Babylon 5 Mafia: Severed Dreams - Over

[malthusis]

For all the people who don't understand Pacman's idea,

http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php ... %27s_Razor

[armlx]

I don't see why hp isn't dead yet. He has what amounts to a claimed guilty on him.

[Kinetic]

For all the people who don't understand Pacman's idea,

http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php ... %27s_Razor

Seeing as that page doesn't link to anything, I'll explain the concept instead:

Basically it is the concept that the Simplest answer is the best answer.

This means that the concept that is most likely thing to have happen is the one that has the least exceptions.

In this case, the razor case is that someone lied, either Malt or HP, because they have equal reason to lie if one of them is lying.

Reasons for this that would not satisfy Occam's Razor are ones that have bizarre or unlikely occurrences.

In this case, those arguments would be the Bus Driver argument and others like it.

This does NOT mean those arguments are technically wrong. This could be considered an appeal to probability in a sense since you're believing the most likely event to occur is the one that occurred by believing Occam's Razor.

[Kinetic]

I don't see why hp isn't dead yet. He has what amounts to a claimed guilty on him.

Because we have two weeks until deadline and I know I personally would not mind taking a few days to investigate the case just a little bit more. Its not going to kill us and he's still going to be here.

There is no reason to rush to a decision.

Ideally Malt should have waited a day so we could know a little more about his role, but this is the hand we are being dealt.

[armlx]

I'm not sure what there is to investigate.

And I agree Malth should have waited, if only because now he is assured to be heavily targeted if he is town and a longer wait would mean more info.

[Tarhalindur]

"You forgot the first rule of the fanatic: when you become obsessed with the enemy, you

become

the enemy!" - Jeffrey Sinclair

The Thirtieth Vote Count (aka the "Acts of Sacrifice" Vote Count):

Vote Count:

VisMaior (0)
Empking (0)
malthusis (1) - Mana_Ku
Kinetic (rep. MBPikamon) (0)
MafiaSSK (0)
armlx (0)
forbiddanlight (0)
MacavityLock (rep. populartajo) (0)
Mana_Ku (0)
Natirasha (0)
veerus (0)
The Internet (2) - forbiddanlight, Kinetic
DrippingGoofball (0)
cr3t1n (rep. Blitzer) (0)
pacman281292 (0)
RandomGem (0)
hp [leaves] (7) - malthusis, armlx, DrippingGoofball, Natirasha, veerus, MafiaSSK, MacavityLock
dybeck II (rep. farside22 who rep. Tovarish) (1) - Empking

Not Voting (8): VisMaior, The Internet, cr3t1n, pacman281292, RandomGem, hp [leaves], dybeck II

Votes required to lynch: 10

FoS Count:

VisMaior
Empking (1) - veerus
malthusis
Kinetic (rep. MBPikamon)
MafiaSSK (1) - veerus
armlx
forbiddanlight
MacavityLock (rep. populartajo)
Mana_Ku
Natirasha
veerus
The Internet
DrippingGoofball
cr3t1n (rep. Blitzer)
pacman281292
RandomGem
hp [leaves]
dybeck II (rep. farside22 who rep. Tovarish)

Current Deadline:

November 21, 2008 at ~6:00 P.M. (GMT -6)

Second Mod Deadline Review:

November 14, 2008 at ~6:00 P.M. (GMT -6)

[DrippingGoofball]

I don't see why hp isn't dead yet. He has what amounts to a claimed guilty on him.

His scumbuddies are backing off bus'ing and going after The Internet? Just a guess.

[armlx]

I don't see why hp isn't dead yet. He has what amounts to a claimed guilty on him.

His scumbuddies are backing off bus'ing and going after The Internet? Just a guess.

Seems like a fair guess to me.

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: HP

He's known not town andf it'd test the semi-cop.

[armlx]

Actually, DGB, to be fair, the obv partner is fl, Kinetic believing his theory is just more likely then him unbussing.

[Mana_Ku]

Unvote Vote Empking

Not town in this case doesn't mean scum. If you're AOL, you shouldn't hunt hp if his claim is correct.

FoS Malthusis

I may have unvoted, but that doesn't mean that you're of the hook. Especially after saying these things:

The flavor says I am a good judge of character, so [hp] might not nessecarily have a gun

I know that [hp] can kill for sure, or else I wouldn't have claimed.

You're also talking about a gun, while you said that the results you get is:

You can investigate someone and see if they are able to kill

FoS DGB and armlx

hp isn't dead yet and you guys are already saying that 'his scumbuddy/scumbuddies' are voting The Internet. But as you should have seen, there are only 4 groups: TI voters, Empking voter, hp voters and no vote voters. Don't like this from you guys. Especially not from armlx.

[armlx]

Mana Ku would say all that given how obvious it will be she is obv scum once HP flips scum.

I don't see your point about what DGB and myself are saying....

[Mana_Ku]

Mana Ku would say all that given how obvious it will be she is obv scum once HP flips scum.

And why is that?

I don't see your point about what DGB and myself are saying....

hp [leaves] (7) - malthusis, armlx, DrippingGoofball, Natirasha, veerus, MafiaSSK, MacavityLock

Actually, DGB, to be fair, the obv partner is fl, Kinetic believing his theory is just more likely then him unbussing.

Mana Ku would say all that given how obvious it will be she is obv scum once HP flips scum.

You are speculating about hp allignment and mine and fl's if hp turns up scum. However, we don't know hp's allignment yet. So, I don't see how it's helpful to the towns to speculate about the allignments. As far as I can remember, you have done this only once in the games we were in together. Or do you have an example where you did this when you were town?

[armlx]

And why is that?

Notice broken symmetry much?

So, I don't see how it's helpful to the towns to speculate about the alignments.

Why? HP has essentially a guilty result on him.

As for an example of it, go find any game where someone had a guilty result on someone or similar early on that I was in.

[Mana_Ku]

The flavor says I am a good judge of character, so [hp] might not nessecarily have a gun

Besides, he has admitted that it's a gunsmith-like role. That could mean that he will see cops as dangerous. And not to forget, this is a tar-game. Anything can happen.

Notice broken symmetry much?

What about it?

[forbiddanlight]

Actually, DGB, to be fair, the obv partner is fl, Kinetic believing his theory is just more likely then him unbussing.

Setting me up already? You do realize that malt has been all over the place between "dangerous" and "can kill". He's FINALLY reconciled these, which is why I'm going to

Unvote, Vote [hp] Leaves

. To be fair, claiming "gunsmith like role" and the fact I could see cops as being dangerous, I think it's actually more obvious that I'm trying to actually lynch scum rather than just follow the cop/gunsmith But, whatever.

Why? HP has essentially a guilty result on him.

No, he didn't until malth clarified. Thanks for misrep.

FoS Armlx

Besides, he has admitted that it's a gunsmith-like role. That could mean that he will see cops as dangerous. And not to forget, this is a tar-game. Anything can happen.

this.

[MacavityLock]

The flavor says I am a good judge of character, so [hp] might not nessecarily have a gun

Besides, he has admitted that it's a gunsmith-like role. That could mean that he will see cops as dangerous. And not to forget, this is a tar-game. Anything can happen.

While it could mean that, malt has specifically said that his role told him that hp could kill. That's a stronger statement than a gunsmith can make, and given that hp has said that he can't kill, it looks like one of the two is lying.

[Mana_Ku]

A gunsmith normally gets the result of: gun found or no gun found.
When a gunsmith investigates a cop, he also gets a result of 'gun found'.
In this case, the results will be: dangerous or not dangerous.
It seems likely that when he investigates a cop, his result would be 'dangerous'.

However, that's one thing that bothers me. The other thing is that Malthusis can use his flavour about him being a good judge of character, that he made a mistake. But now he starts talking about knowing it for the fully hundred percent. And that's the other thing. He only started talking about definitly knowing it, after ppl started voting hp.

[dybeck]

Hey... guess who's back. Replacing farside.

For the sake of clarity... farside was a Centauri as per his second claim.

I'm slightly disappointed that you didn't lynch him. He lied, for god's sake. Have you guys played mafia before?

I'm interested to know why we're lynching a claimed cop with a plausible claim.

The psi-corps DOES seem plausible as cops. It doesn't seem plausible as Vorlon or Shadow operatives.

So I'm really not buying this whole wagon. One of malthusis and hpleaves is lying. And I don't think hpleaves is lying. Additionally, malthusis's fuzzy claim that he's 'dangerous' seems far too deniable tomorrow.

unvote, vote: malthusis

Malthusis: did your PM mention hp leaves by name?

[forbiddanlight]

However, that's one thing that bothers me. The other thing is that Malthusis can use his flavour about him being a good judge of character, that he made a mistake. But now he starts talking about knowing it for the fully hundred percent. And that's the other thing. He only started talking about definitly knowing it, after ppl started voting hp.

That does bother me, but he's locked himself to a position that he gets lynched if hp isn't scum/killer.

[armlx]

And I don't think hpleaves is lying

Why?

[VisMaior]

I think its safer to lynch the claimed gunsmith than the claimed cop tough.

[Kinetic]

Just so everyone knows, HP is at Lynch -1.

I was just thinking about re-voting him frankly because there is now more we can learn from his lynch (which was my original intent when I unvoted him) but I wasn't sure if I wanted to hammer him just yet.

Either way, people should know to be careful if they vote him.

[armlx]

I think its safer to lynch the claimed gunsmith than the claimed cop tough.

Its safer to lynch the person claiming the guilty then the person the guilty is on?

........

[malthusis]

I think its safer to lynch the claimed gunsmith than the claimed cop tough.

Why?