UK Eastermeet 2022 Invitational (Game over!)

[Primate]

I'm not really talking about cpol because I don't really think they're scum but i don't really agree with them about much (the pushback against postie I get, that's fine, I don't really get why Postie's tunnelling so hard (although it is making them seem town, which is nice) )

[Klick]

I'm interested in your thoughts on CES

[Primate]

Don't find him particularly scummy, lean town. Him keeping his thoughts limited to certain issues is a bit of a shame. I don't agree with your argument against him and Chris' case is uninspiring.

[ChannelDelibird]

Rules Update

As previously floated, I have formally updated the rules in the opening post - specifically, rule 11, to reflect my belief that a three-strikes-and-you're-out system is not the right approach for this particular game. I have heard no objections to that suggestion, which is why I am comfortable making this change, but I appreciate that this might be considered poor form and apologise if it in any way affects anyone's strategy in this game.

Vote Count

Cogito Ergo Sum (4):

cpol, Nexus, Klick, McMenno

McMenno (3):

Fenchurch, Cogito Ergo Sum, Postie

Postie (1):

Wenna

Not voting (2): Primate, Porochaz

With 10 players alive, it will take 6 votes to execute.

Activity

Wenna

has been prodded.

Time until deadline: (expired on 2022-05-04 13:33:00)

[Nexus]

Dum di dum di dum prod dodge.

[cpol]

Don't find him particularly scummy, lean town. Him keeping his thoughts limited to certain issues is a bit of a shame. I don't agree with your argument against him and Chris' case is uninspiring.

Then why aren't you voting Menno right now? You even said you think they are scummy in #324.

[Wenna]

Do you have any actual reads you can substantiate

Nope

[cpol]

Do you have any actual reads you can substantiate

Nope

And you can't even chose between either CES or Menno at this point?

[Wenna]

No, possibly because I think it's both of them

[Wenna]

Or rather, either of them, to the same degree

[Wenna]

I know nothing.

Whatever Menno is, I think even they would admit they've played it poorly on day one. So they could be either baddy or goody. Even though I have more feelings about CES, and also Postie, for whatever stupid reasons, being baddies, I feel like it would solve some mysteries to execute cpol or Menno. But at the same time, isn't that playing into what the baddies want?

So I'm conflicted. I feel like because of the hammer and potato stuff, the baddies may have just been able to sit and chill...? (Poro, Klick, Primate...)?

Saying that - if it's on 5/6 at ~11am tomorrow I will change my vote for an execution. On CES, cpol or Menno. I won't let my indecision stop the town from making a play.

[McMenno]

What do you think of Klick, Menno?

I sure thought he was scum

now idk doesn't really make sense to push a counterwagon on you when he could've stuck on me

[Primate]

Don't find him particularly scummy, lean town. Him keeping his thoughts limited to certain issues is a bit of a shame. I don't agree with your argument against him and Chris' case is uninspiring.

Then why aren't you voting Menno right now? You even said you think they are scummy in #324.

I think I'm mostly just lying to myself about the fact that my lurking has meant I haven't really been able to influence the day at all, by pretending the deadline doesn't exist.

VOTE: Vote McMenno

[Wenna]

So that's 4 votes each on Menno and CES with only Porochaz (and me) left to vote...

I thought the day ended in 25 minutes but it turns out I don't know what days are, so that's good.

Only 24 hours left!

[Postie]

Yes, I very much disliked your posts #128 #129. I didn’t understand why you’d come in so hard for me. And, I’ll be honest, there was a little OMGUS-y ness around being called lazy, a slow learner and then being facepalmed at I brought this up in post #133, asking why you were doing what you were doing, but you never replied.

I think I was frustrated by you arguing that getting yourself executed was preventing a mis-execution, and not an obviously contradictory chain of logic, and then the day ended before I could really think to respond further.
Well, regardless of your alignment, I hope I didn't come across as too harsh. Sorry if I did!

[Postie]

Aw crap that's not a lot of time
I just flew to a foreign country so my brain is a bit scrambled

[Postie]

I don't know how this many people have no strong opinions on anything, but I guess lots of people here haven't played in a long time so maybe that makes it harder to know how to engage. That said, I am wary of letting scum hide in the active lurkers.

[Postie]

I think I was frustrated by you arguing that getting yourself executed was preventing a mis-execution, and not an obviously contradictory chain of logic

Also really struggling with how a townie runs down this thought process
Like I know you've done the same thing as town in FtF mafia and that's why I ignored it at the time, but reading it back over I'm not sure the thought processes were the same both times and the logic behind your stated reasoning bugs me in a way I can't quite articulate

Can you try and explain what you were thinking again when you gave away your potato?

[cpol]

Of course.

So firstly, as a VT I saw the potato as a mechanic that I could at least do something with, fairly risk free. Worse case scenario is that a die, and if a townie is going to die it may as well be a VT. Lacking a power role, it was something mechanically I could actively engage with to try and drive some conversation and get some reads from. I was also in favour of using it to get an additional execution out of the day, or at very least putting the pressure on someone via the mechanic as a counter to the Consuls. Eh, I just like the idea of the mechanic in general and wanted to play with it more than I got chance to during WereLeg tbh!

I was first was concerned around your thoughts on a potato stealer. Given that the potatoes were going D2, I thought this could be a way that they get used. My comment in #31 was relating to this - if I saw someone that I thought looked suitably town, and they had a feel of a power role about them, I'd give them my potato to protect them from this potential ability. I did try and vaguely clarify this in #34

Nexus challenged my comments, to which I replied in #40. I didn't want to completely out that my first idea was to give a potato to someone I thought particularly town, if the scenario arose. That felt like I'd be putting a target on them.

After getting no suitable town reads that I wanted to 'protect', I then instead decided to hand the potato off to someone, just to see how they react. In my head at least this would show that I was a townie by being willing to die to get information out in to the game (a statement that in hindsight clearly did not work!). I was also trying to react to the frequent miss-executions that seemed to be happening in FtF, and felt like it was happening again here. I could get it over and done with D1 and not have to try and defend myself during the end game. I wanted to do this roughly half way through the day so I could see how it played out, and see how people reacted to the situation. I chose Fenchurch because she was so anti the potato passing play I thought it would be interesting to see if that opinion changed afterwards. I did kinda expect to get it back to be honest, but Menno hammered so damned soon afterwards that it made the whole thing kinda moot. (Post #124 explaining why I did it when I did)

What I did not expect was to be given a potato, which again in hindsight was pretty dumb, and has caused a lot of confusion. I do still maintain that there is pro-town play in using this mechanic, though I will concede that the method that I went about it wasn't great.

[Fenchurch]

Thanks Postie for asking that question and Cpol for answering... I didn't realise until now that I had been bothered by the same contradiction. To my mind the purpose of the potatoes is to push for a bonus kill on someone you think is scummy; not to volunteer for your own death. But it sounds like you did have some rational reasons for doing it. I feel better about both of you right now tbh.

Like everyone is saying I'm not keen on some of the lurkers - Nexus hasn't barely posted anything game relevant for the past week - but I know he probably has real life things to attend to. Wenna is super wishy-washy and reluctant to commit to saying that anyone is more likely scum than anyone else. I don't remember Wenna being so resistant to taking a stance before, and not sure what to make of it, whether it is just from the transition to forum or more than that.

But my feelings on Menno are the same and I still think they are by far the best execution for the day. Yes their play was probably bad as either alignment, but I think it all makes more sense coming from scum than as town.

[ChannelDelibird]

Vote Count

Cogito Ergo Sum (4):

cpol, Nexus, Klick, McMenno

McMenno (4):

Fenchurch, Cogito Ergo Sum, Postie, Primate

Postie (1):

Wenna

Not voting (1): Porochaz

With 10 players alive, it will take 6 votes to execute.

Activity

Cogito Ergo Sum

and

Porochaz

have been prodded.

Time until deadline: (expired on 2022-05-04 13:33:00)

[Porochaz]

Irgh okay 21 hours, I'm at work still and super tired so put it this way, I'm going to be voting menno in a few hours unless my subsequent read through of the past day gives me an exciting new insight. I don't see me voting ces, postie could be a viable option but I think we are at a choice between the two.

[Klick]

Menno is a really poor vote, there's little substantiating it other than 'the quickhammer wasn't good'

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Sorry I've been busy recently. I find I'm starting to dislike phone posting, which is a little limiting these days.

One thing I definitely want to note before the day ends is that I can very much see Menno and Klick being partnered, especially due to how Menno has cast some shade on Klick while at the same time not really saying much at all about them. I've got stuff to do now but I'll go into more detail later tonight.

[Porochaz]

Menno is a really poor vote, there's little substantiating it other than 'the quickhammer wasn't good'

I mean if I had been around more substantially this weekend I'd have delved into looking into you so...

The reason, by the way, of "the quick hammer wasn't good" is better than most other cases on mafia scum. I don't see that as a bad case, I see it as more tangible than "his tone wasn't right on page 5" or "blah blah potato blag" (alongside some wild theories about roles that has no real evidence of being in play, looking at postie here)

Menno is not a bad vote.