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[Testarossa]

I understand that strategically it would be more wise to hunt for the wolf team as the threat of two nks might fall away when there is only one wolf left and we lim them today in best case.

I think to an extent I can go along with Dunn's poe (need to check a few things with two slots tomorrow).

I am not fully convinced on Gamma yet though. I agree with nom about the Gunsmith claim, which is imo a good point aganst Gamma. However I don't feel the argument he was trying to counterwagon against Elsa. Maybe an issue of definition, but like it didn't really feel he was actively trying to recruit people for a A50 wagon? At most there was a short interaction with Iecerint where he doubled down on a comment from Iecerint. Otherwise it felt like a pretty individual thing by Gamma.

[Testarossa]

Personally I feel more like trying it here. VOTE: Iecerint

Under the assumption that there would have been a two wolves team and the premise of being in a tough spot when one already goes down on D1 I think there should have been an effort to save Elsa. Although even in case of three wolves this still would be the case imo.

On review I didn't really like his meta argument of calling Elsa town because of that. Like he argued with meta, but rather in a shallow manner ("people know Elsa, Elsa is behaving like in last game where he was town") without really giving any examples why this would mean why Elsa was town here too and why it was different from Elsa's scum meta.

Finally I have trouble following his progression on Gamma from town to scum. To be fair I am here just not sure if his change of mind feels constructed or I just don't understand it. He said Gamma's AtE in his "if he dies, it's A50" post is out of proportion, however I don't feel it's necessarily out of line of Gamma's personality considering how he generally seems to react to particular things of people he is familiar with.

@Iecrint:
Can you clarify on both points? I mean what made you in particular believe Elsa's town meta applied to this game and wasn't less likely to be scum and why Gamma EoD1 behaviour is overshadowing your initial townread on Gamma making you more likely lean scum on him.

[Testarossa]

As for the other scum team I think the best shot would be on the Elsa wagon.

T3 is town imo, I haven't seen a plausible explanation why he would counterclaim as scum. Also 2-shot Neighborizer seems to have a thematical syngery with 2-shot Cop (well, in a spiritual manner, one shot for each scum team).

I feel better about nom mostly because of their initial reaction to the Elsa-T3 claim situation as they came instantly to the same conclusions I drew.

Still town on Dunn and don't really think he is tmi'ing here.

Need to specifically iso hem, A50 and cyrus tomorrow, too tired rn. With hem I have mostly a positive feeling the way he approaches other slots, although it might be tricky given the nature of multiball.

A50 was for a certain amount of time on the wagon before he backed off, but I thought there were a few interactions with Elsa that would at least rule them out as fellow wolves (by Elsa).

No idea with cyrus, so many people seem to have strong opinions here that aren't really comprehensible to me. I can see some takes being being "too clumsy" for having a scummy motive, just not having a firm grip on his character yet and after scumnpom I prefer to be wary about these player types. Will probably just poe here unless I get a strong ping here.

Kitty is the only one there imo who looks initially scummy by his treatment of Elsa on D1. Dislike his fos on Gamma today too.

[cyrus62]

I real dislike huge walls of post . I am not being clumsy I stick to my reads till proven other wise it is no secret that I scum read gamma Nero or kitty day1 and I haven't seen no post worthy to change my mind besides nero I'm on the fence with him unless I see some one scummyer . Right now I could see arc being scum why haven't they posted besides end of d1

[T3]

Multiball with 2 scum per team is very bad for bussing. Scum are going to hard defend their scumpartner. Elsa hard defends Kitty for no reason. Later in the day Elsa moves on to Kitty as it seems he is being limmed. This feels like a last-ditch distancing attempt.

[Iecerint]

On review I didn't really like his meta argument of calling Elsa town because of that. Like he argued with meta, but rather in a shallow manner ("people know Elsa, Elsa is behaving like in last game where he was town") without really giving any examples why this would mean why Elsa was town here too and why it was different from Elsa's scum meta.

Finally I have trouble following his progression on Gamma from town to scum. To be fair I am here just not sure if his change of mind feels constructed or I just don't understand it. He said Gamma's AtE in his "if he dies, it's A50" post is out of proportion, however I don't feel it's necessarily out of line of Gamma's personality considering how he generally seems to react to particular things of people he is familiar with.

@Iecrint:
Can you clarify on both points? I mean what made you in particular believe Elsa's town meta applied to this game and wasn't less likely to be scum and why Gamma EoD1 behaviour is overshadowing your initial townread on Gamma making you more likely lean scum on him.

1A. Elsa's D1 behavior is extremely similar to that of the game I linked to ActionDan. Specifically, he has a grandiose, emotional way of communicating as Elsa that reads scummy (to me, at least). I'm pretty sure it's put-on by Elsa, because they don't do the same behavior as Bambi Jay, which contributes to it coming off as inauthentic/scummy. Dan doesn't know Elsa and reacted to it the same way that I did in my previous game with Elsa.
1B. Multi-scum is distinguished at a meta-level by a generalized bloodthirstiness. This is because scum can help with scumhunting, but they care less about accuracy.
=>Given 1A and 1B and the high level of enthusiasm for Elsa-wagon despite a weak case, I concluded that both scumteams were pushing Elsa, which led me to conclude Elsa was probably town.

Elsa did do a couple of things that made me say probably town rather than firmly town. First, their idealization of Titus early on seemed forced to me, even for Elsa. Second, their continuing to harp on Kitty SIMULTANEOUS WITH presenting a "reasonable" face (for Elsa) did not make sense, because tunneling on the Kitty topic single-mindedly would match an emotionally dysregulated Elsa, not a calm one. But, it was enough that I would have preferred another elimination to Elsa's.

2. Elsa's flip is the additional piece of the puzzle. It changes the meaning of Gamma's pattern of pushes D1. D1 I townread him in part because he seemed to be "reasonably" looking at other possibilities given the basis of Elsa-wagon being weak. But that's a much weaker towntell given Elsa flipped Werewolf.

[Nero Cain]

I real dislike huge walls of post . I am not being clumsy I stick to my reads till proven other wise it is no secret that I scum read gamma Nero or kitty day1 and I haven't seen no post worthy to change my mind besides nero I'm on the fence with him unless I see some one scummyer . Right now I could see arc being scum why haven't they posted besides end of d1

guy, Arc didn't post till near the end of the day b/c she didn't replace in till the near end of the day. She hasn't posted today but thats pretty null to me.

[Almost50]

Alright, landline restored.

Spoiler:

I don't see how Dunn is so sure both teams were hunting town also. NDMath was null to me and I don't see how he would look that townie to anyone.

I can't believe there's still a debate about this, and with such misconception of what has been said!

First: Dunn didn't say BOTH teams went for Town. He only said the MAFIA did.
Second: It was based on his own reads of who can be a WOLF and who cannot.
Third: NDM was indeed a "Mafia suspect" as per Dunn's readlist. He didn't explicitly say it, but he did say that everyone outside the four he suspected would include the other wolf

could still be Mafia

.

So, if you missed 1, 3 should have auto-corrected you, and vice-versa.

[Almost50]

I'll try to get a feel of everyone's ISO

Spoiler:

[countdown]0.00[/countdown]

[Almost50]

Can I just spread good vibes in this thread?

R U Japanese??

Spoiler:

[Almost50]

I bet nobody would notice how overjoyed I am about being able to post videos again! Yeah, I'll keep it subtle.

[Nero Cain]

A50 are u suggesting that Dunn is only active as town and inactive as scum?

I am. In fact, as far as I can remember his low level activity is NAI, but when he is active he is more likely town

this is not my experience with him. I mean its possible that he lurks it out as scum and is more active as town but that would mean he intentionally lurks to better his meta.

[Almost50]

I'll read this game in this state of

advanced happiness

, let's see if I can connect some thoughts together.

OK, scratch the previous question. You're probably my wife playing a prank on me.

[Almost50]

My favorite theory is 2 scum, 2 werewolves and a traitor for each team. A grand total of 12 town v 5 scum. (Traitors count as 0.5)

Traitors count as 0.5 when counting PRs, not when counting slots!!!!

In other words, if there's a traitor for each side then it's 11 Townies, 2 Mafia + a Mafia Traitor, 2 Werewolves + a Werewolf Traitor = 17 players

Signed: A monkey that knows how to count.

[Almost50]

Have we ruled out that T3 isn't a Mafia Neighborizer who counterclaimed Elsa?

It is starting to look I can only read monkey typing!

I don't see why any designer would give one side a 1-shot and the other 2-shots, but that's about as much as I can argue against it

based on the role itself

.

But I'd also argue T3's use of his first shot was Townie, and his explanation is even looking better.

[Almost50]

Also, why not keep up the bit and just crumb his no result? Then he could draw roleblocks away from PRs with shots left.

The counterpoint is if he perceives his no result as a guilty, but he isn't acting like it.

I like this in t5he general sense of it.

@Gamma: I second the question about not claiming your shots and trying to draw the Roleblock and/or the NK unto yourself. Why couldn't you do that?

Note: Not asking why you claimed your role, your target or your result. I am asking precisely about you claiming ONE SHOT.

[KittyTacky]

I neighborized nomnomnom.

Who's your second target then?

Is this some kind of claim, or are you misunderstanding something?

Isn't that how a neighborizer works? You pick two targets and they become neighbors with each other.

[KittyTacky]

Kitty is the only one there imo who looks initially scummy by his treatment of Elsa on D1. Dislike his fos on Gamma today too.

Okay I understand how those three posts are scummy now but

how is my push on Elsa scummy?

It felt like blatant pocketing.

[KittyTacky]

Multiball with 2 scum per team is very bad for bussing. Scum are going to hard defend their scumpartner. Elsa hard defends Kitty for no reason. Later in the day Elsa moves on to Kitty as it seems he is being limmed. This feels like a last-ditch distancing attempt.

Elsa defended me because she wanted apologizing... but there was no evidence an apology was needed. It was pocketing that failed.

[Almost50]

A50 are u suggesting that Dunn is only active as town and inactive as scum?

I am. In fact, as far as I can remember his low level activity is NAI, but when he is active he is more likely town

this is not my experience with him. I mean its possible that he lurks it out as scum and is more active as town but that would mean he intentionally lurks to better his meta.

OK then. But aside from activity, do you think his posts are town-motivated or scum-motivated?

[Dunnstral]

I neighborized nomnomnom.

Who's your second target then?

Is this some kind of claim, or are you misunderstanding something?

Isn't that how a neighborizer works? You pick two targets and they become neighbors with each other.

No, T3 is in a neighborhood with nom

[Nero Cain]

do you think his posts are town-motivated or scum-motivated?

scum

[Gamma Emerald]

I think I'm willing to explore new grounds, like..

What the freak is this?

Spoiler:

For a 17 person game I expected more people to show up in the first hour. I wanted three pages already.

It is 10:42 in the bEST time zone.

Yes it is, right now, but not when you posted

Hi Titus

I think he's just an awkward but nice guy who sheep's people while trying to give town ideas.

My scum detector is fully erect from this and it won't calm down. Intuition says TMI, but I don't know how TMI you could really be as scum in a 2-team game.

nom what's your take?

You actually used the word erect and weren't referring to a penis wow, who does that?

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey

Wow 42 pages. Its a lot!!

hello angel

This is shit. Big big shit.

VOTE: Elsa

For future reference HEM: even if I'm scum this time, I literally only defended Kitty because I felt bad because I'm an emotional player like that. The Mafia scumteam rode that to my death hard since literally everyone shut down anything elsa going after that.

I make plans pre-game of my very first action BEFORE I know what role I'm even getting so that's what town!me planned from the beginning to do with defending Kitty. PR town me will lie to your face as well as VT me. I hate giving readlist day 1 too because it's WAY easier to get strong reads on 3-4 players instead of forcing myself to read everyone right day 1. I hope I can actually talk to people next time for non-alignment reasons for idle chit chat. That's my favorite part of mafia.

I hope to God I get town next game tho. I know I like playing scum but when I get it FOUR TIMES in a row ... It gets a little grating. I signed up for multiball even JUST to still scumhunt as well on the off chance I rolled scum again. So my readlist is legit if you wanna find Mafia.

I'm outting this all so I won't have minor hope at work or die before I say my peace. See some of you next time.

Unfortunately, ArcAngel 9 slot and Andresvmb are totally unreadable going into day 2 off of a scum elimination

I wouldn't elim Testarossa tomorrow. Town lean, I also doubt they are paired with Elsa because they spoke out against them even if they didn't vote.

Iecrent made one effort post and then hasn't done much else. Their stances are weird. I'm unsure of why people have been calling this town, is this meta?

So Lucifer has transformed back into an angel and Elsa literally scumclaimed. Ok, I take that. lol

I guess that should clear the early Elsa wagon from being Elsa's teammate(s) considering it's permanence. That's finally something to work with.

Well sure but the other team is sitting on him so eh

Icerint or Gamma are my favorite picks for Elsa's scum partners

me "active lurking" be like

why the quotation marks? you HAVE actively lurked all day

T3

Almost50

Gamma Emerald

cyrus62

Titus

Arcangel9 (replaces LuciferMorningStar)

ActionDan

KittyTacky

Nero Cain

Testarossa

Andresvmb

NDMath

Iecerint

humaneatingmonkey

nomnomnom

Blue names are people who I have given me at least some reason to believe that they're not aligned with Elsa.

I am assuming 2 scum on each team, right now, but this doesn't get shaked up too hard even if there are 3.

That means that if I didn't false-clear anybody, Elsa's partner should be within this pool of 4:
[Gamma Emerald, Arcangel9, Andresvmp, iecerint]

Additionally, there's nothing preventing names on this list from being mafia of the opposite alignment. Meaning, mechanically, I think it makes the most sense to look here first.

Also, I'm interested in hearing if anybody disagrees with any of this

Why did you mech-cleared cyrus? He was a late addition to the wagon, and has taken a hesitantly defensive stance on Elsa

fwiw Andres joined this game because I asked him too, and I know he was stretched thin already.

Skimmed and saw the scum claim. I can hammer whenever if elsa is E-1.

I think town's in a good spot. In case I'm dead tomorrow I would like people to stop wasting their time with gamma/cyrus, both are town, continue on that path and I'll be their weapon. @Dunn re:Iec meta read mostly, his takes aren't that bad in that they are all plausible.

other people: NOOO YOU CAN'T WATCH THE GAME UNFOLD YOU MUST GIVE YOUR EVERY PASSING THOUGHT AND ANALYSIS TO THE THREAD NOOO SCUMMM
me: haha elsa wagon go brrrr

VOTE: Elsa Jay

Before I go. Like justice kavanaugh, I like beer.

But I also like guns.

As for this day? Borat would say, Great Success!

A bit of both nero

hello angel

Hello love

This is shit. Big big shit.

VOTE: Elsa

For future reference HEM: even if I'm scum this time, I literally only defended Kitty because I felt bad because I'm an emotional player like that. The Mafia scumteam rode that to my death hard since literally everyone shut down anything elsa going after that.

I make plans pre-game of my very first action BEFORE I know what role I'm even getting so that's what town!me planned from the beginning to do with defending Kitty. PR town me will lie to your face as well as VT me. I hate giving readlist day 1 too because it's WAY easier to get strong reads on 3-4 players instead of forcing myself to read everyone right day 1. I hope I can actually talk to people next time for non-alignment reasons for idle chit chat. That's my favorite part of mafia.

I hope to God I get town next game tho. I know I like playing scum but when I get it FOUR TIMES in a row ... It gets a little grating. I signed up for multiball even JUST to still scumhunt as well on the off chance I rolled scum again. So my readlist is legit if you wanna find Mafia.

I'm outting this all so I won't have minor hope at work or die before I say my peace. See some of you next time.

Guess you're giving up?

Unfortunately, ArcAngel 9 slot and Andresvmb are totally unreadable going into day 2 off of a scum elimination

Hey Dun, You can read me easily. Are you scum?

I wouldn't elim Testarossa tomorrow. Town lean, I also doubt they are paired with Elsa because they spoke out against them even if they didn't vote.

Iecrent made one effort post and then hasn't done much else. Their stances are weird. I'm unsure of why people have been calling this town, is this meta?

I like this post. Sounds town.

So Lucifer has transformed back into an angel and Elsa literally scumclaimed. Ok, I take that. lol

I guess that should clear the early Elsa wagon from being Elsa's teammate(s) considering it's permanence. That's finally something to work with.

Ironic isn't it?

Well sure but the other team is sitting on him so eh

Hey nero, what is your faction?

Icerint or Gamma are my favorite picks for Elsa's scum partners

and how are you presuming that?

me "active lurking" be like

Lazy or scum. One of it.

why the quotation marks? you HAVE actively lurked all day

then let's demand more.

T3

Almost50

Gamma Emerald

cyrus62

Titus

Arcangel9 (replaces LuciferMorningStar)

ActionDan

KittyTacky

Nero Cain

Testarossa

Andresvmb

NDMath

Iecerint

humaneatingmonkey

nomnomnom

Blue names are people who I have given me at least some reason to believe that they're not aligned with Elsa.

I am assuming 2 scum on each team, right now, but this doesn't get shaked up too hard even if there are 3.

That means that if I didn't false-clear anybody, Elsa's partner should be within this pool of 4:
[Gamma Emerald, Arcangel9, Andresvmp, iecerint]

Additionally, there's nothing preventing names on this list from being mafia of the opposite alignment. Meaning, mechanically, I think it makes the most sense to look here first.

who are your suspects for other scum team?

Also, I'm interested in hearing if anybody disagrees with any of this

Why did you mech-cleared cyrus? He was a late addition to the wagon, and has taken a hesitantly defensive stance on Elsa

I read Humaneatingmonkey town already.

fwiw Andres joined this game because I asked him too, and I know he was stretched thin already.

Skimmed and saw the scum claim. I can hammer whenever if elsa is E-1.

I think town's in a good spot. In case I'm dead tomorrow I would like people to stop wasting their time with gamma/cyrus, both are town, continue on that path and I'll be their weapon. @Dunn re:Iec meta read mostly, his takes aren't that bad in that they are all plausible.

Hey AD, Why do you think you will be dead?

other people: NOOO YOU CAN'T WATCH THE GAME UNFOLD YOU MUST GIVE YOUR EVERY PASSING THOUGHT AND ANALYSIS TO THE THREAD NOOO SCUMMM
me: haha elsa wagon go brrrr

It will be very hard to read people like this.

VOTE: Elsa Jay

Before I go. Like justice kavanaugh, I like beer.

But I also like guns.

As for this day? Borat would say, Great Success!

A bit of both nero

Cool. i would have done this too.

Or this for that matter

Hey everyone.

Let’s slay whatever factions there are against Town here.

Also, I do have a pressing matter I need to take care of, so I’ll be paying some attention to that. I do promise to actually read and provide some useful content probably tomorrow.

Also, if Dan reads me wrong he’s Scum.

VOTE: Gamma

[/quote]
I liked Arc’s entrance, Andres idk

[Almost50]

I liked Arc’s entrance

Really! Tell me more. Feel free to highlight the good parts of you will. Also, how do you like her activity on D2?? Also also, she wasn't the only occupier of her slot, so how did you feel about her predecessor?

[Almost50]

do you think his posts are town-motivated or scum-motivated?

scum

I would ask for elaboration, but I know I most likely won't be convinced, so I'll just save you the trouble.

Do you have an opinion on "Dre" yet??