Cosmos Mafia (Postgame)

[professotic]

sorry I'm here but I'm like pre Christmas drunk -_- I see your Lunar solve, but who do you think is Solar?

Why does Solar matter at the moment?

Why are you trying to push for that?


Miss Lunar.

[professotic]

interesting
i'm unsure on dds's alignment but i think it's either town or solar. i'm going to write off lunar given the immediate suspicions on mmr

DDS is mod confirmed to not be aligned with Solar.
I do think he might be Lunar that did theatre with MMR.

[professotic]

Because FA & MMR distanced day 1?

More like Dingle and MMR distanced day 2.
And is your partner.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

sorry I'm here but I'm like pre Christmas drunk -_- I see your Lunar solve, but who do you think is Solar?

Why does Solar matter at the moment?

Why are you trying to push for that?


Miss Lunar.

I don't know if you're incredibly tunneled or what

But I asked because she only gave her Lunar solve. I need to see people's full solves and see if that makes sense

[Cat Scratch Fever]

[t-bone, firebringer, meuh]
if there's more lunar they're in here

Look at Frozen Angel’s interaction with MMR.

Firebringer isn’t aligned with MMR from that.

Like take a look at ONLY FA’s interactions with MMR and you will see what I mean.

Because FA & MMR distanced day 1?

I will ask you again - why can FA not be Lunar?

Too many times have I see deepwolf coast to endgame victory because they bussed and/or distanced from their partner on day 1.

[Ydrasse]

the fa interactions are neutral
could be bussing or not but im not inclined to say "yes. pure clear"

[professotic]

This is an atrocious waste of posts! Speaking of post count, someone remind me. Is there a post limit this game, and if so, what is it?

So you counting the mod posts now?

There's already been discussion around your slot, mastina, professotic, and Bunny... What more are you looking for?

For me to wake up and see 2 new pages in the game about variant topics that I can analyze and for the mod to not be bored again to post 6 times to make a top page vote count next time maybe?

I'm probably overreacting.

Mastina is a slot I'd like to sort later. I think this is just what she does and if it's entirely random she's scum but if it makes some sense she's probably town. I am leaning toward the latter.

I don't think that you are overreacting.
138 definitely reads like shade, to me, coming from FA.
It's completely understandable and NAI to not understand the mech in a closed setup.
VOTE: FA
-Rubella

Let me remember to not respond to why I find something alarming next time someone asks me about it then? the statement can be NAI on its own but I didn't like the attitude shown in it so it was noted. In no context I said I scum read the slot for that so this by you is shading not what I said.

I posted the line I find that post alarming in response to mastina's almost hard townread on the slot - implying that I don't see how such a thing could give her an almost locked town read on the slot when it can be easily faked. There is absolutely no context in which you could have misunderstood it as a scum read on the slot so I can't believe you with that.

STD's becoming hard defensive about it and not engaging with me when asked about other slots was in fact over reaction but yours attempt to create a wagon over it felt way more self-aware and intentional.

and again since its being questioned - what I find alarming:

- People chatting about some mech speculations in a closed setup
- Someone dropping a line with a I don't know and don't wanna know attidue like there is something to know to make it believable they are in a not giving a f state

The IDGAF state can be easily faked. Its absolutely not deserving for that townread and has to be monitored

I think that I get you now.
When I first read 138, I genuinely thought that you were trying to shade STD by accusing him of faking confusion when to me, he felt like he actually was lost.
I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.
I need to reaccess my reads.
-Rubella

I just hated MMR jumping with gun - the wall post and the back track as they saw they will get hanged for misrep. I don't feel this is genuine at all

VOTE: MMR

I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.

That's the thing tho.

STD's town/scum meta are night/day different. And this game STD is a beacon of light. This is his towngame through and through. He's literally radiating his alignment, a shining beacon of towniness. He is town, 100%. Like, genuinely top-tier townread, town. He cannot be scum here.

Frozen Angel also has a town/scum meta that are night/day different. The asterisk to my read on FA here is that I don't know which is which.

I KNOW that FA has a night/day difference in her town meta and her scum meta.
I'm PRETTY sure that this is the night half, that this is the scum half, that this is FA as scum. But the asterisk on my read is that I might be remembering it backwards. I'm PRETTY sure I'm getting it right that this is the scum half tho.

I see.
I think that I get the lock-TR on STD more after his interactions with FA, then your original TR before so.
Though, I 100% agree that STD has noticeable differences between his towngame and scumgame based of previous games.
I'm not sure about FA though because I don't know her towngame or scumgame. I think that I'll take your word though because you seem to know her better than me.
-Rubella

she said nothing there for you to sheep it. just some meta calls. not for std and not for me. she specifically said she has no idea what she is doing with her meta read on me and you intend to sheep it cause pushing me seems like a viable strategy and townreading std seems consistent with your stance from before? she didn't even explain the meta on std and how its similar to this game.

I do agree with you that mastina's read on STD is a bit off. I don't feel like his content at the time when she made the read, was exactly that Towny.
UNVOTE: FA for now.

That's the thing tho.

STD's town/scum meta are night/day different. And this game STD is a beacon of light. This is his towngame through and through. He's literally radiating his alignment, a shining beacon of towniness. He is town, 100%. Like, genuinely top-tier townread, town. He cannot be scum here.

Frozen Angel also has a town/scum meta that are night/day different. The asterisk to my read on FA here is that I don't know which is which.

I KNOW that FA has a night/day difference in her town meta and her scum meta.
I'm PRETTY sure that this is the night half, that this is the scum half, that this is FA as scum. But the asterisk on my read is that I might be remembering it backwards. I'm PRETTY sure I'm getting it right that this is the scum half tho.

I see.
I think that I get the lock-TR on STD more after his interactions with FA, then your original TR before so.
Though, I 100% agree that STD has noticeable differences between his towngame and scumgame based of previous games.
I'm not sure about FA though because I don't know her towngame or scumgame. I think that I'll take your word though because you seem to know her better than me.
-Rubella

she said nothing there for you to sheep it. just some meta calls. not for std and not for me. she specifically said she has no idea what she is doing with her meta read on me and you intend to sheep it cause pushing me seems like a viable strategy and townreading std seems consistent with your stance from before? she didn't even explain the meta on std and how its similar to this game.

I missed the part where she said that she had no idea.

I don't think that pushing you counts as a viable strategy if I was scum, because I'm more likely to look worse by doing so. As for STD, I think that his tone during his interactions with you feels consitent with his tone from previous games where he was Town.
The last sentence is a good point, though.

like what is happening in this game.

Was this intended as a question?
Because I feel like a lot of reads for me in this game are based off interactions.
-Rubella

So I colored up the part she mentioned my meta read. Your response is god damn awful here for multiple reasons:

1 - She clearly said all over the place that she is not certain which is which but she never said she had no idea, so you missed that even after looking into it again when I called you on it?!
2 - Even ignoring the first point how could you not see that confusion part in the original post in first place when its literally all over the place?!

That is so weird for it to be a non biased analytical mindset. you seem to be wanting to keeping everyone happy, jumping on mastinas meta read and then jumping back out of it after I come back at you for sheeping that shallow read.

---

as for your questions, at this point in game 2 days ago I was basically feeling many slots don't wanna put in any work and the rest just wanna say stuff for the sake of it. like for example we had a full 3 page / 4 page discussion over me calling a behavior alarming and calling it out load in response to mastinas hard town read on it with me explaining it like 20 times that its not a scum read and just an alarming behavior to keep note of for reasons I explained yet people still ask the same questions over and over about it instead of developing the game on different directions to give me any kind of ammo to analyze slots

and then there are people like mastina who drop a meta read on me that I'm either 100% town or 100% not town based on it and she acts like she is developing the game with dropping that bomb shell of information in game and yet still refused to talk about any of her weird reads that she dropped of nowhere cause her process is internalized or something.

so yeah I was frustrated and I was having trouble with the game. My play style is extremely analytical. usually I go in deep real time conversations and question back and forth to sort slots but I cant do much of that nowadays in comparison to old times cause of limited time for gaming so I'm way more relied on the game to be progressed on multiple directions by other town players so I can analyze things and make my reads.

---

and before someone asks why I'm writing this, I'm writing cause it was questioned. If you don't wanna read me ranting about this game then dont read it

How is knowing that will help you read my slot?

I was trying to see which part of your scum meta that mastina was using to SR you.

Because meta is easy to use as a basis for a SR if there isn't anything obvscum on the slot.
And ngl I still dislike mastina's reads on Math and Yume.
Both feel too OOG based as their content respectively don't feel like they connect with mastina's reads on both slots.
-Rubella

If you found that out let me know as well please

yet still doesn't answer my question. why you specifically asked about distancing and what would knowing that do to sort my slot out for you without any other flips in game?

Angel's interactions with Rubella running parallel to a Mastina vote gives me bad vibes.

I still scum read MMR

I just felt I cant not vote mastina

I'm still catching up while reading new posts in parallel too. I didn't read anything about page 16 till my first post tonight yet

Measles didn't say anything about the vote.
-Rubella

Since your hydra seems so splitted, I need to know something

was it the same hydra head that voted me and changed the vote or where they two different people/other people talked to them inside your hydra? I mean the vote after STD thing that was retracted after my response

Math says things and I don't believe he actually thinks them

He feels kind of genuine to me.
Ngl but mastina repeatedly saying similar things on FA doesn't feel like much of a progression.
I'm going to talk with my hydra partners first but I could potentially be down for a vote on her.
-Rubella

Your slot is probably my most confident tr in this game. Can you please elaborate some more on both of these things?

Math felt genuinely annoyed at mastina during his interactions with her. This could be scum!Math being annoyed at being caught or town!Math being annoyed at being falsely accused. I just feel like his reaction to mastina and ensuring interactions don't feel faked to me.
As for mastina's FA read, it feels like she hasn't made any effort to sort FA other than that she could be in her scum meta and that due to this one thing, FA has to be scum. It feels too confbiased and this might become a liability for us later.
-Rubella

I don't believe that she is confbiased. I just dont think she intends to solve my slot and is pretending to show her read more than what it is to act like she is confbiased.

if that makes sense.

I have now, and my opinion remains unchanged.

how the hell would you read my posts in 2 minutes?

I didn't read all of them, just the ones about mastina, and as someone who hydraed with her, I know how she plays, and your case is pigswill.

so you read 802 805 810 813 849 and 983 in 2 minutes and decided that my case is pigs will?

If you have no respect for me and my word to even spend time reading it, I can also return the favor and have 0 respect for you

and her being illogical is not the point. its about her try in taking lead for reads she doesn't have and tries to make them look strong to act as she is conf biased while doing her things that I find fake

How do you know she doesn't have those reads? As for being conf biased, every player in this damn game is, including you and me!

cause she doesn't have them? she fails to explain how she has them yet keeps acting stubborn talking about "how she has them" by repeating the same thing over and over without any data or logic to back it?

like she could have said its a gut feel and there was no issue. but you can see that she just throws the read and then make up reasons to have the read instead of having reasons to make a read

she is purposefully refusing to engage with me to avoid giving more context for the logical case/reasoning I have for my vote on her and to not have to drop her fake confbiase

there is absolutely no other reason not to.

I'm not moving away from her until I find something even more promising or if I get something actually promising from her

I dunno.

Every other post isn’t Math scum and it’s content.

So she is delivering something readable and it isn’t the scum tunnel and quit she’s done in the past

Granted that content

might

be scum content

But it’s loads better than what was previously done

I think that this fits with my opinion of mastina right now.
Her content has improved and I think that this might be either town!mastina letting go or scum!mastina changing her play.
I'm leaning towards the former, though the main thing that I'm still a bit annoyed about is that we haven't seen the results of the FA meta research.
But I'm probably just impatient, given that if mastina was to do that, I'll probably feel more convinced of town!mastina.
But then, I can't read mastina and I have to admit this.
-Rubella

math posts feels genuine

this feels distancing

why people read MMR as town?

@FA
Why am I scum with mastina?
-Rubella

well I scum read you for other reasons

"with mastina" part is not what I'm comfortable saying

but that post gave extremely distancing vibes. math unvotes "you agree but you want her to meta case me but you have doubts but you cant read her well but you still scumread her" just doesn't feel genuine to me. its more like you want to have options based on how things go there

@FA
Why am I scum with mastina?
-Rubella

well I scum read you for other reasons

"with mastina" part is not what I'm comfortable saying

but that post gave extremely distancing vibes. math unvotes "you agree but you want her to meta case me but you have doubts but you cant read her well but you still scumread her" just doesn't feel genuine to me. its more like you want to have options based on how things go there

I said that I'm leaning towards town!mastina, which is intended to be interpreted as nulltown.
I genuinely can't read mastina well.
I've literally TRed scum!mastina and SRed town!mastina before.
So you're half-right that I'm adapting. As I read more, my reads change.
-Rubella

I just got interpretations that you're maintaining such a wishy washy stance over this and each wind is blowing you to a different direction on it.

whats your main scum read right now?

FA interacted with MMR the MOST.
This is not even all of it.
I also showed a part with Yume and how they defended Mastina that I still find wolfy.

I guess here though FA thought MMR was distancing from Mastina or something.

[professotic]

[t-bone, firebringer, meuh]
if there's more lunar they're in here

Look at Frozen Angel’s interaction with MMR.

Firebringer isn’t aligned with MMR from that.

Like take a look at ONLY FA’s interactions with MMR and you will see what I mean.

Because FA & MMR distanced day 1?

I will ask you again - why can FA not be Lunar?

Too many times have I see deepwolf coast to endgame victory because they bussed and/or distanced from their partner on day 1.

Cause there was way too much aggressive interaction with MMR.
Compare that to Dingle where it’s not so much I believe.

[professotic]

Yeah I think I’m only voting CSF or T-Bone today probably.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Sigh

[professotic]

What’s your “solve” anyway?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Firebringer is solar & enchant/ydrasss are lunar

I'll reconsider enchant depending on what conclusions he actually draws from his analysis

[professotic]

That’s really fucking bad solve lmao.

Firebringer is fine but the Lunar solve you have is a fucking joke.

After what both have done your just gonna continue with your read on them?
It’s a lazy “oh I’ll just name the low posters” wolf pin.
It’s something a wolf does, again makes me believe you to be a wolf here.

[professotic]

You wanna actually tell me the reason they are both wolves and explain how they fit together and maybe show something that involves MMR cause I don’t see anything.
Maybe I missed it, I’ll have to search your ISO but again, I think your a wolf and right now your gonna for the lazy solve.

[professotic]

You are a Lunar Starmaster

While you are alive, whenever your faction successfully performs a factional action on a player, you will passively learn the role of the target. If your faction targets a member of the Solar Cult, you will receive a result of vanilla, regardless of the target's role.
[REDACTED]
You win when your faction makes up half of the living players, and no members of the Solar Cult are alive.

This role doesn't really make sense with recruitment. Why would scum need to learn the role of their target if they've recruited them into their cult?

Ugh, the theory of delayed kills really made a lot of sense with MMR and dds' roles, but i feel like we would've seen someone die by now

Explain DDS. How does it make sense?

[professotic]

I don't disagree. The inclusion of Firebringer in that "would lim" list is somewhat worrisome for my solve, but yea, I think ydrasse is more likely lunar, Enchant is kinda 50-50

Nothing is explained. To me it’s like a PoE read that you are OK with and “trying” to be confident on.

It’s a lazy read, they are low posters and have made the least amount of content to go off of to get out of the PoE and of course wolves need to make content to get out of PoE low posters but your just going for it like it’s ok?

You need something more.
Give me something that actually shows the player to be aligned with MMR, to be a wolf.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Enchant can be either Lunar or Solar. Lunar because they've tried to save MMR by voting PPF on Day 2. Even though he thought MMR's claim was suspicious, he voted PPF anyways because he wanted to resolve MMR/mastina later (even though they were counterclaiming each other). He can also be Solar because Radical Rat was protecting him.

Ydrasse is more likely Lunar than Solar mostly because Radical Rat had her in their PoE and seemed willing to compromise there over Toog. Generally speaking, I just don't find much clearing her.

Firebringer I still don't like his interaction with me about my Meuh townread, which gave me the impression that he wasn't sorting me from a town perspective. I admit he is less likely to be Lunar with MMR because of FA's interactions with MMR on Day 1, but I personally don't find that wholly clearing. FA dropped her push on MMR to push mastina.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

You are a Lunar Starmaster

While you are alive, whenever your faction successfully performs a factional action on a player, you will passively learn the role of the target. If your faction targets a member of the Solar Cult, you will receive a result of vanilla, regardless of the target's role.
[REDACTED]
You win when your faction makes up half of the living players, and no members of the Solar Cult are alive.

This role doesn't really make sense with recruitment. Why would scum need to learn the role of their target if they've recruited them into their cult?

Ugh, the theory of delayed kills really made a lot of sense with MMR and dds' roles, but i feel like we would've seen someone die by now

Explain DDS. How does it make sense?

I don't have a satisfactory answer as to what Lunar has been doing.

My townread on DDS is based on dayplay. DDS has been providing original analysis - I don't actually agree with some of their analysis, but when I probe them about it, they've shown that their analysis can hold water and that they've been thinking deeply about the game behind the scenes.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

That’s really fucking bad solve lmao.

Firebringer is fine but the Lunar solve you have is a fucking joke.

After what both have done your just gonna continue with your read on them?
It’s a lazy “oh I’ll just name the low posters” wolf pin.
It’s something a wolf does, again makes me believe you to be a wolf here.

No offense, but you're literally trying to hero solve by clinging onto what is possible instead of probable. I think I have blatantly been trying to solve, and you're letting people coast because ________ (fill in the blank).

If mastina is scum, why does my slot try to save her? And furthermore, why does my PoE not make sense to you?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

*If mastina is town

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Like I think I've explained why I townread every other slot? Please point out which slots you want further clarification on

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I don't have a satisfactory answer as to what Lunar has been doing.

This is like... not for a lack of trying btw. It's just I haven't come up with any theory that I think is probable.

I've tried to metadive MegAzumarill to get ideas of what factional abilities Lunar may have, which was rather painful because she is the author of a thread called "Faction Crafting Cafe" along with her participation in other wacky role-crafting threads.

I've considered the delayed kill theory as mentioned previously.

I've considered that Lunar have a factional vanilla-ization power based on this Pirate faction idea she posted in another thread. I didn't think this was a likely factional ability, because I think Scum would have vanilla-ized MathBlade.

I've considered DDS' idea that Lunar have a JOAT ability, which is a plausible theory based on Meg's Starkin faction (if I even understood that faction right...) but it feels rather inelegant so shrug emoji.

I've considered that maybe Lunar don't have an active ability and have more Scum like 4 vs 2, but that doesn't square with MMR's role.

The most likely theory I landed on is that Lunar are priming people & will maybe activate their primed targets at some point like an arsonist does, but I don't know - even this theory I'm not particularly confident in.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Like if you have other ideas, please regale me because I'm all ears

[Cat Scratch Fever]

The most likely theory I landed on is that Lunar are priming people & will maybe activate their primed targets at some point like an arsonist does, but I don't know - even this theory I'm not particularly confident in.

If this is indeed true, then I'll be more suspicious of Meuh because Lunar have not targeted her in spite of mastina fullclaiming on Day 1. But again, idk wtf is really going on with Lunar & mastina has some associatives with both flipped factions that make her slot look good

[Past Present Future]

enchant wagon bad
ydrasse wagon better

I think they’re both bad.

I personally wouldn’t mind Dingle or CSF.

But Dangle confirmed their role. They said if you get targeted you get a mod message telling you who and we also know that RR lied, so not understanding this.

And we know now that Solar has an nk right, so I think CSF role sounds believable.

And I think I’m pretty much cleared from Mathblade not being targeted at noon 1 because no way Titus wouldn’t have killed him if we were scum here.