House of the Dragon - Game Over!

[Lukewarm]

Lukewarm very scummy.
Would still have him on the council though. Though i don't think master of ships is a position anymore

No fuck that, I don't even want on the council.

I want to be off council, and then cop checked night 1.

And once I am clear, we kill GL.

[PenguinPower]

I am a little scared to make LLD king

why?

Risk:Reward

I think that if a scum!LLD landed the king position, we would lose the game.

I think that if a town!LLD landed the king position, she would be effective -- but not massively noticeably more effective towards a town win condition then if she were to be in a council position or in the IC-esque position I described.

I won't stand in the way of king LLD, and can see myself compromising there if the other two look like they might lose to GL, but it kept her from being my first choice - which is what I was working out at the time.

Sorry - why does scum!LLD = game over but town!LLD = no different than placed elsewhere?

[Lukewarm]

At the time, he did not seem to care about (or at least enough to comment on) LLD read at all.

bruh

as an addendum thought, his long explanation of his LLD read gave me an impression of scum buddying town, I see a lot of explanation of things scum!LLD could have done instead of what she's done here, but virtually no paranoia about why she isn't scum just emulating what she thinks she would do as town. It's hard for me to put into words but it gives me a vibe of a read justification that was derived from assuming the conclusion (town!LLD) first

are you trying to act in good faith here??

Oh.

it seems my ctrl+f skills for "Luke" in your iso failed me. Once I saw the "I mostly liked his town reads except Bella" alarm bells went off given you quickly then went into attacking a town read I had.

I retract lol

[Firebringer]

Firebringer probs scum – yw warmpuppy

thanks penguin, you the best.

Yo Firebringer, you appear to have missed 834.

didn't miss it. i am really not out to make a case on you right now, so didn't feel the need to go into it any further. i guess plus one for u following up on it though.

see? firebringer is town this game

No u. I am def scum.

Lukewarm very scummy.
Would still have him on the council though. Though i don't think master of ships is a position anymore

No fuck that, I don't even want on the council.

I want to be off council, and then cop checked night 1.

And once I am clear, we kill GL.

Fake and dumb.

[GuiltyLion]

I want to be off council, and then cop checked night 1.

And once I am clear, we kill GL.

why not just cop me? wouldn't that be better FYPOV

[Firebringer]

Can anyone tell me if lukewarm new meta is to go full tunnel aggro and act in bad faith. The town!lukewarm i know is reasonable and considerate, this is just amazing me watch this performance.

[Datisi]

firebringer is en route to become my strongest townread, and only partly because i wanna annoy him

(srsly tho 1244 is Good and i deadass assumed we'll be getting a fresh 150 cap for some reason?)

anyway i see nobody wants to chat with me that's cool that's fine i'm totally not gonna go cry

[PenguinPower]

idk - the tunneling reminds me of playing in LOST with him though I remember agreeing with his points much more

[JunkoChan]

firebringer is en route to become my strongest townread, and only partly because i wanna annoy him

(srsly tho 1244 is Good and i deadass assumed we'll be getting a fresh 150 cap for some reason?)

anyway i see nobody wants to chat with me that's cool that's fine i'm totally not gonna go cry

hello Datisi what's your take on this three:

Luke
Guiltilion
Baltar

I'm totally not doing this out of pity

[UNOwen]

This is alarmingly unconvincing.

alright, explain why I'm wrong then. Explain why he's scum.

I'm not even confident he is scum, but he certainly doesn't come across as so trustworthy.

You say he's hasn't expressed slimy scumreads - sure, but what are his scum reads? We're in a part of the game where scum aren't needing to wagon anyone - how is the lack of sliminess meaningful? I'd expect a scum strategy here could be to coast this part by being proactive in King electing theory to boost their own townie stakes. Steering in a pro-town direction? How? By balloting people for their opinions on Andres as king? Again this seems a fairly neutral activity in the context of VPB not expecting Andres to do much more than go with consensus. Ignoring unproductive conversations - what are you referring to here and how is that extremely townie?

My point basically is I'm not clear what sort of expectations you have for how scum would be playing this that VPB is defying such a great extent.

[Lukewarm]

I am a little scared to make LLD king

why?

Risk:Reward

I think that if a scum!LLD landed the king position, we would lose the game.

I think that if a town!LLD landed the king position, she would be effective -- but not massively noticeably more effective towards a town win condition then if she were to be in a council position or in the IC-esque position I described.

I won't stand in the way of king LLD, and can see myself compromising there if the other two look like they might lose to GL, but it kept her from being my first choice - which is what I was working out at the time.

Sorry - why does scum!LLD = game over but town!LLD = no different than placed elsewhere?

I honestly don't know what part of that is confusing to you

Scum getting lots and lots of power = bad... especially when the power is put into the hands of probably the best scum player on the playerlist, someone who would absolutely figure out the best way to maximize the benefits of that power.

This feels like it should be a non-controversial take tbh.

Gonna assume that the question here is about the town scenario then.

I am distinctly [town!lld!king] to [another town player as king + LLD on the council (or cleared)].

And in that scenario, I think that she could effectively scum hunt, use what ever PR she gets, advise the king, ect, from that position too


However, the calculus would change if I thought the alternative to king LLD was a scum king.

[Datisi]

Luke
Guiltilion
Baltar

scum
town???
town

i feel like luke and baltar are the two reads i have spoken a lot about so idk why you're asking me about them but

[Lukewarm]

I want to be off council, and then cop checked night 1.

And once I am clear, we kill GL.

why not just cop me? wouldn't that be better FYPOV

I was already king of thinking that I wanted the first cop inno to be someone that is then permanently planted into the kings guard, so was thinking about that being me.

But I would not fight against it being used on you either I guess.

[Firebringer]

idk - the tunneling reminds me of playing in LOST with him though I remember agreeing with his points much more

on the list to skim over the weekend i guess then.

firebringer is en route to become my strongest townread, and only partly because i wanna annoy him

(srsly tho 1244 is Good and i deadass assumed we'll be getting a fresh 150 cap for some reason?)

anyway i see nobody wants to chat with me that's cool that's fine i'm totally not gonna go cry

WELL FINE I DONT EVEN WANT UR SCUMREAD THEN. SEE WHAT I CARE

[PenguinPower]

And in that scenario, I think that she could effectively scum hunt, use what ever PR she gets, advise the king, ect, from that position too

sure sure - except she wouldn't be the one deciding who's on the council and in what position nor would she have protection from scum just offing her. Not much use as an advisor if dead. Like if you think LLD is town and as good a player as you are stating, she would be more effective, and quite likely for longer, as king vs on the council.

i may have just talked myself into changing my vote

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Flavor

Grand Maester is an important position in the government of the Seven Kingdoms. The Grand Maester is the personal maester to the Iron Throne and the Red Keep, and is considered a senior member of the Order of Maesters. He is a learned man wise in history, science and medicine who also provides counsel. The Grand Maester sits on the King's small council, which oversees the day-to-day operations of the realm in the name of the King.

On several occasions in history, a Grand Maester has also been appointed as Hand of the King, serving in both offices at once.[1] The Grand Maester is also responsible for leading the council in the Hand's absence, and appears to be the next ranking member after the Hand.

Grand Maester

The Grand Maester is responsible for advising the King and providing potions and treatments for ails.

They hold the following abilities:

Healing Salve

Each night they may prepare a healing potion for a player.

This must be done in the first twenty four hours after nightfall.

A player receiving a potion must choose whether to drink it - if they choose to drink it they will be protected from one night-kill attempt on that night.

This ability costs [Redacted] Gold Pieces to activate each time.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Coronation Vote - Day One

With twenty one players alive - it requires eleven votes to make a decision. Plurality rules will apply at the deadline.

GuiltyLion [5]:

Dannflor, thestatusquo, Dwlee99, PenguinPower, Junkochan

VP Baltar [4]:

Datisi, Lukewarm, Andresvmb, GuiltyLion

Unowen [3]:

Lady Lambdadelta, Unowen, Enchant

Andante [2]:

mastina, Andante

Lady Lambdadelta [2]:

Charloux, Rhaenyra,

Dannflor [1]:

Titus

Enchant [1]:

ProfessorDrapion,

Junkochan [1]:

Firebringer

Andresvmb [1]:

VP Baltar

Thestatusquo [1]:

Bellaphant,

not voting [0]:

Deadline:

(expired on 2022-11-19 23:48:35)

mod note

datisi - vla wed/thurs always
I do everything by hand so please pm me if I miss something.

[Firebringer]

And in that scenario, I think that she could effectively scum hunt, use what ever PR she gets, advise the king, ect, from that position too

sure sure - except she wouldn't be the one deciding who's on the council and in what position nor would she have protection from scum just offing her. Not much use as an advisor if dead. Like if you think LLD is town and as good a player as you are stating, she would be more effective, and quite likely for longer, as king vs on the council.

i may have just talked myself into changing my vote

wouldn't town king lld just die night 1.
Or maybe scum thinks she would be useful for chaos and keep her around? idk i think i would just kill town king lld night 1 here.

Unless king can't be killed like with kingsguard stops it. Do i need to read what the council roles do or something.

[PenguinPower]

And in that scenario, I think that she could effectively scum hunt, use what ever PR she gets, advise the king, ect, from that position too

sure sure - except she wouldn't be the one deciding who's on the council and in what position nor would she have protection from scum just offing her. Not much use as an advisor if dead. Like if you think LLD is town and as good a player as you are stating, she would be more effective, and quite likely for longer, as king vs on the council.

i may have just talked myself into changing my vote

wouldn't town king lld just die night 1.
Or maybe scum thinks she would be useful for chaos and keep her around? idk i think i would just kill town king lld night 1 here.

Unless king can't be killed like with kingsguard stops it. Do i need to read what the council roles do or something.

as long as a majority of the kingsguard are "loyal" then she couldn't be killed

[Charloux]

And in that scenario, I think that she could effectively scum hunt, use what ever PR she gets, advise the king, ect, from that position too

sure sure - except she wouldn't be the one deciding who's on the council and in what position nor would she have protection from scum just offing her. Not much use as an advisor if dead. Like if you think LLD is town and as good a player as you are stating, she would be more effective, and quite likely for longer, as king vs on the council.

i may have just talked myself into changing my vote

I'm am unwilling to say precisely who I would put and where because what happens then is I get supported IFF scum approve.

It's better to say "I will hand them to townies" and leave scum wondering. It does mean I'll have a harder path to a throne but... I'm okay with that.

About that...

[Lukewarm]

And in that scenario, I think that she could effectively scum hunt, use what ever PR she gets, advise the king, ect, from that position too

sure sure - except she wouldn't be the one deciding who's on the council and in what position nor would she have protection from scum just offing her. Not much use as an advisor if dead. Like if you think LLD is town and as good a player as you are stating, she would be more effective, and quite likely for longer, as king vs on the council.

Maybe. I was primarily approaching the question from "if I am wrong on my read, I think this choice loses the game" then from the full benefits of her else where as town. I did advocate earlier to give her the weakest PR in order to make the scum team less likely to kill her, but maybe you are right.

i may have just talked myself into changing my vote

[Firebringer]

roles so far:
GRAND MAESTER -basically bulletproof giver - can give potion at night that they can use to save them. Costs a coin
MASTER OF WHISPERERS - Tracker - costs coins
MASTER OF LAWS - jailkeeper - costs coins
MASTER OF COIN - power role enabler - gives money to the council. Can make investments?
LORD COMMANDER OF THE KINGSGUARD - basically PT with seven other people. Can kill the king/prince if they decide to overthrow don't want scum with this. Needs 50% control to do that for 7 that would mean 4 day 1. If loyal then king can't die.
HAND OF THE KING - cop. Costs coin to act.
THE PRINCE OF DRAGONSTONE - becomes king on death of king.
King - Day Vig - can lim one person during day, cannot be consecutive. (stops any normal voting and we cannot lim someone else that day) selects the council.




questions i want to ask on roles:
> if you don't drink maester potion can it be used on future nights. seems to be yes. just confirm.
>what kind of investments can coin do to raise more funds.
>can kingsguard select to just kill king or do they have to kill both king/successor prince.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

The full list of small council positions is included below;

Small council positions in the hands of the mafia faction may unlock special "bonus" abilities that are not known to you but will be known to the mafia faction - a king must choose his advisors wisely.

In the event of the death of a small council member, the following procedure will be followed:

Prince of Dragonstone - The King chooses a new heir.

Lord Commander of the Kingsguard - The Kingsguard elect a new Lord Commander from amongst their ranks

Any other Small Council Member - the King may give their duties to another member of the small council - no member of the small council may hold more than two roles at a time.

Spoiler: Prince of Dragonstone

The Prince of Dragonstone

The Prince or Princess of Dragonstone is the title held by the Chosen Heir to the King or Queen.

They hold the following abilities:

Heir to the Iron Throne

Ascends to the Iron Throne upon death of the Ruling Monarch.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Spoiler: Hand of the King

Hand of the King

The Hand of the King is Chosen by the King to execute his Will.

They hold the following abilities:

Investigate Loyalty

Once per night you may investigate a player to determine their alignment.

This ability costs [Redacted] Gold Pieces to activate each time.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Spoiler: Lord Commander of the Kingsguard

Lord Commander of the Kingsguard

The Lord Commander of the Kingsguard is chosen by the Ruling Monarch to defend their life.

They hold the following abilities:

First of Seven

Each day you must select six players to join you as members of the Kingsguard to defend the King.

Players may not refuse appointment to the Kingsguard.

This number will decrease as the number of players is reduced.

You may not select members of the Small Council or the King to be members of the Kingsguard.

Brotherhood of Arms

Kingsguard members will have access to the Kingsguard PT.

Kingsguard members will notify the mod by pm if they wish to defend the king. The King is immune to nightkills if all members decide to defend the king.

Coup in the Castle

If 50% or more Kingsguard Members decide to overthrow the King - they may murder him at night and install his chosen successor onto the throne.

If all Kingsguard Members agree to overthrow the Monarchy - they may murder him and his successor. The Small Council will be role blocked from committing any actions on this night. New elections will be held on the following day.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Spoiler: Master of Coin

Master of Coin

The Master of Coin is responsible for managing the financial affairs of the Kingdom.

They hold the following abilities:

Keeper of the Purse

Each day you may make investment decisions on behalf of the Crown

You alone will know the contents of the Treasury and the incomes and debts of the Crown.

During each day you may distribute gold to members of the small council for their activities on the following night.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Spoiler: Master of Laws

Master of Laws

The Master of Laws is responsible for enforcing the King's Justice.

They hold the following abilities:

The King's Justice

Each night they may detain a player for questioning.

The player will be role blocked from committing any actions and protected from all killing abilities on that night.

This ability costs [Redacted] Gold Pieces to activate each time.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Spoiler: Master of Whisperers

Master of Whisperers

The Master of Whisperers is responsible for finding the secrets of the King's Enemies.

They hold the following abilities:

The Walls have Ears

Each night they may have a player followed

They will know where the player visited during the night.

This ability costs [Redacted] Gold Pieces to activate each time.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

Spoiler: Grand Maester

Grand Maester

The Grand Maester is responsible for advising the King and providing potions and treatments for ails.

They hold the following abilities:

Healing Salve

Each night they may prepare a healing potion for a player.

This must be done in the first twenty four hours after nightfall.

A player receiving a potion must choose whether to drink it - if they choose to drink it they will be protected from one night-kill attempt on that night.

This ability costs [Redacted] Gold Pieces to activate each time.

Member of the Small Council

Has access to Small Council Meetings.

[Firebringer]

interesting.

@mod
>am i to assume theres ways for master of coin to make more money?
> what happens when someone dies with unused coins?
> Is it correct to assume that no new person can join the council? Or that a position could be retired completely if not? In other words if i say don't want to give position of whisperers to any other council member and i can't select a new one entirely that position is gone or can be changed later when i feel like it?
> if you don't drink maester potion can it be used on future nights. seems to be yes. just confirm
> can kingsguard select to just kill king or do they have to kill both king/successor prince.

Love asking all these mod questions that i doubt pooky wants to or will answer lol

[Lukewarm]

A player receiving a potion must choose whether to drink it - if they choose to drink it they will be protected from one night-kill attempt on that night.

This feels ominously like you would not want to drink the potion if this role is scum.

[JunkoChan]

Luke
Guiltilion
Baltar

scum
town???
town

i feel like luke and baltar are the two reads i have spoken a lot about so idk why you're asking me about them but

because luke said some relevant things a few pages ago(?) and it goes hand in hand with the other 2