

So, I'm not allowed to express things in my own way?

Wow, thats bad.

[orangepenguin]

So, I'm not allowed to express things in my own way?

If by your own way, you mean really short content-lacking responses..

[charter]

Statements like that won't help your case.

I've already explained how you apply your logic differently depending on who is under question in similar circumstances.

[Nameless]

ITT, Nameless briefly descends into third person to distance himself from himself as he actually agrees with something that Wall-E says (#727) although that

was

something that Nameless had mentioned against Kmd two hours earlier so he's yet convinced Wall-E actually had an original, useful thought.

Nameless has also decided it worth mentioning that GK's accusation of Charter in #732 is, indeed, exaggerated.

Ani posts with no contribution and Nameless watches Wall-E with interest. OP is still hypocritical and Nameless is disappointed, and also wishes OP would actually make the analysis of GK he supposedly wanted to make.

[GnKoichi]

You know what, yes. What I said about Charter was an exaggeration, but it's one that rings true. What has he contributed in the last ten pages? He asks other people questions, but seems incapable of updating his own opinions. I don't expect him to suddenly be on my side, but there has been a lot to look at since OP started posting, and he really doesn't seem very interested in it since that has taken votes off of me. He's a one trick pony. If he really thinks Ani & I are scumbuddies, how does he explain my vote on Ani? Why not put his vote on Ani to try and call what he must assume is a bluff on my part?

My statement against Charter was mostly out of anger. When someone posts something like this...

I don't really see the need to debate GK being lynched. He needs to, there's really no other side of it. Look at what he's doing now. It's almost the same thing as me saying I lied, he's admitting to playing scummily. By his own logic he should be lynched. I've said that phrase about him too many times to count now...

... I get steamed. To say there's only one side to an argument is to show your lack of understanding of the situation. He has his blinders on, seeming only to think of voting me, which is just as disrespectful to the game as lurkers. If he really wants me gone, he should try to build a case against me. He must see that most people aren't voting for me anymore, so his own vote is wasted if he doesn't put more effort into building that lynch.

But more importantly, let's see if those who said Ani had only one last chance will stick to their word and knock him out after that post.

[orangepenguin]

You know what, yes. What I said about Charter was an exaggeration, but it's one that rings true. What has he contributed in the last ten pages? He asks other people questions, but seems incapable of updating his own opinions. I don't expect him to suddenly be on my side, but there has been a lot to look at since OP started posting, and he really doesn't seem very interested in it since that has taken votes off of me. He's a one trick pony. If he really thinks Ani & I are scumbuddies, how does he explain my vote on Ani? Why not put his vote on Ani to try and call what he must assume is a bluff on my part?

Not that I ever said I though that, but scum buss their partners all the time. I don't really see where you where going with that though.

[GnKoichi]

Ugh. I just read what "bussing" means. Well, crap.

People play this game pretty crazy.

[orangepenguin]

Yeah...I had to hammer my only scum partner Day 1, and nearly won the game, after bussing him the first day. It was a newbie game, I was the newbie, he was the IC, and I am not that good of a player. But it was a good experience. Despite my chances of winning were low, I almost managed to win, and (there was 3 players, and the doc was the deciding factor, and the person the other guy replaced was inactive during the first days, so that kind of sealed my fate- losing on a technicality, even though I almost had him convinced.

So now that you mention that I think you two are scum, it doesn't seem that far-fetched. Scum do it all the time. Even though it seems as if you didn't know there was a term for it, you could have just as well have been bussing, thinking that you would look good for being on your partner's wagon. Then again, anyone voting anyone can be bussing, so you can't really use bussing as an argument if you're not sure if someone is scum or not. Not effectively. Just spec.

[Plum]

Elvis, welcome! This was a pleasant surprise.

3)

Hypocritically denounced scumbuddy theorizing whilst engaging in it himself. This is less a scumtell in my book. It's like a half-scumtell. After all, I'm a huge hypocrite. Still, it adds to the pile.

Yay irony! And meta-hypocrisy! Still, I see OP's hypocrisy as a legitimate part of the case against him, so I'll look at Wall-E's hypocrisy as another matter relevent to the case on

him

. Moving on. Other parts of Wall-E's post: Calls OP out on saying he didn't have a case on Wall-E when he had. My question here was that Wall-E accpted OP's quote-and-vote as a case, but on reread he apparently didn't mind it. Hmmm. For now, fine, I suppose. The unvote and such itself: looks kinda . . . well, schitzo-y; how flavor-text appropriate. Still, as Elvis said, weird vote switch, especially as nothing came from Ani between the 'I wish my vote would hammer Animorpherv' and 'unvote, let's go back at the OP case, voe OP'. That's consistent with Wall-E's inconsistent behavior this game, at least. He's been all over the map, somethimes verging on uncharted territory. Then again, I sort of see where he might be coming from: Not expecting much of Ani, but giving him a chance at redemption before a hammer.

GnK is getting pretty strong with the denouncement of his play for the first 23 pages of this game. Really strong.

I don't totally disagree with EK's analysis of my earliest play, as I feel I only completely got into the game around the time I voted Wall-E, which is not to say I would consider myself to have 'totally not been scumhunting' (this might also have been due to having had to catch up with two or three pages of play twice in the early bits of the game, if I recall correctly). I was slow to vote and my contributions weren't as good as they got, so for an early scan I don't overall mind the minor accusation.

More stupid semantics. I'll say that in saying 'half the game' and later clarifying the halves to be pages 1-23 and pages 24-30, or wherever we're at, he did nothing wrong or contradictory enough to warrant comment. I could explain this, but it would be more semantics. The main point of the original statement was that there were two distinct parts of the game; in the first GnK's play was not as good, and the second, ongoing of which, in which his play was better.

Kmd: First an eyeroll post rhetorically asking GnK if we're supposed to ignore his play during the first 23 pages of play (not especially helpful) and then, after an admirably reasonable response post from GnK, Kmd just bashes him, providing little substance about his views of GnK as he did so. To be honest, I haven't had any relly strong feelings about Kmd thus far. Offhand, I would have said, 'hasn't done anything overtly scummy lately' and 'Oh yeah, for some reason Charter seems to think he's the SK'. But now I'm . . . meh, at least be useful, etc. Much of your latest posting hasn't been too useful, Kmd; I plan to keep an eye on you.

On that note:

It's almost the same thing as me saying I lied, he's admitting to playing scummily.

No, not really. He seems to be saying he's tried to play pro-town the whole game, and in retrospect feels that for much of the game he's failed to do so and has done scummy things. Lying is more a direct, concious decision to do something that's too often anti-town.

So, I'm not allowed to express things in my own way?

Wow, thats bad.

I don't know to whom this response was directed, but that was a bad post. Seriously, Ani, convince us,

expressing it your own way, if you like

, that you're reading the game, playing seriously, trying to benefit the town, and scumhunting. That should include a brief case on a player you find scummy. By 'case', I mean some sort of minor analysis or explaination as to why you find that player scummy.

Ani posts with no contribution and Nameless watches Wall-E with interest. OP is still hypocritical and Nameless is disappointed, and also wishes OP would actually make the analysis of GK he supposedly wanted to make.

Plum does, too.

Ugh. I just read what "bussing" means. Well, crap.

People play this game pretty crazy.

Yeah, bussing. That's something to take into account, in my opinion, after the town successfully lynches scum (like, for example, serious scumpartner accusations). I, as town, lost my (intense, well-played by many) newbie game despite lynching the first scum Day 1 because his partner bussed him so thoroughly that day. It's a useful technique in other words, and something players should take into account. And yeah, I think you could quite possibly be bussing Ani, but I'm not going to think about that as an argument too seriously until one of you filps scum, if and when that happens. There's planty more potential bussing out there; much too much for speculating about every single vote being bussing to be worth it.

Of course people play this game crazy. That's part of what makes it such fun .

[Wall-E]

ani isn't even trying

unvote: vote animorpherv1

why do you make me hate, ani? why?

nameless: can a person say something pro-town and still be scummy? can the opposite occur, where an honest-to-god pro-town player does something scummy? what was it that I said that you supposedly already said? do you think i'm town or scum?

[Nameless]

what was it that I said that you supposedly already said?

You effectively called Kmd out for active lurking in #727, while I'd called out Kmd for active lurking in #721 (although you referred to a different post of Kmd's).

[Kmd4390]

Hey, my opinions aren't changing, and I'm not going to sit here and repeat things like I did in Tranquility.

I think GNK is scum for reasons I've covered more than enough. I think that if Charter is scum, either him or GNK is SK. I think Animo may be scum. I think OP is town.

I've already made my stances as clear as I'm going to be able to.

[Stef]

So.. you think he may be scum but you are not willing to lynch him?

[Kmd4390]

When did I say I wasn't willing to lynch him? No, he wouldn't be my top choice. That's GNK. It doesn't look like we are going to get the analysis I asked for, so I guess an Animo lynch is ok.

[Stef]

I didn't imply you did. That's why i formulated it as a question.

[Kmd4390]

Then, yes, I'd be willing to lynch Animo.