Hollow Knight Mafia [game over]

[fireisredsir]

it's not like he's at all 100% locked in on thinking it's gimli anyway

[Gimli]

well you are a good lawyer

[fireisredsir]

i would be an awful lawyer ngl

[fireisredsir]

the thing is im not even 100% that it isn't klick

i just think that a lot of the things that you're suspecting him for are actually things that make total sense as town to me

if he's scum he's playing a very good game and idk maybe you both can just see right through it and not doubt things but it feels wrong to me

i don't really get what furtive has done that has you convinced he's town either

[Klick]

elo is hard for scum. it's hard to maintain solving, it's hard to keep your thought processes consistent and show progression and explain yourself without ever slipping up in your mindset. it's hard to realtime with people and talk to them and make sure your reactions are what they will think looks town

you and klick have both dove headfirst into doing all of that

because you're trying to solve the game and it's genuine

furtive hasn't

I get what you're saying here and understand it

My main conflict I'd that I wouldn't expect different from furtive here if furtive were town
I wouldn't expect that kind of solving, furtive hasn't shown evidence to me previously of solving at that level

[Klick]

i literally just explained how it makes sense are you even reading the game

yeah but your explanation is thin, it's still far superior for town!klick to play f3 against two unclears than to give the win to who he thinks is mafia.

You are removing this from its context and it reads as incredibly intentional to me
You're providing zero evaluation of everyone's likelihood of winning in a Klick/Gimli/furtive F3 and just going 'lol obviously everyone has a better shot of winning as scum if they're against 2 unclears'

If I'm town, and you're town, and you've basically openly stated that you'd vote me at F3...
And if you're scum and furtive is basically openly stating that he just wants to vote me...

Then Klick's odds of winning, regardless of alignment, are basically nil in a Klick/Gimli/furtive F3.

Agree or disagree?

[furtiveglance]

elo is hard for scum. it's hard to maintain solving, it's hard to keep your thought processes consistent and show progression and explain yourself without ever slipping up in your mindset. it's hard to realtime with people and talk to them and make sure your reactions are what they will think looks town

you and klick have both dove headfirst into doing all of that

because you're trying to solve the game and it's genuine

furtive hasn't

I get what you're saying here and understand it

My main conflict I'd that I wouldn't expect different from furtive here if furtive were town
I wouldn't expect that kind of solving, furtive hasn't shown evidence to me previously of solving at that level

Embarrassing attempt at a discredit, Gimli's right it's strategic.

[Gimli]

yup

[Gimli]

klick you haven't answered me if you have previous games with furtive and aristeia where they have tunneled you as townies, in order to properly justify what you were saying in #6390

I see you ignored my questions, then ignored that I said you ignored them, and you are now asking me other unrelated things

[Gimli]

notice how the micro we played cannot be used as a justification to argue you'd kill ari over petapan, since ari didn't start tunneling you in that game at least one day after peta died in this game

[Gimli]

i literally just explained how it makes sense are you even reading the game

yeah but your explanation is thin, it's still far superior for town!klick to play f3 against two unclears than to give the win to who he thinks is mafia.

You are removing this from its context and it reads as incredibly intentional to me
You're providing zero evaluation of everyone's likelihood of winning in a Klick/Gimli/furtive F3 and just going 'lol obviously everyone has a better shot of winning as scum if they're against 2 unclears'

If I'm town, and you're town, and you've basically openly stated that you'd vote me at F3...
And if you're scum and furtive is basically openly stating that he just wants to vote me...

Then Klick's odds of winning, regardless of alignment, are basically nil in a Klick/Gimli/furtive F3.

Agree or disagree?

you don't think I can find you as town if you're town all of a sudden?

[Gimli]

I think the odds of you winning klick/gimli/furtive in f3 are nill if you're scum

if you're town just town it up

[Gimli]

but I don't see you towning it up I see you bullshitting me

[Klick]

Right, it did, but for most of the time it was on Klick

Fire, if you vote me here, Klick will join. He said as much. And that makes zero sense if he thinks it's Gimli like he said he did! It's very clearly desperation. I know it's hard to see when you're the one getting pocketed but you are.

Weirdly, I'd rather bet on the less likely player being scum than get voted out and definitely lose

[Klick]

Klick: *says anything*
Gimli AND furtive: 'What a terrible and blatant attempt at manipulation, could you make this any more obvious?'

[Gimli]

I'm sorry

[Gimli]

Right, it did, but for most of the time it was on Klick

Fire, if you vote me here, Klick will join. He said as much. And that makes zero sense if he thinks it's Gimli like he said he did! It's very clearly desperation. I know it's hard to see when you're the one getting pocketed but you are.

Weirdly, I'd rather bet on the less likely player being scum than get voted out and definitely lose

you're phrasing it in a way that could be interpreted as you saying its more likely furtive

since i'd be the less likely player being scum in this situation

[furtiveglance]

Klick: *says anything*
Gimli AND furtive: 'What a terrible and blatant attempt at manipulation, could you make this any more obvious?'

That's what it looks like to me, you're saying I never play well as town

[Klick]

klick you haven't answered me if you have previous games with furtive and aristeia where they have tunneled you as townies, in order to properly justify what you were saying in #6390

I see you ignored my questions, then ignored that I said you ignored them, and you are now asking me other unrelated things

I have very limited time and I think you're scum
I've spent a VERY large portion of my time budget responding to your continued back and forth with me, don't pretend I'm just ignoring you.

Furtive does have at least a couple of games where he has had exactly this attitude towards my way of playing as town yes
Ari doesn't have more than that Micro. I think that Micro and this game is sufficient evidence for Ari having that reaction to my way of playing.

[Klick]

notice how the micro we played cannot be used as a justification to argue you'd kill ari over petapan, since ari didn't start tunneling you in that game at least one day after peta died in this game

I haven't verified if this is true or not
I don't think this is particularly important though!

[Gimli]

you were justifying that you wouldn't kill peta over ari cause ari tunnels you on style in #6390

but she tunneled you after peta died here

and you have no other games with her

so

[Gimli]

it was important when you were using it to justify the order of NKs make no sense if it's you

[Gimli]

I agree it's not important - unless you're using it to townread yourself

[Klick]

i literally just explained how it makes sense are you even reading the game

yeah but your explanation is thin, it's still far superior for town!klick to play f3 against two unclears than to give the win to who he thinks is mafia.

You are removing this from its context and it reads as incredibly intentional to me
You're providing zero evaluation of everyone's likelihood of winning in a Klick/Gimli/furtive F3 and just going 'lol obviously everyone has a better shot of winning as scum if they're against 2 unclears'

If I'm town, and you're town, and you've basically openly stated that you'd vote me at F3...
And if you're scum and furtive is basically openly stating that he just wants to vote me...

Then Klick's odds of winning, regardless of alignment, are basically nil in a Klick/Gimli/furtive F3.

Agree or disagree?

you don't think I can find you as town if you're town all of a sudden?

I have been consistently presenting my perspective and you have insistently stonewalled the idea of reconsidering your perspective
You have openly stated that you aren't interested in reconsidering today, like, in the last page or two lmao

[Gimli]

and I also said I'll read and evaluate in f3

today I'm not moving my vote obviously