Mini 2287: AB:LoAF (Postgame)

[TemporalLich]

Are you in a neighborhood now or is the first neighbor on N1? I forgot how that role works.

I indeed have a neighborhood right now.

[Doctor Drew]

I can confirm TL's claim.

[Gimli]

and that can be a role that scum has, right? just so we're clear

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

and that can be a role that scum has, right? just so we're clear

yes all roles are alignment-less

basically anyone can have any of the roles regardless of alignment in this setup

[Kokichi Oma]

I can confirm TL's claim.

What's your read on Lich in and out of the neighborhood? Are you the only two or are there more people?

[Doctor Drew]

I can confirm TL's claim.

What's your read on Lich in and out of the neighborhood? Are you the only two or are there more people?

Just TL and I in the neighborhood. They also said that I (or specifically narrow parking) was a random choice.

There hasn't been much action in the hood, just TL explaining to my former self what a hood is lol. Really no real alignment read from that. I almost feel like they are too scared too give too much away, but their in thread activity has matched their hood activity, so might be nothing big about that.

In thread, seems weird that they are the only real wagon and besides TL's push on Kyo, there been a real push for a counter wagon. I keep going back to TL's sudden read change on Mara, which to me seemed the most scummy thing to happen to that point.

I feel like I am overthinking my way out of a TL voted, but I would prefer to let things play out a bit more.

[Enchant]

I forgot i am in this game somehow

[Herta]

So did we!

[Enchant]

okay I think this is for the best.

TL, you either fullclaim now or I'm putting you on E-1. I think the best way we can play this out is either eliminate you or have your claim so we can absolutely move to different targets. you're not gonna convince anyone you're town by posting, I don't think.

claiming Meta-Neighbor

I discarded Extension

Meta-neighbor

You have access to a meta-neighborhood PT with another random player if this card is one of the role cards you can pick.

If this card is picked, the meta-neighborhood PT will remain open. However, if this card is not picked, the meta-neighborhood PT is locked at the start of pregame.

---

are "meta" cards like this allowed?

Extension

You can bind yourself to someone at night, for that night.
Anything that happens to that player due to actions at night(including visits and results), except conversions, also happens to you(but not the other way around). You will always know the people you visit.

eeeeeeh.

I would pick Extension instead of shitty Hood.

[Fuyuhiko Kuzuryu]

I discarded vanilla

Do you think it's likely both you and kirigiri got vanilla roles in a game with soooooo many roles?

Don’t see why we can’t both be vanilla.

[Fuyuhiko Kuzuryu]

Vanilla discards ftr

[Enchant]

I didn't really count how many pure vanillas in setup.

... 39.
Therefore chance is pretty respectable.

[Fuyuhiko Kuzuryu]

So it looks like taking the meta-neighbor role did not guarantee TLich would have a partner in it?

[Kokichi Oma]

I didn't really count how many pure vanillas in setup.

... 39.
Therefore chance is pretty respectable.

Ah okay, then it's understandable.

[Enchant]

So it looks like taking the meta-neighbor role did not guarantee TLich would have a partner in it?

Incorrect.

TLich already had hood during discards and knew who is in it.

If TLich pick Meta Neighbour, hood are not closed.
If Meta Neighbour discarded, this hood closes, but continues to exist.

[Kokichi Oma]

That sounds confusing, but does it really matter?

[Enchant]

Nope. Hoods suck.

[Kokichi Oma]

I'm still all for voting off TemporalLich today. I'll wait for more opinions though. I feel like I've talked the most

[Herta]

I'm not as sure that Temporal Lich is town as others are that he's scum. I'm not super committed to that read. I'll hammer if NM doesn't. A counter wagon would be nice.

VOTE: yume

[Aisa]

Summary of claims so far:

Herta
Pick: Universal Miller (Must Pick)

TemporalLich
Pick: Meta-Neighbour
Discard: Extension

Doctor Drew
Pick: Meta-Neighbour

Kyoko Kirigiri
Discard: Vanilla

Fuyuhiko Kuzuryu
Discard: Vanilla

Enchant
Discard: Untopped Post Restrictor

[Marashu]

Sorry, lost track of time!

Because now I've cornered them into them NEEDING to have a reason. Later in the game if it comes to a point that their role doesn't have a reason for this, then they are caught lying.



I'm Smart huh?

This reasoning makes sense to me.

Should we share discards

I don't think there's a point because, with the meta janitor, it makes it SUPER easy to just lie about, and I don't think that there's any AI info to glean from it.

now the good players figure out if this is worth its salt and we either move elsewhere or do what y'all want

I'm starting to have doubts about Gimli.

UNVOTE: I'd be ok with a TL elimination today. I'm not keen on some of Enchant's reactions (specifically how Enchant reacted to the VT discard claim) so I'm not sure why people are saying Enchant comes out looking town from that exchange.

[Marashu]

Summary of claims so far:

Herta
Pick: Universal Miller (Must Pick)

TemporalLich
Pick: Meta-Neighbour
Discard: Extension

Doctor Drew
Pick: Meta-Neighbour

Kyoko Kirigiri
Discard: Vanilla

Fuyuhiko Kuzuryu
Discard: Vanilla

Enchant
Discard: Untopped Post Restrictor

To my understanding Doctor Drew didn't pick Meta-Neighbour; by TL picking it, Doctor Drew's slot was brought into the neighbourhood.

[Marashu]

I realize I edited out why I unvoted. I don't want to rush the day.

[Marashu]

I'm debating whether I should force the claim issue or wait a day to prove myself. I will say I have a role that is difficult for scum to interfere with and works best when coordinated with town. I have a back-up plan if we decide to not coordinate.

[Aisa]

Also yay, first post on my birthday!!

Happy birthday!

locktowning kokichi I think. suspicion over kyoko is good. suspicion over lich I still don't see it but it might just be things people scumread other people for that I don't, so.

I think sharing discards is an interesting idea. but does it make our actual roles more likely to reveal? like, the strength of them. making the game easier for scum at night, and whatnot. and does it help our wincon as townies to share such a thing? I think I'm against it.

Can you tell me why Lich is townie to you at all?

i mean its a little over the top to be scum at some points, scumreads merging together, wants to do a reads list as soon as everyone posts etc. I don't see a person playing like them and think they're scum, but clearly it's pinging everyone else so maybe I'm wrong. it's not that I'm necessarily going like 'oh this is a nice towny post', it's more a sensation that it's a townslot.

Any chance you can be a little more specific?
My personal experience has just been that often the seemingly-scummy slots are actually scummy >.<

I'll try. Sometimes I townread things I don't fully understand.

For instance, lich's response to the miller claim is calling it scum, scum tactics and scum mindset. Do I get it? No I don't get it. But why would scum be faking this level of paranoia?

Why not? Scum have to fake some paranoia somewhere.

Then there's... His whole ISO kind of looks like that. So many scumreads, and I think I disagree with most if not all of them? Or at least the reasoning. But I have a feeling of that presence that's trying to understand the game and it just feels town. The excessive self awareness in some posts is also too unbelievable. Scum wouldn't be this upfront with looking scummy?

Hmmm
just re-ISOed TL and I don't see anything scum couldn't fake. Do I remember someone else bringing up that TL's reasoning for scumreading Kokichi is consistent?

OK. Let's analyse:

Spoiler:

@Temporal, mind expanding a bit on your KittyTacky read? Also on how your read on me changed from 78 to 133?

KittyTacky's questions feel towny to me.

When I was reading your ISO for when I was compiling the lead rist, it didn't feel towny despite my initial read. That being said, your push is towny to the point "seemingly not townie" doesn't make sense as a read.

Just having a busy day. The list is pretty meh and I'm not sure what was his big fuss about "making a list" not making a list till that specific slot also posts stuff specially since in list its still "No content as of now"

whats "scummy mindset" with kokichi. can you elaborate on that read?

Yeah... It was past early D1 despite not everyone having content but I was needing to do a lead rist so I can make sure my vote makes sense.

Anyway, Kokichi Oma's pushes feel like they have ulterior motives behind them.

Also Kokichi clearly wants a mislim or at least to cause confrusion

@Lich analyze the wagon on you, please. What do you think of each vote?

Marashu's vote on me is an RVS vote, so that's a purely NAI vote
Aisa's vote on me is towny (I believe the vote was in RVS, but Aisa put out a case on me which has a towny mindset even though the case itself is meh)
Fuyuhiko Kuzuryu's vote on me is somewhat reactive but also comes with an associative, so I will say the vote itself is NAI (the pushes are scummy though)
Kokichi Oma's vote on me is scummy and the post afterward basically means they were rolefishing the universal miller claim

VOTE: Kokichi Oma

Best elim as of now due to having many associatives... Kokichi and Kyoko are very likely co-aligned

actually idk

my scumreads might be merging together

actually idk

my scumreads might be merging together

what does that mean, merging together? as in they're aligning themselves ITT from your POV?

no, kokichi and kyoko were seemingly the same player and I was scumreading kokichi

then again kokichi and kyoko are very likely co-aligned and it would be difficult to convince me that a kokichi wagon is not the way to end Day 1 as a kokichi elimination will provide a lot of info

considering that kokichi and kyoko have very strong associatives... my vote is on kokichi because kokichi is an outright openwolf (and not in a jestery way)

I see, like, 2 ideas repeated:
1. Kokichi is scum, plus generic accusations like he "clearly wants to cause a mislim" and "is a powerwolf"
2. Kokichi and Kyoko are aligned
It's not that much work to keep track of these two ideas and keep repeating them, so I think I disagree with the conclusion that TL's posting so far is sufficient to prove he has a consistent thought process.