Open 99: Mayo Clinic (Game Over!) before 703

[charter]

I dont get how you think Wall-E is scum, but OP is just sitting back watching me and GK tear each other apart while OP is voting for Wall-E.

If anything I'd think animorph is the lurking scumbuddy, because he clearly didn't read my explanation and just quotes GK to make him look better.

[Wall-E]

Nameless, you you have jack shit to back that up or are you just terminally stupid?

[Mirth]

"I think I'll give up all pretension of medical talk and admit that my mind is elsewhere."

VOTE COUNT

Wall-E - 5 - [Nameless, Plum, animorpherv, orangepenguin, GnKoichi]

GnKoihi - 3 - [Stef, Kmd, charter]

charter - 1 - [Wall-E]
TonyMontana - 1 - [Kiro]

Not Voting - 1 - [Mana_Ku]

Children, can we lay off the personal insults please?

[charter]

I'm just looking for clarification.

[charter]

Also, day one is now on its 14th freaking page. I'm not saying rush, but lets try and wrap up day one.

Also, I want to post my suspicions of who the scum and SK are. Sooo tempting (not gonna do it now cause I don't want to open a whole new can of worms).

[Kiro]

Ugh, Tony posted something minor and is gone again. As much as I'd like to press that case more, I don't think it's going to happen on this Day.

A lot of varying concerns regarding Wall-E and GnK, but I think the latest bits take the cake. So in 297, GnK explained he voted Wall-E to L-2 saying that it was a warning, but he still had a bit of a town read on him. What kind of an action is that? It is not your job to help "wake up Wall-E" and did you think it was going to help him by actually voting him and giving him one more person he has to convince? That explanation makes no sense from a pro-Town viewpoint. If you had a slight Town read on him, what were you going to do if Wall-E was pushed to L-1? Pretend to be swayed extra quick and unvote him before he gets hammered?

What's interesting is that in the same post, you then condemn Wall-E to be scum, not because of his own actions, but because of charter's actions. So your entire post goes from initial remorse for Wall-E to a justification that you were right because he was exposed by someone else? Considering that charter's actions do not definitively expose Wall-E as you think it does, your logic is extremely bad.

I'd pass it off as newbishness except for your last bits. You said in 320 that while the group is leaning towards Wall-E, you think charter is more scummy and want people to switch to him in 322. You've got a weird back and forth going here, but you haven't actually put your vote back on charter yet. So, does that mean the Wall-E lynch is better because it's closer to fruition or the charter lynch is better because he's the one who "makes" Wall-E scum? If you think they're both scum, why are you trying to do a subtle derail of the Wall-E bandwagon? Is that little Town read you got from Wall-E in 297 kicking in again? You've got some crazy inconsistency here.

Unvote: TonyMontana
Vote: GnKoichi

[charter]

Kiro, sure you want to do that? There's still room left in GK's scumtriangle for you... [/sarcasm]

[charter]

I mean that GK has room left in the people he thinks is scum...
English charter, english...

[Wall-E]

I got it.

This is what I get for sticking up for a newb.

Luckily, I think Gonk does have some talent, so it'll just be a question of him learning not to say illogical things.

[GnKoichi]

Wall-E has been anything but a lurker, OP has been nothing but a lurker. And my reason for finding Wall-E town is that you and him are not scumbuddies, which leaves you. Go ahead and call me out for just stating it, I'm not going to tell how I know this right now, and don't even try and push the "charter must know cause he's scum" crap. I'm actually getting really fed up with this game and a lot of the people letting you off the hook despite the mountain of evidence pointing towards you being scum.

Okay, how are we even still talking about this? This is not me twisting Charter's words. He is the one trying to make it clear now that Wall-E not being scum is not a hunch, but knowledge. Something that he knows, as in a fact. Not a strong feeling. Not a really good theory. HE is the one who says this. I just called him on it.

As was said before, this has only three implications:

1) He and Wall-E are scum, hence his "knowledge" of who is and isn't a scumbuddy.

2) He is lying, and this proves my point of how misleading he has been ALL GAME!

3) He has information he shouldn't have, making him a cheater (since he didn't get Mod killed for saying this, I assume he isn't).

Whatever you think about me, how is this not the easiest thing to vote for ever?

unvote, vote: Charter

[GnKoichi]

Kiro: I never left the camp of rather having Charter out than Wall-E. My initial vote for Wall-E may have been a bad idea, but I haven't seen anyone make a good argument against my Charter/Wall-E theory. Some people have said it's flawed, but no one has said how. I kept my vote on Wall-E because I heard nothing about other people being willing to switch to Charter, and I wanted to make sure one of the two scum got lynched. But with Charter's latest argument digging so deep a hole, I trust that he's the easier lynch now.

[Wall-E]

GnKoichi and charter are both off my list as of this post.

Who else in this town needs some TLC?

Vote: OP

Speak up or die.

[GnKoichi]

Further Evidence for Charter/Wall-E: Now that I've made a very strong case against Charter, and those votes should start moving to him any time now, Wall-E pulls his vote off of Charter.

I don't mean to be arrogant, but is there anything that would make me wrong here? Isn't this the strongest scum argument we've seen all game? EVERYONE! Please throw your votes to Charter! He has almost admitted to being scum. Wall-E is almost certainly his partner, but even if that's wrong, Charter is the best Lynch, by far. No matter what you think about me, if you can't find a counter to my argument, please do the right thing and VOTE FOR CHARTER!

[Nameless]

I dont get how you think Wall-E is scum, but OP is just sitting back watching me and GK tear each other apart while OP is voting for Wall-E.

OP could be the SK, or more likely and as I mentioned, distancing himself from Wall-E.

Also, you want to hurry D1 but are going to wait to post your suspicions until ... when? Just in time to stop a hammering or until D2 when you might not be alive?

GnKoichi and charter are both off my list as of this post.

And your thoughtful, townie reasoning for this is ...?

I don't mean to be arrogant, but is there anything that would make me wrong here? Isn't this the strongest scum argument we've seen all game? EVERYONE! Please throw your votes to Charter!

*snap*

unvote; vote: GnKoichi

[GnKoichi]

Nameless, how are you voting for me? What is your theory in this? I posted a strong logical argument against Charter. You posted a sound effect. What are you doing?

[Nameless]

"GK, you've pushed your newbie act too far for me to believe that there is any significant chance of you being a townie and acting in this manner" - should be the implication of said SFX.

Charter has done several dubious things but what you are actually pushing on him amounts to incredibly exaggerated

semantics.

I pointed this out nicely, and you repeat the craplogic louder. This, plus most of what Kiro argued in #330, makes me reasonably sure you're scum.

[GnKoichi]

I am not arguing semantics. Charter is the one who changed his own words from "hunch" to "know". He even implied that he would have to defend against the very argument I made. I'm not twisting his words. He has not said I took what he said wrong. He has made no attempt to defend his words or say that I misunderstood.

HE ADMITTED TO BEING SCUM!

[GnKoichi]

EBWOP: You can call me a newbie, but it reflects much more on the rest of you that when I make the best argument against Charter in this entire game, you send more votes at me.

And STILL no one has offered a counter argument. You can't just say I'm wrong and dismiss it.

[Kmd4390]

Where did Charter say, "I am scum." He didn't.

[Nameless]

He has almost admitted to being scum.

HE ADMITTED TO BEING SCUM!

Counterpoint: No, he didn't.

There's ... really not much else you can say about that. People often say "know" when they're convinced of something, in Mafia and IRL.

[Kmd4390]

Oh, and GnK, when you say that a major point in your case is that he went from saying hunch to saying know, do you realize you went from saying "almost admitted" to "ADMITTED"?

[GnKoichi]

Nameless: That's not what "know" means, and I shouldn't be held accountable just because Charter used the wrong word.

Also, Charter still hasn't said that I interpreted him wrong, and even anticipated me giving this response. You are defending someone who makes no efforts to defend themselves. Please, do the right thing and switch your vote to him.

KMD: I got upset at Nameless's dismissal. It's an "almost" admission because the other option is that he is being purposefully misleading again, which has been my case against him all game, so it really is a scum tell either way.

[Kmd4390]

Wait. You say he basically admitted to being scum, but is being misleading? If he is misleading us, and admitting to being scum, wouldn't that make him town by your logic?

Sorry, but bad case.

[Nameless]

I am not arguing semantics.

Nameless: That's not what "know" means,

Wait. You say he basically admitted to being scum, but is being misleading? If he is misleading us, and admitting to being scum, wouldn't that make him town by your logic?

Wait, wait, wait. Now

Kmd

is misinterpreting GK?

Damn it people, you can't ALL be scum.

[Kiro]

Considering that charter's actions do not definitively expose Wall-E as you think it does, your logic is extremely bad.

GnK: That is my response to your Wall-E/charter theory. So to recap, when orangepenguin comes out of lurking to vote Wall-E without explanation, charter votes orangepenguin without explanation. OP's action was suspicious, but surprisingly enough, charter's isn't. I interpreted charter's vote on OP as a warning that OP's action was scummy, not that Wall-E was his scum buddy (which is your speculation). After you vote Wall-E, charter votes you. You again interpret that the reason is because Wall-E was his scum buddy (which is your speculation). However, several posts later, charter explains that he had his vote on you for a good portion of the Day and his reasons from before continued to apply. You seemed to have forgotten that he's been on your case regardless of his relationship with Wall-E if there is even any.

For all I know after reviewing the above, charter did set you up. He could be scum hoping to bag what seems to be an easy lynch. I'm not going to ignore him and I'd probably be on his or Wall-E's case more except you started digging yourself into a hole. No one forced you to say that you voted Wall-E to "wake him up." No one forced you to say that you determined Wall-E to be scum because of charter's reaction. You said that out of your own volition and I thought they were bad ideas which are scummy enough to get my vote. I'm voting you for your own scumminess while you had voted Wall-E for a test, then justified it with charter's scumminess which is not even Wall-E's own scumminess (his hypocriticalness and his backtrack on Nameless).

Further Evidence for Charter/Wall-E: Now that I've made a very strong case against Charter, and those votes should start moving to him any time now, Wall-E pulls his vote off of Charter.

I don't mean to be arrogant, but is there anything that would make me wrong here? Isn't this the strongest scum argument we've seen all game? EVERYONE! Please throw your votes to Charter! He has almost admitted to being scum.

No no no!!! That is wrong! What does this have to do with charter? If Wall-E has stated that GnK and charter are not scum anymore, but makes no effort to dissuade your current wagon when you're at L-2, that makes Wall-E really scummy. This has nothing to do with charter. You are failing to grasp the idea that when someone does something unusual, it makes the person performing the action the most scummy. Wall-E unvoting charter for the reasons he gave may increase charter's scumminess, but it increases Wall-E's a lot more.

This latest development doesn't make charter's possible lynch easier, but it makes Wall-E's easier. That being said, I'd like Wall-E to clarify why both GnK and charter are "off his list" now. You want to tell the people on GnK's wagon why they shouldn't be voting for him right now? And charter's ok now after you had presented your idea of a Nameless/charter scumpair???

Unvote: GnKoichi

for the moment.