Mafia 86 - mafia.gif - Game Over!

[farside22]

No need to PM me.

Mod can you update the front page when you have a chance?

[farside22]

Okay I finished page 10 and need a break, but I want to address some issues I have already.

01- skitzer - his random vote with nothing said and quick unvote when questioned about it is suspect. post 180 I think this says nothing about anyone. You made comments about what people said but have not scum suspects in this post. In short a post to post. post 188 why Ku_F?
03- Seraphim - post 97 well gee how do you play mafia if you don't discuss and why sign up for a large game if you aren't comfortable with large group discussions? Post 206 where in the world did you get that blakadder hammered?
06- Erratus Apathos - post 28 BW page two already? Post 245 how was ckd using chainsaw defense?
07- curiouskarmadog - post 69 I see ckd has a reason for not this, but why single out cybele over others mentioned?
08- Ku_F - post 133 uses lot of sarcasm when Stef is being looked at for his smily use. (I notice sek did the same thing). Post 147 I don't get who's side Ku-F is on at this point. He doesn't really say anything here.
14- Jebus - post by jebus day cop comment. Now with tar coming up town this looks highly suspect even if it is a joke.
18- massive - post 46 out of all the strange names why sekinj?
19- ShadowGirl - Post 194 agin I feel like a person just posting to post without really adding to the conversation here. post 232 why are you not voting anyone at this point?
20- Rush - newbie who is lost in the game. (just saying)
23- Sierra - post 128> I don't like the way sierra wants to stand back instead of giving pressure to Stef. Vote for Sera is poor reason in comparison to other stuff going on. Post 161. Please sitting back and waiting to see what others say and do is scummy.
24- BlakAdder - post 205 I really dislike when people who have been away add nothing and say well it's already been said for me. Grrrr. Wait how is pop and stef even related as scum pair? (post 214) Post 239 can you show where tajo was trying to take pressure off stef and why you felt that was a big deal?

I will either finish my read today or tomorrow depending on somethings.

[farside22]

@Post 232: Because I didn't believe tajo to be scum - erratic townie, yes, which is why I wasn't voting him.

I understand that, but you weren't voting for anyone or even really making a case on anyone during that time.

[farside22]

Okay, I'm beat now. I'm at page 18 and I need a break for the day on this read. Just a few things from where I left off.
03- Seraphim - post 326 how do you know who killed who with all that went down?
06- Erratus Apathos - post 394 there is so much more going on I don't get this vote. So far unimpressed.
07- curiouskarmadog - post 253 why do you keep voting for cybele if you are suspicious of others? Post 290. Just a point of something I want to keep an eye one. Not that tajo is a newb, but I saw a newb claim doc and scum hammer him then later claim doc themselves. So far no scum vibes are anything negative coming from CKD, but something I am always wary of since it happened.
11- TheSweatpantsNinja - Post 406. EA wasn't the only one to dismiss the BA case sek dismissed it as well.
12- farside22 (DynamoXI)
20- Rush - post 349 is that a vote for CKD? Post 377. Not sure if you are reading the game or just a newb lost at this point.

Wow look post 353 I see a dead scum (sek) defending blakadder. Weeeeee
tar's post 331: I know tar pushed some very interesting point on BA, haschel, emp, electra (mafia), sera, skitzer and sierra. Good post and seriously something I will be looking at with his death.

I would be voting Blak at this point, but I don't know if anything has changed since then so

FOS: BlakAdder

for now

[farside22]

Finally done. Good I won't even comment on how bad empking played day 2 that was terrible.
Last comments here.


Seraphim - post 514 feels like someone trying to protect someone they know will turn out town. Also was the Jester comment really necessary?

Fine. You know what? You can lynch me next round; I don't care. He could be Jester; I don't care. I'll deal with that next day. For now, I think I speak for the majority when I say

Vote: Empking

Tar, just remember, this was your idea. If he isn't a jester, he's definitely scum. If he turns up town, I guess the joke's on me, then.

You know if tar was alive this would look like someone trying to place the blame on him for the lynch

So looking at the past 2 days and what happened and sek's bah post I lean on one more person as part of that faction and I think that person is BA. If you look back you see sek defending BA and putting pressure on Empking.

vote: blakadder
Fos: Seraphim, ShadowGirl and Sierra

Sera for the above
SG for really hanging back and having no opinion of her own. Active lurkering without saying anything.
Sierra for post 128 and post 161

[farside22]

EA: The point is I'm not sure if you are just tunnel vision or not reading the game, but there was a lot more going on at post 394 then CKD and cybele. Do you even have a suspect or thoughts on who is scum and why upon reading the game?

[farside22]

EA: The point is I'm not sure if you are just tunnel vision or not reading the game, but there was a lot more going on at post 394 then CKD and cybele. Do you even have a suspect or thoughts on who is scum and why upon reading the game?

Did you miss the posts where I argued why I didn't care for the BlakAdder wagon, asked for the Empking case, disagreed with the Empking case, agreed with the new Empking case, and now today where I'm voting Rush? What exactly am I missing with my "tunnel vision or not reading the game" here?

Yup. I saw that on day 2. Why did you wait to day 2 to really say anything else beside the whole Cybele and CKD comments?

[farside22]

I reveiwed my case against BA...half of the case was based on his interactions with Stef..who was part of the jap mafia. With 3 jap scum dead, i am not certian that BA is part of that scum team. 4 players per team seem excessive to me...but with the ability to cross kill it could be feasible.

at any rate, I am not as hell bent about his lynch as I was yesterday. i am more interested in finding more of this greek mafia or trying to find the possible SK....

more thoughts to come.

I have no issue with scum hunting but are you saying you would rather lynch someone else then BA if you believe he is part of the Jap mafia?
It is one less kill if there is only one Jap mafia member left. Also SK's are a hard one to find. I am terrible with finding serial killers as they are loaners who appear town for the most part.
I will have to look to see who if anyone Electra interacted with.

[farside22]

I reveiwed my case against BA...half of the case was based on his interactions with Stef..who was part of the jap mafia. With 3 jap scum dead, i am not certian that BA is part of that scum team. 4 players per team seem excessive to me...but with the ability to cross kill it could be feasible.

at any rate, I am not as hell bent about his lynch as I was yesterday. i am more interested in finding more of this greek mafia or trying to find the possible SK....

more thoughts to come.

I have no issue with scum hunting but are you saying you would rather lynch someone else then BA if you believe he is part of the Jap mafia?
It is one less kill if there is only one Jap mafia member left. Also SK's are a hard one to find. I am terrible with finding serial killers as they are loaners who appear town for the most part.
I will have to look to see who if anyone Electra interacted with.

I dont know if I understand your first quesion. What I am saying, is since there are 3 dead right now(jap), I dont know if I believe that BA is jap mafia anymore...however, it seems that people are going on the notion that there are 4 people per group. Why is that exactly?

I thought you believe BA was part of the jap group. My appologize.
As for a forth person possiblity, well I know mafia love to use WIFOM, but if there was just 3 people what purpose does sek's bah post makes. He lost if there was just 3 however if there is a forth there is still a possiblity to put a win for the jap mafia.

[farside22]

Just for a laugh hascow. you will happy to know empking was lynched. Granted he was town, but he was very anti town. I'm starting to think that is just his way.

[farside22]

Curiousity makes me ask this hascow. Do you think BA is scum based on his interaction with the Jap mafia or do you think he is just scummy in general?

[farside22]

As you said, its likely there's another Japanese mafia, which is what the case on BA was built on.

I stated the same thing but it got ignored.
@hascow: Do you think if there is another Japanese mafia member that BA is more likely a memember or do you believe SG is more likely scum to either group?

[farside22]

@Armlx. If you want the link I can try and do that later. I have easier time just using looking for my post and hiting the quote key.

So looking at the past 2 days and what happened and sek's bah post I lean on one more person as part of that faction and I think that person is BA.

If you look back you see sek defending BA and putting pressure on Empking.

vote: blakadder
Fos: Seraphim, ShadowGirl and Sierra

Sera for the above
SG for really hanging back and having no opinion of her own. Active lurkering without saying anything.
Sierra for post 128 and post 161

Also SG is also one of the people I agree with Cow about as well as sierra and seaphim. Fun and good times.

[farside22]

armlx that is a rediculous reason to place a vote. Other factors that cow brought up where more interesting such as i stated as well her following the votes and backing off of votes.
gorckat: I do not understand what you are talking about post 709.

[farside22]

Always happy to help.

Of course I'm willing to vote for anyone

. I've already expressed that I have suspicions about at least three people, what they are, and this thread needs more lynching and less standing around looking at people.

[farside22]

Sorry I fell behind in a couple of game which effect this game. I will do a read of what I missed tomorrow. Thanks

[farside22]

Caught up from the past few pages now.

CKD: Post 702 what were you hopping the mod's story line would give you?
armlx: post 708 out of all the reasons to vote this one is a really low reason for a vote.
Sierra: Post 736 agree that Skitzers post is very opportunistic.
spring: post 739 WIFOM!!!!
massive Post 745 more wifom (WWEEEEE) and the bottom comment "shadwoGril actually seemed like a possiblity of a lynch." Basically BW vote to lynch looks good hmm?
ckd: post 754 everything I read of rush screamed newbie with no clue.
armlx: post 768 Wins!
Rush: post 769 If you are town play to find the mafia. If you are mafia continue your ways and you will be lynched as scum.
armlx: just a note BM seems to think that because k-7 never post or does anything that is how he survives as scum or town. There is a theory that it's best to think about lynching these types of players because they are so anti town. With that said I agree with post 776
BA: Post 793 why?

Still like BA as scum. Everyone talks about Rush lurking and offering next to nothing BA is just as bad. SG why the disinterest. At least do a reread or something to kick this game back in for you if you are town.
Read on Rush is just anti-town newb who is out of his league.
massive looks like he jumped on the SG bandwagon more then actual scum hunting or pushing for anything at this point.

[farside22]

Mod: Please note sig. More likely limited access then Vacation. It depends on a few things.

[farside22]

Deadline extension please.

[farside22]

I thought Rush was a newbie who just needs to be replaced. I could be wrong. I need to read through. This game will have my thoughts later today.

[farside22]

Rush has made it clear he is going to continue to be in the game without participating, and is actively using said meta as a WIFOM to protect himself.

Isn't that more vig worthy?
I just remember thinking Rush was newbie without a clue who should be asking for a replacement.

[farside22]

FOS Skitzer

You are evidently reading along with the thread.

I think votes for him are better if he is lurking as he is.

unvote:
vote: skitzer

I want context!

[farside22]

vote Cybele,

at least skitzer posted

This is so backwards.

FOS CKD

Not posting = flake. Posting = active lurking.

QFT

[farside22]

skitzer is still anti-town to be sure...and he is obvious following the thread because he posted MINUTES after I posted calling him out...what I dont like is how quickly people are willing to jump on the wagon..what I dont like are people who ask for an extension, but dont do anything with it....what I dont like are people who have no opinions of people and are fence sitting AT THIS POINT IN THE GAME. I also dont like Cybele actively lurking...cybele is posting everywhere but ignoring prods to this game....that is bullshit.

there are a lot of things in this game I am not liking..I am trying to get conversation started..and lurkers to participate.

I wish I had more than one vote...if skitzer thinks that his little "i got to reread" will keep my vote off him he is mistaken....I expect some content out of him...and soon

your FOS (and farside's qft) are silly.

The point is that skitzer is paying attention. His little oh I have to read is BS. And 2 votes on skitzer and you think BW hoe!! Are you insane? Skitzer has been lurking this entire game. Go look at his post. I had his as one of those people who need to post more context when I started. So no I don't like what he did and it confirms that he is actively lurking whichi is scummy.

[farside22]

ok..

what is your point?

My point was that you stated you didn't like people jumpining on skitzer (there was 2 votes) he is more then anti-town in my mind because obviously he is paying enough attention that he noted the request and now is stating he needs to read. Obvousily he is paying attention.
Also I asked for an extension because I was on limited access and felt something was missing with the SG and massive comments. Lots of lurking and no one really talking. I thought an extension after the holiday was justified.
Why are you complaining? Do you think an FOS on skitzer is really all that is needed? Do you think massive or SG is scum and why them over skitzer's just oops I forgot and read comments are?

[farside22]

farside: Cybele hasn't been posting in mafia games and was replaced out of Babylon 5 Mafia a while ago. While he is posting elsewhere, he is clearly not playing this game.

That is just lurkering or more likely a player that forgot about this game. Skitzer is not like Cybele. Why is this directed to me and not CKD?

[farside22]

All four Mafia groups still alive? That means BA is scum at least.

vote BA

Four mafia groups?

Looks to the front.
Looks at massives post.
Looks at the front.

No I see 2 mafia groups mentioned not 4.

What do you know?

vote: massive

[farside22]

The problem with if EA is a vig or SK should be noted that most SK have nk immunity in games like this. I don't like the idea of leaving him alone based on the kill flavor.

unvote:
vote: EA

Really Jebus didn't like the lie on BA considering most including myself still think he is part of the Jap group.

[farside22]

@farside - EA doesnt get lynched if no one counters vig. If you are vig, counter him. I already how showed taking out a faction works given the WIFOM situation it makes for scum involving their next NK.

You want if someone is the vig to claim? Is that smart considering that unless niv is the last jap that there is a chance that person could be killed? Sorry but that is the facts. No I'm not counter claiming I'm just saying that outing a PR is bad.
Why would the vig kill CKD? That's who Jebus targeted and EA admitted to. I never saw CKD as scum in any way shape or form. I want a reason and a valid one on why EA targeted who he did.

[farside22]

First Niv isnt going to be Jap mafia, I am pretty sure of that on connections alone and how much we knew when Seph made is slips. EA I dont know what he is going to be, if its anti town, there is a higher chance of non-Greek. If we can take out someone who has a chance of finishing a faction at the expense of getting our vig in the open, it is worth it to me.

How about an answer from EA on his choice of kill first. Humor me on this.

[farside22]

@Farside - If no one claims vig would you still want a EA lynch?

No but seriously if I was the vig and looking at yesterday well never mind. I don't agree with EA's reason's at all. They are weak, weak reasons. However till a counter claim happens (which I really believe there is a vig out there that is not EA) I will unvote

unvote:
vote: BA

I think BA is part of the Jap group. I have no case on Niv myself. BA's interactions with past dead Jap group mafia is too hard for me to ignore.
Jebus fake claim comment about BA just muddies him which hurts the town. I really wish he had not done that. Of course BA can say he didn't target the player in question. And no I'm not buying the vanilla claim.

[farside22]

I don't like how farside practically ignores Niv by saying "I have no case on Niv myself". It looks to me like he's trying to divert attention away from Niv by first trying to push a wagon on EA, and when that fails he resorts to attacking BA. Possible scum-buddy behaviour there.

How? I'm not going to magically find some case on a person I never felt suspicion on. I think EA's vig choice and the term murder seems SKish to me but hey everyone thinks lets out the vig that is dumb. I stated a case on BA and believe he is most likely scum with Jap group.

[farside22]

Of interest. Please explain very clearly what you mean to imply with this post.
I may or may not hold it against you.

Oh sure. Given the number of people who have said that (1) they believe EA is a killer but not the vig and (2) then vote for BA, it seems to me that there are more people interested in finding (what feels like) an opposing Mafia member than an SK. It's not just you. farside22 did the exact same thing.

Getting rid of an extra kill is bad in your book? Seriously? You like to see 3 to 4 deaths in the night?

[farside22]

Lynching EA (a known and admitted killer) vs. lynching BA (an unknown but probably commodity) ... how is one MORE likely to get rid of a night kill, and why are you backing the wrong one?

I stated I believe BA to be part of the same group as stef. If there is a 5th person that is part of the group I would be shocked. Getting rid of BA should be getting rid of the last person in one mafia group. If I am correct about BA's alignment and or group. Since Llama wants a counter claim and no claim thus far for the Vig EA lives, but I seriously doubt EA's claim till the game ends or EA's alignment is revealed by the mod.

[farside22]

How much of your suspicion on BA rests with posts that link him to stef? Do you see any WIFOM where he could be distancing from someone still alive?

Actually it was sek I noted defending BA as well as BA following BW's without a reason. It seems as far as sek goes she didn't distance from Stef so I don't believe she did distancing very well looking at that interplay and her interplay with BA.

[farside22]

That sounds like the best plan but SK’s are sometimes NK immune right? Is that a varient that is not typical for large normal game roles?

This is what I thought too. I don't want to out guess the mod but with 3 kills going on not including the SK I can't imagine a SK not NK immune.

[farside22]

I dont know who Jap/SK is, I thought BA was Jap for a while, but the reaction to the Jebus thing seemed genuine. SK is most likely one of Jahudo or Sierra after the people I have ruled out, but I really dont know which of them is the better persuit.

I completely disagree because Jebus claim was tainted in a lie. Of course he didn't target GW the day he died. That is not hard to fake a comment like that when it is probably true based on them scum buddies together

[farside22]

I dont know who Jap/SK is, I thought BA was Jap for a while, but the reaction to the Jebus thing seemed genuine. SK is most likely one of Jahudo or Sierra after the people I have ruled out, but I really dont know which of them is the better persuit.

I completely disagree because Jebus claim was tainted in a lie. Of course he didn't target GW the day he died. That is not hard to fake a comment like that when it is probably true based on them scum buddies together

What, what?

Explain, please? (or at least re-word, I'm not really sure how to interpret this )

Didn't you claim you saw BA target GW and that was not the truth?

[farside22]

Eh, screw it.

unvote
Vote: Erratus Apathos

I'm a watcher. He killed (specifically) CKD.

I targeted Tarhalindur (didn't get targeted), Ghostwriter (killed by BlackAdder), and then CKD (killed by Erratus Apathos).

I've got no hard evidence on massive, so my justification on killing him is much lighter.

Ghostwriter was a Japanese mafia, so BlackAdder is not. Erratus Apathos could be any scum, so I go with him over BA.

They can't be anything else, 'cause they were targeted by one person only, and they died from it.

Here is the quote. As I said Jebus the statement in regards to BA targeting GW was a lie you stated later it wasn't true so to me yes BA's reaction is genuine as if BA is scum with GW why would he target him the night he died.

[farside22]

But, Jebus... if he didn't kill GW, then he knows you're lying, whether or not he's scum. So there isn't likely to be that much difference between genuine townie outrage and scum faking it. That's the point.

That is exactly what I said.

[farside22]

As for why we shouldn't look for the SK - The SK is always aligned as town until most, if not all, of the mafia is gone. Why? If the mafia hold a majority over town, then the SK is in the minority and thus has a bad chance of losing

This is true and not true. Most SK's are looking to win. They need to make sure about the number for mafia but they aren't acting as vig for the town. They will get rid of threats to themselves first.
Which is why I believe EA is SK and not vig as CKD seemed like town to me.

[farside22]

Farside,

, you apparently believe BA is Jap and EA SK. Who's greek?

I would say Llama as top contender based on his last comment. I think I would need to reread a few things to really see if I see anything else.

[farside22]

Just to continue really quickly. Reading Electra alone she gave nothing away as far as talking with anyone or ignoring anyone. It may take me a bit to get a better read on the remaining players to figure out the Greek mafia.

[farside22]

Also, what makes you think Sierra or I are the SK?

My notes basically just have you two as options at this point. EA doesnt fit and SL doesnt fit for that part of the puzzle.

I have strong greek or a town read on everyone else (except BA who I just am clueless on).

I know its pretty conveluted in the process that I went through, but if someone counterclaimed right there it would of ment a scum lynch, no questions asked. If fact it still would if someone counters EA, would make my job a bit easier.

Will get to the other stuff a bit later.

The part in bold is an odd thing to say. It seems like what mafia bussing a scum partner. Why for example is it town or Greek on people. I have only been in one game with Llama when he was mafia but I read another where he did bus his scum parnters to look more town. So this little comment doesn't seem like something that should be ignored in his case.
Especially looking at the kills there is another Jap (at least one). Could there be more then one? I can't imagine the balance on that as mod.

[farside22]

I just can't believe EA isn't the SK. God help me.
Llama do you know for sure if you are blocked by someone? I ask only because I just can't believe someone town killed CKD for such poor reasoning so forgive me question.

[farside22]

Armlx seemed very pro-town to me, and such is this case that I usually turn the other way - so I figured I'd ensure that he was on town's side. I'd intended to investigate BA, but changed my mind at the last minute.

The first statement is horrilbe reasoning. You get a town feel but want to verify. Uhhhh No. Second is you thought BA but decided Tar for what reason exactly? A last minute change should have a better reason then none. Tar was pretty town in my read through so I really don't see a reason to investigate him.

[farside22]

DAMN IT! I knew, knew LF fake claimed but it wasn't till the night I died.
Well I tried. It was fun. EA's reason's for killed CKD was completely off and why the vig didn't claim earlier at one point was beyond me.
Good job from Llama.