Mini 2293: Death Note. Postgame!

[Black]

I'm open to hear a StD case and I admit it's probably not smart to think it could only be HPE/Gimli. If we consider StD then we have to consider Meg imo

I'm the only one it can't be and Kawaii is about as close to cleared as you can be without actually being cleared

[Black]

POSSIBLY KIRA

1. Gimli (Teru Mikami)
2. Kokichi Oma (Thierry Morrello)
3. HighPrincessErinys (Shuichi Aizawa)
4. Save The Dragons (Raye Penber)
5. MegAzumarill (Quillsh Wammy)
6. Not_Mafia (Mihael Keehl)

NOT KIRA

1. Black (Misa Amane)
2. KawaiiKame (Hideki Ide)

[Gimli]

i defended mala cuz i thought she was town, i didn't jump on the popular belief that we should kill her

then you called her posts bad at some point

when shit hit the fan with the claims and the investigator kill you just went like 'i'll wait for reveals'

playing an absolutely safe game

also you'd townread mala to pocket her, I think.

I have more reasons to think you're kira than to think hpe is kira, at any rate. I'll check meg and NM at some point.

[Gimli]

POSSIBLY KIRA

1. Gimli (Teru Mikami)
2. Kokichi Oma (Thierry Morrello)
3. HighPrincessErinys (Shuichi Aizawa)
4. Save The Dragons (Raye Penber)
5. MegAzumarill (Quillsh Wammy)
6. Not_Mafia (Mihael Keehl)

NOT KIRA

1. Black (Misa Amane)
2. KawaiiKame (Hideki Ide)

agreed

[Save The Dragons]

i defended mala cuz i thought she was town, i didn't jump on the popular belief that we should kill her

then you called her posts bad at some point

those recent mala posts aren't great

shortly after:

I'm okay with recent mala content though it's not amazing by any means

i think it's pretty clear it wasn't enough to make me lose my tr of her.

when shit hit the fan with the claims and the investigator kill you just went like 'i'll wait for reveals'

i don't see the issue with this, i didn't want anyone to do anything rash so i unvoted so i couldn't be used. i tr mala and vander and it was confusing so i wanted to see what would happen before i did anything.

also you'd townread mala to pocket her, I think.

wait so now i was tring her even though i called her posts bad? this seems like you're trying to have it both ways

I have more reasons to think you're kira than to think hpe is kira, at any rate. I'll check meg and NM at some point.

what are they

[Black]

UNVOTE: HPE

I still think it might be Kira but maybe I'm jumping the gun a little. I'm still pretty upset with the way mala got ran up yesterday and I feel like this whole situation could have been avoided

I'm going to try to look through some stuff to find anything that can help here. I'm looking forward to hearing from Meg and N_M as well

[Gimli]

you're playing like kira would. safe throughout the game, not a single wave, not a single push that wasn't thread consensus. even today you're like 'hpe or gimli' lol. this is not your towngame.

hpe is playing like a follower would, trying 1v1s, being loud, acting obtusely. I don't think that's how kira would behave.

so I think it's just you. I may or may not have time to look at other slots, but I'm okay with my solve and I'm ok with being wrong.

[Gimli]

you're playing similarly to your bug game in gnosia

[Save The Dragons]

you're playing like kira would. safe throughout the game, not a single wave, not a single push that wasn't thread consensus. even today you're like 'hpe or gimli' lol. this is not your towngame.

i don't think any of this is true and anyone can look at my iso and see for themselves. i don't think pushing you or kawaii was safe and it wasn't thread consensus every time i pushed you guys.

today i don't see why thinking it's between two people who are causing chaos and sputtering all sorts of stuff is safe or thread consensus. i think other possibilities are possible but unlikely at this point

how is it not my town game

[Gimli]

yes it was, very safe and very consensus both times. you were getting behind the main pushers everytime. when you were pushing kawaii, I was the one doing it loudly. when you were pushing kokichi, I was the loud one. when you were pushing me, it was black's doing. you're not getting your hands dirty. you're playing from the sidelines. you're agreeing with whatever is convenient throughout the game.

[Gimli]

have I caused chaos today? really? I'm just posting, I'm playing my game.

[Save The Dragons]

you're playing similarly to your bug game in gnosia

i think people misunderstood what i tried to do as bug

I actually outlined my strategy as bug and publicly revealed it, hoping and ensuring that thread apathy would lead people to make the mistake of falling right into my trap. i said early on that bug would try to find gnosia and eliminate them, and then 3 days later people picked my target, the one i correctly assumed was gnosia.

i have done nothing like that here. im crafty and calculating as scum and here i've just been going with the flow. im not helping produce thread apathy or anything like that.

so i don't see the comparison.

[Gimli]

going with the flow is a calculated play, I'm sure you can see that.

[Gimli]

I wanna know how you got to a POE of either me or HPE just because we are 'causing chaos', which in my case must be the fact that I'm posting.

[Black]

Gimli could be galaxy braining me but why does Kira!Gimli not just push HPE here? Continuing to solve beyond the obvious Kira suspect at this stage of the game seems ridiculously townie to me but also that could be exactly why Gimli is doing it. I'm getting town vibes from this StD thing. It's actually making me rethink the game a little

[Save The Dragons]

i don't think so, i think that's what i normally do

i don't think me not being loud is AI

[Gimli]

Gimli could be galaxy braining me but why does Kira!Gimli not just push HPE here? Continuing to solve beyond the obvious Kira suspect at this stage of the game seems ridiculously townie to me but also that could be exactly why Gimli is doing it. I'm getting town vibes from this StD thing. It's actually making me rethink the game a little

aaaa my favorite type of post

[Black]

i have done nothing like that here. im crafty and calculating as scum and here i've just been going with the flow. im not helping produce thread apathy or anything like that.

The stakes are much bigger as Kira here so you would have every reason to adjust your meta I think

[HighPrincessErinys]

i kinda think hpe would have tried to strike down any slot you suggested, you just happened to pick me

either you're kira and hpe is pure and it is correct and wants to lim you

or hpe is kira and is trying hard to lim you specifically because that's its plan for looking townie

im having trouble seeing other possibilities

we can both be town, one of us can be a follower and the other town. show me your work on how you can have this POE of two people as possible kira. can't be kokichi, can't be meg, can't be not_mafia?

It's possible that kokichi/meg/not_mafia is Kira, but how likely? Give me a Kira case on all 3 of them
I want you to give the 3 Kira cases on what indicates them to be Kira and I want HPE to give a P0E case as to why Kira is only you/HPE

Alright alright alrighty then. Let's see what Vander thinks of these three!

Kokichi:

This is a surprisingly genuine set of interactions. Vander and Kokichi agree with each other sometimes, and disagree with each other sometimes. They aren't really distancing nor is Vander sheeping Kokichi. That being said, he also openly postulates a possible Kira!Kokichi multiple times and even briefly mentions feeling a Mala/Kokichi/StD pair before focusing on Kawaii. The disagreeing hurts a bit too.

Meg:

A lot more sparse, admittedly a case for distancing could be made. Prominent disagreement in 1094 however.

Lorne:

A bit more of an active townread situation, with the main standout probably being 763. Lorne also seems to mostly townread Vander, except for his final post before being banned in which he literally naked votes Vanderscamp. This is BEFORE the Condemn too. Kira, technically possible, but Vander also took a liking to Black and well... She certainly ain't Kira now is she?

One could really make an argument for all three if they tried, but what's fundamentally important is how realistic that is, and if that person is even likely to be Kira WITHOUT the associative at play to begin with.

[Save The Dragons]

my point is that bug plays entirely differently so comparing scum to bug or even kira to bug is disingenuous

[Black]

@HPE - you answered Gimli's question. You were supposed to answer why it's only you/Gimli here as possible Kira options

[Save The Dragons]

it also, if gimli is kira, wouldn't be the first time scum tried to pin me as scum due to playing bug even though the comparison is off, so i'm a little wary of it because i did get mislimmed for it

[KawaiiKame]

Why Gimli is Kira:
Actions:
Pursued me in the opening when I feigned Kira, Kira/town both have an incentive to do this, Kira to eliminate pseudo-Kira, town to eliminate Kira, nai
Realized my innocence: Tow does this when town believes someone is town, Kira has incentive to look town/knows I am town, nai
Flipped between me/mala/Idk who else: You can flip/be indecisive as any alignment, nai

Forced Mala to out herself as the Detective

Kira has the ultimate objective of forcing the Detective to out in the day to kill her in the night to win in the next day if they escape elimination, Gimli has a behavioral pattern of catching onto details ("fading away and becoming a non-entity") pursuing that detail, seeking elimination. Gimli picked up that Mala was a PR like when he picked on I was acting like Kira, pursued Mala like he pursued me:
If Gimli is Kira then he pursued Mala, forced her to out as the Detective, caused the Detective to believe Gimli was not Kira, HPE is, killed the Detective in the night

Gimli was accused of game throwing when pursuing Mala close to Twilight yet didn't stop...

Association:
It's a well known fact Vander defended Gimli/pursued me + Mala with Gimli, since Vander was so townread it's reasonable to believe Vander used this perception as being town to Gimli so Gimli looked town in association, Vander was a big reason why I saw Gimli as town outside of Gimli seeing me as innocent eventually

[Gimli]

bug and kira are quite similar, all you have to do is not get killed, and in both games you played exactly like this agreeable starfox lurky guy

[Save The Dragons]

i don't think i lurked in either game tbh