Mini Normal 2170: Stuff I’m Listening To [Game Over]

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

i'm not sure how i feel about pooky's insistence that you're absolutely fakeclaiming scum but i feel like if i had actual deep reads in this game i would probably feel similar

ducky am I in lala land or something?

[the worst]

either you are or i am!!
you're right that like, the IC kill with a loyal jailkeeper is an insanely bad look
but the amount of badass energy it takes to make that play after the IC themselves point out that it wouldn't be a good look is like.. huge

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

What was he going to do. Leave the iC alive and let the IC push him today?

[the worst]

leaving the IC alive despite the IC not really townreading him adds like, a level of credibility to his claim

[Thestatusquo]

A scum RB doesn't make a ton of sense in this setup I think but its vaguely plausible, thats probably the only circumstance in which bulge is not scum right?

[Blitzo]

He says he protected kasu though...

[Thestatusquo]

Oh I'm stupid, I posted from the scene, didn't see the two pages of discussion.

Let me catch up.

[Blitzo]

leaving the IC alive despite the IC not really townreading him adds like, a level of credibility to his claim

Does it?

[Blitzo]

I am so not dealing with this right now.
I'll check in tomorrow.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't like the bulges target. Obviously I think the town is in a better position today if there's a conf town alive. His argument that scum wouldn't kill outworlder is null as soon as he makes it. It's wifom. This is the second time in two days he's used a WIFOM argument like "why would scum do X" well...for exactly the argument you're making right now. I don't like bulge's "fuck" post when he enters the thread. It seems like the post of someone who was gearing up to have this argument and wanted to fake an emotive tell. I've done the same thing myself as scum.

I don't really like pookys absolute certainty that bulge is scum either. That doesn't scream like a town mindset to have (granted, it was the exact mindset bulge had on day 3 also re: outworlder.)

I don't like worsts wishy washyness either. He's saying things like "oh my brain hurts" but doesn't seem to be making an actual good faith effort to break it down.

So I'm gunna vote the bulge and if he's town he'll get piled and we lose and he can yell at me in the post game and if he doesn't one of him or me is scum and the town can decide that how they please. I don't care about using all our discussion. This day comes down to this always anyway.

VOTE: Bulge

[the worst]

leaving the IC alive despite the IC not really townreading him adds like, a level of credibility to his claim

Does it?

a loyal protective?... yes

[the worst]

you don't have to like me shea. my wishy washiness is exactly how i'm feeling because at a surface level it SHOULD be an outright scum indicator but like. is it actually anything scum have the balls to do in this situation? i legitimately don't know

i should probably actually do some reading etc.

[Thestatusquo]

The main thing that doesn't make a lot of sense to me is that is that scum actually ARE unlikely to try to hit outworldER if bulge is town. Because its the obvious protect. So maybe they wifom themselfves out of it. It's only in a world where bulge is scum where they can confidently submit that kill. It gets into leveling wifom from there but Occam's razor tells me the simplest explanation is that scum knew outworlder was not going to be protected. Because bulge is not town.

Am I sure of that? Not really, but I don't think any amount of leveling is going to actually help me make a better decision. I've considered all sorts of crazy things last night like for instance what if blitzo and gamma aren't neighbors at all but are both scum, but tbh all of those possibilities just seem much less likely than just bulge being scum.

[the worst]

Actually I am probably reading this backwards - whether or not Bulge is incentivised to shoot OutW is probably markedly less important than like who the hell is incentivised to shoot OutW when there's a town ungated protective out there?

[The Bulge]

yea i wonder why you would kill the IC-town who has the strongest influence slot and doesn't believe your BS protective claim

What was he going to do. Leave the iC alive and let the IC push him today?

I won't believe that you are so tunneled that you don't realize the flaw in your logic. this is a scum shitpush. neither of these posts even explicitly imply scum motivation yet you act like it's clear as day. outworld not believing my claim and being alive is far worse for me as Town than if i'm scum, because we are in limlo. scum cannot lose the game here. I'm not saying that's why I didn't protect him, I already explained my night action choice. but your reasoning has no basis in reality.

[The Bulge]

you continue to ignore my alternatives every time you play the "has everyone in this game lost their freaking minds?!?!?" card.

I don't see a single valid reason for a town protective to not protect the IC in the game.

yesterday you argued it was because you suspected OutworldER was scum

you don't have that argument today.

I'm not restating my argument just because you keep blatantly ignoring it. I'll let you look for it yourself if you're so genuinely interested in scumhunting.

[The Bulge]

A scum RB doesn't make a ton of sense in this setup I think but its vaguely plausible, thats probably the only circumstance in which bulge is not scum right?

He says he protected kasu though...

Oh I'm stupid, I posted from the scene, didn't see the two pages of discussion.

Let me catch up.

oh man i super do not buy this lol

like with or without timestamps, each post in a vacuum, or as a whole, I don't see a good angle for either of you here

leaving the IC alive despite the IC not really townreading him adds like, a level of credibility to his claim

Does it?

and what the hell is this

[The Bulge]

I don't like the bulges target. Obviously I think the town is in a better position today if there's a conf town alive. His argument that scum wouldn't kill outworlder is null as soon as he makes it. It's wifom. This is the second time in two days he's used a WIFOM argument like "why would scum do X" well...for exactly the argument you're making right now.

lol what does using a wifom argument even mean. that's not even something people do it's something scum likes to slap on literally any speculative statement and say "they're using WIFOM!!!!!!!!!!!!" like how often do you actually see scum tank themselves mechanically or wtv just for the chance of winning points in some imaginary future argument? especially in this case with a full scumteam, this is a big fucking stretch. the fact you keep bringing up occam's razor as if anything about your stance on me isn't riddled with massive assumptions is laughable.

I don't like bulge's "fuck" post when he enters the thread. It seems like the post of someone who was gearing up to have this argument and wanted to fake an emotive tell. I've done the same thing myself as scum.

what is this shit? you don't like my fuck post? man I get you had to rethink your whole angle on me after I claimed and you couldn't in good conscience stay down the same path you had been laying and had to tap out for pooky yesterday, but now you've regrouped and are grasping at any hunk of shit you can throw at me and it is seriously not it.

I don't really like pookys absolute certainty that bulge is scum either. That doesn't scream like a town mindset to have (granted, it was the exact mindset bulge had on day 3 also re: outworlder.)

I don't like worsts wishy washyness either. He's saying things like "oh my brain hurts" but doesn't seem to be making an actual good faith effort to break it down.

you don't have to do this, I already decided I wouldn't be tracking associative tells past day 3.

So I'm gunna vote the bulge and if he's town he'll get piled and we lose and he can yell at me in the post game and if he doesn't one of him or me is scum and the town can decide that how they please. I don't care about using all our discussion. This day comes down to this always anyway.

VOTE: Bulge

this is maybe a townie mindset if you're in, say, a 3 or 5p limlo after a long hard game. but with a full scumteam left LOL absolutely not. the only way in hell this is a time and place for a 1v1 is for shea to maintain his trajectory on me and continuing pushing his teams wincon (ie, get rid of the guy who can block kills and confirm townies).

I sincerely hope you know that you are scumclaiming to me every time you do the 1v1 shit. like I'm hoping that that is a given to you in this plan.

[The Bulge]

Actually I am probably reading this backwards - whether or not Bulge is incentivised to shoot OutW is probably markedly less important than like who the hell is incentivised to shoot OutW when there's a town ungated protective out there?

I actually had a thought that maybe they came to similar conclusions as I did with my flowchart thing. my worst case scenario would be scum's best and vice versa. so they decided to take the same kind of gamble, that I would not protect the IC, and hope for their best case scenario, which is to make me lose as much credibility as possible.

[The Bulge]

I would like to take this time to remind everyone that

THE TOWN CHECKER, WHICH IS A ROLE CONFIRMED TO BE IN THE SETUP, MAKES LITERALLY ZERO SENSE IN THIS SETUP WITHOUT MY ROLE

.

[The Bulge]

like when i'm saying I'm conftown I'm not just talking from my pov

i'm hoping the remaining town can see through the obvious scum agenda to yeet me

at all fucking costs

which shouldnt be asking much if they would take a single glance at what we know about the setup thus far.

[The Bulge]

the fact you keep bringing up occam's razor as if anything about your stance on me isn't riddled with massive assumptions is laughable.

let's talk about this some more.


Shea keeps bringing up occam's razor as if his me-scum theory doesn't hypothesize that I have been one-man-show scumtheatring it up since the start of day 3, wasting all of my faction's actions on the stupidest fucking unnecessary wifomy bullshit multi-phase huge-target-on-my-back "play" that gives scum-me ZERO clout, credit, or credibility. all of that after 3 miselims in a row and 3 dead prs? get the fuck outta here you don't believe any of that for a fucking second.

Pooky acts like me being scum should be the most obvious thing in the world, when anyone reading the game can clearly tell this is an extremely complicated and nuanced situation (or else guess what? I would have been dead already if it's so cut-and-dry). he has stopped dead in his tracks on any other lead he's been following this whole game. Is that something a townie does when HALF OF THE OTHER LIVING PLAYERS ARE SCUM, or something scum does when they 1)need one more miselim to win, 2)there is a player who has put a huge target on their own back, 3)and so far this game they have been successful at manipulating the town thru three miselims in a row?

[The Bulge]

I really really really really need townies to read that post.

[The Bulge]

I would like to take this time to remind everyone that

THE TOWN CHECKER, WHICH IS A ROLE CONFIRMED TO BE IN THE SETUP, MAKES LITERALLY ZERO SENSE IN THIS SETUP WITHOUT MY ROLE

.

I would also like to remind any doubters that I hardcrumbed directly before the massclaim in a way that would be impossible to back out of.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

are you still pretending this is some kind of gamble dude?