Community

[RH]

Day 1 Count IX

Kokabiel (4) - Roden, DeasVail, PenguinPower, The Bombay
Roden (4) - Flavia, N.Y. M, Herta, Frogsterking
Passenger (1) - Andresvmb
The Bombay (1) - Kokabiel
PenguinPower (1) - JohnnyFarrar
Frogsterking (1) - Passenger

Not Voting

- Bell, furtiveglance

Notes

• My mod ISO is here.
  
• PenguinPower is V/LA until Tuesday.
  
• If I missed any other V/LAs, let me know.
  
• With 14 remaining, it takes 8 to form a majority.

The

Day

concludes in (expired on 2022-11-16 17:00:00).

[The Bombay]

My experience with Luke in Lost was that he lacked any ability to Townread me whatsoever, so unfortunately it's in his Townrange to believe I'm scum to a level of delusion which equals my own delusion that catboi was scum in KTANE.

I am not arguing that you are scum.

I also had you down as town in KTANE in my reads list right before I replaced out

You seem to be letting me [incorrectly scum reading you, really strongly, one time] color your entire view of me quite a bit.

Which... you do you I guess

[Bell]

VOTE: Kokabiel

[Frogsterking]

You seem to be letting me [incorrectly scum reading you, really strongly, one time] color your entire view of me quite a bit.

What's also coloring my view of your play is this:

1) You believe I'm Town

2) You are voting a slot I strongly Townread (Kookaburra) WITH the player who FMPOV is confirmed groupscum.

FMPOV you are either incompetent because it's impossible for Roden and I to both be telling the truth, or you're scum who is pretending to be incompetent by voting a player who makes no sense to be voting considering you have a 50 50 shot at hitting groupscum by voting between Roden or I.

If you are able to admit you misread Roden's fakeclaim and adjust your play EoD to account for the fact that you now know your Townread on one (or both I guess sometimes) of Roden or I is wrong, that would do wonders to remedy my view that your Townplay is incompetent.

If you continue to vote Kookaburra despite the fact you know at least one of Roden or I must be lying by fact, and you have no factual reasons (or even good reasons IMO) to suspect that Kookaburra is lying, then I am going to call your Townplay incompetent, because with the information available to you there is no competent reason for you to believe that voting Kookaburra is an effective choice compared to voting between Roden or I.

[DeasVail]

Hmmm, I do think we should probably be eliminating Frogster but the deadline is close enough that I'm okay sticking with Koka

[The Bombay]

Frog, I don't think that you actually care what my reasons are for my reads, and I have already put them out there, so I think I will just nor respond anymore and hope that enough other people log on and come to the same conclusion as I did, that Roden just... never does this as scum.

But I have to say that you sorting from a PoV of whether or not I have the same reads as you, or am willing to listen to your reads, is flawed, because

1)You and I think about games so differently that it feels like our conclusions are fairly alien to one another and
2)Even though I think you are town, I don't find your cases very compelling (likely in part because of the above)

[JohnnyFarrar]

I fully think frog's our guy here

[The Bombay]

Final thoughts on the Roden Vs Frog thing.

~Roden is always town.

That leaves 2 worlds.

Frog is also town. In which case I want to kill Koka.

OR

Frog is scum. If we are living in that world, Frog's play for the back half of the day seems hell bent on saving Koka. And therefore I still want to kill Koka first.

[The Bombay]

Like, here is Frog's path on Koka:

Koka is town because of he thinks Flavia is scum, and is preflipping Flavia to clear Koka (197)
Koka is town because of he thinks Passenger is scum, and is preflipping Passenger to clear Koka (252)
Koka is town because he doesn't trust Roden and Bell (459)

Each time he has explained a reason to think Koka is town, it has been because of preflipping his scum reads, BUT it literally did not matter who his scum reads were. It always landed on Koka town.

Despite that he has jumped on Herta for voting Koka (270)
Bell for voting Koka (441)
Roden for voting Koka (562)
Me for voting Koka (repeatedly)

I found 562 interesting

Spoiler:

VOTE: kokabiel

Spoiler:

[/sp/oiler]

-Marci

Awww how cute~

can you vote kokabiel

-marci

This, on the other hand, is NOT cute at all. I fail to see how calling acquaintances to join a... RVS? vote is town behavior.
I doubt scum would blatantly call their buddies like this so thats one association down.

Why didn’t you ask me?

can you vote kokabiel?

Yuck. Can totes see this as a scum theater.

The scumminess in this post's tone is out of this world lmao. This is how you scum post when you want to appear like you don't care about getting scum read, the confidence is just too misplaced.

VOTE: Kokabiel

Roden making up a motive to vote Kookaburra "the scumminess is out of this world." Trying to discredit an obtown player for bad reason

Because now Koka is obvtown, despite his reason for town reading them at all points prior to this to have been because of preflips.

And finally, frog did not go off the rails until Roden activated his ability, claimed his role, and then explained why we should then kill Koka.

Like, here is frog's last post before the Roden reveal. Compare that to every thing he has done since

I decided only to partially claim my role today:

#1 I'm informed that at least one player has a role which gets misleading results.

#2 Protectives don't go on me. I'm paranoid this advice won't get followed.

__

#3 Scum team read is

moderate

certainty:

Passenger/Roden/Bell

Government reads are

low

certainty:

2nd choice Flavia (my case applied to gov instead of groupscum), 1st choice Penguin (Kookaburra's theory)

I townread everyone not mentioned above except for Johnny, who I null read. If I die we're Probably Gonna be Okay

He was level headed, and reasonable appearing.

And his play has done nothing but spiral since that happened.

Even if Frog is scum, he is trying desperately to keep Koka alive, so we... probably should not keep Koka alive in that world either.

[JohnnyFarrar]

You think scum Frog wants to save Koka because they're true claiming and scum wants those juicy 3p deets?

[Frogsterking]

Final thoughts on the Roden Vs Frog thing.

~Roden is always town.

[Frogsterking]

My mind is literally blown with how terrible Luke is at Town.

[Frogsterking]

Luke can't fathom the idea that at least one of Roden and I have to be scum and that Roden simply lied about a claim. Absolutely unbelievable.

Luke, you have shot all of your credibility for your belief that not only is Roden "always Town" here, but that there is somehow in your mind a possibility that Roden and I can BOTH be Town. You're truly incredible Luke: as in literally in-credible, like I can't believe these are real takes coming from a real player.

[Frogsterking]

I'm going to become a hermit frog for real now so I don't have to bust my chops making sense while Luke mis-hammers like 4 Town slots in a row and then claims postgame it wasn't his fault Residents lost.

[Kokabiel]

VOTE: Roden
Roden's theory about Frog being government actually has a hole.
Government!Frog would receive two messages confirming Roden as town. One because he is government who received notification from mod that Roden is conf town; And one from Roden confirming himself as town. What would you guys think if you received confirmation 2 times?
There is also no point in government!Frog to defend me this hard FMPOV since he needs me dead.

Roden also says i botched my claim, but there is a lot of precedent of Mod providing a fake claim for games with flavor like these. How stupid would i need to be not to see it. If i were scum who got a role called i dunno consigilere and no fake claims you bet i'm going to find something more believable on the net that may use the term advocate. Spokesman or Lawyer are the first things that pop into my mind.

I think Roden is pushing for a Frog miselim because it will handicap town severely.

[Kokabiel]

Since he claimed after me, He also has leevay to modify his role somewhat because there is precedent. I believe while the basis is the same, our roles are fundamentally different

[Kokabiel]

His Gambit of revealing now to check if Frog is government also makes no sense. I find it hard to believe town!Roden would waste his confirmability like this when it's such an amazing boon for late game

[Roden]

Koka, you

did

use a fake claim.

It's a Moonlight dancer with an additional on-death trigger, and no it's sadly not a vengeful.
I claimed and gave out my reads so there is no info you can get from me apart from the flip. So y'all useless lazy town without any reads better start working. 4 Days remaining, you can always come back to finish the job.

First you claim Moonlight Dancer,

My role name is Advocate. It's role is Advocate i'm assuming because an Advocate advocates. And when i pm the mod he confirms that i'm an advocate which is my role name.

Then you claim Advocate. If you're only an Advocate, why did you initially claim Moonlight Dancer?

However you don't even seem to know

why

you're called an Advocate, likening it to a Spokesperson or Lawyer. In my case, I'm an Advocate for the Community itself, meant to bring attention of our plight to the wider world. I reveal my alignment to the Government because flavor-wise I become a political target. However, in your case you only become a political target because you claim to be able to reveal the Government to the Delegation.

Why would the flavor of your role give information to the scum team and not the town?

[Kokabiel]

UNVOTE:

At least until Koka gets in here and explains the Advocate thing.

~Luke

It's a Moonlight dancer with an additional on-death trigger, and no it's sadly not a vengeful.
I claimed and gave out my reads so there is no info you can get from me apart from the flip. So y'all useless lazy town without any reads better start working. 4 Days remaining, you can always come back to finish the job.

Looks like a role explanation to me and not a claim but you are just grasping at straws cuz you got caught

[Kokabiel]

My role is anti-government not anti-town since it gives the scum team no info on the town
You also stalled the game for a day so town would be forced to make a quick decision based on an illogical gambit

[Kokabiel]

If you suspected Frog of what you claimed, you would've hopped on him as soon as you saw him not responding

[Roden]

Roden your plan failed.
If i hadn't revealed first you mightve caught them, but it is what it is.

Doesn't seem like you thought so earlier.

[Roden]

First thing everyone should know: my role isn't called Advocate or Moonlight Dancer. My ability is called Advocate, but my role is actually called

Proponent

. Koka has already botched their role claim as far as flavor goes. I'm fairly certain Koka isn't claiming their real role name because it would sound scummy and didn't think anyone else was also an Advocate. Though Koka did say the correct trigger phrase "Represent Residents", as that was mine as well.

Besides that, the secondary effect from my ability let's me send a message to my target mod-confirming me as town. I'd like for this player to announce this, please.

I see, so your role is arguably pro-town since you can confirm yourself while mine is arguably pro-delegation since i give info to the scum team.

I mean, you argued my case for me here. Not sure why you're trying to claim otherwise now.

[Roden]

Yeah this is no good. I can't clear myself and i think Passenger is town, so that's 2 miselims.
I suppose it's time to come out with my modifier.
When i get modconfirmed the government receives a notification that the delegation will find out their identity during the next night phase(N2 in this case) unless i get killed.
I didn't say anything so i could watch the votes on me and their reasonings and Catguin looked like he had an eureka moment right after i got Modconfirmed. And AFTER that he asked what the hell a moonlight dancer is.

Also still no real answer given why you waited to reveal yourself here instead of immediately activating it and explaining how it works at the start of the game.

[Kokabiel]

Roden your plan failed.
If i hadn't revealed first you mightve caught them, but it is what it is.

Doesn't seem like you thought so earlier.

Based on activity the only one who didnt confirm Roden is Flavia.
The alternative is Penguin going Vla without bothering to answer

Yes, it sure doesn't seem like i thought the extent of your plan was to bait government and confirm yourself with a townread of yyours.

First thing everyone should know: my role isn't called Advocate or Moonlight Dancer. My ability is called Advocate, but my role is actually called

Proponent

. Koka has already botched their role claim as far as flavor goes. I'm fairly certain Koka isn't claiming their real role name because it would sound scummy and didn't think anyone else was also an Advocate. Though Koka did say the correct trigger phrase "Represent Residents", as that was mine as well.

Besides that, the secondary effect from my ability let's me send a message to my target mod-confirming me as town. I'd like for this player to announce this, please.

I see, so your role is arguably pro-town since you can confirm yourself while mine is arguably pro-delegation since i give info to the scum team.

I mean, you argued my case for me here. Not sure why you're trying to claim otherwise now.

Reads aren't static. Everything clicked to me the moment you revealed your "master plan".
Instead of getting confirmed by a town read of yours you decide to send 2 confirmations to Frog. Brilliant, i'm sure everybody will believe you that you can confirm yourself now and have not lied about your role.

Also I have a theory that Koka's role also reveals their alignment to the Government. However, I think that there's a good chance they're actually a Traitor, and that their Advocate reveal also tells the main scum team that they're a Traitor. Which is why I asked Nancy what kind of roles could possibly want to get eliminated; if Koka is a Traitor, they might be trying to look scummy in order to sacrifice themself for a scum buddy who got run up AKA Passenger.

Yeah, speaking of Traitors, your play here fits the bill you defined here.