Monty Python's Mafia Circus Game Over

[farside22]

So did massclaim just fall by the wayside? I still think that's a good idea. I would also still prefer Internet over Azimuth.

why are we mass claiming?

To see if we can find the cult recruiter.

[strappado]

Poker, where are you with your massclaim vote counting?

[PokerFace]

Sorry about that. Been real busy as of late. There are quite a few aspects about Elvis's role that don't match up with the hunter role I seen before. I don't see too many of them as any great problem. They are wierd but nothing big in my book. In general I get the impression that if what she claims is true about her role, that Shaft.ed made it all up off the top of his head, without influence of him ever seeing the hunter role I have seen. Which wouldn't surprise as I am fairly certain Shaft.ed made up some aspects of my role from scratch. I never seen anything like my role before. More on all this involving Elvis's role when I get more time later. I'm at work right now. Heres that count:

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Massclaim(6): PokerFace, Farside, Strappado, Ninja, Internet, Imaginality,

No Massclaim(2): Muerto, Azimuth

Indifferent(1): Gurgi "I'll go with it if rest of town does"

Not voting (2): Elvis, K7

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I am also wondering if the mass claim will be necessary or if its better to take someone suspicious, Vote them, have them claim then before lynching and then proceed to analyze their claim and then decide if they are the best lynch. Maybe have the most scummy claim first ain't a bad idea should we find them cult and not need other claims. It would keep more things secret. Basically I'm estimating which one is quicker and better further. I looked back at a couple of things and I haven't really seen anyone deeply defending another person. Either the recruits know the recruiter and the cult recruiter has been recieving no flak this game; he hasn't needed help or corroboration to defend himself. Or I more rationally see a cult that doesn't know its leader or one that doesn't exist at all.

In terms of speed finding things and narrowing them down, I think massclaim still wins out and a good idea, but if there is no recruiter then I worry we will be giving away to much to the mafia. If we can find the recruiter through basic scumhunting and voting to lynch without massclaim, that would be best. I'll make a big post on all these matters and who I think is scummy later on. Even though we got a majority vote for massclaim, I'd still like to hear the bad or devil's advocate version of our actions from it's protesters so that we all understand and know what risks we are taking before any claiming begins.

[PokerFace]

another concern of mine is generally considering who has claimed and those others who have acted scummy has given me the impression things may already be narrowed down enough. It basically depends on what type of cult exists (minnions know leader or not) and how likly the recruiter has acted scummy this game in accordance with how and if recruits would know and need to defend them.

I hope that makes sence to someone. Alot of people being open about their roles allready vs the efectivness of our general game play so far. I wonder how many believe there is a strong cult vs there being a weak one (by type and members) vs there being none at all.

Do we need to expose all aspect (role action and player) of the bridgekeeper, the machine that goes bing, the other thing that hit me night one OR do we just need to understand they ain't a recruiter.

You guys think I should mention the other unique skill that hit me night 1?

[farside22]

Sorry about that. Been real busy as of late. There are quite a few aspects about Elvis's role that don't match up with the hunter role I seen before. I don't see too many of them as any great problem. They are wierd but nothing big in my book. In general I get the impression that if what she claims is true about her role, that Shaft.ed made it all up off the top of his head, without influence of him ever seeing the hunter role I have seen. Which wouldn't surprise as I am fairly certain Shaft.ed made up some aspects of my role from scratch. I never seen anything like my role before. More on all this involving Elvis's role when I get more time later. I'm at work right now. Heres that count:

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Massclaim(6): PokerFace, Farside, Strappado, Ninja, Internet, Imaginality,

No Massclaim(2): Muerto, Azimuth

Indifferent(1): Gurgi "I'll go with it if rest of town does"

Not voting (2): Elvis, K7

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I am also wondering if the mass claim will be necessary or if its better to take someone suspicious, Vote them, have them claim then before lynching and then proceed to analyze their claim and then decide if they are the best lynch. Maybe have the most scummy claim first ain't a bad idea should we find them cult and not need other claims. It would keep more things secret. Basically I'm estimating which one is quicker and better further. I looked back at a couple of things and I haven't really seen anyone deeply defending another person. Either the recruits know the recruiter and the cult recruiter has been recieving no flak this game; he hasn't needed help or corroboration to defend himself. Or I more rationally see a cult that doesn't know its leader or one that doesn't exist at all.

In terms of speed finding things and narrowing them down, I think massclaim still wins out and a good idea, but if there is no recruiter then I worry we will be giving away to much to the mafia. If we can find the recruiter through basic scumhunting and voting to lynch without massclaim, that would be best. I'll make a big post on all these matters and who I think is scummy later on. Even though we got a majority vote for massclaim, I'd still like to hear the bad or devil's advocate version of our actions from it's protesters so that we all understand and know what risks we are taking before any claiming begins.

Well I think Azimuth and the internet as the scummiest. Not sure about Imaginality or Muerrto. I think people aren't voting either which they should be if they are suspicious of anyone. No one is even near L-1. So if people want how about a list of your top 2 suspects and who you would vote for right now. I think those not voting should vote though to add pressure to those who are scummy.

[strappado]

just an FYI - going camping this weekend, no internet. I'll be back on Monday.
No worries if we do a massclaim as my role is already out there.

[strappado]

Oh whoops - forgot to say that Azimuth is my top suspect, thus the vote.
Not sure who I'd put 2nd. Either K7 or Muerrto
I'm suspicous of Muerrto for being so against a massclaim - but if there is some type of role that could be mod-killed for revealing themselves, then he'd pretty much drop off my list because I haven't seen much else from him that strikes me as scummy.
k7 has played in the same manner chenhsi did, and we had such good luck with the chenhsi lynch, I'd be comfortable with a k7 lynch. I dont see how his "Patsy" role could benefit the town. If he sends a scum off to "watch" someone else, he could help the scum figure out pro-town power roles like docs/cops... The only way his role could be useful is if he picked a town person and had them check on a scum I guess...but so far, just about everyone he's sent anywhere has died so we haven't gotten any information. There's just something about him I don't trust.
I especially didn't like how he questioned Poker about who I visited. It seemed like he was way too eager to have his role verified.... something scummy about that to me.

[farside22]

You guys think I should mention the other unique skill that hit me night 1?

Only if you think it helps the town.
So who is voting for whom at this point?

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

Maybe have the most scummy claim first ain't a bad idea should we find them cult and not need other claims.

Sure.

Let's see, my order, (not counting me), would be:

The Internet
Azimuth
Muerrto
imaginality
strappado

And, unless I'm wrong, the following already have claimed:

Pokerface
killa seven
farside22
Lord Gurgi
elvis_knits

Huh, I guess massclaim wouldn't have quite as much of an impact as I thought, on account of we're already halfway there.

[killa seven]

Oh yea, i vote 2 mass claim.

[PokerFace]

@TSPN, Actually Ninja...

The following have claimed or partly claimed

Killa Seven
Strappado
PokerFace
Farside - Some Wedding party member
Lord Gurgi - Obviously albatross seller is his claim
Elvis - "The mother has elephant ankles" in no way references Lancelot

Unclaimed

Vote count of these is 3 to 2
Ninja
Azimuth
Internet
Imagordan
Muerto - Unclaimable role that somehow knew someone like Elvis targeted him

_______________________

Those with "Confirmable" actions not belonging to a recruiter

Other Unique night 1 guy that targeted me**
Machine that goes Bing!**
Bridge Keeper**
Strappado
Killa Seven
PokerFace

Those with unconfirmed or yet to be confirmed actions

Muerto
Ninja
Imagordan
Azimuth
Internet
Lord Gurgi
Farside
Elvis

@Everyone,

Can anyone other than Elvis explain the death of luigi?
I may add Elvis to the confirmed actions list bearing this and one other thing I am pondering.

It should also be noted that since I have been doing alot of looking at previous days I haven't had a great amount of time to look at posts 1440 - 1444 . I will cover stuff in those posts and who I find scummy over the weekend.

@Killa Seven,

you did read why and what not we are massclaiming in one of my previous posts right?

[imaginality]

With a cult unrecruiter role in the game, I think there's zero chance of having a strong cult, since unrecruiting any cult member would tell us who all the other cult members are - seems too swingy depending whether and when the unrecruiter targets a cult member. And as PokerFace says there hasn't been any evidence of cult players defending cult leader kind of behaviour as of yet.

So I think we have either a weak cult (don't know leader) or no cult. Given shaft.ed's sense of humour, and the fact that it looks like PokerFace is searching for someone who doesn't exist, I'm swinging towards the 'no cult' hypothesis. Especially now that the Sir Lancelot role has been explained.

I don't think elvis is lying about her role unless farside is also lying, the two roles go together. If they're both lying that could make them mafia but not cult (as I've already argued I don't believe a strong cult exists).

With Elvis's claim significantly shifting my opinion towards there being no cult, I think PokerFace's suggestion of forcing the scummiest/most likely to be cult players to claim first is a better one than massclaim now if we are still cult hunting. Mass claim gives too much information to the mafia too easily.

In case anyone thinks I'm saying this because I'm a cult recruiter leery of a mass claim, I will prove I am not, by saying this: I'm the person who targeted PokerFace night 1.

Pokerface, the following word should be enough to confirm that I know what you're thinking of: long. Hopefully that's enough for you to know what I'm alluding to.

I'd prefer not to say more than that right now, as I think the 'make the most suspicious player claim first' approach is better. But that should be enough to show I'm not cult leader (admittedly I could still have been culted, but we're trying to find the cult leader if he/she exists).

For what it's worth, my lists of suspicions at the moment:

Potential scum:
K7
Azimuth
The Internet

Potential cult leader if we do have a cult:
Azimuth
The Internet
TSPN

[PokerFace]

1) Muerto was first to bring up sight of seeing little coloboration among players. I looked back and noticed not many incidents of players defending other alive players, so I'm wondering if he actually had something there.

2)

In case anyone thinks I'm saying this because I'm a cult recruiter leery of a mass claim, I will prove I am not, by saying this: I'm the person who targeted PokerFace night 1.

Pokerface, the following word should be enough to confirm that I know what you're thinking of: long. Hopefully that's enough for you to know what I'm alluding to.

fdsgds?

The word "long" ain't ringing a bell with what I am actually refering too. Perhaps I was hit by more than just K7 and this unique other skill.

When I say unique other skill, I say it because there is only 1 python character that could have possibly caused this other effect on me. I also refer to it as a unique skill because I was told it hit me. In normal games if you are investigated or doc protected, there is no way for you to know this. The skill I was hit with actually had a "noticeable effect" on me. kinda like how K7 gave me the power to track strappado for 1 night. That was a noticable effect. I

do not

naturally know

everything

that's hits me as a product of my character. If some cop investigated me at one point then I would not know about it.

Can you say another word without giving much away? I am beginging to wonder exactly how much stuff I was hit with night 1.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

I guess I missed/forgot strappado's claim. But comments on the order/where you'd like me to be in it?

Also, its sort of interesting that imaginality expected you to have some idea what he was talking about.

[Muerrto]

Not sure who I'd put 2nd. Either K7 or Muerrto
I'm suspicous of Muerrto for being so against a massclaim - but if there is some type of role that could be mod-killed for revealing themselves, then he'd pretty much drop off my list because I haven't seen much else from him that strikes me as scummy.

Not mod kill. Vanillalize(is that a word?)

Gone for the weekend, will comment when I get back.

[Azimuth]

Lord Gurgi, you're annoyed because

one

person is voting for you in a game? I find that hard to believe. It's almost as if you expect me to apologize for calling a weak argument weak...very strange. And, as I've already pointed out, I responded to your arguments with more than "I disagree." Let's look at those before I move on to other points:

Further: You had no problem at all with my suspicion of you...

Well, I had a "problem" in that I knew it was wrongly placed, but there's nothing wrong with having an initial case on someone. I did think you had seemed to go through my posts and highlight things that "might" be a mafia tell, which can be done with virtually everyone in every game. It's not a bad place to start an initial investigation, but it's not very substantial otherwise. Sticking to it blindly while ignoring responses and adding little else to the picture is what made me suspicious of you.

Since Lord Gurgi used his rare opportunity of verbosity to talk about me, it is only fair to address his suspicions.

I can't help but think that people who reveal their roles too eagerly should be attacked, first with bombs and rockets to destroy their homes, and then when they run helpless into the street, mow them down with machine guns. And then, of course, release the vultures.
I know these views aren't popular, but I have never thought of popularity.

In that case, do you prefer a guitar, castanets, a bowtie, or a motorbike? Or none of the above? More I dare not say, lest you do something awful to the player who guesses the exact role.

These posts worry me, especially considering that there is only one post between them, in which time he changed his position quite dramatically.

In the beginning, I was more whimsical than I am now. I wanted to find a way to throw in a favorite Python quote of mine, and I was also excited about testing my trivia prowess regarding Iron Man. If I remember correctly, others were curious too before we realized the implications. It was all a long time ago, in the early stages.

Here you directly ignore the fact that I am showing that you first make the implicit suggestion that role fishers should be killed, and then proceed to fish.

For the VERY LAST time, that was a joke post during early/whimsy stage with an obvious MP quote. This point would be comparable to me saying, "OMG Lord Gurgi voted for Rogue Shenanigans early on, but never voted for his replacement killa seven ever since then. He's so inconsistent he must be mafia." I've explained this whole situation several times, and I don't think you're stupid, so I can only conclude that you are pushing a false meme for sinister purposes.

Let me correct your other statements as well: in that post I was expressing disapproval of role

revealers

, not fishers. I was initially curious of Iron Man's character (not role), but I stopped once I realized what I was doing. It was more trivial pursuit than role fishing, and I wasn't the only one. That's not "I disagree"; that's a refutation. If you don't believe me, you can at least say that, but just repeating the weak argument with nothing else, completely ignoring previous explanations and even describing my initial actions incorrectly, is suspicoius to me, especially since I know I'm town.

1. We lost the cop? Ouch. And there's probably a cult? Double ouch.

Complaining about a bad night is traditionally a scum tell.

You do have a point here; I even wondered whether someone might think it was suspicious when I included it. However, such notions are largely circumstantial. One might as easily be "suspicious" of LG's post 948, in which he expresses joy about lynching mafia when he thought IM was admitting to it. Sometimes we express feelings because it's how we feel, not because we're trying to look a certain way.

Nice attempt at deflection, really. Believing that we had lynched scum is hardly comparative to lamenting the night. and of course they are circumstantial, that's all we have. Circumstance and a smattering of logic.

On Day 4, I would hope that we would have more than "circumstance" to go on, especially with all that's happened. And I wasn't "deflecting"; I didn't think you were mafia and I still don't. I was pointing out the very obvious notion that non-mafia people often do things that can be read as mafia tells. Our actions, while obviously not identical (as though that mattered), both fell into the "react with pro-town emotion" category. I imagine others have done similar things in this game, if we had the motive to look for them, but I personally don't.

I notice that he has never done any scum hunting of his own, only followed what the town has been saying and asking an occasional question. This makes me lean to the scum side.

I don't quite agree with this characterization; how is asking questions not hunting? It's true that most topics weren't started by me, mainly because nothing happened to me overnight -- unlike, apparently, many others -- and I was mostly trying to catch up with the posts of those others and make sense of them. There are only so many topics that can be brought up, after all; I'm not going to invent some new crazy topic just to satisfy someone else's idea of hunting.

You never stated any unique suspicions of anyone, until perhaps your latest post, and no I don't believe that you need to start discussion to scum hunt. You ask benign questions, that are in no way interrogation, or useful for that matter, clarification from the mod and asking people how they

feel

is what it amounts to.

I get that you don't approve of my early hunting style in this game. This is probably what you were referring to when you said that my response was "I disagree" rather than a refutation. Now that the low signal/noise ratio of the early days has increased, I think I've been able to make better contributions to the game -- though I still have less to talk about, since twelve things haven't happened to me every night (unlike others, apparently). If you still think my contributions are unhelpful, that's fine, but I wonder why the recent minimal play of others (K7, Mr. Ninja) doesn't seem to bother you as much.

As a side note, I find that someone who is not voting for someone by the end of the day to be quite scummy.

Is that based on actual experience, or just a particular preference of yours? I definitely have not seen that to be the case, especially on days where a townie is lynched. For my part, both days we were waiting for IM to say something; on Day 1 killa seven quickhammered before it even happened, and on Day 2 someone else (farside?) put the hammer soon after IM's reply, before I had a chance to return and read it. I'm not going to place some random vote late in the day just to appease someone else's idea of appearing town.

Experience. It works reliably, especially since we lynched a scum day one, your argument is flawed. There was plenty of time to vote the counter claimed scum with the badly faked post restriction.

First of all, there wasn't "plenty of time" to vote DBE, since a vote during the last several days would have either hammered her or put her at L-1. We were trying to do other things that game day, and I was severely unavailable most of that week (look it up if you don't believe me, starting with post 470). We weren't even close to deadline, and I didn't want to help along a DBE quickhammer until I had time to return and sort some other things out; as it was K7 was able to quickhammer her anyway, so my inclinations were justified.
Second of all, you didn't suspect me because I wasn't voting for DBE; you suspected me because I didn't vote for DBE (mafia)

or

Iron Man (town). That makes my argument far from "flawed"; it makes your initial argument opportunistic.

There is always someone you are suspicious of,

always

. I refuse to believe that two days in a row you could find no one suspicious enough to warrant a vote. Unless you are trying to lie low.

I refuse to believe it too, especially since it isn't true. Not counting my initial JordanA24 vote, I voted for Luigi Day 1 (though I removed it in anticipation of the SpyreX/DBE dilemma), and I voted for K7 Day 3. This is yet another thing you have said about me that is false; my response is not just "I disagree," it's "this is not accurate." Hence,

refuted

.

This makes a good pausing point; the other points will be addressed in a following post.

[Azimuth]

Okay, now let's talk about the other points in Lord Gurgi's post.

I hesitate to lay these next cards on the table, but here goes: since I agree that at least trying to lynch the cult recruiter is "the thing to do" for today, with lynching any cult member as an acceptable alternative for me, I would focus on farside22 and Lord Gurgi, who have been acting overly chummy since at least Day 2.

Quotes please.

Are you denying that you and she have been chummy? Well, you mention it yourself in post 961, as Day 3 was dawning (emphasis mine):

Farside22
Seems very pro-town to me,

quotes me a lot saying QFT

, which makes me think that maybe I am getting my points across. Her hammer of Iron Man was well reasoned, and I think that she is more town following that.
Read: A1

farside22 had never mentioned my name at all in the game until a few posts later, in 969:

It's scary that I agree with LG on some of his choices. Mine was just a gut check moment especially with the internet and Azimuth with their post. I will go back and highlight a few things that caught my interest with these 2.

The rest has been my own observation over the past few game days, and I've not seen much to refute it. Let's just say that I'm not at all surprised that she was the first to join you on my bandwagon (post 1443). So, I ask again: are you denying it?

With LG going after people for talking about the cult, making superficial attacks while hiding behind a restriction, and even accusing Muerrto of being the recruiter out of the blue, I get the notion that any of several lynches would be okay for him, which is consistent with that of a cult member.

The man has unilaterally declared that it is impossible for him to be a recruiter because of what he did yesterday. That is more than enough for me to want to lynch him.

It seemed too opportunistic to me. You suddenly want to lynch him because of one sentence in one post among many that he's made -- I assume you're talking about his second paragraph, post 1418 -- and your logic seems to be "only the

true

cult recruiter would deny his identity." It's not enough, and I stand by my suspicions of your sudden aggression against him, especially since you didn't even try to explain yourself in your "free post" (more on that later).

For now I will say that recently I have been most suspicious of JordanA24; I will be interested to see how imaginality plays that role and whether it negates or confirms my suspicions.

Have any comments on this also?

Undecided. He certainly hasn't played strangely the way JordanA24 did, and other recent revelations have possibly challenged my initial views of JordanA24 and his motives. I may have to do a re-read of the whole situation some other day if we are both still alive, but he is currently not among my strongest suspects for either mafia or cult. Still watching him, though.

With farside22 as the other possibility, EK's claim presents problems. I guess it depends on whether we care whether EK wins, and also whether we really trust her motives behind not wanting farside to be lynched. Still, LG's superficial aggressiveness make him more likely than farside to be a recruiter (though it could be someone else).

Please show me where I am being superficially aggressive, I think that if you tried my post restriction you would be ripping your hair out from not being able to say everything you want like I am. I am not in any way hiding behind my post restriction.

The Muerrto case above is an example of superficial aggression in my eyes. Also, considering that you just spent a free post without addressing it, or answering my questions regarding your strange post 1408, or expounding your superficially aggressive post 1411, or talking about almost

anything else in the entire game

besides your initial weak arguments against me, I can quite solidly call that hiding behind your post restriction. Let's hope you saved up enough so that you can make another free post soon.

While we're on the subject, what is the logic behind talking about how hard your post restriction is? Are we to conclude, "Gee...LG has a hard post restriction, therefore he must be pro-town"? Are you asking us not to mention it if you present an incomplete or inaccurate argument? I'm sure it's a challenge, but it doesn't give me a reason to trust your motives, especially since I happen to know you are pushing weak arguments against a pro-town player (me).

I have 103 posts to your 33.

Low quantity is not low quality. I suppose if I had spent Day 1 making lots of double- and triple-posts about practically nothing, lowering the signal/noise ratio but beefing up my post numbers, you would think I was the bee's knees? What do you hope to gain by presenting this fallacy?

I am truly quite frustrated that you are ignoring my suspicion as refuted. If this post sounds angry that's because it is. I have a vote too Azimuth, just because I can't make posts as large as you all the time doesn't mean that it counts for less.

I've never said your vote counts for less. When has the validity of your vote ever been an issue? I've been questioning the validity of the

arguments

behind your current vote, and more recently your motives in presenting those arguments as strong ones while generally ignoring my responses to them. I do so because I think it may help the game; if you choose to be angry or frustrated about that, there's not much I can do.

Another post to follow regarding other parts of the game since my post 1440 (hey! I might be a triple-poster after all...)

[farside22]

For the record just because I agreed with LG on his post doesn't mean squat unless you want to say that Elvis is also my scum buddy and we made this whole thing up. So far that is a big fat chance to make.
Also LG was questioned by Poker in regards to is PR as well as others so him saying he hates his PR when questioned doesn't seem like sympathy to me.

[Lord Gurgi]

Albatross!

How's it credible to say we're chummy off one post?

Albatross!

[farside22]

Albatross!

How's it credible to say we're chummy off one post?

Albatross!

Wait lets see how far he buries himself. He is in for such a surprise from me at least.

[Lord Gurgi]

Albatross!

The post numbers were to say that I am contributing.

Albatross!

[Azimuth]

Aw darn, no triple-post. Although, I don't quite get farside22's reference to elvis. (Did she mean strappado? That's another kettle of fish....)

I still don't like the idea of a mass claim, because I think the anti-town forces stand to gain the most from the information. However, I realize that if my bandwagon grows I may need to claim regardless. I don't think that learning who I AM will necessarily help the baddies, but I'd still like to avoid it if possible.

BTW, if there ever IS a mass claim, I'd like even those whose roles have already been "revealed" to give a complete summary of what they've told us.

I'd still like to hear from elvis_knits again, especially regarding my thoughts on her claim -- e.g., what she thinks about not trying to kill anyone anymore ("wedding party" up to her, of course), among other things.

Regarding my bandwagon: in other circumstances I might be indifferent to my own lynch, since at least my revelation as town might finally send people after my pursuers. However, since there is at least a possibility of cult-related LYLO, I will fight to survive. I'd at least like to know whether those who vote me are doing so because they think I'm mafia or they think I'm cult. (Even Lord Gurgi should be able to do that.)

My current top suspects for cult: Lord Gurgi, farside22
My current top suspects for mafia: killa seven, strappado

I am still baffled by all things PokerFace. Is there no end to his possible hidden revelations, and will any of them help us? I suppose only he can say for now.

@Lord Gurgi: never meant to say you weren't "contributing." So you are in fact denying that you and farside22 have been chummy? This should also be easy to answer, restriction-wise.

[farside22]

Elvis states she is looking to kill the wedding party. I stated I am avoiding Sir Lawcelot which is her role. Since you decide to bury yourself and not actually read the game let me enlighten you by showing where I breadcrumb my role.

Here is a bit right before Iron Man was lynched:

I'm torn by many things. However i don't think it will matter. Iron man has not helped this game. Don't get me wrong. Even i have had days of being off and on in some game. Will holding up and talking more help this game. I don't see how. Today was more informative for scum then anyone i think. Holding back and waiting for one player is very fustrating. Eventually we need to move this game along and some slackers have hurt this game. i Love this game too much to let slackers hurt this game. Iron man has run and come and is not making any sense. Various roles have i'm sure confused most people. I don't think that iron man needs any more chances to keep us guessing. So with everything that has been discussed and my own suspicious.

vote: iron man

If you look at everything I capitalized you see a hidden message.
I hate to spell it out, but seriously if anyone listens to this guy you are nuts.

[farside22]

By the way forgot to add after that night when I didn't die (which I thought I was going to) Spyrx admitted to doing his things to Elvis and Elvis stated she was RB which is why I don't think I died, but I really don't know.

[elvis_knits]

I never targetted you farside. The night spyrex targetted me, I tried to kill chenhsi. I think I was RBed because Spyrex didn't die.

About massclaim, I think it's fine. I don't really see why we're doing it now though. I'm most interested to hear why muerrto didn't die last night, but he says he can't claim.

About me killing tonight -- how many people agree with azimuth -- that they want me to refrain from killing? I'll go either way. I said I would roll with the consensus.