Mature Mafia: Game Over

[nonny]

Can you explain how something can be suspicious and not scummy?

As soon as you tell me how it's helping us scum hunt I can.

Tally: is there a deadline or not at this point?

Everyone else: where are you? The game is over here *waves*

[Talitha]

There is no deadline. I can't see myself even setting one today unless the need is extreme.

I started to write a reply to some of nonny's mentionings of me from previous page, but really, what's the point? I'm just making myself upset by trying to respond to someone who is not on my wavelength at all, and who has already decided that she's against me in this game and interprets everything i do from that position.

Adel is a bit the same, but at least I can have a discussion with her.

Anyways, I don't know if their anti-Tally bias makes either of these two scum. They might be, but I am trying not to let my pro-Tally bias cloud my judgement. It feels pretty clouded, though.

I have a weekend starting tomorrow and hopefully I will get a better handle on this game.

[Talitha]

Also, this game needs more DGB in it.

[Talitha]

Nonny, I'll just say this, to get it off my chest. I don't lurk in games. I give to them as much as I can, whether I'm scum or town. If I'm not posting it's because I can't. I don't have a job like yours where I can post from work. I work really hard all day, then I have my 3 kids to look after when I get home. And we're just coming out of the worst winter I can remember for illnesses. I had to have several weeks in bed during June & July due to a nasty case of bronchitis, and then the worst flu I have ever had. I'm the only person one who does my job, so when I'm away the work all piles up waiting for me to come back. And I have to catch up. I'm amazed I found time to post on scum at all.

So yeah, I'll happily agree that my play in this game has been pretty crap. If you want to explain or put forward a theory of how that makes me

scum

, be my guest. Feel free to check out my play as scum in other games. I will even link all my games I've ever played as scum (and there are a lot) if it will help you to see that I do not lurk as scum. So if you use the word "lurking" in my direction again, I will simply assume that you're saying how sparkly and pro-town I am, and I will smile and ignore it.

[armlx]

So if you use the word "lurking" in my direction again, I will simply assume that you're saying how sparkly and pro-town I am, and I will smile and ignore it.

This made me laugh.

[Werebear]

I hereby retract suggestion. I'm not apologizing for attempting to figure out how to cover the town's ass if a townie is lynched. As a matter of fact, I really want to know how doing that is suspicious.

Right now, my biggest concern is the missing players. Much as I enjoy talking to you three, armlx, Talitha, and nonny, I wouldn't mind hearing from others as well.

[nonny]

Actually tally on my re-read you moved further down(away) on my scum list. I'm not baised towards you being scum. I just know you can do better so it's frustrating. I accept your explanation of the lurking, doesn't mean you are cleared in my book just means it is taken into account. Plus, I don't really meta so I won't be needed that.

Werebear: I understand what you were trying to do, I just believe that it is the right thing to even consider. Thanks for moving on. Who are on your scumlist and why?

Right now, my biggest concern is the missing players. Much as I enjoy talking to you three, armlx, Talitha, and nonny, I wouldn't mind hearing from others as well.

QFT, but i did all the prods last game day, so someone else should do them I think.

I'm shocked adel went to being completly active to not active at all. Last game day it was mostly me and her for the good majority of it.

Armlx: while you do have a big ole post count looking through your posts they seem lacking, mostly one lines. Also noticed you essentially hammer'd glork. So, was that you changing your deadline vote(even though you just said you would for DGB) or is that you following a bandwagon?

[armlx]

So, was that you changing your deadline vote(even though you just said you would for DGB) or is that you following a bandwagon?

Of his counter argument, he just says "true that" to all the points I feel make him the scummiest (policy on DGB, skewed PBPA, the hunch vote on Axel) and counters the ones I could care less about (how he arrived at the game being modless, semantic arguments about "woots").

That was compared to DGB more or less being DGB over the course of the game.

[nonny]

That quote is from you not glork, right?

[armlx]

That quote is from you not glork, right?

Err, yeah. I'm tired and fail at editing in my own quote tags on the quick quote function thing.

[Adel]

sorry for my inactivity, I've been having a serious attack of "Mafia is pointless and random"


I'm down with lynching Nonny. We don't have many days left to let her continue being the #2 wagon, the almost-lynched player. It is a pattern that should be familiar to all of us, like a bad joke.

What do you call a person who is always the second-scummiest? scum.

[nonny]

I thought you were on the no mod job = scum wagon. What made you change, yet again? It's not like we have a deadline, this is the time where you actually discuss. Maybe look over my case and questions directed at you? Are you still trying to push your case from day one? Were macros was only scum by association, so if the other two weren't scum then the association doesn't hold. How about your "new" reasons then?

You are jumping around so much no wonder nothing is being accomplished and you feel it's pointless. If you jump that many times then nothing happens.

If no one else is willing to I will send out prods.

[Adel]

I thought you were on the no mod job = scum wagon. What made you change, yet again?

I have too theories, one is that DGB is scum and Werebear and Tally are scum with her, and the other is that you are so damn scummy it is a miracle that you survived this far.

It's not like we have a deadline, this is the time where you actually discuss. Maybe look over my case and questions directed at you?

Which questions?

Are you still trying to push your case from day one? Were macros was only scum by association, so if the other two weren't scum then the association doesn't hold. How about your "new" reasons then?

1. macros changed posts, got caught, (or confessed out of fear), and then got himself replaced by you.
2. Each day there have been a number of people willing to lynch you, but you have not been lynched
3. Your activity level and approach to this game makes me think that you are narrowly managing to survive by out-typing the townies who would like to lynch you.

You are jumping around so much no wonder nothing is being accomplished and you feel it's pointless. If you jump that many times then nothing happens.

If no one else is willing to I will send out prods.

Please send out prods.

[armlx]

1. macros changed posts, got caught, (or confessed out of fear), and then got himself replaced by you.

I completely forgot about the post edit. That is anti-town AND scummy.

[Axelrod]

I am going to post something meaningful tomorrow.

See, if I make this post now, then I will feel obligated to actually do it.

[nonny]

1. macros changed posts, got caught, (or confessed out of fear), and then got himself replaced by you.

I completely forgot about the post edit. That is anti-town AND scummy.

Everyone has said that, so apparantly it wasn't that scummy. I'm not going to justify it anymore, because it not something I did nor did I have control over it. It just was.

Maybe adel since you want the town around so bad to lynch me then you can send out the prods, I've done it 3 times by now. We shouldn't need a babysitter to play a game. Oh and if you actually read my post that I put effort into you will see the questions directed at you. Other poeple have already answered there, I shouldn't have to point yours out.

2. Each day there have been a number of people willing to lynch you, but you have not been lynched
3. Your activity level and approach to this game makes me think that you are narrowly managing to survive by out-typing the townies who would like to lynch you.

2: obviously not enough since i havn't been lynched. And since when is it part of mafia that if everyone does it, it must be the right thing to do! Because we are all brainless and just follow what others do? Last time I checked that was a scumtell.

3: I'm active because I care about this game and find it interesting, but right now it's a load of bollocks. I actually read this game before being part of it and went out of my way to replace in, but with the current activity level I regret that. Since no matter how many times poeple are prodded they just go back to ignoring this game, the time we had the most accomplished was the 24hours leading up to deadline. Everyother time it's not balanced contribution. So you're saying my having time to post in this thread atleast once a day while no one else seems to have that time or want is a scumtell? Please show me the logic there.

[armlx]

Everyone has said that, so apparantly it wasn't that scummy

Explain your point here.

[nonny]

Everyone has said that, so apparantly it wasn't that scummy

Explain your point here.

If something like that is so utterly scummy, I would think poeple wouldn't forget it. Especially poeple that are voting for macros' replacement aka me. So either it's not that scummy, or it's not note worthy. Either way I think it's weak.

I'm logging off now, as you can tell i'm a little frustrated with this game right now.

[armlx]

You apparently do not understand how people A) respond to new actions and B) respond to replacements then. Older actions are often by passed in the assault against newer transgressions.

[Axelrod]

Okay, finally time to respond to Nonny's posts. This, I think is everything even somewhat negative you had to say about me leading up to your vote. I'm ignoring the things I said that you said you agreed with:

People who seem as okay as you can seem considering it's only 83 posts into the game:

logicticus
elvis_knits
Talitha

I don't like that there is no exlaination for this list. And no prompting for it eiter.

Okay. What don't you like about it? Saying you don't like something can be construed as you saying you think it's "scummy." Is that what you mean here? If so, what's scummy about it (in your opinion). I do this all the time, and I do not think that making a list of people you are feeling good/bad about at any particular moment in time is ever a scummy thing.

If not, then it would seem you are guilty of the same crime you insinuiate that I am guilty of - namely throwing out a list (or a statement) without purpose.

I just want to hear the "Alignment" part of your claim. I don't really care about the "Role" part. I agree that the "Role" part could be town/scum equally and there's not a real basis to tell the difference. But not the "Alignment" part, so I don't get what you are saying there.

Then why are you now saying one none mod power person has to be scum? This is pointless to go on this far in the game.

What? Either I am not understanding your issue or you are completely missing mine. I asked a very specific question of 'cam (for a very specific reason) at a point in the game

well before

everyone had claimed whether or not they had a Mod. duty. I did not have a feeling at that point that there was any specific distribution of Mod. duties amongst the town/scum. That was not what I was talking about at all.

I did have a feeling that scum would have Mod. duties though, and that it would not be obvious who was scum or not based just on that.

Do you still feel coron is a threat now that you know glork is town?

This is one of those questions that makes me think you are talking to hear yourself talk and not actually paying attention, considering I had

just

made another list and Coron/Armlx was sitting right at the top of it. Did you just miss my post or something?

Axelrod do you still feel this way about logic, or the other poeple you seperated in your lists? (obv exclude elvis)

Ditto.

Axelrod posts a list and assumptions about the game. He tries to clear tally on mod power alone. I find this all very WIFOM and why would you say

Talitha is least likely scum based on Mod. power alone.

I don't think any townie would try to clear someone so easily. FOS axelrod on that alone.

And here's the complete misrepresentation. I was absolutely NOT trying to "clear" Talitha from being scum with that post. One would have thought that was clear from the context. I was playing a game - out guessing the Mod. and speculating on what Mod. duties made the least sense for scum, such that

if

EmpTyg. had picked who got what, what would he have been more/less likely to pick.

You say "I don't think a townie would try to clear someone so easily," the implication being that you do think a scum would try to do it? Why is that, exactly?

then moves on to macros

Because if he were scum, he would have cheated. I can't believe his role (as Scum Death Post Editer) would have made it okay to remove critical information from the posts, like the alignment and role of the deceased player. That just makes the game unplayable (as discussed before). No, if he were scum, I'd call it cheating, flat out. As a townie who just screwed up though, it's completely possible.

Again trying to almost clear someone on power alone. Do you still feel this was axelrod?

Again, answer me - even

assuming

that what I was doing was trying to "clear" people (which it wasn't), why would I be doing this as scum? Especially "clearing" townies? Macros is/was you.

3rd least likely (in my opinion) is "Executioner." Because that would just be such an odd role for a scum to have. I mean, they are already trying to kill the town, and one of them has a separate role that says "When a player is lynched you send them an instruction telling them to reveal themselves in the thread." This would presumably include their fellow mafia? That's just weird.

trying to clear this one seems silly to me.(now elvis is cleared) But I don't see why that role couldn't have been scum, would have made sense since they would also be the one to say "oi we night killed you go post" but seeing as now we know it's not, it's a moot point, but still he is stretching to clear certain roles/players.

Again you accuse me of "stretching" to clear townies (which is wrong), but at least here we now know Elvis was, in fact townie. And presumably you know yourself to be townie, yes? So I have been "stretching" to clear at least 2 and possibly 3 townies. Why would I ever do this as scum? Why "stretch" at all?

And if this is just you again pointing out something you don't like, but without having any reason to think it's scummy, then....why?

Still feel this way about the latter part?

Another seemingly pointless question.

Axelrod: you are the one that pointed out that the front post changed. And you are the one for changing it. Pot calling the kettle black there.

Not. Even. Close. Seriously, did you go back and read what I said, when I said it and how I said it? If I had accused the person who edited the first post of being scum, that would be one thing. If I had said "omg, how scummy, someone edited the first post - people don't do that" that would have been one thing. But I made 2 back to back posts with a very specific purpose in mind. The first post was to memorialize what I remembered zuFaul's death post to have said before it was changed, and the second to

point out

that the first post had been edited to reflect the information currently available in the thread. I planned to

use

that post to support my claim when and if I made it. It was very deliberate and not even slightly scummy.

That is so completely different from what happened with Macros I can hardly believe you are trying to raise it as a point.

I wrote a whole post on this, you know. It's just a theory that not ALL the scum were given Mod. duties in this game, as opposed to the bunch of townies who were not given duties. Aesthetically, that makes sense to me. So it's more of a process of elimination thing, although there may be other reasons to vote one of those people completely aside from the lack of Mod. duty.

I find this detracting from real scum hunting.

You find trying to stir up debate about

something

"detracting?" Considering the extreme lack of scum hunting that was going on, one might have thought you'd have been happy someone was trying to talk about anything.

And I

still

stand by the point that, without anything better to go on, eliminating both the non-mod. powered people would statistically and logically be better than lynching at random.

After all that, you vote for me. And I still can't tell why - what out of all that you didn't like moreso than the dozens of other things that you posted that you didn't like from every other player?

The posts were lengthy, yet superficial. It's like you did this skim re-read of each player and just jotted notes to yourself as you went without any awareness of what had actually happened in the game or the context in which certain posts were made.

So tell me again - why are you voting for me, Nonny?

[Adel]

I thought you were on the no mod job = scum wagon. What made you change, yet again? It's not like we have a deadline, this is the time where you actually discuss. Maybe look over my case and questions directed at you? Are you still trying to push your case from day one? Were macros was only scum by association, so if the other two weren't scum then the association doesn't hold. How about your "new" reasons then?

I was just thinking about this. I was sold on DGB being scum based off of out-guessing the mod, but once Glork was lynched, the support for that totally went away so I lost faith in it. Now that lack of support is bothering me, because Glork is far more dangeruous for scum than DGB or I am. It seems to me that the scum advanced the "lynch one of the no mod power players" to get a mislynch, and then abandoned it. Did they abandon it because they saw that DGB would be the next person lynched on that case instead of me? Did they abandon it becuase once Glork was out of the picture they could coast to a win?

Who are the players who were gung-ho for lynching one of the "no mod power" players until Glork was lynched? I'm thinking of Axelrod and Werebear, but am I missing anyone? Do their reasons for no longer wanting to lynch one of the "no mod power" players read as sincere? Is this a signficant tell against DGB?

[armlx]

Okay. What don't you like about it? Saying you don't like something can be construed as you saying you think it's "scummy." Is that what you mean here? If so, what's scummy about it (in your opinion). I do this all the time, and I do not think that making a list of people you are feeling good/bad about at any particular moment in time is ever a scummy thing.

If not, then it would seem you are guilty of the same crime you insinuiate that I am guilty of - namely throwing out a list (or a statement) without purpose.

Axel, while your other points are fair, this one is not. Nonny definitely posted reasoning.

[Adel]

did you just totally skip my post? I meant the questions for everyone.

[Werebear]

Am driving to Cape May today. Should have internet access. Sorry didn't post yesterdy

[armlx]

did you just totally skip my post? I meant the questions for everyone.

Pretty much, it was 4am. Though to be honest, I don't have real answers for you, as I only really started looking at and thinking about / agreeing with the argument today, and even then I think we are better off trying to lynch actually scummy people today.